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Loading level on buses (Part 2)

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  • Sbs6750E's Avatar
    1,953 posts since May '15
    • Confirmed 374 will have high demand after LRT service via Cheng Lim ends at 8.30 pm.

  • BusAnalayzer's Avatar
    10,525 posts since May '12
    • Loading on svc 157 from Toa Payoh Interchange @ 17.25 B9TL

      Toa Payoh Interchange -- 25 (0/25)

      Lor 6 TPY -- 31 (0/6)

      Lor 4 TPY -- 34 (0/3), 36 (-2/4)

      Lor 6 TPY -- 37 (-2/3)

      Bradell Road -- 43 (-1/7), 46 (0/3), 44 (-2/0), 44 (0/0)

      Macritchie -- 50 (-3/9)

      Lornie -- 51 (-1/2), 50 (-1/0), 50 (0/0), 50 (0/0)

      Adam Road -- 51 (-1/2), 50 (-4/3)

      Bukit Timah Road -- 48 (-4/2), 44 (-4/0), 34 (-10/0) TKK, 35 (-1/2), 40 (-1/6), 36 (-4/0) Sixth Ave, 34 (-2/0), 34 (0/0), 34 (-2/2), 41 (-2/9) KAP, 39 (-4/2)

      Jalan Anak Bukit -- 52 (-5/18) lot of students from SIM/Ngee Ann transfer here 

      Jurong Kechill Road -- 64 (-4/16) Beauty World, 66 (-2/4), 64 (-2/0), 64 (0/0), 64 (0/0)

      Bukit Batok East Ave 6 -- 66 (0/2), 58 (-12/4)

      Bukit Batok East Ave 3 -- 65 (-7/14) lot of transfer from 106/963 IMO, 64 (-6/5)

      Bukit Batok Central -- 60 (-10/6)

      Bukit Batok West Ave 3 -- 54 (-8/2), 50 (-6/2), 46 (-6/2), 46 (-2/2)

      Bukit Batok Road -- 44 (-2/0)

      Jurong Townhall Road -- 58 (-3/17) many transfer pax from 180 IMO

      Jurong East Ave 1 -- 57 (-4/3) I alighted here. 

      * Overall loading quite okay compared to other BT services. Though loading has dropped along BT stretch clearly because of DTL2, there are substantial people taking 157 from Toa Payoh/Macritchie to BT and from KAP/Beauty World to BBT town as a DTL2 feeder. There is quite good loading between BBT and JE/JW towns as well. 

      * Peak loading = 66 pax. DDs are doing well on this route with upper deck 30-40% full. 

      * Opposite direction observed empty DDs along BT stretch but they too had good loading between JE/JW and BBT town. 

  • carbikebus's Avatar
    20,584 posts since Nov '03
    • Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

      Loading on svc 157 from Toa Payoh Interchange @ 17.25 B9TL

      Toa Payoh Interchange -- 25 (0/25)

      Lor 6 TPY -- 31 (0/6)

      Lor 4 TPY -- 34 (0/3), 36 (-2/4)

      Lor 6 TPY -- 37 (-2/3)

      Bradell Road -- 43 (-1/7), 46 (0/3), 44 (-2/0), 44 (0/0)

      Macritchie -- 50 (-3/9)

      Lornie -- 51 (-1/2), 50 (-1/0), 50 (0/0), 50 (0/0)

      Adam Road -- 51 (-1/2), 50 (-4/3)

      Bukit Timah Road -- 48 (-4/2), 44 (-4/0), 34 (-10/0) TKK, 35 (-1/2), 40 (-1/6), 36 (-4/0) Sixth Ave, 34 (-2/0), 34 (0/0), 34 (-2/2), 41 (-2/9) KAP, 39 (-4/2)

      Jalan Anak Bukit -- 52 (-5/18) lot of students from SIM/Ngee Ann transfer here 

      Jurong Kechill Road -- 64 (-4/16) Beauty World, 66 (-2/4), 64 (-2/0), 64 (0/0), 64 (0/0)

      Bukit Batok East Ave 6 -- 66 (0/2), 58 (-12/4)

      Bukit Batok East Ave 3 -- 65 (-7/14) lot of transfer from 106/963 IMO, 64 (-6/5)

      Bukit Batok Central -- 60 (-10/6)

      Bukit Batok West Ave 3 -- 54 (-8/2), 50 (-6/2), 46 (-6/2), 46 (-2/2)

      Bukit Batok Road -- 44 (-2/0)

      Jurong Townhall Road -- 58 (-3/17) many transfer pax from 180 IMO

      Jurong East Ave 1 -- 57 (-4/3) I alighted here. 

      * Overall loading quite okay compared to other BT services. Though loading has dropped along BT stretch clearly because of DTL2, there are substantial people taking 157 from Toa Payoh/Macritchie to BT and from KAP/Beauty World to BBT town as a DTL2 feeder. There is quite good loading between BBT and JE/JW towns as well. 

      * Peak loading = 66 pax. DDs are doing well on this route with upper deck 30-40% full. 

      * Opposite direction observed empty DDs along BT stretch but they too had good loading between JE/JW and BBT town. 

      157 from last time 50/50 SD/DD

  • BusAnalayzer's Avatar
    10,525 posts since May '12
    • 883 should see a surge in loading from Q3 onwards. 4 large BTO projects to open for occupancy in next 2-6 months. 

      117 loading also could improve due to transfer pax from 883. 

      883 may soon get many rigid fleet adds like 860 did. In future, 883 will be a good candidate for DDs as the MRTs are quite far from BTOs (until Canberra MRT opens in 2020). 

       

  • SMB1368T's Avatar
    1,213 posts since Mar '16
  • CZT's Avatar
    521 posts since Jun '16
    • Originally posted by SMB1368T:

      2019*

      Just saw TIB987K's post in press release on the operating dates of 405 and 130A. While i've not taken these 2 services (But does 405M count? coz i joyrode it last time :p), im pretty curious how their loading level is, and any possiblity of having 130A being withdrawn in the future? Maybe someone could shed some light on this issue? Thanks

  • array88's Avatar
    1,452 posts since May '14
    • Originally posted by CZT:

      Just saw TIB987K's post in press release on the operating dates of 405 and 130A. While i've not taken these 2 services (But does 405M count? coz i joyrode it last time :p), im pretty curious how their loading level is, and any possiblity of having 130A being withdrawn in the future? Maybe someone could shed some light on this issue? Thanks

      Both can go full house, though I haven't spotted people unable to board yet.

  • CZT's Avatar
    521 posts since Jun '16
    • Originally posted by array88:

      Both can go full house, though I haven't spotted people unable to board yet.

      Hmmm qing ming period rightt. What about other occasions for 405? Same?

  • SMB5007J's Avatar
    946 posts since Nov '15
  • hgdep103's Avatar
    310 posts since Sep '16
    • Originally posted by array88:

      Both can go full house, though I haven't spotted people unable to board yet.

      not true for 130... 130A always comes 1-2 min behind 130, so there was a DD trial on 130A last year (7473Z) which ran empty the whole day

  • Sbs6750E's Avatar
    1,953 posts since May '15
  • Scopittabuses's Avatar
    145 posts since Mar '17
    • Originally posted by Sbs6750E:

      How’s 374’s loading?

      recently there is ard 3-5 scania/citaros parking in compassvale at any point of time in afternoon. not sure is there so many buses for 374 or what

  • Sbs6750E's Avatar
    1,953 posts since May '15
    • Originally posted by Scopittabuses:

      recently there is ard 3-5 scania/citaros parking in compassvale at any point of time in afternoon. not sure is there so many buses for 374 or what


      Maybe buses from Sk Int.

    • Expect 50/82/136 Sunday loading to drop slightly since Transfiguration Ch open liao.

  • TPS Timothy Mok's Avatar
    1,190 posts since Aug '07
    • Loading for service 39

      Tampines Concourse Int - 0

      Tampines Ave 5 - 1 (0/1), 2 (0/1)

      Tampines Ave 2 - 0 (Alight)

      This is to show how worst the service 39 is during off-peak period. If service 39 is also made to amend via Tampines Ave 4, Ave 1 and Ave 2, that's more likely when DTL3 opens, given that it will take in more passengers other than service 20. This will however decongest Tampines and Simei MRT Stations in total, but they will not give you a paid link.

      Edited by TPS Timothy Mok 28 Apr `17, 7:54PM
    • Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

      Loading on svc 67 @ 17.20 from CCK Interchange MANA95 lush green

      CCK Interchange -- 65 (0/65)

      CCK Way -- 70 (-1/6), 68 (-8/6), 49 (-24/5), 38 (-16/5) 

      CCK Road -- 31 (-10/3), 27 (-6/3)

      Bukit Panjang MRT -- 18 (-13/4)

      Upper Bukit Timah Road -- 16 (-2/0), 16 (0/0), 16 (0/0) Cashew, 14 (-2/0), 14 (0/0), 17 (-2/5) Hillview, 16 (-3/2), 14 (-2/0), 14 (0/0), 12 (-4/0), 14 (-1/3)

      Jalan Anak Bukit -- 14 (-3/3), 14 (-2/2)

      Bukit Timah Road -- 13 (-3/2), 12 (-4/3) KAP, 12 (0/0), 12 (0/0), 11 (-1/0), 11 (-2/2) Sixth Ave, 10 (-1/0), 13 (0/3), 12 (-3/2) TKK, 10 (-2/0), 7 (-6/3) Botanic Gardens, 7 (0/0), 6 (-1/0), 6 (-2/2) Stevens, 6 (-2/2), 11 (0/5), 10 (-1/0), 13 (0/3), 14 (-1/3) Newton Circus, 13 (-3/2), 17 (-1/5)

      * time check: bus in front = 09 min, bus behind = 04 min, 12 min (+08m).

      Little India MRT -- 22 (-6/11)

      Serangoon Road -- 55 (-4/37), 72 (-4/21), 87 (-8/23) 

      * 3 stops along Serangoon Road fetches = 81 pax.

      Lavendar St -- 86 (-3/2), 89 (-3/6), 91 (-1/3), 89 (-5/3)

      Kallang Road -- 87 (-2/0), 72 (-24/9) I alighted here.

      * 67 still serves as an important feeder in spite of LRT between CCK way and CCK Interchange (also unlike LRT, bus stops are further away from CCK LRT).

      * Loading is HORRIBLE between Bukit Panjang and Little India (range: 06 pax to 17 pax with average of about 12 pax on a DD). Serious waste of resources.

      * Next bus is at 04 min -- wonder how many pax would it take, but is needed as loading is super high at Serangoon Road towards Geylang in spite of bus coming under 10 mins of previous bus (think: bendy as it showed NWAB). 

      Do you think it is okay to have 67 go all the way from CCK to Tampines with such uneven loading patterns? Comments??? 

       

      The reason of horrible loading is not because of DTL2, is because those are rich estates, and the salary cost is more than $50,000; meant to cover cost. Probably all the ministers stay there, Goh Chok Tong and Tony Tan had gave up the car and take DTL2 which is quite good.

  • Sbs6750E's Avatar
    1,953 posts since May '15
  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • Originally posted by CZT:

      I feel like slapping Gekpohboy alr. (ok i dun literally mean it but sorry for getting triggered) "remove the bus connection to Larkin Bus Terminal...Larkin Bus Terminla is for holiday makers...only a few people (around 30) actually take 170 everyday to get from Larkin Bus Terminal to Singapore..." I admit i  cannot physically be present at the checkpoint to observe this but at least make comments that make sense like carbikebus. And here are the reasons why:

      1. If u talk abt people commuting to Singapore daily, workers have their blue Bas Pekerja/Bas Kilang and students have their orange Bas Sekolah, and the fact that it is also not convenient for commuters to transfer at Larkin to get out of Singapore, so yes, maybe can remove. --> But bear in mind, the freq of 170 is at abt 10-15 min per bus, so that stretch frm JB CIQ to larkin with standees is justified. Plus, there are also crucial bus services at Larkin (other than express bus services in case udk)

      2. Have you seen how hectic it gets especially it gets to important festive seasons like CNY and hari raya? Yes we have alternatives (CW1,2, SJE), but 170 is still favoured by many due to its cleanliness, reliablity, and convenience (yes, surprisingly even when ppl are in Malaysia). And we are not talking abt practicality, we are talking abt favourism. Commuters dun talk abt practicality, they think abt favourism. Its literally hell in case you havent been there yet. (Consider this: long queues for 170X at Kranji MRT, but not as much for CW1. Why?)

      Yes i agree with you that the loop at JB Sentral is redundant, but personally I think this is the best way: 170X will still continue to go to JB Sentral as well as 160. Reason being some 170X shifts can convert to 170 and proceed to Larkin aft clearing JB Customs, and the fact that 160 freq is also poor, it shldnt be a prob ferrying those 1 or 2 lazy ppl to JB Sentral. 950, like what carbike bus mentioned, shld go to Larkin. And yes, 170X needs parking lots, and i mentioned b4 there ought to be a proper ter to house 170X and CW1 to handle the mess and danger everytime at that bus stop (yes dangerous, literally. 925 long queues and crowd and buses cutting in to the bus stop dangerously. Chaotic). I wont agree to you 170M idea thou.

       

      A qns for carbikebus: Why such thoughts for AC7?

      I am aware of the local bus routes that originate at Larkin Bus Terminal and provide bus service for the surrounding areas. There are routes that connect to the Johor Bahru Checkpoint, and 170 is one of them. The other ones I know are CW1 and CW2 operated by Causeway Link.

      I have observed before the loading on bus service 170 in Johor Bahru, at around 6:20am. There were only a handful of people taking the bus to Larkin Bus Terminal, and around 10-15 of them taking the bus to the Johor Bahru Checkpoint.

      (For more information, read the article I wrote at page 39 of this thread.)

      I understand this may not be the accurate representation of the passenger volume on bus service 170 during morning peak hours, as the service begins in 5:20am and I was only able to observe the loading at around 6:20am, when most of the people at Larkin would have already reached the Causeway, to avoid getting caught in the jam on the Causeway to Singapore.

      Anyway, considering there are around 11 trips made to and from Larkin Bus Terminal between 5:30am and 8:30am, and assuming the number of people on each trip is about the same, the total number of people using bus service 170 during morning peak hours should be around 33 towards Larkin, and 150 from Larkin.

      Previously, I figured out that the cost of operating a public bus service is around $4 per kilometre. Considering a trip from Johor Bahru Checkpoint to Larkin Bus Terminal and back spans 14.2km, a trip like this costs around $56.80 to operate.

      With an average of 16 people per trip, the amount of fare revenue generated is only $18.56. A loss of $38.24 is incurred per trip, which is equivalent to 67.32% of the operating cost. And this is during peak hours. Imagine the amount of loss incurred during other hours of the day, on usual days when very few holiday makers use Larkin Bus Terminal? The loss could be around 130% of the operating cost, which is obviously not sustainable.

      In view of the other bus services that provide the connection between Larkin Bus Terminal and the Johor Bahru Checkpoint, it may be better to withdraw our bus service 170 from Larkin Bus Terminal, and shorten the route to Johor Bahru Checkpoint.

      I do not know about the bus fare on the other bus routes, but considering the highest bus fare I paid for a ride on a local bus route was five Ringgit ($1.67), I am sure the price should be about the same as our bus service 170 ($1.16), or lower than that.

      With regards to bus service CW1 operated by Causeway Link, there are also many people taking that bus to Singapore from the Johor Bahru Checkpoint. If there is less people taking the Causeway Link bus services as compared to bus service 160 and 170, it could be due to the lack of awareness of the Causeway Link services.

      As for the congestion at the Causeway and Checkpoints, I know how it feels to get caught in a jam that is barely moving. Recently, our government announced that it will increase the capacity of the Woodlands Checkpoint. This is on top of the upcoming MRT line which will run between Woodlands North, Singapore and Bukit Chagar, Malaysia. The traffic congestion problem would be resolved once these projects are completed.

      But for now, the only way to avoid the jam on the causeway is to travel during non-peak hours - either very early in the morning, very late at night, before 10am (to Johor Bahru), or 10am to 4pm (to Singapore).

      Edited by gekpohboy 01 May `17, 5:09AM
  • CZT's Avatar
    521 posts since Jun '16
    • May i ask how would u explain the private operators such as TS1 and TS8 who are operating cross borders that does not go to any industrial area, and that they are operating daily, with intentions for TS3 and TS6? Wont they make a greater loss?

  • carbikebus's Avatar
    20,584 posts since Nov '03
    • Originally posted by Sbs6750E:

      Mr Dupdup how’s loading on 381? Ho seh bo?

      Below average,Peak hours also hard to get full seated.Instead of 381,Its better to introduce a peak hours express svc to CBD.

  • Priyasharma34577's Avatar
    8 posts since May '17
  • dupdup77's Avatar
    3,061 posts since Nov '13
    • Originally posted by Sbs6750E:

      Mr Dupdup how’s loading on 381? Ho seh bo?

      Hi mr sbs6750E, no good. Quite bad. Not much people. How about 374? Cheers. Thanks.

  • gekpohboy's Avatar
    2,180 posts since Mar '16
    • Loading on svc 651 from Jurong West Avenue 3 @ 07.32 Scania K310IB (49-seater)

      Jurong West Avenue 3 -- 5 (0/5), 17 (0/12)

      Jurong West Avenue 5 -- 18 (0/1)

      Jurong West Street 75 -- 25 (0/7)

      Jurong West Street 82 -- 29 (0/4)

      Jurong West Street 81 -- 32 (0/3), 36 (0/4)

      Jurong West Street 71 -- 40 (0/4)

      Jurong West Street 61 -- 43 (0/3), 43 (0/0)

      Anson Road -- 37 (-6/0)

      Robinson Road -- 25 (-12/0), 14 (-11/0)

      Marina Boulevard -- 6 (-8/0), 0 (-6/0) I alighted here.

      * The bus was 87% occupied when it ran express from Jurong West Street 61 to Anson Road.

      * Peak loading = 43 pax. If this was a Mercedes-Benz Citaro bus (90 pax), the bus would be 47% occupied, which is well below the maximum loading of 85%.

      * Bus ran express from 7:51am to 8:25am, and arrived at the last bus stop (Marina Bay Financial Centre) at 8:37am.

      Edited by gekpohboy 20 May `17, 9:06PM
  • carbikebus's Avatar
    20,584 posts since Nov '03
    • Originally posted by Scopittabuses:

      recently there is ard 3-5 scania/citaros parking in compassvale at any point of time in afternoon. not sure is there so many buses for 374 or what

      Lay over and split shift buses.

    • Originally posted by Sbs6750E:

      Mr Dupdup how’s loading on 381? Ho seh bo?

      Shouldn't introduce 381 in the first place,Should have an express route from PGL Int instead running like 518.

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