Muslims assesed as threat to world peace in 60yr old report
-
http://www.danielpipes.org/rr/3370.pdf
Its very interesting to read what this declassified report has to say. -
What can we expect from a "no brainer, one-liner" ?
Have you read in detail the material you have referred to in particular (Page 24 - 34), and the contents of the entire report that will tell of the general purpose and direction that this report is intended ?
Can you even understand the contents before making your own twisted conclusions to fit into your own twisted agenda of demonising a repectable Religion ?
This is a report made SIXTY YEARS AGO - does the content have any relevance to the geo-politics of Islam as we know it today ?
Was it not made in a period just before the McCarty 'yellow peril' in the USA, a period of instability after a catastrophic world war that ended with the loss of millions of lives throughout the world, and the beginning of a polarisation of the new world order ?
What do you think was the mentality of the people of that period that emerged from the catastrophic event of that period, and facing the challenges of a new world order ?
The contents of the report - from Pages 24 to 34 - is but an open assessment of that period, and had identified the weakness of the Islamic workd, with the vast diversity of its faithful followers that are bound by one religion but separated by the diverse tongues that further fragmented by nationalism, political and religious rivalries of the various tribes, ethnicities, and races.
What was the threat that was defined SIXTY YEARS AGO that is not already known in the present ?
The threat projection remains the same - that is religious arrogance, impatience, dominating orthodoxies, fanaticism that are targetted at ineffectual and corrupt rulers of the various countries that adopt Islam as a national religion and are non-secular.
What is the purpose of your present reference except to use this SIXTY YEAR OLD REPORT to justify your present effort to DEMONISE a respectable religion that has been corrupted by demons who are simply "no brainers" that we are already familiar with ? -
It is exactly because it is 60 years old that we marvel at its insight.
It predicted what would happen today way back 60 years ago before any obvious threat.
I hope you are open minded enough to read the report carefully.
It warned us way back before we were even born. -
Said Qutb may be long dead, but his legacy has created a brand of terrorism that uses warped interpretations of religion to bring about dictatorship.
-
Insight ?Originally posted by Salman:It is exactly because it is 60 years old that we marvel at its insight.
It predicted what would happen today way back 60 years ago before any obvious threat.
I hope you are open minded enough to read the report carefully.
It warned us way back before we were even born.
Don't kid yourself - if you only have some grey matter in the carvenous space up on top of your hollow structure, you will probably be another Alvin Toffler's - "Third Wave" and Samuel Huttington's - Clash of Civilization.
There are Think Tanks - where intellectuals with some brains - extrapolate from Historical Events to Current Issues into the Future.
If you do not indulge in narrow minded bigotry and "no brainer" intolerence towards the opinions of others - you maybe given a nano iota of hope to be included in the rarified space to breathe in the CO2 released by these intellectuals at work. -
Its amazing how we're so afriad of offending the muslims, that we'll do anything to self censor and try to sugar coat any issues pertaining to muslims.Originally posted by Atobe:Insight ?
Don't kid yourself - if you only have some grey matter in the carvenous space up on top of your hollow structure, you will probably be another Alvin Toffler's - "Third Wave" and Samuel Huttington's - Clash of Civilization.
There are Think Tanks - where intellectuals with some brains - extrapolate from Historical Events to Current Issues into the Future.
If you do not indulge in narrow minded bigotry and "no brainer" intolerence towards the opinions of others - you maybe given a nano iota of hope to be included in the rarified space to breathe in the CO2 released by these intellectuals at work.
In response to the drawings, we tell each other its understandable that the muslims kill priests, stone danes and increase terrorism.
"Its our fault, we shouldn't have incited them"
"its an understandable response, anyone else would have responded that way. The muslims are being very nice about it already"
"Its are few islamic countries that indulge in terrorism, the rest are lukewarm about it"
Even in sg, no one dares to tell a muslim joke for fear of the sedition act. We can't tell malay jokes for fear of retribution.
Yet the chinese are happily telling indian jokes and the malays are happily telling chinese jokes.
What do you get when 4 chinese get together? They'll start playing majong. What about 5 chinese? They'll form a secret society...
Not very funny but any chinese here wanna call for the overthrow of the government? The extermination of any other races? What about a couple of airplanes crashing into mindef and raffles city?
In the last 10 years, how many terrorist acts have been conducted by muslims? How many by Christians? how many by catholics? how many by hindus? Get the point?
No?
How many buddist monks call for assassination of non buddists? how much gold did the pope say he will give to anyone who killed a non catholic? how many muslim clerics have been calling for violence, murder and terrorism?
Any difference?
After the attempted assassination of the pope jp2, did the pope call for the extermination of the muslim religion? did the pope even condemn the act? was there violent protests all over the world?
After some muslims blew up the giant statue of budda, did any buddists call for terrorism against the muslims?
If the muslims do not want to constantly be checked at all airports, if the muslims do not want to constantly be treated as terrorists, if they do not want to be an outcast in the international community, they should start "cleaning up their act" and take actions against those who misrepresent their faith. Only then do i give them credibility.
There is no need to further have inter-religions understanding for other religions to understand muslims. I think now is the time that muslims start understanding other religions.
When an errand child resists all efforts to gently teach him manners, perhaps a slap would wake him up. -
Dedicated to SilverPal:
Is there any good in debating the comparative worth of each religion, or the superiority of one's race over that of another ?
I won't take my religion from any man who never works except with his mouth.
Carl Sandburg (1878 - 1967)
I have learnt silence from the talkative, toleration from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet strange, I am ungrateful to these teachers.
Kahlil Gibran (1883 - 1931)
The test of courage comes when we are in the minority. The test of tolerance comes when we are in the majority.
Ralph W. Sockman
We have, in fact, two kinds of morality side by side: one which we preach but do not practice, and another which we practice but seldom preach.
Bertrand Russell (1872 - 1970),
Sceptical Essays (1928 ),
"Eastern and Western Ideals of Happiness"
Good people are good because they've come to wisdom through failure.
William Saroyan (1908 - 1981)
A great nation - or a great civilization - is reflected in the magnamity, tolerance, discipline, morality, honesty, and humanity in its Citizens towards each other and to those outside of its own Communities.
Should we measure our self-worth with that of the animal world ?
Is our effort in leading a human life comparable to that of an ant ?
Should our instinct and value system follow the worst from within our Community ?
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.
John F. Kennedy (1917 - 1963),
In a speech at the White House, 1962
It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of nonviolence to cover impotence.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869 - 1948 )
Victory attained by violence is tantamount to a defeat, for it is momentary.
Mahatma Gandhi (1869 - 1948 ),
'Satyagraha Leaflet No. 13,'
May 3, 1919
Teachers open the door. You enter by yourself.
Chinese Proverb -
Dedicated to Salman :
In the beginning there was nothing.
God said, 'Let there be light!'
And there was light.
There was still nothing,
but you could see it a whole lot better.
Ellen DeGeneres -
Is there any good in debating the comparative worth of each religion, or the superiority of one's race over that of another ?
Thats right Atobe, thats the smartest thing you ever said.
A great nation - or a great civilization - is reflected in the magnamity, tolerance, discipline, morality, honesty, and humanity in its Citizens towards each other and to those outside of its own Communities.
Should we measure our self-worth with that of the animal world ?
Is our effort in leading a human life comparable to that of an ant ?
Should our instinct and value system follow the worst from within our Community ?
One shouldn't say that his religion is superior over others'.
But thats exactly what those fanatics are saying. Thats why we need to expose their evil teachings for what they are and help create a better world. -
Originally posted by Salman:
Unfortunately, the smartest thing you ever done was to note that :- "One shouldn't say that his relgion is superior over others" .
Original post by Atobe:
Is there any good in debating the comparative worth of each religion, or the superiority of one's race over that of another ?
A great nation - or a great civilization - is reflected in the magnamity, tolerance, discipline, morality, honesty, and humanity in its Citizens towards each other and to those outside of its own Communities.
Should we measure our self-worth with that of the animal world ?
Is our effort in leading a human life comparable to that of an ant ?
Should our instinct and value system follow the worst from within our Community ?
Original reply by Salman:
Thats right Atobe, thats the smartest thing you ever said.
One shouldn't say that his religion is superior over others'.
But thats exactly what those fanatics are saying. Thats why we need to expose their evil teachings for what they are and help create a better world.
BUT - regrettably - you remain not so smart in quoting my post so well, and took the trouble to ignore. .
Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.
Martin Luther King Jr. (1929 - 1968 ),
Strength to Love, 1963 -
Originally posted by SilverPal:
it's very true indeed! how we tell each other it is AOK to su** american c***, to set up a base or bases in independent country because it can't defend itself.
Its amazing how we're so afriad of offending the muslims, that we'll do anything to self censor and try to sugar coat any issues pertaining to muslims.
In response to the drawings, we tell each other its understandable that the muslims kill priests, stone danes and increase terrorism.
since master americans said so, invasion of iraq was also supported. question is where is the WMD? where? where is the link to terrorism? and where is the more than 100,000 innocent civilians who were KILLED by americans and supporters right now? all dead obviously. I believe that exceeds the total number of civilian casualties by ALL terrorist attacks in the last decade (including in recent years in Iraq, after invasion by the master americans).
it's amazing how we sugar coat the mighty americans' insolence to openly violate UN decisions! innit?
I don't think singaporeans need to discuss politics or freedom of speech for many reasons, including
1. they don't have freedom in their country
2. their WHOLE economic system is bound to american corporations
3. their culture is a pseudo-american culture (diehard wannabe americans, with fake american accents and so on...)
4. hundreds of thousands of deaths are not even ONCE reported in the media or in this forum by any forumite of Salman's ilk AS bad or evil. what hogs the limelight is two or three demonstrations that ended up being violent.
i now see how reasonable your arguments are.
and what made you think indians or chinese can not be muslims or vice versa. your assumption that a malay joke is equivalent to a muslim joke tells us how ignorant you're. so if you tell an indian joke or a chinese joke, that may be a muslim joke too! anyway i'm not going to authenticate the rightness or wrongness of such jokes.
"Its our fault, we shouldn't have incited them"
"its an understandable response, anyone else would have responded that way. The muslims are being very nice about it already"
"Its are few islamic countries that indulge in terrorism, the rest are lukewarm about it"
Even in sg, no one dares to tell a muslim joke for fear of the sedition act. We can't tell malay jokes for fear of retribution.
race .....religion......NOT same. you've 'em mixed up.
Yet the chinese are happily telling indian jokes and the malays are happily telling chinese jokes.
I dont understand btw why chinese and indians are in singapore, sandwiched between malaysia and indonesia, in the malay world. in the malay peninsula.hmmmm...intriguing! there must be something that this region offers them that china or india doesn't.
What do you get when 4 chinese get together? They'll start playing majong. What about 5 chinese? They'll form a secret society...
or maybe we should search some reports on religious abuses (against muslims if you want, but against any religion in general) in china. also in india IF you want. u wan?
off hand, i dunno if u call them terrorist acts, dropping bombs on civilians killing 'em en masse, in fact juz yesterday got some new revelation on abu gharib prison scandal by CHRISTIANS......hmmm....i dun understand why u wanna drag in innocent christians, catholics, hindus etc in here. you are not good for social harmony my fren, i'm sorry.
Not very funny but any chinese here wanna call for the overthrow of the government? The extermination of any other races? What about a couple of airplanes crashing into mindef and raffles city?
In the last 10 years, how many terrorist acts have been conducted by muslims? How many by Christians? how many by catholics? how many by hindus? Get the point?
No?
hmm....I don't know the exact numbers. umm..you wanna give me the EXACT numbers? it will help.
How many buddist monks call for assassination of non buddists? how much gold did the pope say he will give to anyone who killed a non catholic? how many muslim clerics have been calling for violence, murder and terrorism?
that government (the Talibans) were recognized by three (3) governments in the world?
Any difference?
After the attempted assassination of the pope jp2, did the pope call for the extermination of the muslim religion? did the pope even condemn the act? was there violent protests all over the world?
After some muslims blew up the giant statue of budda, did any buddists call for terrorism against the muslims?
plz DONT insult buddhists or any religions. why you wanna drag in buddhists for no reason? why you wan me 2 quote this?
http://www.khandro.net/dailylife_war.htm
also like these why you wanna cause uproar against ANY religious community?
Buddhist Violence
Buddhists do not always live up to the highest principles. Individuals are not always mindful of the precepts and there have been instances where groups and governments consider that violence and even war are necessary.
In the 14th century, the uprising that eventually evicted the Mongols from China was led by Buddhists.
Japanese Buddhist monks were known to have trained Samurai warriors in meditation and other, less peaceful, skills. In 1942, during the period of Japanese aggression, Zen master Sawaki Kodo (1880–1965) did not hesitate to write:
"It is just to punish those who disturb the public order. Whether one
kills or does not kill, the precept forbidding killing [is preserved]. It is
the precept forbidding killing that wields the sword. It is the precept
that throws the bomb."
The Chinese takeover of Tibet was not without its resistance movements. In one notable event, a violent uprising was led by the women of east Tibet. There are many who find it difficult not to admire this action, considering the circumstances.
A 5-point peace plan proposed to resolve the issue of Tibetan freedom.
The Buddhists of Ladakh refuse to flee from Kashmiri insurgents, even if they must fight. Should they succumb to eviction as have most of the brahmins there?
And sadly, in Sri Lanka a civil war between the mostly Buddhist Sinhalese and the Hindu Tamil minority has already cost 50,000 lives is also far from resolved.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2065/is_2_55/ai_106560164
Is there a place for violence in Theravada Buddhism? This question is often raised when various recent events are examined in relation to the ethnic conflict in Sri Lanka and the genocide of 2-3 million Khmers (mostly Buddhists) between 1975 and 1979 by Poi Pot and the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia. (1) Both Sri Lanka and Cambodia are primarily Theravada Buddhist societies and in the last three decades both countries have witnessed a great deal of physical violence and abuse of human rights. While the violence can be attributed to various political problems, civil unrest, growth of communist thinking and fanatical armed groups, corrupt politicians and poor economic infrastructures, at least in the case of Sri Lanka ethnic prejudices are the pre-eminent cause for the turmoil and recent violent struggle.
hmmm...maybe this is what you wanted to say all along. instead of beating about the bush, straightaway bash islam/muslims. no probs. but maybe, just maybe, you should remember that you DID that and maybe, just maybe, some how have to bear responsibility. in many possible ways. e.g. from government.
If the muslims do not want to constantly be checked at all airports, if the muslims do not want to constantly be treated as terrorists, if they do not want to be an outcast in the international community, they should start "cleaning up their act" and take actions against those who misrepresent their faith. Only then do i give them credibility.
There is no need to further have inter-religions understanding for other religions to understand muslims. I think now is the time that muslims start understanding other religions.
When an errand child resists all efforts to gently teach him manners, perhaps a slap would wake him up. -
Originally posted by SilverPal:
it's very true indeed! how we tell each other it is AOK to su** american c***, to set up a base or bases in independent country because it can't defend itself.
Its amazing how we're so afriad of offending the muslims, that we'll do anything to self censor and try to sugar coat any issues pertaining to muslims.
In response to the drawings, we tell each other its understandable that the muslims kill priests, stone danes and increase terrorism.
since master americans said so, invasion of iraq was also supported. question is where is the WMD? where? where is the link to terrorism? and where is the more than 100,000 innocent civilians who were KILLED by americans and supporters right now? all dead obviously. I believe that exceeds the total number of civilian casualties by ALL terrorist attacks in the last decade (including in recent years in Iraq, after invasion by the master americans).
it's amazing how we sugar coat the mighty americans' insolence to openly violate UN decisions! innit?
I don't think singaporeans need to discuss politics or freedom of speech for many reasons, including
1. they don't have freedom in their country
2. their WHOLE economic system is bound to american corporations
3. their culture is a pseudo-american culture (diehard wannabe americans, with fake american accents and so on...)
4. hundreds of thousands of deaths are not even ONCE reported in the media or in this forum by any forumite of Salman's ilk AS bad or evil. what hogs the limelight is two or three demonstrations that ended up being violent.
i now see how reasonable your arguments are.
(continuation in next post) -
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Its our fault, we shouldn't have incited them"
"its an understandable response, anyone else would have responded that way. The muslims are being very nice about it already"
"Its are few islamic countries that indulge in terrorism, the rest are lukewarm about it"
Even in sg, no one dares to tell a muslim joke for fear of the sedition act. We can't tell malay jokes for fear of retribution.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
and what made you think indians or chinese can not be muslims or vice versa. your assumption that a malay joke is equivalent to a muslim joke tells us how ignorant you're. so if you tell an indian joke or a chinese joke, that may be a muslim joke too! anyway i'm not going to authenticate the rightness or wrongness of such jokes.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yet the chinese are happily telling indian jokes and the malays are happily telling chinese jokes.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
race .....religion......NOT same. you've 'em mixed up.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you get when 4 chinese get together? They'll start playing majong. What about 5 chinese? They'll form a secret society...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I dont understand btw why chinese and indians are in singapore, sandwiched between malaysia and indonesia, in the malay world. in the malay peninsula.hmmmm...intriguing! there must be something that this region offers them that china or india doesn't.
or maybe we should search some reports on religious abuses (against muslims if you want, but against any religion in general) in china. also in india IF you want. u wan?
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Not very funny but any chinese here wanna call for the overthrow of the government? The extermination of any other races? What about a couple of airplanes crashing into mindef and raffles city?
In the last 10 years, how many terrorist acts have been conducted by muslims? How many by Christians? how many by catholics? how many by hindus? Get the point?
No?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
off hand, i dunno if u call them terrorist acts, dropping bombs on civilians killing 'em en masse, in fact juz yesterday got some new revelation on abu gharib prison scandal by CHRISTIANS......hmmm....i dun understand why u wanna drag in innocent christians, catholics, hindus etc in here. you are not good for social harmony my fren, i'm sorry.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How many buddist monks call for assassination of non buddists? how much gold did the pope say he will give to anyone who killed a non catholic? how many muslim clerics have been calling for violence, murder and terrorism?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
hmm....I don't know the exact numbers. umm..you wanna give me the EXACT numbers? it will help. -
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Any difference?
After the attempted assassination of the pope jp2, did the pope call for the extermination of the muslim religion? did the pope even condemn the act? was there violent protests all over the world?
After some muslims blew up the giant statue of budda, did any buddists call for terrorism against the muslims?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
that government (the Talibans) were recognized by three (3) governments in the world?
plz DONT insult buddhists or any religions. why you wanna drag in buddhists for no reason? why you wan me 2 quote this?
http://www.khandro.net/dailylife_war.htm
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Buddhist Violence
Buddhists do not always live up to the highest principles. Individuals are not always mindful of the precepts and there have been instances where groups and governments consider that violence and even war are necessary.
In the 14th century, the uprising that eventually evicted the Mongols from China was led by Buddhists.
Japanese Buddhist monks were known to have trained Samurai warriors in meditation and other, less peaceful, skills. In 1942, during the period of Japanese aggression, Zen master Sawaki Kodo (1880–1965) did not hesitate to write:
"It is just to punish those who disturb the public order. Whether one
kills or does not kill, the precept forbidding killing [is preserved]. It is
the precept forbidding killing that wields the sword. It is the precept
that throws the bomb."
The Chinese takeover of Tibet was not without its resistance movements. In one notable event, a violent uprising was led by the women of east Tibet. There are many who find it difficult not to admire this action, considering the circumstances.
A 5-point peace plan proposed to resolve the issue of Tibetan freedom.
The Buddhists of Ladakh refuse to flee from Kashmiri insurgents, even if they must fight. Should they succumb to eviction as have most of the brahmins there?
And sadly, in Sri Lanka a civil war between the mostly Buddhist Sinhalese and the Hindu Tamil minority has already cost 50,000 lives is also far from resolved.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
also like these why you wanna cause uproar against ANY religious community?
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2065/is_2_55/ai_106560164
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Is there a place for violence in Theravada Buddhism? This question is often raised when various recent events are examined in relation to the ethnic conflict in Sri Lanka and the genocide of 2-3 million Khmers (mostly Buddhists) between 1975 and 1979 by Poi Pot and the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia. (1) Both Sri Lanka and Cambodia are primarily Theravada Buddhist societies and in the last three decades both countries have witnessed a great deal of physical violence and abuse of human rights. While the violence can be attributed to various political problems, civil unrest, growth of communist thinking and fanatical armed groups, corrupt politicians and poor economic infrastructures, at least in the case of Sri Lanka ethnic prejudices are the pre-eminent cause for the turmoil and recent violent struggle.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the muslims do not want to constantly be checked at all airports, if the muslims do not want to constantly be treated as terrorists, if they do not want to be an outcast in the international community, they should start "cleaning up their act" and take actions against those who misrepresent their faith. Only then do i give them credibility.
There is no need to further have inter-religions understanding for other religions to understand muslims. I think now is the time that muslims start understanding other religions.
When an errand child resists all efforts to gently teach him manners, perhaps a slap would wake him up.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
hmmm...maybe this is what you wanted to say all along. instead of beating about the bush, straightaway bash islam/muslims. no probs. but maybe, just maybe, you should remember that you DID that and maybe, just maybe, some how have to bear responsibility. in many possible ways. e.g. from government. -
I don't know anything else, but I know people of this religion, has a hair-trigger.
-
From this forum, we can see how much extremism has taken over this region.
We have these goons here defending extremism that created suffering among millions. -
Aren't all those tragedies wherein many pilgrims die during every Haj, a clear enough signal from God that something is being done wrong???
-
Originally posted by Salman:
The first statement the "no brainer" made is surprisingly correct :
From this forum, we can see how much extremism has taken over this region.
We have these goons here defending extremism that created suffering among millions.
"From this forum, we can see how much extremism has taken over this region."
Even in this Speakers' Corner, 'no brainer' extremism has also taken over this region with the non-discriminatory denigration of a large majority of good people for the work done by a smaller group of 'no brainer' extremists bent on non-discriminatory terrorism. .
The second sound-bite requires correction and should read as :
"We have a 'no brainer' acting as a goon - non-chalantly oppressing and denigrating the innocent majority for the non-discriminatory destructive works by a minority of 'no brainer' terrorists" . . -
nuke em. God has given us intelligence to create tools to clense the world
-
Yes, the USA had developed a 'Neutron' bomb that destroys all living matters but keep inert matters untouched. .Originally posted by donchoo:nuke em. God has given us intelligence to create tools to clense the world
We could tweak these 'Neutron' bomb to fill the carvenous craniums of those "no brainers" and burn their shadows onto the ground to remind us of the hardships that these "no brainers" have carved into our lives. .
-
They believe that if they die during haj, they make heaven straight away.Originally posted by ShutterBug:Aren't all those tragedies wherein many pilgrims die during every Haj, a clear enough signal from God that something is being done wrong???
Life is tough for some of them, especially the women. Death could be of comfort. -
Originally posted by Salman:
Yes, with your "no brainer" appreciation of women who "sucks" - that will surely make your Life tough. .
They believe that if they die during haj, they make heaven straight away.
Life is tough for some of them, especially the women. Death could be of comfort.
Unfortunately, 'heavenly doors' may not open for you - especially those 'doors' guarded by Sumiko and Diana - whom your appreciation "sucks". .
Life is pleasant. Death is peaceful. It's the transition that's troublesome.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)
Any fool can tell the truth, but it requires a man of some sense to know how to lie well.
Samuel Butler (1835 - 1902) -
such silly thinking is a threat to the world.
nobody shld be trampled to death.
we have been warned since 60 yrs ago -
i understand that you're referring to your alter-ego, having an identity crisis is no good.Originally posted by Salman:From this forum, we can see how much extremism has taken over this region.
We have these goons here defending extremism that created suffering among millions.
YOU started this thread calling a particular group of people as threat to world peace, shouldn't YOU be the one held responsible for it? or was it your alter-ego? -
The report told us 60 years ago and we are seeing it today.
It didn't happen by chance.