Send Ram Tiwary back to Singapore to hang
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I wonder... doesn't the same thing apply for IRs?Originally posted by Nelstar:Surface viewing is always so nice.
Stop looking on the surface. There are many hidden unknowns before you can put the two to comparison.
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Wahaha, we might as well become priests in that case.Originally posted by Nelstar:Buddhism advocates in living a secular life, without procreation without suffering.
Are you going to have babies in the future?
No wonder the Government has a problem with population crisis. -
It's an artful deception.Originally posted by iveco:I think you gotta ask Robert Teh about this one. If I am not wrong, he posted something about the Swiss system of referendum regatrding important policies in his "Definition of True Democracy" thread. It's a long thread, though. Surprised that it's still alive. But I must say the posts there are getting boring.
They are better than PAP... at least they bluffed an entire nation to believe their voices were heard.
My Government didn't.. that's why we have iveco and me. -
Anything and everything can be wrong and biased. pikamaster. Just that I felt that hanging is wrong but it's a good deterrent does not mean all fear the noose.Originally posted by pikamaster:I wonder... doesn't the same thing apply for IRs?
My fear of the noose is not about death, but just a personnal ego problem. I fear the noose because I felt all my education was ruined if I ever went to the gallows.
There is no such objective except for us to understand differing views in here.
If you want to insist in rights or wrongs, there isn't. Every legal system by itself is a flaw of our society. If our people can do everything to protect the interest of others, then there wont be so much problems or such needs.
It's life.
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Wow, the discussion has moved into casinos. Way off topic, isn't it?
Anyway, the bottomline is that Tiwary has committed an offence in NSW and should be subject to local laws. After all, when in Rome, do as Romans do. When in Sydney, do as Sydneysiders do. -
Nelstar,Originally posted by Nelstar:iveco, you're comparing the wrong things again.
HOW many times must I reiterate that change cannot come astronomically. Yes it would be ideal if there is no death penalty.
First we got to ensure that every generation goes through the education channel.
The education level between us and our elders differ so much that we must always amend the law to keep in touch with them and their lives.
YOU are not alone in this world iveco, how many times must I remind you that laws must be amended to keep in touch with the society.
2) The Death Penalty is not like the education system. You either abolish the Penalty, or you retain it. For an education system, you would change it bit by bit, but that is because the change required is much more than for the Death Penalty. Or else, how do we have a half-death Penalty? Look, none of us here are suggesting that murderers should go unpunnished.
3) ok... but shouldn't the govt be a little more pro-active?
4) What is so hard about telling our elders, "the Death Penalty is immoral, we should scrap it from our law"? Do they require a uni degree in order to understand the statement?
5) Interesting. Then why is section 277 of the Penal Code not removed; after all, social forces demand the need for the "Pink Dollar", don't they?
Anyway, you contradict what you said in the previous paragraph. Does society only consist of out elders? What about what the activist young want? Or are they not part of your "society"?
:X:X:X:X:X:X
the (uncomprehending) pikamaster -
2) Changes in the laws must reflect the needs of a society. The Death Penalty is still a much fear deterrent. I still think it's more effective than life-imprisonment.Originally posted by pikamaster:Nelstar,
2) The Death Penalty is not like the education system. You either abolish the Penalty, or you retain it. For an education system, you would change it bit by bit, but that is because the change required is much more than for the Death Penalty. Or else, how do we have a half-death Penalty? Look, none of us here are suggesting that murderers should go unpunnished.
3) ok... but shouldn't the govt be a little more pro-active?
4) What is so hard about telling our elders, "the Death Penalty is immoral, we should scrap it from our law"? Do they require a uni degree in order to understand the statement?
5) Interesting. Then why is section 277 of the Penal Code not removed; after all, social forces demand the need for the "Pink Dollar", don't they?
Anyway, you contradict what you said in the previous paragraph. Does society only consist of out elders? What about what the activist young want? Or are they not part of your "society"?
:X:X:X:X:X:X
the (uncomprehending) pikamaster
3) Tell the Govt that not me.
4) The fact that they are still rooted to their thinking says very much of our difficulties to tell them.
5) The problem is, not all lawmakers are happy to change a law. And to me, the pink dollar is a topic of 'you are not forced to gamble, you gamble your fault.' Whether it exist or not, I can handle my own affairs well.
For the elders/young ones, there is the compromise of a judge. -
That I agree from page 1 with iveco.Originally posted by iveco:Wow, the discussion has moved into casinos. Way off topic, isn't it?
Anyway, the bottomline is that Tiwary has committed an offence in NSW and should be subject to local laws. After all, when in Rome, do as Romans do. When in Sydney, do as Sydneysiders do.
We should not meddle with the laws of another country even though the affected victims are our citizens.
In fact, we should respect their jurisdication system. -
Scandinavian are completely different societies for any meaningful comparison for goodness sake. Their populations are very homogeneous with long history and are nationalistic, they have very tight immigration laws to prevent foreigners from staying put, 90% of their population are Lutheran, one religion!! Their tax is about 50% and vat is something like 25%!! and the state take care of them in every aspect, may be that's why they still love their kings.Originally posted by iveco:I've been in Scandinavian cities before, and I feel much safer there than in JB or KL.
How you compare the legal system necessary for such countries to countries here which have short history since independence, where different races and religions mix, immigrants still come and go, foreigners are as many as locals, wide income gaps among the citizens..... ?? Not only you should know that "laws must be amended to keep in touch with the society", do you know the differences in these societies?
I was told that in scandinavia, guest workers or foreign workers are segregated physically, living in ghetto, muslims there are not allowed to have mosque that has any resemblance of a mosque anywhere, that sure reminds me of the Third Reich era. -
today newspaper got this man sexually abused his neighbours dotter. knn this kind of person shd be hanged also
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iveco be careful now. crazy monkey might want to call for you to be hanged next.Originally posted by crazy monkey:today newspaper got this man sexually abused his neighbours dotter. knn this kind of person shd be hanged also -
Wahaha, my conscience is clear. Also, where I am now the law doesn't allow extradition to places with capital punishment. Precisely why we took so long with Mike McCrea. Ah Hao should have done the same but he's a retard, anyway.Originally posted by Nelstar:iveco be careful now. crazy monkey might want to call for you to be hanged next. -
do you have to go below the belt?Originally posted by iveco:Wahaha, my conscience is clear. Also, where I am now the law doesn't allow extradition to places with capital punishment. Precisely why we took so long with Mike McCrea. Ah Hao should have done the same but he's a retard, anyway. -
The elders will tell you lucky there is canning and death penalty in singapore to take care of the gangsters. Otherwise ppl are prepared to kill as long as you promise him some money for him when he gets out of jail. When a gang of twenty ppl slash a person to death, the government can't put all 20 in jails for life, can they?Originally posted by pikamaster:4) What is so hard about telling our elders, "the Death Penalty is immoral, we should scrap it from our law"? Do they require a uni degree in order to understand the statement?
the (uncomprehending) pikamaster
You can have all the uni degree for all they care, you haven't live the life they went through, so don't teach your daddy how to fcuk. (sorry for this but that is the best term I can find for those who show little respect for the elders.) -
It may take a long time but Mike McCrea is in singapore now. You can run but you can't hide, if there is a will, there is a way.Originally posted by iveco:Wahaha, my conscience is clear. Also, where I am now the law doesn't allow extradition to places with capital punishment. Precisely why we took so long with Mike McCrea. Ah Hao should have done the same but he's a retard, anyway.
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ppl like Took Liang How when kenna hang nobody will pity him. if he sentence to life in prison, only waste taxpayer $$ to feed him. capital punishment is good.
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We can have him, but we can't hang him. Sounds pointless, doesn't it? And so much Victorian taxpayers funds were wasted on him while Singapore and Canberra negotiated. Had we abolished the death penalty from the start, we could have dealt with him sooner.Originally posted by sgdiehard:It may take a long time but Mike McCrea is in singapore now. You can run but you can't hide, if there is a will, there is a way. -
The question for the victorian taxpayers is whether their money was spent to help an innocent person or were they helping a murderer from running away from the law.Originally posted by iveco:We can have him, but we can't hang him. Sounds pointless, doesn't it? And so much Victorian taxpayers funds were wasted on him while Singapore and Canberra negotiated. Had we abolished the death penalty from the start, we could have dealt with him sooner.
I think we should bill the australian government for housing and feeding this guy for life, if he is indeed convicted of murder and only sentenced to life imprisonment.
You can't be saying that we should abolish our law just because some criminals manage to escape to another country rendering our law enforcement ineffective right?? Then ah hao should have stayed in malaysia then. -
malaysia got death penalty also.Originally posted by sgdiehard:The question for the victorian taxpayers is whether their money was spent to help an innocent person or were they helping a murderer from running away from the law.
I think we should bill the australian government for housing and feeding this guy for life, if he is indeed convicted of murder and only sentenced to life imprisonment.
You can't be saying that we should abolish our law just because some criminals manage to escape to another country rendering our law enforcement ineffective right?? Then ah hao should have stayed in malaysia then.
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It is a case of proper justice to be seen in the process of being done, not like the fast assumptions of guilt our "efficient" police force seem to trumpet so much.Originally posted by sgdiehard:The question for the victorian taxpayers is whether their money was spent to help an innocent person or were they helping a murderer from running away from the law.
I think we should bill the australian government for housing and feeding this guy for life, if he is indeed convicted of murder and only sentenced to life imprisonment.
You can't be saying that we should abolish our law just because some criminals manage to escape to another country rendering our law enforcement ineffective right?? Then ah hao should have stayed in malaysia then.
That fine line of process and procedure distinguishes us from the monkeys. -
sgdiehard,Originally posted by sgdiehard:The elders will tell you lucky there is canning and death penalty in singapore to take care of the gangsters. Otherwise ppl are prepared to kill as long as you promise him some money for him when he gets out of jail. When a gang of twenty ppl slash a person to death, the government can't put all 20 in jails for life, can they?
You can have all the uni degree for all they care, you haven't live the life they went through, so don't teach your daddy how to fcuk. (sorry for this but that is the best term I can find for those who show little respect for the elders.)
1) In order to say this, the elders have to be able to understand what the statement is saying, so ya they can understand "the Death Penalty is immoral; we need to scrap it." I'm talking about mere understanding, not about appreciation of the concept.
2) I have simply no idea where the idea of respect for elders comes in to this issue, so I'll try my best to make an educated guess. If you claim abolishing the Death Penalty is being disrespectful to Elders since they support the retentionist side, (and besides how sure are you that they support it?) then this argument is flawed. Because Respect does not equal concurring with everything the opposite party says.
the pikamaster -
No i did not bother to read it.Originally posted by pikamaster:Let me refer you to my post above; have you even read it yet?
anyway i just read it.what are u talking about? u are saying that the death sentence should be abolish..while i'm saying that it should stay..it do justice to the victim..
i refer to your above post as u say to get my ans, and i did not get the reply i wanted. so what with the let me refer you to my post above? Have u read your own post before replying to my? -
Don't like that lah, LL, appreciate the fact the war is half-won when you scare the wits out of the criminals-to-be.Originally posted by LazerLordz:It is a case of proper justice to be seen in the process of being done, not like the fast assumptions of guilt our "efficient" police force seem to trumpet so much.
That fine line of process and procedure distinguishes us from the monkeys. -
Nelstar,Originally posted by Nelstar:2) Changes in the laws must reflect the needs of a society. The Death Penalty is still a much fear deterrent. I still think it's more effective than life-imprisonment.
3) Tell the Govt that not me.
4) The fact that they are still rooted to their thinking says very much of our difficulties to tell them.
5) The problem is, not all lawmakers are happy to change a law. And to me, the pink dollar is a topic of 'you are not forced to gamble, you gamble your fault.' Whether it exist or not, I can handle my own affairs well.
For the elders/young ones, there is the compromise of a judge.
1) The Death Penalty is only a fear deterrent under a ceteris paribus assumption. But as you yourself pointed out, there are many hidden factors to consider in anything. So have you considered the hidden factors involved in reduction of crime rate before coming to such a conclusion?
2) ok...
3) They might not accept it, but they will still accept it. Besides, abolishing the Death Penalty is an action. Do the action, and then start explaining it.
4) Agreed.
5) Actually, a jury would be better of course...
the pikamaster -
Nelstar, there is always a problem with scaring tactics: do those obstacles provide challenges or obstacles? And unfortunately, this is a question not easily answered.Originally posted by Nelstar:Don't like that lah, LL, appreciate the fact the war is half-won when you scare the wits out of the criminals-to-be.
the pikamaster