'Old Elephant' Lee Kuan Yew refuses to quit
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No one is disputing the fact that he did good for singapore you dumb acs guy. We are saying that he should step down and make way for the younger generation. Even in USA, the president only holds on to power for a maximum of 8 years. LKY has been creating so many office post. You tell me which country got minister mentor lah.Originally posted by fishyang:Lee kuan yew is a good man ok? you never study history meh? You look wad he did for our economy and all lah. He is patriotic too, cried in front of the TV when Malaysia fen shou with us. Old so what? Doesnt mean you old cannot work anymore rite. Den all the people who are old should be retrenched lah -
After Mentor Minister is it Advising Minister then?????
But seriously speaking he is a good leader having all the good qualities on him to become a one -
The guy won't die so soon if thats what peopl are asking; not with that pet alien that he's keeping to extend his life.
Hey you didn't hear that from me.
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i respect him regardless of what he does. you young punks don't seem appreciate what he has done for the country
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how old are you?Originally posted by tomsss:i respect him regardless of what he does. you young punks don't seem appreciate what he has done for the country -
No matter what LKY has done, he is still a founding father of Singapore. We can openly disagree with him, but we shouldn't call him names.
Having said that, I am am quite disappointed with the elitist attitude of the LKY and the PAP goverment. Singapore was born in a time dearth of talent, it is understandable why they place so much value on talent that time.
But today Singapore has has changed tremendously,there is more room for people to develop different kind of talents but we are still stuck with LKY's belief of genetics and IQ theory.
The result is Singaporeans have developed an Us Vs Them mentality. When the ordinary Koreans speak of the rising samsung or the K-pop wave, they feel that they are a part of it, even though its still a small group of people driving this wave.
In Singapore, Singaporeans do not feels proud of Singapore's achievement. We are constantly reminded how capable the goverment is, how lucky Singaporeans are, how the most talented are in the goverment - The success of Singapore is their success. They are the "luling class", we are the highly skilled worker class or peasant class. The Plato's republic experiment has turned out really sour for national identity. -
He is not the founding father of Singapore.
The first bunch of minister did.
Singapore is what it is now because the policy drafted by his ministers.
That was when they and the people are one.
Singaporean, you and me, have make Singapore Inc a success.
Now, the political environment is different.
Any voice that is different from what is stated by the Government are viewed as Poison and Time Bomb.
They have the guts to tell the opposition that they are not close to the ground.
They should do some survey in their huge GRC whether the resident know who their MP is.
Talking about the Kettle calling the pot black.
I have only seen "warmth" of the local MP in socialising with the residents recently after MIAing for the past three years.
That is what they defined as "close to the ground".
You be the Judge.
Do you know who your MP is and have you seen they doing any visit for the past three years ? -
Without LKY, Singapore wouldn't be what it is now.
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That is what every one assume about LKY and Singapore.
There may be some one better than him.
So, dun keep saying that no LKY, no Singapore.
That is silly. -
Look at other cities, did they achieve, in 40 years, the success Singapore has?Originally posted by Medicated Oil:That is what every one assume about LKY and Singapore.
There may be some one better than him.
So, dun keep saying that no LKY, no Singapore.
That is silly.
He is forward thinking.
Yes, he had made some mistakes in judgement before, but the good he did is even more.
Ok... No more comments -
LKY has with the help of men like Dr. Goh Keng Swee, Dr. Toh Chin Chye and Hon Sui Sen succeeded in building the nation's industrialization, and its necessary infrastructure and public housing from the early 1960s to about the beginning or mid 1970s.
However since 1970s, he had accumulated power through the people and become arrogant about his own invincibility and refused to accept alternative views. He had engaged in too much rhetorics and self-indulged in his own brand of talents, leadership, pragmatism and meritocracy which had produced a top-heavy elitist administration which do not blend with the people.
He had neglected broad-based education successfully practised by advanced countries like Finland and Switzerland which had maintained high standards of living without all the dropping wages and job losses as has happened for many years since 1997s. Singapore was going downhill lagging behind other developing Asian tigers.
As a result of practising too much conceptual governance based on rhetorics and assumptions, Singapore has lost its shine and its economy and social progress nose-dived, Hundreds of thousands have since lost their jobs and domestic sector of the economy was ailing.
Throughout the prolonged recessions from the 1997s to 2002, LKY was seen as helpless and unable to turn around the economy except by blaming the poor economy on the external forces and had failed to produce benefits in job creations or upgrading of the low-based economy.
He practised tight controls and regulations to snuff out political alternative voices and gerrymandered the election processes to hold himself and his party to perpetual power regardless of the greater good of the nation.
He had practised high fees and taxes charging some of the highest prices for housing and transportation in the world.
Despite the major mistakes of his many past policies as posted in the 20 major problems in another thread, he did not do anything concrete to solve problems or was passionate about fighting for the people. Clearly he had retrogressed and was no longer effective in producing results as he did in the 1960s. He charging of the highest full market prices for HDB flats has caused many citizens' losing their retirement CPFs worsen by his charging the highest costs for all basic and essential government services.
Tried as he did from the 1980s, he was slow in upgrading the economic competitiveness except by persistent taxing and charging for the highest housing and transportation costs etc.
He had forgotten that leaders should possess the passion to serve for the greatest good of the greatest numbers. He was seen as practising the narrow policies of ensuring his own continuing election successes.
He seems to be interested only in securing high rewards regardless of the sufering of the people many of whom remain unemployed for long periods despite high educations.
The domestic sector of the economy has been in the doldrums due to lack of success in restructuring the initial industrialisation model to value-adding and high techology model as other Asian tigers are achieveing.
Despite the constant feedbacks of the people the leaders are found during recessions to keep increasing all the fees and recovering full costs to create reserves for unessential purposes like the 7 wonders.
Singapore economy was the last the recover from the last two deep rececessions with property dropping by 40 %. He had lost sight of working for the people and work for them as servants to bring about greatest benefits to the greatest number of citizens who as a result was trapped in serving the world's highest mortgage debts. Despite the prolonged recessions reserves were not put to use except for the government own narrow purposes of spending on image like the 7 wonders.
The above-stated major mistakes of LKY in his leadership has dented his initial achievements. The biggest mistake is that he had forgotten that it is leader's duty to fight for the greatest number. -
I agreed with. .most people here
Mr. Lee had been elected by choice of the old generation, and Singaporeans are a forgiving people who want to remember Mr. Lee old good works without remembering his political mistakes.
Those were not just mistakes. They were costly ones too. WE lost our ties and our friendship with the Malaysian neighbors long ago across the causeway, a tie we really cannot do without! WE lost our freedom to VOTE when the GRCs are here! WE lost our jury system as a check and balance toward the corruption of the whole justice system. WE have the whole nation survive under the fear of PAP! We are all intimidated like all the kiasu people we all become. So we need to change, but starting from where? The whole system is so well protected that anyone who dare - got to end up with the Police for interviews then ISA and so on. I am 60 years, and will be honored if they do this to me when I just talk here! 
However, People of Singapore wake up!
How on earth we allow all this to happen: by not taking our votes seriously or what? I don't know Please tell me! I suggest this: from time immemorial we all are like easy to boil sleeping frogs, cooked and [manipulated by the PAP via the news and the powerful political machine of the PAP.
However, for not correcting those mistakes he still want to talk smug and keep on the deception as if nothing had been wrong.
We had been bullied and cowed into an obedient population with only one road to go. The PAP one and the only way! What happen when the time comes when PAP falls? Will anyone or even now Mr. Lee able to put back humpy dumpy back together again?
It is time to VOTE him out! -
BTW Happy Lunar New Year .. and Young people PLEASE don't go into politics unprepared or too deep and get hooked by PAP..be careful what U talk! I talk because I have counted the costs, I am willing to pay, but you are too young to get into that nasty net of Police calling you up..
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Without LKy...singapore, you and me will still be what we are......as commoners.Originally posted by redstone:Without LKY, Singapore wouldn't be what it is now.
Is was Sir stamford Raffles who opened singapore as trading port. Not as some people said was LKY...
Nothing so great about him...without the other ex-ministers and singaporeans to assist him. He wouldn't be today as he is. Tell me him don't claim all the credits. -
If you think that Singapore is great under his rule, just ask yourself the following questions:
How many times have you actually voted so far ?
Can you express dissent or alternative viewpoints against the present ruler without any fear of any arrest or law suit ?
Do you have any say in the continuing increase in public transport fares that was using public fund to build up ? (NB: The bus servicing waiting time did increase after the fare increases so the promise of better service was never fulfil.)
Why must there be a limit in the CPF if the money belong to you in the first place ?
If you have a car and a HDB flat, how long do you need to work just to completely pay up the debt or you are destined to work till you die to service the loan ? -
Is there a year where there was no price increase?
Little wonder that the ministers wanted to keep their pay as private matters. -
What, and before that singapore was nothing? You seem to think that Singapore was no more than a huge sandbox prior to the 1960s.Originally posted by redstone:Look at other cities, did they achieve, in 40 years, the success Singapore has?
He is forward thinking.
Yes, he had made some mistakes in judgement before, but the good he did is even more.
Ok... No more comments
(Not true in case you are wondering) -
Singapore was relatively prosperous in the 12th century too, in fact, comparatively speaking, pre-Majapahit S.E.A counted Temasek as one of the trans-Indian Ocean trading ports.Originally posted by lwflee:What, and before that singapore was nothing? You seem to think that Singapore was no more than a huge sandbox prior to the 1960s.
(Not true in case you are wondering)
Try checking out the Journals in the Singapore-Malaysia Collection at NUS one day.Lots of interesting information that will make you really surprised. -
anyway...when was it stated that LKY is going to fight the upcoming election?
given his age, it seems impossible isn't it?
ur news correct or not? -
I am not frm acs lah and i am not a guy too. Pls get yr facts rite.... u so smart u go and be prime minister lahOriginally posted by shade343:No one is disputing the fact that he did good for singapore you dumb acs guy. We are saying that he should step down and make way for the younger generation. Even in USA, the president only holds on to power for a maximum of 8 years. LKY has been creating so many office post. You tell me which country got minister mentor lah. -
Originally posted by fishyang:I am not frm acs lah and i am not a guy too. Pls get yr facts rite.... u so smart u go and be prime minister lah
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wait a minute ... does the police serve the public or does it serve a political party? does it keep the public safe or does it terrorise all who happen to have alternative ideas and viewpoints?Originally posted by norey:but you are too young to get into that nasty net of Police calling you up.. -
Originally posted by ruixiangz:anyway...when was it stated that LKY is going to fight the upcoming election?
given his age, it seems impossible isn't it?
ur news correct or not?
You expect him to physically fight? It's a mental fight, between PAP and the opposition parties. If you think he can't, you are wrong. When election comes, go watch TV and see how good he is. -
Originally posted by Lowclassman:
Alamak, since when are we taught that LKY opened Singapore as a trading port? It is stated very clearly in history books that it is Sir Stamford Raffles, not him.
Without LKy...singapore, you and me will still be what we are......as commoners.
[b]Is was Sir stamford Raffles who opened singapore as trading port. Not as some people said was LKY...
Nothing so great about him...without the other ex-ministers and singaporeans to assist him. He wouldn't be today as he is. Tell me him don't claim all the credits.[/b] -
i suggest u all dun call him names here.......hav ur view points, but pls support dem with evidence......
no doubt wad spore hav today is probably due to hardwork of him......but den, as said, no man is god right?.....if we can make mistakes, y cant he?.....i find it funny dat some pple can list one whole list of his mistakes here n yet nt tok abt wad gd he has done.......if he was reallie dat bad den i guess pple would hav voted him out of the general elections long ago n some other party would be in power........further more, there is this saying "old is gold"......he has proven himself with successes dat he has acheived over in the forty years......
the older generations had been treating him with respect n admiration......we as younger generation shld at least respect him even though we might nt agree with him........
>.<