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DTL rationalisation speculations

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  • BusAnalayzer's Avatar
    10,431 posts since May '12
    • Originally posted by SMB1368T:

      60 by then needs to be full fleet DD too

      Loading on 60 will fall with DTL3 as there is a  MRT station at Bedok Reservoir Road loop where 60/228 ply and get a huge loading for 60. Many of those might move to DTL3. 

  • carbikebus's Avatar
    20,294 posts since Nov '03
    • Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

      Loading on 60 will fall with DTL3 as there is a  MRT station at Bedok Reservoir Road loop where 60/228 ply and get a huge loading for 60. Many of those might move to DTL3. 

      At most they will convert some DD to SD

  • SMB1368T's Avatar
    1,138 posts since Mar '16
    • Depends, because not all blocks there are near to the station and it would be quite a walk to get to the bus stops. Those blocks near the mega bus stop are not always near to Kaki Bukit MRT. In fact, 60 would be the only bus left to get to Bedok from there. There are also a lot of passengers going towards the town (at least thats what I observed)

      Edited by SMB1368T 13 Jun `17, 5:08PM
  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • Originally posted by carbikebus:

      At most they will convert some DD to SD

      Actually, BusAnalayzer’s route suggestion is workable.

      But, there would need to be new routes introduced, to make up for the loss of direct connections.

      Suggestion

      New A: Joo Koon to Choa Chu Kang, via Benoi Road, Jalan Ahmad Ibrahim, Corporation Road, Boon Lay Way, Jurong Town Hall Road, Bukit Batok Road, Bukit Batok West Avenue 3, Bukit Batok East Avenue 3, Bukit Batok East Avenue 6, Jalan Jurong Kechil, Upper Bukit Timah Road, Choa Chu Kang Road, Choa Chu Kang Way, Choa Chu Kang Loop. (24km)

      New B: Toa Payoh to National Junior College (loop), via Lorong 2 Toa Payoh, Pan Island Expressway, Whitley Road, Bukit Timah Road, turn to reverse direction after Hwa Chong Institution, Dunearn Road, Whitley Road, Mount Pleasant Road, Pan Island Expressway, Lorong 2 Toa Payoh. (12.6km)

      New C: Bukit Merah to Lorong 1 Geylang, via Bukit Merah Central, Jalan Bukit Merah, Alexandra Road, Telok Blangah Road, Kampong Bahru Road, New Bridge Road, Hill Street, Victoria Street, Kallang Road, Lavender Street, Kallang Bahru, Geylang Bahru, Lorong 1 Geylang. (17.8km)

      New D: Queen Street to Bedok, via Queen Street, Ophir Road, Victoria Street, Kallang Road, Lavender Street, Kallang Bahru, Geylang Bahru, Bendemeer Road, Whampoa East, Serangoon Road, MacPherson Road, Paya Lebar Road, Ubi Avenue 2, Eunos Link, Jalan Eunos, Sims Avenue East, New Upper Changi Road, Bedok North Road, Bedok North Avenue 3, Bedok North Street 1, Bedok North Drive. (18km)

      Four new routes (132.2km), to make up for the shortening of Nine existing routes (183km).

      Although the new routes may be long, they would minimise the inconvenience caused.

      Total Original = 545km

      Total Amended = 362km

      Total Removed = 183km (545 - 362)

      Total New = 132.2km

      Net reduction = 50.8km (183 - 132.2)

      Edited by gekpohboy 14 Jun `17, 12:34AM
  • Path Light's Avatar
    1,798 posts since Feb '15
    • Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

      Loading on 60 will fall with DTL3 as there is a  MRT station at Bedok Reservoir Road loop where 60/228 ply and get a huge loading for 60. Many of those might move to DTL3. 

      You sure loading of Service 60 will fall when DTL3 opens?

  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • Coincidentally, I have a Friend at Bedok Reservoir Road, and I visit her often, so I can comment on Bus Service 60.

      60 and 21 share the same route from Eunos MRT to Bedok Reservoir Road. A lot of people walk to the bus stop outside Eunos MRT to take the bus, instead of waiting for 60 at the bus interchange.

      But the return trip to Eunos MRT only have 60. I take that route many years already, so I know.

      There's a route 228 from Bedok that loops at the market area, at Bedok Reservoir Road. I understand it's already 10 kilometres long.

      Maybe we can shorten 228 a little, to ply a shorter route between Bedok Bus Interchange and Bedok Reservoir Road market, and then extend the route to Kaki Bukit MRT station, and then return back to Bedok Bus Interchange.

      21 is already very long, so I won't recommend extending it any longer.

      60 is actually a feeder to Eunos MRT station. Consider we can edit 228, I rather we edit 228 instead, and leave 60 alone. It's the only route from Bedok Reservoir Road that goes to Eunos MRT station, and those city-bound passengers would use 60 to connect to the MRT via Eunos station, as that is the shorter way.

      Anyway, if I'm not wrong, 228 duplicates many routes before coming to Bedok Reservoir Road market. Shortening it should be easy, and then we can re-route it to the nearby Kaki Bukit MRT station for connection to the Downtown Line.

      How about that?

      And, if I'm not wrong, very few people take 228 at Bedok Reservoir Road - Kaki Bukit area. Most of the loading come from the section along the Bedok Reservoir residential apartments (those that face the Reservoir). So, as you can see, 60 is actually more popular than 228 at Bedok Reservoir - Kaki Bukit area.

      If want reroute, reroute 228 instead, to Kaki Bukit MRT station.

      Leave 60 alone, please.

      Edited by gekpohboy 14 Jun `17, 7:53AM
  • TPS Timothy Mok's Avatar
    1,147 posts since Aug '07
    • Originally posted by Path Light:

      You sure loading of Service 60 will fall when DTL3 opens?

      Only 585 will be withdrawn. Then passengers can take City Direct 658.

      Side note: LTA is reviewing an extension of service 228 to connect Kaki Bukit MRT Station. It will be available on 21 October 2017.

      60 may be considering to be diverted to Kaki Bukit. Passengers can take service 87 instead.

      Edited by TPS Timothy Mok 13 Jun `17, 8:15PM
  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • Originally posted by Path Light:

      You sure loading of Service 60 will fall when DTL3 opens?

      There's still demand for bus connection from Bedok Reservoir Road to Eunos MRT station, because Downtown Line does not connect to all places where East West Line connects. So, the demand for 60 should remain the same. In fact, I think it would only drop a little bit, maybe 30%.

      Edited by gekpohboy 13 Jun `17, 8:32PM
  • Vampire77lim's Avatar
    112 posts since Nov '16
    • There are training route from the last  few months  route from serangoon  maperson    ubi ave 2  jalan eunos  Sims ave East  new upper changi rd to bedok south rd  Ecp to where don't know   i

  • TPS Timothy Mok's Avatar
    1,147 posts since Aug '07
    • 60 can divert via Jalan Tenaga, Kaki Bukit Avenue 1 and Jalan Damai. This will see that load will drop.

      228 may have to preserve the link yet.

      LTA is currently fixing the bus stops back at Jalan Tenaga and Jalan Damai.

  • Vampire77lim's Avatar
    112 posts since Nov '16
    • For the bus service 60 should extended to changi business terminal and  the results are not considered  to  the area planning official said that not planning on the area 

      For said that  60 can divert via Jalan Tenaga, Kaki Bukit Avenue 1 and Jalan Damai. This will see that load will drop.

      228 may have to preserve the link yet.

      LTA is currently is not considered  to provide the bus service  

  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • In fact, if you don't mind, I would recommend 60 and 228 do a mutual route swap, to make 228 shorter, so that we can extend it to loop at Kaki Bukit MRT station.

      228 ply 60's route from Bedok Bus Interchange to Bedok Reservoir Road market area (Eunos CC), via Bedok North MRT station.

      60 ply 228's route from Bedok Bus Interchange to Bedok Reservoir Road market area (Eunos CC), via the Bedok Reservoir condominiums.

      In fact, 60 extension to the other part of Bedok Reservoir Road would enhance connections. The route can also take this opportunity to loop around Bedok MRT station, instead of going into Bedok Bus Interchange. Many new community amenities would be launched at Bedok North area, so an amendment like this would really enhance the intra-town connection between Bedok Reservoir Road and Bedok Town Centre.

      228 on the other hand can take this opportunity to ply the Bedok Reservoir Road market area in both directions, to make things easier for the bus driver. With a shorter route, it can afford to ply additional mileage to the upcoming Kaki Bukit MRT station.

      Furthermore, 60 is a trunk and 228 is a feeder. 60 is considered average, whereas 228 is considered long. It would be appropriate to make 60 longer, and make 228 shorter. I mean, that should be the way, right? Why is it that the feeder run a longer route than the trunk, from Bedok Bus Interchange to Bedok Reservoir Road. It doesn't make it sense.

      So, yeah, that's what I recommend, to provide that connection between Downtown Line and Bedok Reservoir Road. I hope the relevant parties would consider all pros and cons carefully before arriving at a decision.

      Edited by gekpohboy 13 Jun `17, 10:46PM
  • Path Light's Avatar
    1,798 posts since Feb '15
    • Originally posted by TPS Timothy Mok:

      Only 585 will be withdrawn. Then passengers can take City Direct 658.

      Side note: LTA is reviewing an extension of service 228 to connect Kaki Bukit MRT Station. It will be available on 21 October 2017.

      60 may be considering to be diverted to Kaki Bukit. Passengers can take service 87 instead.

      An extension of Service 228?

  • Vampire77lim's Avatar
    112 posts since Nov '16
    • Bus service 228 should use bus service 60 route  and the bus routes 60 should extended to changi business terminal  from bedok North AVE 3 new upper changi rd to changi business terminal and 

  • array88's Avatar
    1,402 posts since May '14
    • Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

      Loading on 60 will fall with DTL3 as there is a  MRT station at Bedok Reservoir Road loop where 60/228 ply and get a huge loading for 60. Many of those might move to DTL3. 

      Doubt so.

      Firstly, DTL3 Kaki Bukit station is still some distance away from Bedok Reservoir Rd, and even further away from the Christ Church part. People still need to walk all the way to Kaki Bukit Ave 1.

      Secondly, DTL3 and EWL have very different routes. Those pax going to Bugis, City Hall, Raffles Place etc will probably still choose EWL, especially considering that DTL3 has no effective interchange with EWL for them, and they still need to walk/take bus to DTL3 stations. (Note that DTL3 pax still need to go through the entire DTL1 just to reach Bugis)

      I forsee a lot pf pax will still choose EWL over DTL3, hence 60 may still be popular.

  • ButIAmAToilet's Avatar
    331 posts since Jun '14
    • Originally posted by array88:

      Doubt so.

      Firstly, DTL3 Kaki Bukit station is still some distance away from Bedok Reservoir Rd, and even further away from the Christ Church part. People still need to walk all the way to Kaki Bukit Ave 1.

      Secondly, DTL3 and EWL have very different routes. Those pax going to Bugis, City Hall, Raffles Place etc will probably still choose EWL, especially considering that DTL3 has no effective interchange with EWL for them, and they still need to walk/take bus to DTL3 stations. (Note that DTL3 pax still need to go through the entire DTL1 just to reach Bugis)

      I forsee a lot pf pax will still choose EWL over DTL3, hence 60 may still be popular.

      Retain 60, amend 228 to ply KB MRT before heading to Eunos CC. There is 66 throughout 228's entire route except for its looping point. So the pair of bus stops 228 missed is already covered.

      Also, Eunos CC is a quick way to reach Chai Chee Industrial Est. It beats squeezing into 222 and heading to Bedok especially if you are going north-bound.

      Another part to take note is that at that Eunos CC area, 228 have very bad loading compared to the rest of its route. By amending it to KB MRT, it gives Eunos CC area connection to DTL3 without resorting to travel to Ubi/Bedok Nth. It will also complement 5/59 partially towards KB.

  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • I was even thinking, why not integrate 228 into 60, and make 60 ply 228's route between Bedok Interchange and Eunos CC, and use the feeder bus frequency? But for that to happen, Bedok North Road must have very poor loading, in order to skip that part. And also, are the people willing to let 60 turn into Kaki Bukit MRT station after Telok Karau Primary School, and return to Bedok Reservoir Road at the landed housing side after that, on its way to Eunos Bus Interchange?

      If Eunos has space for one more bus service, they can make 60 originate at Bedok, to add one more vacancy at Eunos, and then split 21 at Eunos. Then problem solved already, cuz affected commuters of 60 can take 21 to Eunos MRT station via 60's current route.

      But, as far as I know, got a lot of people take 21 from Geylang to Bedok and Tampines. It's not about whether MRT can replace the bus, but rather, the bus brings them straight to their house.

      Worse come to worse, just introduce a new bus service, from Eunos to Kaki Bukit, and loop at Eunos CC. Like the previous 385, except now meander at Kaki Bukit MRT station.

      Or just extend 228 to Kaki Bukit MRT station, and loop via Jalan Tenaga.

      Edited by gekpohboy 14 Jun `17, 11:10AM
  • AJQZC's Avatar
    1,021 posts since Sep '08
    • Originally posted by gekpohboy:

      I was even thinking, why not integrate 228 into 60, and make 60 ply 228's route between Bedok Interchange and Eunos CC, and use the feeder bus frequency? But for that to happen, Bedok North Road must have very poor loading, in order to skip that part. And also, are the people willing to let 60 turn into Kaki Bukit MRT station after Telok Karau Primary School, and return to Bedok Reservoir Road at the landed housing side after that, on its way to Eunos Bus Interchange?

      If Eunos has space for one more bus service, they can make 60 originate at Bedok, to add one more vacancy at Eunos, and then split 21 at Eunos. Then problem solved already, cuz affected commuters of 60 can take 21 to Eunos MRT station via 60's current route.

      But, as far as I know, got a lot of people take 21 from Geylang to Bedok and Tampines. It's not about whether MRT can replace the bus, but rather, the bus brings them straight to their house.

      Worse come to worse, just introduce a new bus service, from Eunos to Kaki Bukit, and loop at Eunos CC. Like the previous 385, except now meander at Kaki Bukit MRT station.

      Or just extend 228 to Kaki Bukit MRT station, and loop via Jalan Tenaga.

      I suggested an extension of 228 to Kaki Bukit MRT & loop via Kaki Bukit Industrial area to LTA earlier this year.

      The reply was that there were already existing services 60 to Bedok North MRT and 8/22/65/66 to Ubi MRT.

      ......

  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • Originally posted by AJQZC:

      I suggested an extension of 228 to Kaki Bukit MRT & loop via Kaki Bukit Industrial area to LTA earlier this year.

      The reply was that there were already existing services 60 to Bedok North MRT and 8/22/65/66 to Ubi MRT.

      ......

      Oh ya. Make sense. Anyway, Kaki Bukit MRT already have 5, 15, 58, 59 and 87. Since 8, 22, 65 and 66 already connect Bedok Reservoir Road (Eunos CC) to the Downtown Line via Ubi MRT, there's actually no need for any route amendment to connect that area to Kaki Bukit MRT or Bedok North MRT. Thanks for the information.

      Edited by gekpohboy 15 Jun `17, 12:57AM
    • Ok. Let's move on to talk about Tampines.

  • TPS Timothy Mok's Avatar
    1,147 posts since Aug '07
    • Originally posted by gekpohboy:

      Ok. Let's move on to talk about Tampines.

      46 can extend, via Tampines Ctrl 1, Tampines Ave 4, Tampines Ave 7, St 45, St 34, St 32, Ave 2, Ave 7, Ave 4, Ctrl 1. Of course, the patronage is not that high at that moment.

      22 can divert via Tampines Ctrl 1, Tampines Ave 4 to reduce fighting of buses.

      39 can divert via Tampines Ave 4, Tampines Ave 1 and Tampines Ave 2 because the demand is still low at the moment.

  • BusAnalayzer's Avatar
    10,431 posts since May '12
    • Originally posted by TPS Timothy Mok:

      46 can extend, via Tampines Ctrl 1, Tampines Ave 4, Tampines Ave 7, St 45, St 34, St 32, Ave 2, Ave 7, Ave 4, Ctrl 1. Of course, the patronage is not that high at that moment.

      22 can divert via Tampines Ctrl 1, Tampines Ave 4 to reduce fighting of buses.

      39 can divert via Tampines Ave 4, Tampines Ave 1 and Tampines Ave 2 because the demand is still low at the moment.

      Okay I had suggested this change a year back for 46. 39 should simply extend to CBP.

  • AJQZC's Avatar
    1,021 posts since Sep '08
  • SMB5007J's Avatar
    905 posts since Nov '15
    • Originally posted by AJQZC:

      Any recent news on 171 (whether it will be amended)?

      don't think it will be amended for now.. 

  • lemon1974's Avatar
    9,347 posts since Dec '04
    • Originally posted by SMB5007J:

      don't think it will be amended for now.. 

      last year someone claim have inside info about 500/700/171 and now all nothing?

      someone even say his friends at HGDEP already learn the route for 500 last year...

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