Should Singapore abolish National Service?
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UPDATE! MANY OF YOU HAVE MISUNDERSTOOD THE TOPIC HEADING SO I AM REPHRASING IT TO [SHOULD SINGAPORE HAVE A DIFFERENT WAY OF OPERATING NATIONAL SERVICE?]
What do you think of it? Well, before you even come to a conclusion, read below.
Many around the world, and i mean many, have sent mails to the United Nations calling to abolish national service around the world. However, the UN of course, can't do that. And so, they came up with a report specially for that.
http://www.unhchr.ch/huridocda/huridoca.nsf/AllSymbols/7CE2591E478971AEC1256E680037B66A/$File/G0410972.doc?OpenElement - website for the report by the UN Chief
There had been many recent deaths reported. What seemed to be happening is that the media has taken sides and to report the news in the Governmnet's favour. Can't really blame them for they are the only media and of course, closely monitored by the government = no freedom. It's totally different from the US where freedom rules.
The news of the deaths jsut seem to fade away and there has been not much probe into it. What really happened, we don't really know the whole picutre. Are there more deaths than reported in the news? I can say a definite yes.
Just look at the PSLE examinations. Many have committed suidcide because of their results. But have the news reported any in the recent years? NO. There are no reports on the tv but, i have spoted one in the SPH straits times. It is a fact that many commits suicide beacuse of their results.
So, is the government hiding something from us about the actual deaths. The inhumane punishments during national service, is it legal of them to do so? NO. It is a no. Why? Well, read up on the law. Singapore has agreed to several UN agreements and it clearly states HUMAN RIGHTS. You can search for UN Human rights via Yahoo! . It states all the laws and stuff there. http://www.ohchr.org/english/law/index.htm - website for Human Rights Law
It's so contridicting.
My suggestion is that the government should use things like CCA points rewards, pirority to enter uni here and stuff like that for those who willing come forward to participate in national service for two years when they hit 18 instead of making it compulsory.
So, who's in to appeal to the government to abolish national service?
If you need for back up evidence, i have plenty and i can go into detail. Singapore has indeed broken many of the human rights agreements of the UN. Go check it out. It;s a fact -
humans are paranoid. there is no way any country will abolish it.
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1 question, how old r u?
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However, the UK has managed to stop national service. It is one of the few examples.
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they shd abolish reservist
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true, cos since serve 2yr liao should leave the ORD personnel alone to build up career...Originally posted by crazy monkey:they shd abolish reservist -
Why on earth do you want to know my age? I would like a reason before i answer.
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I think, there is a price to pay for living in Singapore.
There is also a price to pay for , living in another country.
How much do you think you have to pay for compared to citizens in many other countries to write such remarks about NS? Sometimes community efforts are taken for granted.
Other times, peace can also be taken for granted. -
so does getting ure country taken over by some other country means u still keep ure human rights?
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I've just found this website with the really funny article about singapore's ns being illegal.
National Service in Singapore is illegal.
Section 10 of the Constitution of Singapore states :
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Slavery and forced labour prohibited
10. -(1) No person shall be held in slavery.
(2) All forms of forced labour are prohibited, but Parliament may by
law provide for compulsory service for national purposes.
(3) Work incidental to the serving of a sentence of imprisonment
imposed by a court of law shall not be taken to be forced labour
within the meaning of this Article.
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Which means that forced labour is prohibited unless for national
service purposes. Now Section 12 of the Constitution of Singapore
states :
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Equal protection
12. (1) All persons are equal before the law and entitled to
the equal protection of the law.
(2) Except as expressly authorised by this Constitution, there shall
be no discrimination against citizens of Singapore on the ground only
of religion, race, descent or place of birth in any law or in the
appointment to any office or employment under a public authority or in
the administration of any law relating to the acquisition, holding or
disposition of property or the establishing or carrying on of any
trade, business, profession, vocation or employment.
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Which means that sexual discrination is only allowed when parlaiment
does it by law. Now Section 2 of the Enlistment Act (Chapter 93)
states :
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"person subject to this Act" means a person who is a citizen of
Singapore or a permanent resident thereof and who is not less than 16
years and 6 months of age and not more than 40 years of age or, in the
case of a person who
(a) is an officer of the armed forces; or
(b) is skilled in an occupation which the Minister by notification in
the Gazette designates as an occupation required to meet the needs of
the armed forces,
not more than 50 years of age;
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Which means that enlistment is not enforcing sexual discrimination.
That translates that Ministry of Defence and the Singapore Armed
Forces are violating section 12 (1) of the Singapore Constitution when
they are only enlisting men and not women. Sexual Discrimination can
only be dowe with law. Since Enlistment Act does not only call for
the enlistment of men then excusing women is unconstitutional as
Section 12 of the constitution calls for equality.
Besides the following is declared in the "Proclamation of Singapore"
contained in the "Independence of Singapore Agreement (A Constitutional Law):
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Now I LEE KUAN YEW Prime Minister of Singapore, DO HEREBY PROCLAIM AND
DECLARE on behalf of the people and the Government of Singapore that
as from today the ninth day of August in the year one thousand nine
hundred and sixty-five Singapore shall be forever a sovereign
democratic and independent nation, founded upon the principles of
liberty and justice and ever seeking the welfare and happiness of her
people in a more just and equal society.
(Signed) LEE KUAN YEW Prime Minister of Singapore
Dated the 9th day of August, 1965.
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Which means that Singapore should always seek the happiness and
welfare of her people in a more just and equal society. By only
having men serve national service and excusing women from national
service Singapore is definitely seeking the happiness and welfare of
her people is a less equal and just society. Singapore is violating
her own Independence of Singapore Agreement. Why are Singaporean
allowing this?
Since the enlistment of only men is illegal then all the men in
military prison are there in violation of the Independence of
Singapore Agreement and the Constitution of Singapore.
Besides the "Proclamation of Singapore" is protected by Articles 5
of the 1968 Geneva Convention on International Laws and Treaties.
A violation of "Proclamation od Singapore" is a violation of
International Laws. Such violation of International Laws will
bring Singapore's existence into question!!!
I NOW call for the release of all military prisoners in Singapore!
What's your view on this article found on the web. -
because we think you are a stupid kidOriginally posted by Relm:Why on earth do you want to know my age? I would like a reason before i answer. -
If you are thinking that i am saying without national serivce, singapore will be taken over by other countries, then you are totally wrong. I'm saying that we should be given the freedom to choose wheather we want to volunteer for ns. Have some benefits incop. with it. Is'nt that a better way to do things.
Singapore seem to be over protective of it's ns programme. just look at the enlistment act. It's soooooo over protective -
cos frequently there tend to be pre-enlistees coming in here throwing everything they got even the kitchen sink about how much, how bad NS is so its just to see if its another case of pre-enlistment blues....Originally posted by Relm:Why on earth do you want to know my age? I would like a reason before i answer. -
Since when has our Constitution been in the fore front of every law passed?Our Executive has subsumed the Legislative and well the story you all know..
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If you look closely at many other countrys' laws .....
You will notice that no law is perfect. But ignoring the necessity of a sovereign nation, of having its own defence force, is absolutely foolish.
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So now you say i'm stupid. All these anin't make ups. It's totally true. The law i stated exists.
It's just like when i've told my friends about the space exploration- return to flight mission to the iss, they think i'm crazy. But, without the space programme, we will not survive the solar merger, the asteriod mn 2004 which is heading onto near collision course in 2029 and stuff like that. We will all be dead. We are living in a world of our world, taking things for granted and don't give a dam about the outside world.
Many coutnries have joined in the space programme. The latest, Malaysia.
So what i'm saying is that these are all facts. They are all presented in front of you at this instance. If you say that was stupid, than you are really really really selfish about yourself. You don't give a dam about the wrold around you -
we cant do that
must never do that -
Singapore too small to afford that. With the world now very chaotic, I don't think NS should be aborted. As for reservist, I don't know because I am not a male.
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Yes. Yes. Yes. No law is perfect. That's the main point why there is a way to skip NS without getting into trouble with the law.
But that's not the point here.
Many of you are getting the wrong idea that i want singapore empty of defence. Not that. We have our regulars who work as a military staff for a living. Besides that, we can have people to volunteer, chunk in some benefits for them and we have a truely motivated ns men. These men, i promised that they will be better than the present lot. It also gives singapore a regular army like the present NS scheme. We also have volunteers who volunter for part time ns currently. So, we are NOT DEFENCELESS!!! -
No one's saying you're stupid.But realpolitik often hijacks theoretical laws.Originally posted by Relm:So now you say i'm stupid. All these anin't make ups. It's totally true. The law i stated exists.
It's just like when i've told my friends about the space exploration- return to flight mission to the iss, they think i'm crazy. But, without the space programme, we will not survive the solar merger, the asteriod mn 2004 which is heading onto near collision course in 2029 and stuff like that. We will all be dead. We are living in a world of our world, taking things for granted and don't give a dam about the outside world.
Many coutnries have joined in the space programme. The latest, Malaysia.
So what i'm saying is that these are all facts. They are all presented in front of you at this instance. If you say that was stupid, than you are really really really selfish about yourself. You don't give a dam about the wrold around you
Furthermore, I can agree with you on expanding space exploration and the Apiphos asteroid issue but what has solar merger got to do with this?
Enlighten me thanks.
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chap definitely sounds like he hasn't served NS yet ...
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If our solar system merges with another system which will happen in the near furture, Earth may be history. Lots of dust brought in by the merging may block out the sunlight. So, it's up to the space programme to determine how we can avoid this from happening
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so r u going to say we should hv welfarism next??? i can chose not to work but singapore still hv workforce because of volunteers???Originally posted by Relm:Yes. Yes. Yes. No law is perfect. That's the main point why there is a way to skip NS without getting into trouble with the law.
But that's not the point here.
Many of you are getting the wrong idea that i want singapore empty of defence. Not that. We have our regulars who work as a military staff for a living. Besides that, we can have people to volunteer, chunk in some benefits for them and we have a truely motivated ns men. These men, i promised that they will be better than the present lot. It also gives singapore a regular army like the present NS scheme. We also have volunteers who volunter for part time ns currently. So, we are NOT DEFENCELESS!!!
we r already having lesser babies... but we need critical mass for defence... unless we can be replaced fully by autonomous robotic soldiers.... which would cost us an arm or leg.... abolishing NS is not wise.... -
wait. think before making a conclusion that i've not serve ns
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This galactic merger should not happen for thousands of years IIRC.Unless what you are saying has got to do with the Nibiru issue..Originally posted by Relm:If our solar system merges with another system which will happen in the near furture, Earth may be history. Lots of dust brought in by the merging may block out the sunlight. So, it's up to the space programme to determine how we can avoid this from happening