Many Singaporeans migrating....How come???
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I think you misunderstood, if you are still singapore citizen working or studying overseas thats fine. But if you migrated and left or are planning to leave for good then I don't see how your "Active Interest" going to help improve anything do you? It's like saying how things should be done but at the same time not being there to do it so if things go wrong you can say "it's an honest bad call" but you are shielded and the people here suffer for it, if you don't even want to improve the system when you are here why would want to do it when you become a foreigner what is that? Should singaporeans listen to foreigners? Thanks but no thanks we have enough qualified folks for that job we don't need ex-citizens or soon to be ex-citizens telling us what we should or shouldn't do.Originally posted by HENG@:leave means not part of sg anymore meh? i think the stayers should be the people who still have an active interest in singapore society, whether they are physically there or not. the REAL QUITTERS are the ones who just bo chup whether the system is turning into cow dung or not.
u think we're trying to get even with the F-ed up system? what do we get from that? we're just trying to improve the system, so that people would not have to suffer what we suffered. u want to look down on people who moved away, thats your call. Nobody can stop u from being the brainwashed product the PAP wants u to be. But before u want to come onto us n call us quitters and say things like "you and the rest of your kind who have left or are leaving are not considered part of "our" anymore you are a foreigner here or soon to be one and maybe even a second class citizen in your new country." u better think twice. U might have seen more physically, but your mind never really left the bloody well.
Its always the frogs in the wells who sound the most indignant and smug about their wells. -
ok la so u want to go all singapore supremacist, fine loh. i dun see why someone who has migrated can't be still part of the society. i mean, nobody wants to pay us any attention when we were there, so now we leave so we can be heard without someone trying to shut us up, and u call that quitting? if things weren't so dire, u think we want to move ah? who dun want to live near to their friends they grew up with, and family? how can u be so unfair in saying we didn't even want to improve the system when we were there? and why can't we make suggestions even if we become ex-citizens? its not like we've never lived there and do not know how its like. stop being unfair!Originally posted by KumSioJui:I think you misunderstood, if you are still singapore citizen working or studying overseas thats fine. But if you migrated and left or are planning to leave for good then I don't see how your "Active Interest" going to help improve anything do you? It's like saying how things should be done but at the same time not being there to do it so if things go wrong you can say "it's an honest bad call" but you are shielded and the people here suffer for it, if you don't even want to improve the system when you are here why would want to do it when you become a foreigner what is that? Should singaporeans listen to foreigners? Thanks but no thanks we have enough qualified folks for that job we don't need ex-citizens soon to be ex-citizens telling us what we should or shouldn't do.
u want to make us out to be traitors, its up to u loh. but the real traitors are the one who let the society rot silently. We still have loved ones, friends stuck back in sg, and we are qualified to be concerned for them and to be concerned about the society they're still trapped in. as for qualified folks, think again. the only way u get that job is to be born into a ruling family, or one with connections to them.
call us foreigners, but like it or not, we'll always be singaporeans in a way, and there is not damn thing u can do about it. -
No I call that meddling in other country affairs thats none of your concern anymore by virtue that you gave up on us.Originally posted by HENG@:ok la so u want to go all singapore supremacist, fine loh. i dun see why someone who has migrated can't be still part of the society. i mean, nobody wants to pay us any attention when we were there, so now we leave so we can be heard without someone trying to shut us up, and u call that quitting? .
you want to be patriotic when you become a foreigner, how patriotic are you then to your new country and the one you just left? -
ok la then u speak up in yr country see how well u are heard loh.Originally posted by KumSioJui:No I call that meddling in other country affairs thats none of your concern anymore by virtue that you gave up on us.
you want to be patriotic when you become a foreigner, how patriotic are you then to your new country and the one you just left?
1stly, you are not "us" and we are not other people. we are all singaporeans. like i said, u dun like, also lan lan.
2ndly, we did not give up on us. it is the country who gave up on the people, who force them to move when they don't want to
3rdly, it is still every bit our concern. how dare u say it is not. just because u are too cowardy to make that sort of sacrifice so you can help make the society a better place, doesn't give u the bloody right to decide whether its our concern or not. your apathy is worse than "meddling".
4thly, we have always been patriotic. maybe that is why we moved. u want to question our patriotism, question yours 1st. u're just spewing PAP-speak and maybe u would like to ask if being patriotic to the ruling party equates to being patriotic to the country. maybe u will find some decency in you to stop being such a self-righteous snob. -
frankly leave or stay how many people really feel wanted here?
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with people like KSJ in singapore's society? not manyOriginally posted by dragg:frankly leave or stay how many people really feel wanted here?
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1stly, you are not "us" and we are not other people. we are all singaporeans. like i said, u dun like, also lan lan.
Yah thats true I'm singaporean but definately not foreigner.
2ndly, we did not give up on us. it is the country who gave up on the people, who force them to move when they don't want to
who applied to migrate? Did the singaporean garmen apply for you?
3rdly, it is still every bit our concern. how dare u say it is not. just because u are too cowardy to make that sort of sacrifice so you can help make the society a better place, doesn't give u the bloody right to decide whether its our concern or not. your apathy is worse than "meddling".
I make sacrifices everyday only I do it here "not there" and I like to think these sacrifices in turn contributes to the betterment of my society here. How the weather over there?
4thly, we have always been patriotic. maybe that is why we moved. u want to question our patriotism, question yours 1st. u're just spewing PAP-speak and maybe u would like to ask if being patriotic to the ruling party equates to being patriotic to the country. maybe u will find some decency in you to stop being such a self-righteous snob.
Should I move? Should we all move? Who will join the armed forces or become bus drivers, businessmen, nurses, cooks, policemen who? You? -
Originally posted by KumSioJui:
too bad. u know what? just because we dun physically serve in singapore dun mean we cannot contribute to it. its like calling michael schumacher a foreigner to germany just because he lives in switzerland. even tho he is not doing being a soldier, bus driver, nurse cook policeman etc, how come the german govt recognises him? and other less wll known germans who dun live in germany as germans too? people have different ways of showing patriotism. YOUR way doesn't mean its the right way.
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1stly, you are not "us" and we are not other people. we are all singaporeans. like i said, u dun like, also lan lan.
Yah thats true I'm singaporean but definately not foreigner.
2ndly, we did not give up on us. it is the country who gave up on the people, who force them to move when they don't want to
who applied to migrate? Did the singaporean garmen apply for you?
3rdly, it is still every bit our concern. how dare u say it is not. just because u are too cowardy to make that sort of sacrifice so you can help make the society a better place, doesn't give u the bloody right to decide whether its our concern or not. your apathy is worse than "meddling".
I make sacrifices everyday only I do it here "not there" and I like to think these sacrifices in turn contributes to the betterment of my society here. How the weather over there?
4thly, we have always been patriotic. maybe that is why we moved. u want to question our patriotism, question yours 1st. u're just spewing PAP-speak and maybe u would like to ask if being patriotic to the ruling party equates to being patriotic to the country. maybe u will find some decency in you to stop being such a self-righteous snob.
Should I move? Should we all move? Who will join the armed forces or become bus drivers, businessmen, nurses, cooks, policemen who? You?[/b]
see, this is the sort of anti-progress attitude thats is so prevalent in sg that makes the entire society suffer. refusing to recognise the contribution that immigrated singaporeans can still make for the society. but never mind. u can be as anal as u want, but we will continue giving our views on how society can be bettered. and u can't do anything about it. -
anti-progress? I'm here along with other singaporeans facing the music and contributing everyday you over there from remote only talking hot air telling how much you contribute or can contribute blah blah blah when the very fact is you gave up your citizenship. My way doesn't mean is the right way, you way is definately not. Me anal? you stop being such a p ussyOriginally posted by HENG@:too bad. u know what? just because we dun physically serve in singapore dun mean we cannot contribute to it. its like calling michael schumacher a foreigner to germany just because he lives in switzerland. even tho he is not doing being a soldier, bus driver, nurse cook policeman etc, how come the german govt recognises him? and other less wll known germans who dun live in germany as germans too? people have different ways of showing patriotism. YOUR way doesn't mean its the right way.
see, this is the sort of anti-progress attitude thats is so prevalent in sg that makes the entire society suffer. refusing to recognise the contribution that immigrated singaporeans can still make for the society. but never mind. u can be as anal as u want, but we will continue giving our views on how society can be bettered. and u can't do anything about it. -
Seems like a mud slugging war now.... this thread.
Let me summarise:
The jist of the argument is that those that migrate cannot find an equal opportunity in SGP.. so they choose to go. Equal opportunity can be work, play, political etc etc.
The oterh view is that these are the losers who gave up on SGP...
My take:
Do what is deem fit to get as much grains of rice into your rice bowl becos no govt / political party is going to give a damn if u do not the dough to survive. In this globalized world... no one really give a damn where u r from... onli wat u can bring to the table. -
true, the idea of globalization is to give ppl access to other places which would have been more difficult previously due to national policies. you are free to go where you feel wanted.Originally posted by diggo:Seems like a mud slugging war now.... this thread.
Let me summarise:
The jist of the argument is that those that migrate cannot find an equal opportunity in SGP.. so they choose to go. Equal opportunity can be work, play, political etc etc.
The oterh view is that these are the losers who gave up on SGP...
My take:
Do what is deem fit to get as much grains of rice into your rice bowl becos no govt / political party is going to give a damn if u do not the dough to survive. In this globalized world... no one really give a damn where u r from... onli wat u can bring to the table.
i'm in a funny position cos whilst i am not a singaporean, i treat singapore as my home and singapore has provided me and my family with opportunities which might not have been available elsewhere. for that i am grateful.
notwithstanding this gratitude i have towards my adopted country, i have since moved to HK to work cos of the benefits and opportunities that are present. i am not sure what long term plans may develop but i may well settle in HK if similar opportunites do not beckon in singapore in the future. at the end of the day, its about filling up the rice bowl and for me, the bigger bowl the better.
i would not encourage singaporeans to leave unless they encounter better opportunities abroad. -
I harbor no hard feelings to ppl who take SGP as a stepping board... put me in the same situation, I will do the same. The movement of ppl in/out of a country will accelerate.... if the host country is attractive enuff... some will stayed on.Originally posted by JLennon:true, the idea of globalization is to give ppl access to other places which would have been more difficult previously due to national policies. you are free to go where you feel wanted.
i'm in a funny position cos whilst i am not a singaporean, i treat singapore as my home and singapore has provided me and my family with opportunities which might not have been available elsewhere. for that i am grateful.
notwithstanding this gratitude i have towards my adopted country, i have since moved to HK to work cos of the benefits and opportunities that are present. i am not sure what long term plans may develop but i may well settle in HK if similar opportunites do not beckon in singapore in the future. at the end of the day, its about filling up the rice bowl and for me, the bigger bowl the better.
i would not encourage singaporeans to leave unless they encounter better opportunities abroad. -
Just don't feed the deluded ones and everything will be fine.
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There is nothing wrong with migrating to another country and still being interested in sg. Remember that you family, friends nd relations are still in sg.
I have asked so many times, WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS OF BEING A SINGAPOREAN CITIZEN? yet there has not been any plausible response. Perhaps no one knows or there isn't?
Can we blame others, including ministers' children for being quitters?
Everytime this argument crops up, so many people like to recite the same things:
work for your country, not your country work for you...
we do NS for the love of the country...
we are not a nanny state and does not support bums to keep taxes low...
we get to vote...
I'm sure many forumites can see that these are not exactly "benefits" that are actually available in sg. -
Originally posted by gill_hfc:
Since the beginning of this millienium there has been a sharp rise in migration by Singaporeans because there are not enough jobs for them here.
[b]I've recently returned from London after spending 6 years there as a student/working....what surprised me the most was the number of changes in our population within a short period of time....It also saddened me greatly to see that a number of my friends were thinking of leaving singapore or had already migrated to another country for good. On the other side of the fence, in London, I met a ' Part Time Singaporean' who was born in a third world country and had migrated to Singapore and was now living in London....
There are two issues of concern here:
a) Why isn't the singapore government openly addressing the issue of the number of singaporeans leaving Singapore??? we seemed to be more concerned about upgradings and building shelters around our flats then addressing a serious problem of large number of singaporeans migrating....This are the 'Real Sons' of singapore who were born here, went to primary, sec and college here, who even served 2-2.5 years of their national service...this are the same people who are now wanting to leave singapore for good and who are unhappy with the economic circumstances here....why isn't there any open public debate about their concerns and the reasons for them living??? any statistics available on the number of people leaving Singapore yearly?????
/b]
The MNCs which we have been so dependent for jobs have moved to other countries, such as China and India, as the cost of doing business there is very much lower than Singapore.
On top of this, Singaporeans also have to compete for jobs with foreigners whom the government is actively recruiting to boost Singapore decline birth rate.
You mean you don't know that our government never has the habit of discussing any issue with us? It always believes that it knows best and has the mandate to decide everything for us.
The government has also stopped publishing the number of people leaving Singapore for several years. -
These're definitely two of the reasons.Originally posted by StMichael:Can it be that many of us leave because we feel more appreciated and more at ease elsewhere?
With the emphasis on foreign talents, we locals tend to feel slighted. There're also too many rules and fines for us to feel free. -
Worth considering that people also migrate on values and also for their kids. There is a large proportion of people who embark on migrating to allow their kids a more more reasonable childhood as well as to allow them the opportunity to fail, and still discover their potential in life.
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anal is anal. u face the music? because u want to or because u got no other choice? dun sound so noble la. hahahaha u're the real pussy! anal pussy. ahahahaha! now i know what sort of name bodily orfices have. names like KSJ.Originally posted by KumSioJui:anti-progress? I'm here along with other singaporeans facing the music and contributing everyday you over there from remote only talking hot air telling how much you contribute or can contribute blah blah blah when the very fact is you gave up your citizenship. My way doesn't mean is the right way, you way is definately not. Me anal? you stop being such a p ussy -
to anal supremacists like KSJ its wrong leh. some people bitter that they just cannot migrate for one reason or another so pretend to be all hot blooded patriotism loh. the saying goes: want to die never mind, dun drag other innocent people down with u. some people bitter that other people wun suffer along with them, so they not happy loh, must purposely go n zhuo dui n call people "foreigners"Originally posted by SilverPal:There is nothing wrong with migrating to another country and still being interested in sg. Remember that you family, friends nd relations are still in sg.
I have asked so many times, WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS OF BEING A SINGAPOREAN CITIZEN? yet there has not been any plausible response. Perhaps no one knows or there isn't?
Can we blame others, including ministers' children for being quitters?
Everytime this argument crops up, so many people like to recite the same things:
work for your country, not your country work for you...
we do NS for the love of the country...
we are not a nanny state and does not support bums to keep taxes low...
we get to vote...
I'm sure many forumites can see that these are not exactly "benefits" that are actually available in sg. -
ayah to those people who xiao xin yan one, they wun care so much la. as long as u are not suffering alongside them, they will buay song u one. its lidat one, humans are that ugly.Originally posted by erahnan:Worth considering that people also migrate on values and also for their kids. There is a large proportion of people who embark on migrating to allow their kids a more more reasonable childhood as well as to allow them the opportunity to fail, and still discover their potential in life. -
frankly after 40 yrs here i still dont understand what benefits there are?
we slog and slog until retirement only to collect our cpf on a monthly basis.
what kind of life are we living? -
Um, the food?Originally posted by dragg:frankly after 40 yrs here i still dont understand what benefits there are?
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hey that is true. the food is well good.Originally posted by Meia Gisborn:Um, the food? -
Benefits?
what benefits?
I am 22 yrs old, unemployed and did the government give me any welfare?no
jobs?no
ah ic, making me having to go for NS is a benefit -
Analogy:
My company reorg and my job is like a call center... just that it was given a better name, but still its the same sh!t. When I wanted to look for another position in another company. People tell me to fear the other new, unknown job and new unknown company. That I might never make it and I would get a even worse deal out of my current place. So the work agencies also come and tell me how inadequet I am, and they really can make you feel really small and stupid. Some even suggest I go start my business - forgetting the fact my request to look for a job through them helps them make money. So many people telling me to be fearful, that current, unbearable situation of being a shadow call center to be hounded by rude users and all sorts of demands is what I can look for till the end of my working life or perhaps when I get booted out. But actually I had heard that story before ... in my previous companies. I feel that I need to change to grow and to grow I need to change. Its like the Ying and Yang diagram. And there will always be those "chicken little" people who try to use fear to manipulate your thinking telling you the world outside is very scary... But I take it in my stride and I am a person who is willing to work hard for my salary. (PS: anyone want to hire a hard worker??? )
I think its good that Singaporeans are venturing out to try other things.
But its sad to see what is happening to what we once call home. Even though I am physically in Singapore... I do not feel connected to this country. I also tend to feel that local people are not very open, mature people nor very civil...and that makes living here even more difficult when our own people make it difficult for our own local born sons and daughters to succeed - you can see it by the local employers and the choice of people they choose to hire or how our service industry treats local customers. In every place, there are pull and push factors at work. However, instead of addressing the problem, the government aggrevated the issue by relaxing the foreign policy and then calling local people quitters. I don't know about others, I already been made to feel small in the eyes of the elites ... now I feel like second class to the foreigners especially to the PRC. Singapore Was my home