Should Singapore Review Its Notorious Drugs Law?
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The arguement here is if Muto is playing football in singapore or a Singaporean, I am sure his fade will be totally different. He would have already been charged and thrown behind bars.Originally posted by stupidissmart:3 types of drugs r prohibited.
1. Performance enhancing effects - which contravene the ethics of sport and undermine the principles of fair participation.
2. Health and safety of the athlete - some drug misuse may cause serious side effects, which can compromise an athlete's health. Using substances to mask pain/injury could make an injury worse or cause permanent damage. Some drug misuse may be harmful to other athletes participating in the sport.
3. Illegality - it is forbidden by law to possess or supply some substances
Cocaine is a highly addictive stimulant drug. It had already crossed the first border and is therefore banned for sportsmen. -
Agreed.But does that punishment have to be death?The cruz here is whether we have a right to kill another human being.So far, I've only seen posts after posts detailing what we should do to drug traffickers. Can anyone come up with any counter-post regarding the rights of Man to kill?
Why don't I ask u for a counter post regarding whether is there any rights of Man to jail, to cane or to fine other people. Punishment is needed for deterence. Tat is a theory u cannot deny.
Let me ask u a question instead. We can kill birds, we can kill chickens, we can kill all the other living being in the world. Why can't we kill men because they have committed a grave offences and it is done to protect public interest ? -
What is the penalty for first time drug offender?
U just need to go to drug rehab centre to kick the habit after which u need to go for urine inspections. No criminal records or jail for these people. Tat applies to Muto too since he is a drug taker, not trafficker. Take note I treat your meaning of drug offender as drug taker, not seller or smuggler etc. -
I thought the penalty for first time drug offence is $20,000 fine, 6 months prison or both?Originally posted by stupidissmart:U just need to go to drug rehab centre to kick the habit after which u need to go for urine inspections. No criminal records or jail for these people. Tat applies to Muto too since he is a drug taker, not trafficker. Take note I treat your meaning of drug offender as drug taker, not seller or smuggler etc. -
The death sentence is basically a law that was passed by our gov about 30 years ago and till today there are no statistic to show that it is effective in deterine drug trafficking. In fact the number are extremely volatile as shown below and it is unlikely to change.Originally posted by stupidissmart:Why don't I ask u for a counter post regarding whether is there any rights of Man to jail, to cane or to fine other people. Punishment is needed for deterence. Tat is a theory u cannot deny.
Let me ask u a question instead. We can kill birds, we can kill chickens, we can kill all the other living being in the world. Why can't we kill men because they have committed a grave offences and it is done to protect public interest ?
YEAR Hanged for drug trafficking
1991 5
1992 7
1993 2
1994 54
1995 52
1996 40
1997 11
1998 24
1999 35
2000 17
Protecting public interest by killing humans? Are you living in the animal world? -
Originally posted by Gazelle:The death sentence is basically a law that was passed by our gov about 30 years ago and till today there are no statistic to show that it is effective in deterine drug trafficking. In fact the number are extremely volatile as shown below and it is unlikely to change.
YEAR Hanged for drug trafficking
1991 5
1992 7
1993 2
1994 54
1995 52
1996 40
1997 11
1998 24
1999 35
2000 17
Protecting public interest by killing humans? Are you living in the animal world?
You have no idea how many lives they can wreck. -
We are not talking about legalizing drugs here. are you saying that we could harm more lives if we let those arrested drug offender live another day?Originally posted by Parka: You have no idea how many lives they can wreck. -
Originally posted by Gazelle:We are not talking about legalizing drugs here. are you saying that we could harm more lives if we let those arrested drug offender live another day? There is a chance that they will go back to their old ways.
But hey, remember that the drug trafficking death sentence law is to act as a deterrent. And make no mistake that people have no problem realizing that it's death to traffick drugs.
And why did they still do that when they know what they will face when caught?
If they don't give themselves a chance to live in the first place, it's hard for people to give them a chance to live. -
Zhuge Liang once said," Tian Zhuo Nie You Ke Wei, Zi Zhuo Nie Bu Ke Huo".
Meaning, if it's chance that made the sin, you're pardonable. But if the sin is committed in knowledge that it's a sin, it's unforgivable. -
God didnt create death sentence, human did. It is sin not let give someone a chance to live all over again.Originally posted by Parka: Zhuge Liang once said," Tian Zhuo Nie You Ke Wei, Zi Zhuo Nie Bu Ke Huo".Meaning, if it's chance that made the sin, you're pardonable. But if the sin is committed in knowledge that it's a sin, it's unforgivable. -
Originally posted by Parka:
[b] There is a chance that they will go back to their old ways.
There is also a veryhigh chance that they will change, and many drug offender have already proof that they can.
b] -
Originally posted by Gazelle:God didnt create death sentence, human did. It is sin not let give someone a chance to live all over again. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer, even in the future.
But I do think and still think they have to give themselves a chance to live before we can give them a chance to live. -
The death sentence is basically a law that was passed by our gov about 30 years ago and till today there are no statistic to show that it is effective in deterine drug trafficking. In fact the number are extremely volatile as shown below and it is unlikely to change.
In 1970 there were 20,000 heroin addicts. By 1989 it reduces to 9000. Why compared statistics of number of execution and not the overall number of drug addicts in singapore ?Protecting public interest by killing humans? Are you living in the animal world?
Really ? American have attacked Iraq to protect themselves in 2003 isn't it ? Australia, British and America have believed in pre-empt strikes to protect their citizens too. Israel have come off with some of the most interesting manner to protect its citizens too. R they living in the animal world ? Sorry to say tis, Men Are AnimalsWe are not talking about legalizing drugs here. are you saying that we could harm more lives if we let those arrested drug offender live another day?
Yes. Because it will encourages more people to be drug traffickers and therefore increase the amount of drugs here. More lives have been harmed.God didnt create death sentence, human did. It is sin not let give someone a chance to live all over again.
Hohoho... u talking about God ? U talking about god with me ? Hohohoho... God INVENTED THE DEATH SENTENCE. It is written clearly in the bible !
Exodus 21:12 Anyone who strikes a man and kills him shall surely be put to death. However, if he does not do it intentionally, but God lets it happen, he is to flee to a place I will designate. But if a man schemes and kills another man deliberately, take him away from my altar and put him to death
These r the laws passed from god to moses. He supported the death sentence. He supported men to give death sentence to men. U r going to correct god by saying men shouldn't use the death sentence ? U think u r more qualified than god to comment tat it is a sin not to let someone had a chance to live all over again ? -
i can answer the last question, its because man thinks that he is more important then the other animals, and some of us here think that human lives are more important than any other life formsOriginally posted by stupidissmart:Why don't I ask u for a counter post regarding whether is there any rights of Man to jail, to cane or to fine other people. Punishment is needed for deterence. Tat is a theory u cannot deny.
Let me ask u a question instead. We can kill birds, we can kill chickens, we can kill all the other living being in the world. Why can't we kill men because they have committed a grave offences and it is done to protect public interest ?
and can we stop all this talk about religion and their relationships with the death penalty? because not all of us have the same religion and i myself feel that its really stupid to pull god out everytime as an arguement, about how man has no right to sentance another man to death
oh please, its just like a christian pulling out a bible as proof of god's existence
how do you expect us to accept that? -
Well... actually you cannot divource the law from the bible, 'cause our laws came from the colonial laws which in turn came from the british laws which had its origins in the bibical laws. Not too sure about this. Please correct me if I am wrong
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......Originally posted by greengoblin:Well... actually you cannot divource the law from the bible, 'cause our laws came from the colonial laws which in turn came from the british laws which had its origins in the bibical laws. Not too sure about this. Please correct me if I am wrong
so we're actually a christian nation? 
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Heroin is a "old mans" drug if you havent know, and demand for such drugs has fallen naturally and not because of the DEATH Sentence. Why dont you take look into the statistic of overall drug abuse here in Singapore and tell me if it is increasing or not?Originally posted by stupidissmart:quote:
In 1970 there were 20,000 heroin addicts. By 1989 it reduces to 9000. Why compared statistics of number of execution and not the overall number of drug addicts in singapore ? -
[quote]Originally posted by stupidissmart:
Hohoho... u talking about God ? U talking about god with me ? Hohohoho... God INVENTED THE DEATH SENTENCE. It is written clearly in the bible !
Exodus 21:12 Anyone who strikes a man and kills him [b]shall surely be put to death. However, if he does not do it intentionally, but God lets it happen, he is to flee to a place I will designate. But if a man schemes and kills another man deliberately, take him away from my altar and put him to death
Which GOD are you talking about? Life in Singapore is not just about what you personally believe, please spare a though for other religions. -
I can tell you are one.Originally posted by stupidissmart:Sorry to say tis, Men Are Animals -
and can we stop all this talk about religion and their relationships with the death penalty? because not all of us have the same religion and i myself feel that its really stupid to pull god out everytime as an arguement, about how man has no right to sentance another man to death. oh please, its just like a christian pulling out a bible as proof of god's existence how do you expect us to accept that?
I am no believer of god myself
However some people keep mentioning tat only god have the right to take another person life. I am telling them to shut up, and read the bible more carefully before they coming to their own conclusion which totally deviate from their bible.Well... actually you cannot divource the law from the bible, 'cause our laws came from the colonial laws which in turn came from the british laws which had its origins in the bibical laws. Not too sure about this. Please correct me if I am wrong
Actually after the forming of the republic etc, the law system had undergone a major restructure so tat it will not be based on the bible anymore. Tat is why there r no laws such as slavery, death by stone pelting and cutting off an arm for theft. They also can modernise easily to contain the problem of drugs and firearms, which is never mentioned in the bible at all. If u talk about biblical laws, the bible itself also copied the laws from pagan or laws from civilisation too. Egytians themselves have already a set of laws which was thought to be almost identical to the one stated in the bible.Heroin is a "old mans" drug if you havent know, and demand for such drugs has fallen naturally and not because of the DEATH Sentence. Why dont you take look into the statistic of overall drug abuse here in Singapore and tell me if it is increasing or not?
In 1994, there were 6165 drug abuser arrested. In 2001 it had reduced to 3417. These were for all category of drugs.
http://www.cnb.gov.sg/medialibrary/admin/01DSR-press.doc
Why don't u show me the statistic on whether does drug abuse increase or reduce instead ? U r the one tat keep claiming claiming the drug abuse problem had not improved isn't it ? Why do u say tat ? Where do u verified your claim ?Which GOD are you talking about? Life in Singapore is not just about what you personally believe, please spare a though for other religions.
Which god do u subscribe then ? I clearly see the first one who talk about "only god can take away the life of another man" to be a roman catholic. U r also here to reinforce the same points, so I naturally link u to be christian or catholic. R u a buddhist, taoist or hindu ? Otherwise Muslim and Jews also use the same old testaments and do mention tat death penalty is accepted. But if u r a buddhist, taoist or hindu, u won't be talking about god, sin etc... So wat religion r u from then ?
God didnt create death sentence, human did. It is sin not let give someone a chance to live all over again.
U use your religion as an answer and prevent other people from using religion as well ? Life in Singapore is not just about what you personally believe, please spare a though for other religions.I can tell you are one.
Scientifically speaking, u r one yourself, and so does your mum and dad. Please dish out more points other than personal comments.
Please also take note tat the moment u r kind to drug trafficker is the moment u r harsh to drug victims. There r 2 sides of the coin to tis. -
Not bible.....the british legal system is a mixture of roman civil law and early germanic law which was oddly derived from the torah. Normans brought it to england when they conquered her.Originally posted by greengoblin:Well... actually you cannot divource the law from the bible, 'cause our laws came from the colonial laws which in turn came from the british laws which had its origins in the bibical laws. Not too sure about this. Please correct me if I am wrong -
Originally posted by stupidissmart:
Didnt know that animals has religion.
[b]I am no believer of god myself.
I would like to know if you have ever kill someone before.
However some people keep mentioning tat only god have the right to take another person life. I am telling them to shut up, and read the bible more carefully before they coming to their own conclusion which totally deviate from their bible.
2001 is the beginning of a up trend if you havent notice. Didnt you read news that drug user of estasy and Ketamine are on the rise and that fact was not reflected in this pcs of data.
In 1994, there were 6165 drug abuser arrested. In 2001 it had reduced to 3417. These were for all category of drugs.
http://www.cnb.gov.sg/medialibrary/admin/01DSR-press.doc
Why don't u show me the statistic on whether does drug abuse increase or reduce instead ? U r the one tat keep claiming claiming the drug abuse problem had not improved isn't it ? Why do u say tat ? Where do u verified your claim ?
This death sentence law has already been around for over 30 years, and if it is effective, why the number of drug offender is not below 100. Why is there still drugs coming into Singapore?
You dont need to have a religion to believe that there is a God. My conscious mind tell me that we must learn to forgive sinners and give hope to those who are in trouble, and that include people like you,
Which god do u subscribe then ? I clearly see the first one who talk about "only god can take away the life of another man" to be a roman catholic. U r also here to reinforce the same points, so I naturally link u to be christian or catholic. R u a buddhist, taoist or hindu ? Otherwise Muslim and Jews also use the same old testaments and do mention tat death penalty is accepted. But if u r a buddhist, taoist or hindu, u won't be talking about god, sin etc... So wat religion r u from then ?
I am simply quoting what you have say about human are animals. so who is getting personal here?
Scientifically speaking, u r one yourself, and so does your mum and dad. Please dish out more points other than personal comments.
Please also take note tat the moment u r kind to drug trafficker is the moment u r harsh to drug victims. There r 2 sides of the coin to tis.
[This message was edited by stupidissmart on 2004-11-08 11:29:32.]
Scientifically speaking, u r one yourself, and so does your mum and dad. Please dish out more points other than personal comments.
Is life imprisonment consider KIND?
Please also take note tat the moment u r kind to drug trafficker is the moment u r harsh to drug victims. There r 2 sides of the coin to tis. -
Life terms for convicted serial killers is worse than death. It drives them completely insane. Many of them commit suicide in their cells because they can't take the sentence any more. Look at Fred West and Harry Shipman in the UK. Why can't Anthony Ler & Mike McCrea get the same sentences as them. Ler's hanging was too cheap considering the hrut he did to his daughter, while McCrea wouldn't have a reason to flee to Melbourne.
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Originally posted by iveco:Life terms for convicted serial killers is worse than death. It drives them completely insane. Many of them commit suicide in their cells because they can't take the sentence any more. Look at Fred West and Harry Shipman in the UK. Why can't Anthony Ler & Mike McCrea get the same sentences as them. Ler's hanging was too cheap considering the hrut he did to his daughter, while McCrea wouldn't have a reason to flee to Melbourne. Yeah. Agree.
It conicides with my belief that isolation is the worst form of punishment. -
Interpretation in North AmericaOriginally posted by iveco:Life terms for convicted serial killers is worse than death. It drives them completely insane. Many of them commit suicide in their cells because they can't take the sentence any more. Look at Fred West and Harry Shipman in the UK. Why can't Anthony Ler & Mike McCrea get the same sentences as them. Ler's hanging was too cheap considering the hrut he did to his daughter, while McCrea wouldn't have a reason to flee to Melbourne.
In the United States, life imprisonment usually lasts until the prisoner dies. Sometimes life terms are given in sentences that are longer than how long the prisoner is expected to live on purpose, i.e. a 200-year sentence. In actuality, a life sentence does not always mean "imprisonment for life." In many states, one can be paroled out of a life sentence after a decade or more has passed. For example, sentences of "15 years to life" or "25 years to life" may be given. Even when a sentence specifically denies the possibility of parole, government officials may have the power to grant amnesty or reprieves, or commute a sentence to time served. Under the federal criminal code, however, with respect to offenses committed after December 1, 1987, parole has been abolished for all sentences handed down by the federal system, including life sentences, so a life sentence from a federal court will result in imprisonment for the life of the defendant, unless a pardon or reprieve is granted by the President.
Interpretation in Europe
In the United Kingdom it does not mean, as one might expect, "imprisonment for life", but a prison sentence of indeterminate length. In many cases the Home Secretary sets the "tariff", or length of term, for prisoners sentenced to life imprisonment. The average sentence is about 15 years before the first parole hearing, although those convicted for heinous offenses serve their sentences significantly longer, and some receive "whole life tariffs" and die in prison, such as Myra Hindley and Harold Shipman. Prisoners jailed for life are released on a life licence if the parole board authorises their release.
In Greece, a "life term" lasts for 25-years, and one can apply for parole in 16 years. If sentenced to more than one life term, a person must serve at least 20 years before being eligible for parole. Other sentences will run concurrently, with 25-year terms being the maximum and with parole possible after three-fifths of this term are served.
In Germany, the minimum time to be served for a sentence of life imprisonment is 15 years after which the prisoner can apply for parole. If the verdict in the original trial includes an explicite finding of "exceptional gravity of guilt" (in German: "Besondere Schwere der Schuld") then the possibility of parole after 15 years is excluded and the prisoner can apply for the first time after 18 years. After about 10 years of imprisonment, a specialised chamber (technical term in German: "Strafvollstreckungskammer") of the criminal court which is responsible for the case sets a recommended minimum term to be served depending on the individual characteristics of the crime, in other words, a minimum time which is deemed just and appropriate for the gravity of the crime. Release of a prisoner on parole requires (1) that this minimum time is served and (2) that a psychological expert opinion finds no further dangerousness for this prisoner and a positive social prognosis. In reality, a finding of "exceptional gravity of guilt" drastically increases the time before parole is granted. The average time served for a life sentence in Germany is around 20 years. Around 20% of all people serving life imprisonment stay in prison until their natural death.
In Poland, the prisoner sentenced to life imprisonment must serve at least 25 years in order to be eligible to parole. Moreover, during sentencing, the court may set higher minimum term than above. Since the introduction of life imprisonment in 1997, such minimum term was never higher than 40 years.
Interpretation in Asia and Oceania
In Australia, life imprisonment is a term of usually 40 years.