Our Land Acquisition Acts are such bullies~!Originally posted by robertteh:The church concerned was finally compensated on the correct use class namely car park not road reserve at S$17,000, a jump from S$1.00 originally awarded by the minister. Minister is human and can be grossly inaccurate.
The whole MRT team has all the soil reports of MRT lines so what is new?Originally posted by ndsef:It seems that from the report, it was only known recently that Hock Kee house is build on marine clay with a concrete foundation base which is dangerous. The excavation works will cause the building to collapse. The residents are given 1 month's notice to move rather than the usual 5 years due to the delays in excavation works from the stoppage of works after the Nicoll Highway Incident. To make matters worse, Nishimatsu is claiming for damages from LTA for the delays. In order not to incur unneccessary damages for the delay which WILL EAT INTO OUR TAXPAYERS' MONEY, LTA is forced to give only 1 month's notice.
I think it is premature and to make a very uneducated remark that LTA is bullying the residents of Hock Kee House. The Circle Line which was built for the benefit of the citizens, and DO WE WANT TO WAIT 5 YEARS FOR THE CIRCLE LINE CONSTRUCTION TO CONTINUE AND PAY DAMAGES FOR THE 5 YEARS TO THE MAIN CONTRACTOR? Together with the construction time estimated at 2 years, we will have to wait a total of 7 years for the circle line to be up and running!!!
If that is to happen, wouldn't the good people of Singapore complain again?
So if you are LTA, what would you do? I think we should all look at the bigger picture before grumbling....
Yes MRT should have the soil reports of the MRT Lines... NOT THE SURRONDING BUILDINGS.Originally posted by robertteh:The whole MRT team has all the soil reports of MRT lines so what is new?
In any event the MRT Team should have a good consultant and qualified engineers to design the whole protective cofferdam complete with all the monitoring instruments around all excacated sites so what is new?
If they have the project team holding site meetings they should have discovered soil movements or unusual settlements long ago at the beginning of the project and taken precautions long before now.
So why wait till they are stopped by the Nicol Highway case? If in between Nicol Highway stoppage and project start-up date there has been a delay, delay certification should be recorded and contractor made answerable with project team asked to explain.
Why blame this period of project delay on Hock Kee residents who in any event are customers to be treated with due consdieration not some contractors to be penalised.
Originally posted by ndsef:Unfortunately, soil reports will have to be taken AROUND the sites of the MRT line - this includes all buildings that can be affected by the MRT Line.
Yes MRT should have the soil reports of the MRT Lines... NOT THE SURRONDING BUILDINGS.
:It was reported that HOCK KEE HOUSE is constructed on top of marine clay, and on foundation slabs instead of deep piles.
Why build unneccessary protections here and there to hold up one building?
Yes they have a project team, well so did the Samsung in the case of the leaning building at Church Street.
No one is blaming the Nicoll Highway stoppage as a delay. The delay now is due to the discovery of Hock Kee House's foundation, which is beyond the control of both LTA and Nishimatsu. The Hock Kee House residents are definitely not blamed.
:Is the concern of the residents merely about the sum to be compensated ?
I feel that the question is not the time of one month to move. The problem is with the compensation. Yet no one has brought it up in this thread. IF the residents are compensated say, $500,000 each instead of $100,000 on top of the state valuation then I guess no one will complain. The Clinic for example has already a drop in number of patients visiting, and by the way, I seriously don't think it will take a month to renovate a new clinic.
Originally posted by Atobe:An interesting point you have raised. It is insightful that perhaps the whole urgency to have tenants evicted from Hock Kee is just a smokescreen to acquire the land under the pretense that the circle line will render the structrual integrity unsound.
Is the concern of the residents merely about the sum to be compensated ?
Was it only about the EXTRA COMPENSATION over and above that to be paid for the property ?
It was already made known that compensation will be based on MARKET VALUE, with the value to be assessed by a licensed property valuer, and yet the various strata owners remain worried - and reported by Channel NewsAsia as follows:
Most do understand the need to move out because of safety concerns but they also feel they have few options when relocating.
A day after the shock announcement by the LTA, Hock Kee House tenants and residents are finding themselves in a very complicated situation.
The LTA had acquired the property and is set to demolish it before the Circle Line construction near the Paya Lebar MRT station resumes.
Hock Kee House will be unsafe once the deep excavation works begin.
But the residents say it is not just a simple matter of packing up and leaving.
They have engaged property consultants and even lawyers to help them out.
The tenants and residents have two major concerns: one is the value of their property right now; the second is that they feel a month is simply not enough time for them to move out.
Said property consultant Angela Lee, "Normally, for a seller in order to complete a case, it takes about five months from the start of the property they want to buy. So based on one month it is a bit short for them to move out from their present situation."
Said Ng Hock Chau, who owns property in Hock Kee House, "Because my purchase price is high -- half a million – I still owe the bank S$300,000. If the price they give is lower than that I make a big loss."
Another property owner, Kelvin Tan, said, "At this point, we're not willing to sell our property. This is our investment; we will wait until a better opportunity for market price and we sell. If the government wants us to take back (the property) now according to market price then our investment is going to incur a heavy loss."
Many have yet to sign the agreement to give up their property and are reluctant to do so.
Seriously, this entire exercise by LTA in acquiring the entire building seems very odd, especially when similar properties of the same age, structural design, and soil conditions have existed in the other lines.
Could it be the property was targetted for its strategic location, and when it has a lease for 999 years - (nearly as good as a Freehold Property) ?
Interestingly enough, HOCK KEE HOUSE sits at a strategic site:
- bounded by Paya Lebar Road, Sims Avenue and Geylang Road;
- diagonally across City Plaza;
- and in the good company of Tanjong Katong Complex and the space age design of the Singapore Post Office;
- it is also near the Paya Lebar MRT station.
After the original Hock Kee House is demolished, will any new commercial cum residential building not fetch a much higher price ?
Given the understanding of the present, and the potential value of the future, what should be the compensation value payable to the present strata titled property owners ?
nsdf, surely the Ruling Party a.k.a the present Singapore Government and the LTA do not need you to be their spokesman - (again) - this time ?
[b]Channel NewsAsia: Hock Kee House residents worried LTA compensations not enough : 12 August 2005
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/162849/1/.html
Channel NewsAsia: Hock Kee House near Circle Line construction to be demolished: 11 August 2005
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/162710/1/.html
[/b]
I doubt the low compensation is the real issue here. From what Atobe describes it, the situation appears somewhat dodgy.Originally posted by sbst275:Those tenants should not go to lawyers and ask for more bef Govt compensate.. Govt would purposely lower their compensation...
Just wait and see
Last time when Senett Est was accquired, some ppl there engaged lawyers, end up less compensation... There was 1, end up compensated $1M w/o getting lawyerOriginally posted by iveco:I doubt the low compensation is the real issue here. From what Atobe describes it, the situation appears somewhat dodgy.![]()
Not five years, dump~!Originally posted by ndsef:It seems that from the report, it was only known recently that Hock Kee house is build on marine clay with a concrete foundation base which is dangerous. The excavation works will cause the building to collapse. The residents are given 1 month's notice to move rather than the usual 5 years due to the delays in excavation works from the stoppage of works after the Nicoll Highway Incident. To make matters worse, Nishimatsu is claiming for damages from LTA for the delays. In order not to incur unneccessary damages for the delay which WILL EAT INTO OUR TAXPAYERS' MONEY, LTA is forced to give only 1 month's notice.
I think it is premature and to make a very uneducated remark that LTA is bullying the residents of Hock Kee House. The Circle Line which was built for the benefit of the citizens, and DO WE WANT TO WAIT 5 YEARS FOR THE CIRCLE LINE CONSTRUCTION TO CONTINUE AND PAY DAMAGES FOR THE 5 YEARS TO THE MAIN CONTRACTOR? Together with the construction time estimated at 2 years, we will have to wait a total of 7 years for the circle line to be up and running!!!
If that is to happen, wouldn't the good people of Singapore complain again?
So if you are LTA, what would you do? I think we should all look at the bigger picture before grumbling....
I disagree with you, ndsef.Originally posted by ndsef:It seems that from the report, it was only known recently that Hock Kee house is build on marine clay with a concrete foundation base which is dangerous. The excavation works will cause the building to collapse. The residents are given 1 month's notice to move rather than the usual 5 years due to the delays in excavation works from the stoppage of works after the Nicoll Highway Incident. To make matters worse, Nishimatsu is claiming for damages from LTA for the delays. In order not to incur unneccessary damages for the delay which WILL EAT INTO OUR TAXPAYERS' MONEY, LTA is forced to give only 1 month's notice.
I think it is premature and to make a very uneducated remark that LTA is bullying the residents of Hock Kee House. The Circle Line which was built for the benefit of the citizens, and DO WE WANT TO WAIT 5 YEARS FOR THE CIRCLE LINE CONSTRUCTION TO CONTINUE AND PAY DAMAGES FOR THE 5 YEARS TO THE MAIN CONTRACTOR? Together with the construction time estimated at 2 years, we will have to wait a total of 7 years for the circle line to be up and running!!!
If that is to happen, wouldn't the good people of Singapore complain again?
So if you are LTA, what would you do? I think we should all look at the bigger picture before grumbling....
Originally posted by BillyBong:If we make a survey of all the properties that exist on top of - (or immediately adjacent to) - any MRT Station, it is very significant to note that the properties are owned by the Government, or Government Linked Companies, or those Companies that has very close relations with the Government a.k.a the Ruling Party.
An interesting point you have raised. It is insightful that perhaps the whole urgency to have tenants evicted from Hock Kee is just a smokescreen to acquire the land under the pretense that the circle line will render the structrual integrity unsound.
Unfortunately, only time will tell whether this is indeed the true motive of the LTA. And by that time, many will have forgotten this incident.
A very tidy arrangement if indeed true.
Originally posted by ndsef:In a society that the government has moulded in its own image, in which only MONEY MOVES MOUNTAINS, can you blame the residents for asking the double the compensation that was offered ?
Hey Atobe, seems I am right to make a comment on the size of the compensation. See, the residents are asking for double. This is a classic example that everything has a price, and in this case the price for them to shift out in one month is $200k, and their own valuations of their property, which I believe will never happen.
Valuations are usually done by neutral parties, as in, when you buy a house, it is the bank who does it and not the seller or the buyer. But in this case, the valuations will definitely be seen as biased, since it is the buyer (garmen) who will be buying over the property. But from the garmen pt of view, the seller's valuation will also be biased. So how?![]()
If that day came, it would be another Hotel New World scenario.Originally posted by Agressor:I can't help imagining, if Nicol highway had not collapsed and prompted LTA to stop excurvation and do a detailed study of the soil and building around the circle line, will they discover the problem before Hock Kee house collapse?
Property valuations are decided on (I believe) using three methods, and one of the methods is what you posted, using records of similar properties sold within the vicinity. But what is vicinity? I had come across cases of that my clients had to fight it out with IRAS on the Annual Value of their property. Can you believe that IRAS actually concluded that a condo unit along Bt. Timah Road near Newton is the same as a condo found on Upp Bt. Timah Road near Hillview? Anyone in the property line would know the vast difference in value as well as district!!!Originally posted by Atobe:Will it not be best to have valuation from at least three property valuers of some public standing ?
Alternatively, the records of similar properties sold within the vicinity of Hock Kee House, can be used to determine the value of this subject property.
It is not so difficult to achieve a fair arbitrated value, as there are set precedents for such matters.
It all depends on the Government, if they wish to be fair towards the Property Owners of Hock Kee Houser.