PAP Chances in the next GE
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I know the doctors in HK live in flats, cant afford private condo and thier units are smaller, for japan and HK.Originally posted by charlize:Salaries in Hong Kong and Japan are higher too.
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heavenlyfire
Since you seem to proport yourself to be a PAP extremist, you must surely know plenty about the PAP mindset.
Tell me, how is it possible that the entire wealth of our country has be to under the control of members of a family? I presume you find this PAP 'ruling' acceptable seeing you are such a fire-from-the-hip-gungho-advocate for PAP. -
From my observation, resentment or anti PAP sentiments were built up mainly due to the lack of trust in the party.Originally posted by heavenlyfire:yes, so I simply don understand why a couple of casino is casing such an uproar in the whole nation. In my view, the governemnt is planning for our future, what makes you think PAP digging at its own grave?Even if they knew minorarity doesnt support them and they may loses some seats, they still make the decision. For whom may I ask? The reasons MM lee gives for building the resort has alreadly been stated, and it is clear enough, it is for the nation.
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Singapore had experienced too many mistakes due to the shortsightedness of the ruling party. Much money were spent to see it go to waste. Below are some examples :
1) Esplanade that merely stood there like to durians.
2) Clone merlions that failed to bring in tourist
3) Logistic Hub which resulted in plenty of vacant warehouses in Toh Guan and one half complete in Tuas.
There are many many more examples that lead to the lpublic from loosing their faith in the party. -
heavenlyfire,Originally posted by heavenlyfire:If what you say is going to happen, I can tell you, Singapore will be doomed to oblivion. The Worst case scnerio, the seats is divided equally. Then wouldnt it be more chaotic? one guy is pushing for somthing and the other guy is agruing against it for pride or for rights?whatever
Then changes for the better would take twice as long,I forsee chao and there will be a power struggle. Singapore will step further behind, then by the time we pickedup, wouldn it be to late. Total reform? easier said than done. if you look back at history, how much seats is given to the opposing party?
ppl who thinks like you belong to the minority, why don you start thinking about the things you can do for the country instead of what the country can do for you?
there is nothing very heavenly about this post of yours.
When you try and make judgements on issues, try not to get caught in slippery-slope emotionalism. it doesn't help your argument at all. Besides, look at AU or NZ or UK; Are their parliaments really chaotic? I think only Taiwan can be said to have a truely chaotic parliament, not the rest of the world.
And those last two lines, perhaps you do not understand the implication. A very devious strategy indeed, but here is the real meaning of thsoe last two lines, which I don't think you intended it to be: " Why don't you start thinking of all the sacrifices you can make for the government?" and the implication is : you are asking for people to sacrifice needlessly to the PAP, rather than actively participate in the relevant civil processes to amke sure that the PAP does its job properly.
Gracias,
the pikamaster -
Oh dear, ur really hopeless. You are too much in the midst of PAP propangada that there's really no point in helping you. Well, when the time for a new government comes, don't say I didn't wanna help you. You rejected it yourself.Originally posted by heavenlyfire:so everything drop?your point? governement fault? PAP fault? so what do you propose? I don think, much can be done about this..Singaporean are so highly eduated, thet explain why labour costs for factories is so high and too explain why production factories is withdrawing from SG and looking for neighbouring countries for cheaper labour in order to remain in competition.
That is where tourisim 21 comes in. Tourisim 21 promote South-east ASia as a whole, with Singapore as a hub, or rather a stopping point to other countries. THe governemnt promote huge corporations to set up their HQ over here as we can provide the HR, and hence use Singapore as stepping stone to nearby neighbouring countries.
And there is the triangle relationship between Singapore, Malaysia and Indo. where Singapore chips in the manpower, resources while the latter provides land. one successful example is the batam island and you guys heard of SUzhou Industry park? heard they even have a small merlion there.
Do not think that the ministers is staying in their offices, shake leg and count notes? They are now looking forward to such opportinuites in India now, that explain the visits from our ministers to isolated countries. The ministers' wish is that if one day they become successful, they will not forget us and give us a piece of the pie.
we are talking about globalisation now, our leaders know that we cant survive alone, that is why governemnt is calling us to go out of SG, to venture out, but remain as Singaporean -
It's simple. I won't vote for them when the time comes. I have always wanted to go overseas and learn how political systems work, how politics work, how business works and how it affect society at hand.Originally posted by chunyong:Is there anything we can do ? if we do do anything is it going to change anything ? if we do change anything, is it gonna have any significant effect ? If your answer is 'No' then no need talk so much, either vote for OP or dun vote...dat simple.
accept wat u cannot change and change wat u cannot accept.
And then I'll be back. Then we will see whether the PAP can still rule with an iron fist. -
Trying to be JFK? Sorry, but that's a poor attempt. And ur excuse about chaos in democracy is unfounded and baseless. It's the same old tired excuse LKY keeps on resorting to for the last 40 years and I'm sick of the same old nonsense.Originally posted by heavenlyfire:If what you say is going to happen, I can tell you, Singapore will be doomed to oblivion. The Worst case scnerio, the seats is divided equally. Then wouldnt it be more chaotic? one guy is pushing for somthing and the other guy is agruing against it for pride or for rights?whatever
Then changes for the better would take twice as long,I forsee chao and there will be a power struggle. Singapore will step further behind, then by the time we pickedup, wouldn it be to late. Total reform? easier said than done. if you look back at history, how much seats is given to the opposing party?
ppl who thinks like you belong to the minority, why don you start thinking about the things you can do for the country instead of what the country can do for you?
Offer something new and fresh, please. Otherwise, just go back and think of a brand new argument. Remember, brand new. Not the recycled stuff, please. -
Ya, ya,ya, also trying super hard for his own and Leech familys pockets as well.Originally posted by heavenlyfire:yes, so I simply don understand why a couple of casino is casing such an uproar in the whole nation. In my view, the governemnt is planning for our future, what makes you think PAP digging at its own grave?Even if they knew minorarity doesnt support them and they may loses some seats, they still make the decision. For whom may I ask? The reasons MM lee gives for building the resort has alreadly been stated, and it is clear enough, it is for the nation.
I don join fan club, but I respect LKY. He really try his best for the nation, since 60s, read up the history book if you don know anything.
I am not so sure about his son's capabilities and foresight, so we shall wait and see.
Singapore's economy is dead that why is putting up casinos now.
HDB utilised only about one tenth of land in singapore for residential. JTC controls most of the industrial areas. Capitaland, Keppel land and Asccendas own lots of properties and lands. Todate, there are still loads of vacant lands, factories, warehouses and industry estates with very low low low demand.
Tell me, what is the rational of charging high rentals, high property cost high utilities and even ridiculous high postages fees on a tiny island? Now every authorities are trying to prove to the boss on their account books to look good and aiming to get fat fat bonuses for themselves at the expense of we siongaporen. So you think is this democratic soceity? deep thought will helps to enlighten your bird brain.
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Do you know that the usable lands in Hong Kong is much smaller than singapore? What is their population??? 8 millions!!! dumb!Originally posted by heavenlyfire:friend, you know about japan and HK? dont you know that their houses cost more. pls stop the whining. HDB provides subsidies for those who cant afford the housing. check out if you don know anything. I too find it costly compared to our parents time,but little can i do, unless you want to emigrate?
To build HDB flats for 4 and 5 rooms. Contractors tender at about 75k to 95k per unit from underground services, piling, service roads, landscaping and to the last painting and for people to move in and stay.
Tell me how much are they selling? How much interest of the loan for HDB flats were charging? The gov have utilised our hard earned CPF $$$ to invest with even higher returns and at what rate is our CPF interest we are getting?
What are average income of most singaporeans are earning these days?
Most of the age forties seeking new jobs at statutory board are being rejected. My brother experienced it. -
wait & see!!! how long he has been in the ministry? u mean so far he is good at nothing, that's why we need to wait & see. Don't forget that for his one month salary, an average singaporean will need to work for at least a few yrs!!! 5 yrs, 6 yrs????Originally posted by heavenlyfire:yes, so I simply don understand why a couple of casino is casing such an uproar in the whole nation. In my view, the governemnt is planning for our future, what makes you think PAP digging at its own grave?Even if they knew minorarity doesnt support them and they may loses some seats, they still make the decision. For whom may I ask? The reasons MM lee gives for building the resort has alreadly been stated, and it is clear enough, it is for the nation.
I don join fan club, but I respect LKY. He really try his best for the nation, since 60s, read up the history book if you don know anything.
I am not so sure about his son's capabilities and foresight, so we shall wait and see. -
Which history book?Originally posted by heavenlyfire:yes, so I simply don understand why a couple of casino is casing such an uproar in the whole nation. In my view, the governemnt is planning for our future, what makes you think PAP digging at its own grave?Even if they knew minorarity doesnt support them and they may loses some seats, they still make the decision. For whom may I ask? The reasons MM lee gives for building the resort has alreadly been stated, and it is clear enough, it is for the nation.
I don join fan club, but I respect LKY. He really try his best for the nation, since 60s, read up the history book if you don know anything.
I am not so sure about his son's capabilities and foresight, so we shall wait and see.
The History of Singapore and Malaysia, underwritten by MOE and used in secondary schools?
Or Lee Kuan Yew's Memoir?
Heard of the name Lim Chin Siong??? Barisan Sosialis??
I can suggest a hundred other books for you amongst which are:
(1) The Politics of Social and Economic Controls in Singapore by Christopher Tremewan;
(2) No Man is an Island by James Minchin
(3) Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore by TJS George
(4) Lee Kuan Yew by Alex Josey
Please crawl out of the shell PAP has carved out for you. -
That's why I was wondering: Why should we continue to pay so much taxes, both direct income taxes and indirect taxes, and interest payments for the government to continue getting high wages- and all for nothing to show for it?
Other foreign govts are paid less compared to ours and these govts. are in charge of countries that are 10 times bigger than Singapore. And these citizens in these countries also complain that their govt draws too much taxpayers' money!
The British PM earns 150k pounds annually, I last heard from Guardian. co.uk and BBC while the US President earns US$250k annually.
Our PM earns S$2m annually and we haven't counted the pay he gets from being Finance Minister and his chairmanship of the MAS etc.. Our lame duck President Nathan doesn't nothing except shake hands and eat free food and he gets US$2m!
Something is absolutely wrong here. It's an abuse of their powers for financial gain. -
I don know what you mean by family?PAP or MM and PM lee? In my mind, it has always the finance minstry who is incharge of such thing, any wealth that is take out or insert will go through the minister as in how much left, so on so for.Originally posted by miong:heavenlyfire
Since you seem to proport yourself to be a PAP extremist, you must surely know plenty about the PAP mindset.
Tell me, how is it possible that the entire wealth of our country has be to under the control of members of a family? I presume you find this PAP 'ruling' acceptable seeing you are such a fire-from-the-hip-gungho-advocate for PAP.
Then annually they have the finance report where the numbers will be account for. -
both 1 and 2 are symbol and identity that represent Singapore. 1 is supposed to be comparable to Sydney opera house while 2 is like statute of liberty. The merlion represent the combination lion of SAng nila Uthama and we as a fishing village.Originally posted by Agressor:From my observation, resentment or anti PAP sentiments were built up mainly due to the lack of trust in the party.
Singapore had experienced too many mistakes due to the shortsightedness of the ruling party. Much money were spent to see it go to waste. Below are some examples :
1) Esplanade that merely stood there like to durians.
2) Clone merlions that failed to bring in tourist
3) Logistic Hub which resulted in plenty of vacant warehouses in Toh Guan and one half complete in Tuas.
There are many many more examples that lead to the lpublic from loosing their faith in the party.
3, i not sure about that but i think there must be some reasons,so do you mean we built only when needed?morover the warehouses is built according to supply and demand.It is because at that year, the contractors forsee a demand in warehouses?just like houses?building cant be built overnight, otherwise it will be too late and may disrupt the supply and demand curve. hence the constant supply must be ther to prevent the large fluatation of prices. -
yes, you are right, i was abit agitated when i typed all these yesterday. My aplogies to those who are offended.Originally posted by pikamaster:heavenlyfire,
there is nothing very heavenly about this post of yours.
When you try and make judgements on issues, try not to get caught in slippery-slope emotionalism. it doesn't help your argument at all. Besides, look at AU or NZ or UK; Are their parliaments really chaotic? I think only Taiwan can be said to have a truely chaotic parliament, not the rest of the world.
And those last two lines, perhaps you do not understand the implication. A very devious strategy indeed, but here is the real meaning of thsoe last two lines, which I don't think you intended it to be: " Why don't you start thinking of all the sacrifices you can make for the government?" and the implication is : you are asking for people to sacrifice needlessly to the PAP, rather than actively participate in the relevant civil processes to amke sure that the PAP does its job properly.
Gracias,
the pikamaster
I am not sure about the things is AU,NZ or UK.If i never hear much in the news, it must mean they should be alright. like you say, my point is the future, it is the unknown, so we do not know until it happen.
compare to the past, i feel that the governemnt,especially PM lee, he has alreadly started to include us, public to give our views.
Tjis is because, he hope that we have the ownership in the ideas we give.
Even in RC committee, they now welcom suggestion from the public and give them credits for their suggestion, this is to let them have a sense of belonging for their ideas and let them have a sense of ownership.
some examples are the implementation of ERP and the holiday resorts. well, some public respond to the outcrys but some are still keeping quiet, so whose fault? the public should start to have a sense of belonging so they will feel obliged to speak out more. -
different countries apply different political system, there is no universal system that is applicable to all countries.Originally posted by timothytsgsg:It's simple. I won't vote for them when the time comes. I have always wanted to go overseas and learn how political systems work, how politics work, how business works and how it affect society at hand.
And then I'll be back. Then we will see whether the PAP can still rule with an iron fist.
human are flexible, so sytem controlling human will be flexible as well. If you think, we are dealing with engineering, maths or physis, then you are wrong.
Even in engineering, there is no 1 standard solution for one problem. itwill still depend on the engineer, the cost and time spent.
In other words, factors and circumstances change and they don remain. -
I don like politics, so i don go serious on it, just basing my arguements on knowledge and some common sense. so you mind telling me whos is JFK?Originally posted by timothytsgsg:Trying to be JFK? Sorry, but that's a poor attempt. And ur excuse about chaos in democracy is unfounded and baseless. It's the same old tired excuse LKY keeps on resorting to for the last 40 years and I'm sick of the same old nonsense.
Offer something new and fresh, please. Otherwise, just go back and think of a brand new argument. Remember, brand new. Not the recycled stuff, please.
yes, i admitted it is unfounded and baseless, anything can happen, life is unpredictable so is politics. -
for your first point, its easy,heard of 'environment subtainability'. the principal is that we cant developed all our land, as some will need to be left for the later generation, this is the same like, we cant pump all our natural resources and leave the latter generations to fend for themselves. you want to be cursed by them? that explain the vacant land. as for those warehouses and industrial estate, you don built them only when it is needed, because you need time to built those things.Originally posted by Lowclassman:Ya, ya,ya, also trying super hard for his own and Leech familys pockets as well.
Singapore's economy is dead that why is putting up casinos now.
HDB utilised only about one tenth of land in singapore for residential. JTC controls most of the industrial areas. Capitaland, Keppel land and Asccendas own lots of properties and lands. Todate, there are still loads of vacant lands, factories, warehouses and industry estates with very low low low demand.
Tell me, what is the rational of charging high rentals, high property cost high utilities and even ridiculous high postages fees on a tiny island? Now every authorities are trying to prove to the boss on their account books to look good and aiming to get fat fat bonuses for themselves at the expense of we siongaporen. So you think is this democratic soceity? deep thought will helps to enlighten your bird brain.
second point, are you saying that we can still buy a bowl of wan ton mee for $1.50 or SBS bus fares must still remain at 25 cents. do you know there is this word call inflation? about rentals and property cost, they are interrelated. if the property cost is high and rental low, what will happen. just like HK, ppl over there don buy property but rent them only. HDB idea is to let every singaporean has a home. about your point of authorities trying to get fat fat bonus, any example to quote?
and finally, if scolding me bird brain makes you feel superior, then please go ahead. only reflected badly on yourself. -
so you know about the usuable lands? even if HK is out?how you explain japan. 1 point for sure, singapore do not have that much land too and that brings me to your second point.Originally posted by Lowclassman:Do you know that the usable lands in Hong Kong is much smaller than singapore? What is their population??? 8 millions!!! dumb!
To build HDB flats for 4 and 5 rooms. Contractors tender at about 75k to 95k per unit from underground services, piling, service roads, landscaping and to the last painting and for people to move in and stay.
Tell me how much are they selling? How much interest of the loan for HDB flats were charging? The gov have utilised our hard earned CPF $$$ to invest with even higher returns and at what rate is our CPF interest we are getting?
What are average income of most singaporeans are earning these days?
Most of the age forties seeking new jobs at statutory board are being rejected. My brother experienced it.
That is why we flats couldnt be so cheap, so that owners can afford 2 units. then there will be an oversupply, at the same time is is to prevent owner from profitting to much from selling their houses and property price dont always increase, it has a cycle. Search for it at yahoo if you don believe.
all funds earned is pooled back in to the public funds where the wealth is use for subsidy for education, welfare, bursary and others.
CPF is a previlage, not an entitlement, Singapore is one of the few countries who have such funds. It is make compulsory by our government and its initial use, it so let us have savings when we are old. so who says the government never think for u?
i know the loan for hosing is quite high now and price keep increasing. well, things don remain constant. My proff told us that it will start to drop again when they realised that a marjority cant afford it, and trust me, they will adjust again, as all the industries is related, one fall will lead to the next.
As for your brother stat board application. Stat board always look for the best, so unless your brother has something that stands out. I am sorry, my sympathy. they say as long as you don mind any jobs, there will always be jobs available. please tell you brother not to give up. -
I not sure how much PM lee earn, but i last hear is that their pay is about $10000, any1 sure about actual figure?Originally posted by UTT100:wait & see!!! how long he has been in the ministry? u mean so far he is good at nothing, that's why we need to wait & see. Don't forget that for his one month salary, an average singaporean will need to work for at least a few yrs!!! 5 yrs, 6 yrs????
friend, be contended.
different ppl, different life.
when we were playing hide and seek, they will be in library reading politics, how to compare? -
ok, so we don talk about book, lets us look at successful example, Singapore.Originally posted by Profounder:Which history book?
The History of Singapore and Malaysia, underwritten by MOE and used in secondary schools?
Or Lee Kuan Yew's Memoir?
Heard of the name Lim Chin Siong??? Barisan Sosialis??
I can suggest a hundred other books for you amongst which are:
(1) The Politics of Social and Economic Controls in Singapore by Christopher Tremewan;
(2) No Man is an Island by James Minchin
(3) Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore by TJS George
(4) Lee Kuan Yew by Alex Josey
Please crawl out of the shell PAP has carved out for you.
If there is no LKY, where would we be? do you think we can sit infront of computer and type forum? be fair, we are still a fishing village back then. -
Too good and best of the best that failed to save lives before the Nicoll highway collapsed even with obivious tell-tale sign of giant mild steel 'I' section for structing that buckled for months!!!Originally posted by heavenlyfire:so you know about the usuable lands? even if HK is out?how you explain japan. 1 point for sure, singapore do not have that much land too and that brings me to your second point.
That is why we flats couldnt be so cheap, so that owners can afford 2 units. then there will be an oversupply, at the same time is is to prevent owner from profitting to much from selling their houses and property price dont always increase, it has a cycle. Search for it at yahoo if you don believe.
all funds earned is pooled back in to the public funds where the wealth is use for subsidy for education, welfare, bursary and others.
CPF is a previlage, not an entitlement, Singapore is one of the few countries who have such funds. It is make compulsory by our government and its initial use, it so let us have savings when we are old. so who says the government never think for u?
i know the loan for hosing is quite high now and price keep increasing. well, things don remain constant. My proff told us that it will start to drop again when they realised that a marjority cant afford it, and trust me, they will adjust again, as all the industries is related, one fall will lead to the next.
As for your brother stat board application. Stat board always look for the best, so unless your brother has something that stands out. I am sorry, my sympathy. they say as long as you don mind any jobs, there will always be jobs available. please tell you brother not to give up.
The Authorities' staff had failed to exercise its authority to investigate farther and to call for stop work?
That shows, are these bunch of good bananas that running the LTA??? Freaking idiot staff!!!! -
if what you say is true, i too feel that it is a bit too much.maybe there are reasons like to prevent the ministers from taking bribe or orther reasons? I know other countries minister take bribes, that is why their country never improve.Originally posted by timothytsgsg:Our PM earns S$2m annually and we haven't counted the pay he gets from being Finance Minister and his chairmanship of the MAS etc.. Our lame duck President Nathan doesn't nothing except shake hands and eat free food and he gets US$2m!
Something is absolutely wrong here. It's an abuse of their powers for financial gain.
one example is Malaysia and INdo. they are natural resources, yet they are still so-so after so many years, and even get manipulated by us. -
have you studied your history well. I presumed you must have failed your exam in history.Originally posted by heavenlyfire:ok, so we don talk about book, lets us look at successful example, Singapore.
If there is no LKY, where would we be? do you think we can sit infront of computer and type forum? be fair, we are still a fishing village back then.
Fishing village was before Raffles stepped into singapore.
Without LKy. Singapore will still be today with the help from Toh Chin Chye and Goh Keng Swee, Lim Kim San!!!!!! Without these 3 gentlemen helping there will be no LKY!!!!! -
yes that is a tradegy and an accident, no1 wanted such things to happen.Originally posted by Lowclassman:Too good and best of the best that failed to save lives before the Nicoll highway collapsed even with obivious tell-tale sign of giant mild steel 'I' section for structing that buckled for months!!! The Authorities' staff had failed to exercise its authority to investigate farther and to call for stop work?
That shows, are these bunch of good bananas that running the LTA??? Freaking idiot staff!!!!
this incident has somthing to do with personal professional ethics and anyway, the guilty will be punished.
does changing the government will help prevent such incident again, an inquiry has been conducted and just like hotel new world, hope this incident won happen again.