Awareness of gay issues in S'pore: A political perspective
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Yup, you have proven to be a fool. At least according to scientific research.Originally posted by PRP:Are u an intellectual?Do u want to discuss rationally or to quarrel?
Yes,a person may has an inclination to becomes a homo when young.But if his parrent tell him that such behaviour is wrong and give him a right sex education,then he may not develop into gay when he grows up.But for u,u keep saying homo is born & homo is right.If the majority of the society accept your belief,then all youngsters who have homo inclination would not be taught to change their sexual behaviour.
Is homosex a learned act?So am i a fool?
There's no point arguing so passionately about something, but without reading up on the issue. Most people will realise their sexual orientation around the age of puberty, when their body started to change. As can be seen in other articles I've posted. Such sexual orientation cannot be changed, if you scrutinise the findings from "ex-gay" groups (these are your religious people), you will realised that nothing has changed. The so-called "successful" group is compose of people who has more and more "Denial".. They still cant rid themselves of the attraction towards the same sex, they are just denying themselves to lead a life that has been given to them.
The following is from APA public info website:
Is Sexual Orientation a Choice?
No, human beings can not choose to be either gay or straight. Sexual orientation emerges for most people in early adolescence without any prior sexual experience. Although we can choose whether to act on our feelings, psychologists do not consider sexual orientation to be a conscious choice that can be voluntarily changed.
Can Therapy Change Sexual Orientation?
No. Even though most homosexuals live successful, happy lives, some homosexual or bisexual people may seek to change their sexual orientation through therapy, sometimes pressured by the influence of family members or religious groups to try and do so. The reality is that homosexuality is not an illness. It does not require treatment and is not changeable.
However, not all gay, lesbian, and bisexual people who seek assistance from a mental health professional want to change their sexual orientation. Gay, lesbian, and bisexual people may seek psychological help with the coming out process or for strategies to deal with prejudice, but most go into therapy for the same reasons and life issues that bring straight people to mental health professionals.
What About So-Called "Conversion Therapies"?
Some therapists who undertake so-called conversion therapy report that they have been able to change their clients' sexual orientation from homosexual to heterosexual. Close scrutiny of these reports however show several factors that cast doubt on their claims. For example, many of the claims come from organizations with an ideological perspective which condemns homosexuality. Furthermore, their claims are poorly documented. For example, treatment outcome is not followed and reported overtime as would be the standard to test the validity of any mental health intervention.
The American Psychological Association is concerned about such therapies and their potential harm to patients. In 1997, the Association's Council of Representatives passed a resolution reaffirming psychology's opposition to homophobia in treatment and spelling out a client's right to unbiased treatment and self-determination. Any person who enters into therapy to deal with issues of sexual orientation has a right to expect that such therapy would take place in a professionally neutral environment absent of any social bias. -
I dont know what's your intention to quote yourself?Originally posted by PRP:
I dont even understand the intention of your post.. -
News from Thailand. An attempt to reduce discrimination. Locally, we have the rather degrading "302" category to take care of gays, but then, most gays would rather not "out" themselves during medical classification for fear of being humiliated, discriminated.
Thailand OKs Gay, Transsexual Soldiers
by 365Gay.com Newscenter Staff
(Bangkok) Thailand on Wednesday removed restrictions on gays and transsexuals serving in the military. Thailand has a draft but gays and transsexuals have been barred from serving under the "mental disorder" exemption.
All Thai men at the age of 20 are required by law to register to serve. Recruits are selected through a lottery system, but each year thousands of LGBT draftees are rejected. Wednesday the military announced that it was removing homosexuality and transgenderism from its list of mental disorders following years of complaints from the LGBT community that the ban was discriminatory.
The military said that the change was part of a program to keep up with a changing society. "The existing conscription law has been promulgated since 1954, when there were few homosexuals and transvestites, but society is changing very fast, so the army is in the process of amending the law and omitting those words from the certificate," said Lt. Gen. Arthorn Lohitkul, director general of the Army Reserve Command.
The campaign to amend the requirements for conscription was launched by LGBT civil activist Natee Theerarojnaphong. "No employer wants to hire anyone with a record of mental disorder to work in his company," Natee said, adding that people with mental disorders are also unable to make certain legal agreements.
A celebrity Thai-style kickboxer who underwent surgery to become a woman, Parinya Charoenphol, complained on local television after being exempt from the military. "The words 'mental disorder' marked on the certificate seriously affects our lives," said Parinya. Thailand is a Buddhist country where homosexuals, transvestites and transsexuals are largely tolerated. Gay and transvestite actors play key roles in Thai movies and television soap operas.
The change was hailed in the US by gays fighting for inclusion in the military.
"Neither sexual orientation nor gender identity has any impact on a service member's ability to get the job done," Steve Ralls, a spokesperson for the Servicemembers Legal Defense Network told 365Gay.com. "The United States armed forces should follow the Thai military's example and place qualification above prejudice. Our armed forces should end to the military's unfair discrimination against lesbian, gay bisexual and transgender military personnel."
A bill is pending in Congress to repeal the military's ban and allow lesbian and gay Americans the opportunity to serve openly. A study done by the Government Accountability Office shows that more than 10,000 service members have been discharged over the last 10 years under "don't ask, don't tell". -
Is it true that MDC has many "302s" serving?
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long thread, i didn't follow.
but i just read my cousin's blog and learned that he has just broken off with a guy, (my cousin is a guy), i am very shocked, so this thread attracted me.
i feel that some ppl (and i suspect my cousin too) venture into this sort of thing becos they find it fashionable to do so.
am i correct? -
Possibly? But then that can be said about people entering into heterosexual relationships as well.
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And what exactly is the harm in that? What is the advantage in you trying to force these youngsters into heterosexuality?Originally posted by PRP:.If the majority of the society accept your belief,then all youngsters who have homo inclination would not be taught to change their sexual behaviour. -
First of all, I encourage you to take some time to go through the information here.Originally posted by TehJarVu:long thread, i didn't follow.
but i just read my cousin's blog and learned that he has just broken off with a guy, (my cousin is a guy), i am very shocked, so this thread attracted me.
i feel that some ppl (and i suspect my cousin too) venture into this sort of thing becos they find it fashionable to do so.
am i correct?
And the answer to your question is Nope. Being gay is never fashionable. You will start to realise you are different once you hit puberty. While classmates of yours are busy looking at the opposite gender, you have to hide your inner feelings towards the same gender. If you are found out, you will be ostracised.
In fact, lots of gays do not ever want others to find out that they are gays.
If you have time, talk to your cousin, but without passing judgements. Just understand what it takes to be an "outsider" of the mainstream culture. -
dont think there will be official figure on that.Originally posted by iveco:Is it true that MDC has many "302s" serving?
but in general, gays are more drawn towards the performing arts. and hence, should have a higher chance for them to self-select into a set-up like MDC.
however, do also note that not all gays will want to sign on the 302, it's degrading to sound the least. -
i'm straight but i also wanna go to mdc..
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Your immediately wrong if you treat homosexuality as a fundamental mistake in the nature of things,you see, there are no mistakes in science and nature.
Some say homosexuality is a learned behaviour, other argue that it is its a part of a person's innate instincts.Common belief that it is a combination of the 2.
Sure, you can change the behaviour, as it is but just the execution of the thought. And since the mind controls the thought, the behaviour can similarily be controlled, but it is as far as that.
An individual may be able to repress his homosexuality by not acting out,and "learn" heterosexuality,but he is not forgotten of his original sexuality. That the behaviour can cease to exist but the thought which causes it remains.The problem with this arguement is that it treats homosexuality as a learned behaviour. Sure, it may be true, but if homosexuality is a learned behaviour, wouldnt heterosexuality similarily be a learned behaviour too?
If you regard it as a matter of genes, then theres no arguement at all.They were born way, so were you and I, and neither of any of us did have a choice on who we wanted to be, and if we wanted to be something else, we had to repress our innermost, or rather our fundamental physiology.
Now that would be wrong -
Earthlings,
U said i am a fool,so i say u are a lousy intellectual. -
Is sodomy a learned act?I believe it should be.
One can feel attracted to both same sex or opposite sex persons.Such attraction is of course not within our control.But whether to have sex with same or opposite sex person,it is a willful act.So if a homo wants to engage in homosex,then don't blame the gene cause it! -
Originally posted by PRP:
Heng said the above msg was written by a fool.I post this msg again to let other readers to judge.
[b]A way to be accepted
Everybody kows smoking is wrong.But we accept smokers.Smokers don't argue there is no right or wrong about smoking.They also don't argue smokers are born.They don't form an association to fight for their rghts.Yet society accept smokers despite their wrong habbit.Homosexuals,I think you all can learn from them.[/b] -
Well your not a fool but ur arguement is void.
No.1
Smokers make a concious choice about smoking, Homosexuality, is rarely a concious choice.
No.2
Smokers don't for thier rights, because apparently, their rights have not been infringed on, even when they are openly a smoker. And as far as smokers are concerned, the discrimination they face are a fraction of those faced by homosexuals.
Homosexuals,however, if they are out of the closet, face harmul discrimination, lesser job opportunities, "gay bashing". Even certain schools expel students because they are gay.Sexual contact between 2 males, 2 females, in Singapore, is still considered a crime.
No.3
Sure, you may argue that smoking is a wrong habit.
It is not.
smoking is a bad habit, it is not a wrong habit.If it was wrong,or in clearer terms, socially unacceptable,then it would be criminal.
Homosexuality on the other hand, is not right or wrong, it is a variant of natural behaviour in humans.Who is to decide whether homsexuality is wrong or not? It would like deciding whether being a woman is wrong, because homosexuality is not a habit, it is a mindset, it is a behaviour, it is a way of life. Homosexuality is not something which u can get rid of if you are affected by it, because it is not a problem in the first place, it is something different. -
whoops
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so why must homosexuals practice total abstinence? isn't this a discrimination. is sexual drive natural? oh hell it is. most people cannot go through an entire life without sex.Originally posted by PRP:Is sodomy a learned act?I believe it should be.
One can feel attracted to both same sex or opposite sex persons.Such attraction is of course not within our control.But whether to have sex with same or opposite sex person,it is a willful act.So if a homo wants to engage in homosex,then don't blame the gene cause it!
so how can we trust what you believe in? any evidences to share? you cannot use "what you think" as an evidence to support any position. In the past, we have Philosophy to do that. But then, in modern days, we have Sciences to help address these issues.
so far, we have not seen how did you construct your arguments. Rather, you have accepted that gays are wrong and refuse to read or listen to any comments that follow.
I do not need to show that you are a fool. The references I quoted help me to do the job. Hey wait, did you even read those articles? do u have any comments on those articles? -
What is your point? I don't get it. Please humour me.Originally posted by PRP:Is sodomy a learned act?I believe it should be.
One can feel attracted to both same sex or opposite sex persons.Such attraction is of course not within our control.But whether to have sex with same or opposite sex person,it is a willful act.So if a homo wants to engage in homosex,then don't blame the gene cause it! -
Ahpeh,Originally posted by PRP:Is sodomy a learned act?I believe it should be.
One can feel attracted to both same sex or opposite sex persons.Such attraction is of course not within our control.But whether to have sex with same or opposite sex person,it is a willful act.So if a homo wants to engage in homosex,then don't blame the gene cause it!
The above msg show that sexual actions are concious acts.
earthlings,
There are monks, & Catholic priests in this world.They abstain from sex. -
But what is their sexual orientation in the first place? Anyway, abstaining from sex does not mean these clergymen can't go dating at all before they take up religious life.Originally posted by PRP:earthlings,
There are monks, & Catholic priests in this world.They abstain from sex. -
So your point is that since the act of intercourse is a conscious act, we should stop doing so?
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PRP dont twist my words.
Im not talking about the act of intercourse, but Homosexuality in general, Homosexuality is not a concious choice, a person does not decide which sex he is attracted 2. -
Agree...Originally posted by ahpeh:PRP dont twist my words.
Im not talking about the act of intercourse, but Homosexuality in general, Homosexuality is not a concious choice, a person does not decide which sex he is attracted 2.
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The title of this thread is very misleading. Whatever discussed did not offer any political perspective to the gay issues in Singapore at all. This dicussion should be in Chit Chat and not here.
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It is about the level of awareness in the political scene.Originally posted by lotus999:The title of this thread is very misleading. Whatever discussed did not offer any political perspective to the gay issues in Singapore at all. This dicussion should be in Chit Chat and not here.
The current detour in discourse is due to "troll" like behaviours of some users which is out of our control.
To help, I promise not to reply to PRP's posts anymore.