"You scratch my back, I scratch yours?"-Shin Corp to Temasek
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that why parent always say STUDY STUDY STUDY or next time grow up be a RUBBISH MANOriginally posted by Lowclassman:In fact most the tomasick's elites are enjoying life out there.
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Originally posted by Atobe:
Tomasick paid 73 billions baht for shin corp shares. net income for shin corp was 1.98 billion baht.....so I wonder how long would tomasick recover its cost on this investment? 73 billion baht divided by 1.98 billion baht = 37 years ?
The sale of the giant Thai Telecoms operator - Shin Corp - to Temasek is creating a Political Uproar in Thailand due to shady deals that are now surfacing - as reported in the [b]Bangkok Post. Click here for full article.
The Thai Prime Minister - Mr Thaksin Shinawatra has denied his direct involvement and ownership of Shin Corp since he became the Prime Minister of Thailand; and had stated that his son - Mr Panthongthae - is the owner of the Holding Company - named "Ample Rich" - since December 2000 and that even the Stock Exchange of Thailand is "aware" of this status.
According to the Bangkok Post, the Thai Prime Minister told cabinet ministers that he had set up Ample Rich in the British Virgin Islands only because he wanted to invest in the US stock market and that the subsequent transfer of Ample Rich to his son did not violate any law.
As matters now appear, it seems that the company had reportedly sold 392 million shares of Shin Corp to a Mr Panthongthae and his sister Pinthongta at one baht a share on Jan 20.
The two then sold all their holdings in the telecom giant to Singapore's Temasek Holdings on Jan 23at 49.25 baht a share.
This transaction had created an uproar amongst the Thai Citizens, should we be concerned that our own Temasek may have been taken for a ride in this 'get rich' scheme ?
Did we "scratch" their back, and got our's in return ?
Will Singaporeans make any call for an enquiry to the dealings that Temasek had made in paying such a huge sum of our National Surplus to gain control of another Country's "national asset" ?
Thailand is supposed to be a "Third World" country, and yet they enjoy the Press Freedom of the "First World"; while our Singaporean "First World" Newspapers only make "Third World"news on Singaporeans flashing within their own homes.
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Don't forget, thailand is in its boom years at the moment....what if the world or thailand fall into recession? -
recession do you use ur handphone to call? also paying that amount it include their satellite. and it not cheap to own one.Originally posted by Lowclassman:Tomasick paid 73 billions baht for shin corp shares. net income for shin corp was 1.98 billion baht.....so I wonder how long would tomasick recover its cost on this investment? 73 billion baht divided by 1.98 billion baht = 37 years ?
Don't forget, thailand is in its boom years at the moment....what if the world or thailand fall into recession?
below is extract from wikipedia on Shin Corp.
Advance Info Service PCL (AIS; also Advanced Info Service) is Thailand's largest GSM mobile phone operator with 15.815 million customers as of June 2005
as of June 2005 there is 15mil+ of ppl using their handphone network. this is about 3 time the population of singapore. long term running it profitable what. -
it is a good business proposal.
if im running singtel, i will do the same.
taking over one country's national asset is not enough.
i look forward to the day a Singapore GLC will take over strategic American companies such as AT&T. -
If there is anything worth buying it will be Singapore Inc. - with its hidden reserves, and a list of assets string out like a pearl necklace around the globe, and with each holding perhaps part of the Singapore National Reserves.Originally posted by geodome:it is a good business proposal.
if im running singtel, i will do the same.
taking over one country's national asset is not enough.
i look forward to the day a Singapore GLC will take over strategic American companies such as AT&T.
If Singapore is allowed to buy the crown jewel of other countries, will the Singapore Govenment a.k.a the Ruling Political Party reciprocate the attempts by other foreign companies to buy over the likes of GIC or Temasek Holdings or SIA or DBS or SingTel ? -
Clever ppl dun need tuitionsOriginally posted by charlize:Don't worry lah.
Anything goes wrong or if money is lost, it will all be "tuition fees".
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it not about if you can buy or not, it about are you willing to sell. ppl can give an offer, but whether to sell it another matter isn't it?Originally posted by Atobe:If there is anything worth buying it will be Singapore Inc. - with its hidden reserves, and a list of assets string out like a pearl necklace around the globe, and with each holding perhaps part of the Singapore National Reserves.
If Singapore is allowed to buy the crown jewel of other countries, will the Singapore Govenment a.k.a the Ruling Political Party reciprocate the attempts by other foreign companies to buy over the likes of GIC or Temasek Holdings or SIA or DBS or SingTel ? -
Originally posted by strikefreedom:
Ever heard of 'making an offer that no one can refused'
it not about if you can buy or not, it about are you willing to sell. ppl can give an offer, but whether to sell it another matter isn't it?
The price paid that Temasek paid to the "Family Treasury" of the Thai Prime Minister, was such an offer that got him to let go of his own 'baby' - Shin Corp - which he nurtured for the last THIRTY YEARS.
What price will it take for the Singapore FIRST FAMILY to let go off anyone of the Singaporean GEMS that the FIRST FAMILY seems to treat as their own 'heirlooms' ? -
With passing of each day, the storm gets stronger, clearing the air for the main issues are beginning to crystallize :
From an alternative report - Temasek takes on a 'let go, let grow' business approach dated January 27, 2005 - it seems that lack of due diligence seems to be a hallmark in the transactions of multi-million dolllar transactions of Temasek:
Public 'may turn against S'pore'
Feb 7, 2006
The Straits Times
BANGKOK - A GROUP of academics yesterday warned that there was a risk of public opinion in Thailand turning against Singapore regarding the Shin Corp-Temasek Holdings deal.
In a discussion at Chulalongkorn University, Professor Thitinan Pongsudhirak said: 'Temasek is not an ordinary company, it is owned by a foreign government. This has implications for the Singapore government...Shin Corp is seen here as tainted assets; in due diligence it is surprising that Temasek did not consider the fallout.'
He said Temasek and the Singapore government had become unintended players in Thai politics.
'Temasek needs to clarify its plans and intentions, especially regarding Shin Sat and its applications, and iTV's editorial stance and management' he said.
Shin Sat and iTV are part of Shin Corp's non-core assets. Temasek has declined to say whether it will divest stakes in these businesses.
Shin Sat operates satellite frequencies given to Thailand by the International Telecommunications Union, making it a Thai asset that is now owned by the Singapore government, Prof Thitinan said.
Broadcaster iTV has a long history in Thailand and there are now concerns about foreign interference in local broadcasts.
Senior law professor Suchit Bunbongkarn said: 'The public is convinced that Singapore thinks only of its own interests.'
He added, however, that it is difficult to say whether this negative attitude towards Singapore will be short-lived or will continue.
Professor Suchit was among seven Constitutional Court judges who in 2001 voted against Mr Thaksin in a case in which the premier was accused of misdeclaring his assets. Mr Thaksin won by one vote.
Singapore's embassy on Sathon Road in Bangkok's business district was the target of a small demonstration last week.
And some xenophobic commentaries against Singapore have begun appearing in the Thai media and on radio shows. A column in the Thai-language Kom Chad Luek paper this week accused Mr Thaksin of behaving like a representative of the Singapore government.One recent investment that soured: China Aviation Oil, which in November reported US$550 million of losses from trading oil derivatives. The company, a unit of Beijing-based China Aviation Oil Holding, which supplies jet fuel to airlines flying through China's airports, was first listed on the Stock Exchange of Singapore in 2001. Temasek was among the investors who bought a total of 25 percent of the company, says Temasek spokeswoman Eva Ho.
It will seem that the sheer size of Singapore's Reserve has caused the Elite to be callous in the manner that Singapore's hard earned reserves is spent.
In 2004, the Singapore unit bet that oil prices would fall. As its trading losses mounted and oil prices reached record highs, the Beijing parent brought forward the sale of another 15 percent stake to European and Asian investors in October, raising US$108 million to cover margin calls, according to chief executive Chen Jiulin.
Again, Temasek bought some of the stock, ending up with a total of less than 2 percent, according to spokeswoman Ho. On November 29, China Aviation Oil filed for bankruptcy protection. On January 24, it asked creditors to write off 59 percent of the US$530 million they are owed.
``The general lesson is that when investing in China, the focus on quality and due diligence has to be paramount,'' Dohadwala says. ``China Aviation is listed in Singapore, but it's still a Chinese company.''
Paying 16x the estimated Shin Corp prospective earnings for 2006.
Paying 3.3x the book value in the take over of Dao Heng Bank in 2002.
Temasek owned Companies have also paid MILLIONS to hold a small stakes in Indonesia companies at some questionable valuations:
Singapore Telecom paid US$1.1 BILLION for a 36% stake in Telkomsei - Indonesia's largest cellular operator;
Singapore Technologies Telemedia paid US$594 MILLION for a 42% stake in Indonesian telecoms operator - PT Indosat.
Singaporeans have not had any opportunity to voice our concerns in this matters, as all issues are classified as State Secrets.
In a country, where even the Elected President has no authority to even ask for the accounting of the Country's Reserves, is there any hope for the accounting of the National Reserves ? -
lol are you joking with me of course i do and i do see it too. so far any buying over of organisation such as Shin Corp and Optus are offer that no one can refused.Originally posted by Atobe:Ever heard of 'making an offer that no one can refused'
The price paid that Temasek paid to the "Family Treasury" of the Thai Prime Minister, was such an offer that got him to let go of his own 'baby' - Shin Corp - which he nurtured for the last THIRTY YEARS.
What price will it take for the Singapore FIRST FAMILY to let go off anyone of the Singaporean GEMS that the FIRST FAMILY seems to treat as their own 'heirlooms' ?
but please be fair to them as their main agenda is to aquire business from oversea that can generate profit rather then for their own gain. what difference between an opportunist and a real successful businessman is opportunist will cash in if a very good offer come in while a real successful businessman will keep buying over companies that can generate profit for years to come. in short one is short sighted and the other is far sighted.
so far the price paid for those companies are above the valuation of the company itself, but they are the one that can really generate profit and don't forget the company is a well establish one in term of market share and the infrastructures that they own.
it seem that you are bias against them in everything no matter what they do be it right or wrong isn't it? and if that the case, maybe you should be doing something about ur life like planning to migrate etc now rather then complaining this and that in forum isn't it? as you know that nothing you say will ever change the decision make by ur favourite part aka PAP
the thing about ppl is they never say a word of thanks if they stand to gain, but when they stand to lose, they will curse and swear at them and if law permit i think they would gladly give them a blanket party. -
Originally posted by strikefreedom:
Yes, at a price that is way above market at each transaction.
lol are you joking with me of course i do and i do see it too. so far any buying over of organisation such as Shin Corp and Optus are offer that no one can refused.
Where do you think the funds are coming from that are used in all these foreign transactions ?
but please be fair to them as their main agenda is to aquire business from oversea that can generate profit rather then for their own gain. what difference between an opportunist and a real successful businessman is opportunist will cash in if a very good offer come in while a real successful businessman will keep buying over companies that can generate profit for years to come. in short one is short sighted and the other is far sighted.
Are these funds the Annual Revenue Surplus transferred from the Finance Ministry to GIC and Temasek - funds that could have benefitted Singaporeans in so many beneficial collective programs ?
Who should own those profits generated by funds collected from the Singapore Citizens ? Is the Elected President entitled to access the information to the Annual Profits made by the foreign companies that build on the Annual Revenue Surplus generated from Singaporeans ?
How certain are we that these foreign acquisitions in the face of newer competition from new technologies that will supercede present profits generated by current level of mobile phone and satellite services ?
so far the price paid for those companies are above the valuation of the company itself, but they are the one that can really generate profit and don't forget the company is a well establish one in term of market share and the infrastructures that they own.
In order to maintain profitability, these foreign acquisitions will need additional capital to upgrade and implement new technologies.
Where will be the source of these funds for such works to be accomplished ?
The only source is further transfer from the Annual Revenue Surplus collected from Singapore Citizens.
Why are narrow minded views carry the opinion that loyal Singaporeans should migrate rather then stay to help in the progress of Singapore ?
it seem that you are bias against them in everything no matter what they do be it right or wrong isn't it? and if that the case, maybe you should be doing something about ur life like planning to migrate etc now rather then complaining this and that in forum isn't it? as you know that nothing you say will ever change the decision make by ur favourite part aka PAP
Is this due to FORTY YEARS of brainwashing that all who hold alternative views should vacate this Island Republic for the continued abuse by the POWER OF ONE ?
Does anyone with anything to say "ever change the decision by 'a.k.a Ruling Political Party' " ?
However, whatever that is said can always help to educate those with no access to information, and we can lend support in providing information to the Opposition Party.
Your observation of "Human Ingratitude" is certainly true - and it also speaks of the "ingratitude" of the Ruling Political Party in the broken promises and changed positions after the Elections; and after policies have achieved its purpose, do not withdraw the policies for purpose of collecting more revenues.
the thing about ppl is they never say a word of thanks if they stand to gain, but when they stand to lose, they will curse and swear at them and if law permit i think they would gladly give them a blanket party.