Should NSF be paid the same amount as professional?
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The whole thing is called 'National Service' wat... meaning you are doing the nation a service ... mahiam like you owe the nation ba...
Let face it Sg cant afford a professional army of 250,000 the size need to deter our aggressor ...can imagine wat the expenditure would be like... of cos I strongly beleive they can improve servicemen welfare more loh... especailly 4 ns men like me... ex. more discount for ns men buying flat , car than those PR alway talk cock , never serve..
Lastly, like it or not, fair or unfair u still have to serve ... like they say ' Serve and F Off' I hate reservist but no choice still got to go..
I salute those nsf i met during my active time... who serve with their heart and might ! -
Serving NS is a must- but there are many better ways to go around it. Let's put it in this way: there's no real system of a reward moltivation system. Plus in order to be an officer, they dun look at ur leadership ability, they actually look at your education cert! So ITE people will get nowhere coz they onli hv ITE diplomas!Originally posted by seancannot:The whole thing is called 'National Service' wat... meaning you are doing the nation a service ... mahiam like you owe the nation ba...
Let face it Sg cant afford a professional army of 250,000 the size need to deter our aggressor ...can imagine wat the expenditure would be like... of cos I strongly beleive they can improve servicemen welfare more loh... especailly 4 ns men like me... ex. more discount for ns men buying flat , car than those PR alway talk cock , never serve..
Lastly, like it or not, fair or unfair u still have to serve ... like they say ' Serve and F Off' I hate reservist but no choice still got to go..
I salute those nsf i met during my active time... who serve with their heart and might !
And nowadays NS pple very bo chap. They dun give a fark about things. they do things, yes but coz they dun have a choice. If there's a war, these are the people who will run away first. Why? Because they don't give a flying fark at the 1st place.
Why defend a system that discriminates you by your background at the 1st place? Even I'd refuse to defend this govt in times of war. For my family and friends, yes. But for LKY and his PAP idiots? No way in hell will I do that. -
Safer yes. But coz US is a superpower. We are not. What we do need is a reform of the NS system. The 1st priority is to reform the wage system. Because pple still need money to survive. Paying them peanuts(not the NKF type) will not work.Originally posted by SMAPLionHeart:USA troops are paid more , but when war comes , you will be the eventually sent to fight over-seas...
Judging from previous wartime history of USA , i think its safer to serve with SAF..
at least you get to keep your life and the allowance.
Nah , i won't do extra much during training , slack as much as i can..
i don't wanna die after 2 years, i still wanna migrate
Military hardware is important but so is the military software. Treat the software as though they are crap and the software will get spolit. In the end, if software spolit, then who to depend on to drive the hardware?
It's like operating windows computer without an Windows XP OS. -
My brother loves reservist call back though. He said it is extra paid holidays for him. In reservist, he basically act blur fuck, siam all jobs, and visit the medical center nearly everyday. My house has about 5 bottles of cough syrup, 50 or so tablets, some iodine solutions, and other army "sponsored" stuff.
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He should just geng schizophrenia and get pes f.Originally posted by Cindyfeh:My brother loves reservist call back though. He said it is extra paid holidays for him. In reservist, he basically act blur fuck, siam all jobs, and visit the medical center nearly everyday. My house has about 5 bottles of cough syrup, 50 or so tablets, some iodine solutions, and other army "sponsored" stuff. 
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the US has an annual military budget of USD400 billion.. 5 times singapore's annual GNPOriginally posted by timothytsgsg:US National Guard soldiers are paid a basic US$900 a month for their services- and that doesn't include bonuses and money to pay for the soldier's college(University) tuition fees.
The NS men are vastly underpaid while the state pays too much money for military hardware. I sense a vast un-balancing of financial priorities here honestly. instead of blaming our high military expenses you should blame the government for filling their coffers while emptying ours. -
Singapore can afford to pay it's soldiers more , provided it has a ratio of it's troops according to it's population size.
China , its about 1 billion for 3 million troops
Singapore , its about 4 million for 250,000 troops
1:250
1:16...alot of difference...
Heck ,PRC soldiers aren't that well paid either.
Singapore is also trying to make people from China to make up the shortfall by migrating..just like what over forefathers did.
Never did they expect this to be a hell-hole.
But having a PRC sg army would be good , as in fills in the manpower , but the question of loyalty comes into place then.
But if some forumites are able to question the loyalty of other races of singaporeans , why should we even question the loyalty of the prc pple?
So i support the government's move to make more PRC pple serve SAF.
After all , SG is a migrant country. -
How is that possible? I mean they are the lower hierachy. We should be more afraid of regularOriginally posted by macjoe:Agree.
Can't imagine how stable our national security and defence are when $1000/mth NSmen in vital installations succumb to $$$ bribes.
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Will someone please enlighten us on how much debt the US government is in?Originally posted by timothytsgsg:US National Guard soldiers are paid a basic US$900 a month for their services- and that doesn't include bonuses and money to pay for the soldier's college(University) tuition fees.
The NS men are vastly underpaid while the state pays too much money for military hardware. I sense a vast un-balancing of financial priorities here honestly.
Singapore is such a punitive state as compared to the US. The only why the US dollar has yet to reach the status of the rupiah is because our dear friend, Uncle Sam is a world superpower.
As to settle why NSFs are 'underpaid', I do agree that the payouts do not equal the jobscopes of NSF, or even NSmen. But we must realise two things: The first being, that the liability of a NSF as compared to a regular is very different. The second being that one is a job whilst the other is a service.
Being passed as law, consider yourself lucky that you still get some allowance. Compare yourself with those in North Korea and perhaps you'll find a whole lot of difference.
Always count your blessings! It's easy to just complain and look at someone who is in a better position. -
National Service is really doing the nation a service. Never forget besides providing food, lodging and clothing, SAF, SPF or CDF also provide a integral part of call "making milk drinking boys into beer drinking men"!!
The kind of training we received during NS stays with us for life. I am not talking about firing a rifle, but the bonding, team work etc. I think everyone can agree that NS really helps build up our characters.
Just one funny example, till today, my portion of personal belongings are still neater than my wife's. REALLY. Like Macham every morning got RSM do stand by bed....
This is the kind of "education" or whatever you call it that $$ can't buy. -
I never said once that NS wasn't benefictal. I only said we need to respect Singaporeans who are in NS.
My view is that NS soldiers should get paid more for their service to the nation, period. As simple as that. We know that NS is a service to the nation, we know that it has benefits for men in Singapore. We all know all of that.
The only thing I'm asking of you is this: NS people need a fairer system. They need more pay. They need something to motivate them. This system doesn't give them enough respect and enough money for survival. What's wrong with giving them more money each month to survive?
Is that wrong? Sure they will learn things in the army, as I will do, but they deserve to eat and survive as anyone else does. That's why we need to increase the pay of NS men in the army- the first and foremost of any reform in the NS system.
And where to get the money? Simple- cut down on the salaries of the bloated civil service and the government itself and use the saved money for the salaries of the NS men. In addition, the over-investment of excess military hardware can be diverted to help increase the salary of every NS men.
I don't believe in allowances. As long as you are servicing the nation, it also means you work for the nation. And as long as you work for the nation and its people, you deserve a salary as any other citizen would do.
Its as simple as that. -
there is always the Linux.... and openoffice...Originally posted by timothytsgsg:It's like operating windows computer without an Windows XP OS. -
Well, any computer w/o an OS system is basically useless. Any high-tech fighter jet without a pliot will also be useless.Originally posted by hmsg:there is always the Linux.... and openoffice...
It's the same: mistreat NSF men and in a war, these guys will not fight for you. If we continue to remain stubborn and continue to think everything is still alright when it's not, then when the time comes for us to fight, it will be too damn late by then.
Change is inevitable. We are not changing for the sake of change, but we are changing because the system has to evolve with the times. Time doesn't stand still for our army at all. -
Kinda silly to do NS (brand of education) to gain some kind of holiday experience.Originally posted by ndsef:National Service is really doing the nation a service. Never forget besides providing food, lodging and clothing, SAF, SPF or CDF also provide a integral part of call "making milk drinking boys into beer drinking men"!!
The kind of training we received during NS stays with us for life. I am not talking about firing a rifle, but the bonding, team work etc. I think everyone can agree that NS really helps build up our characters.
Just one funny example, till today, my portion of personal belongings are still neater than my wife's. REALLY. Like Macham every morning got RSM do stand by bed....
This is the kind of "education" or whatever you call it that $$ can't buy.
Try to land a job after NS with that "education" and experience with a competing female candidate with a 2-years diploma cert with zero NS "education" & experience. Even a 5-star NS cert is pretty much useless to the employer.
To me, NS is real intellect brain damage and job education & career suicide.