Role of SM
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I fully agreed that SM is important..Just wondered what is the role and can we have more SM(s). I think will be good for Singapore, as least they are there to help our PM. Your view.
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PM should be the leader of the party and the ruling party.
There will only be one head in the family.
When you have too many cooks, you spoiled the soup.
In the Singapore context, is the PM so useless that he need so much assistences from the past PM as SM ?
I dun think so. -
Don't say until like that..More SMs so that they can assist PM in running the country is like providing more varities..chief chef is still PM. Instead of standard 1 theme of dishes, we can have indian, malaysia, chinese, english for all guests in any one gathering and every guests will be well and better serve.. -
So can we have more for that purposes. I think yes which is also in line with the government promotion of recognision to those capable minister.
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i dont understand why our govt needs a SM and a MM.
is the PM is not good enough? -
Our PM is definitely good. MM can only have 1 and only 1. While I was looking for possibilities of having more SMs to help our PM to deal with existing trend where world event changed rapidly..I am looking at SM as a dominated officers instead of a elected MPs due to their heavy responsiblities in the government and private sectors.Originally posted by dragg:i dont understand why our govt needs a SM and a MM.
is the PM is not good enough? -
While we're on the topic of SM, MM and M&Ms, can we say what exactly it is that these new fangled posts' duties are?
They act in an advisory role right? So why did the MM play a prominent role in negotiation with Alpa-s? AFAIK, it should've been the Minister for Manpower taking up that fight. Or why is SM used as a political PR tool now?
One more thing, if we value SM and MM's inputs into how government is run, then what about the old guard ministers like Tony Tan, Richard Hu, etc.? They were giants in their time, so I'm sure they have a lot of experience to enrich government right? Rather than sitting on the sides at Stat boards or Temasek.
I think as time passes and more PMs become eligible for SM role, there is a need to define what role they should play, and how much say they get in the cabinet.I am looking at SM as a dominated officers instead of a elected MPs due to their heavy responsiblities in the government and private sectors.
Whether they have to be elected MPs or not would depend on the role and responsibilities they assume in the cabinet. If they are taken to be similar to Ministers without Portfolio, then it is not in the people's interest that they become life-long positions. -
Originally posted by lftwgr:While we're on the topic of SM, MM and M&Ms, can we say what exactly it is that these new fangled posts' duties are?
They act in an advisory role right? So why did the MM play a prominent role in negotiation with Alpa-s? AFAIK, it should've been the Minister for Manpower taking up that fight. Or why is SM used as a political PR tool now?
One more thing, if we value SM and MM's inputs into how government is run, then what about the old guard ministers like Tony Tan, Richard Hu, etc.? They were giants in their time, so I'm sure they have a lot of experience to enrich government right? Rather than sitting on the sides at Stat boards or Temasek.
I think as time passes and more PMs become eligible for SM role, there is a need to define what role they should play, and how much say they get in the cabinet. Thanks for reminding me that SM are actually act only as advisory role. Hence, it may not required to be elected MPs in order to carried out such roles. Am I rite?
I think even like Former DPM Tony Tan can be SM, both current DPMs can also be dominated as SMs. Their role will be helping PM beside advising. They are definitely talented and can help our PM in many area. Like Former DPM Tony Tan good in banking..can considered to be assigned to China to look after Singapore financial arms in China, DPM if SM can go india where to help us to create more opportunities in India and Middle East where the market is really big.
Even FM Yeo can be considered to be very talented can be PM representative at all time to go round ensuring bonds with our neighbours are always healthy..
They are many many more..which I may not be able to think of yet..I would believe that they will be proud to do that service for PM and fellow singaporeans. I believed that they will agree with what I mentioned, don't you? -
Thanks for reminding me that SM are actually act only as advisory role. Hence, it may not required to be elected MPs in order to carried out such roles. Am I rite?
No I said it depends on their roles, and right now, it doesn't seem like they are merely advisers. As you would say, they are like the PM's 'representatives', out to handle the dirty work for the PM (like resolving the Alpa-S dispute).
If MM was really acting as an advisor, he would've sat in on the negotiations and let the Minister for Manpower handle the talking, only interrupting to ensure there is a smooth flow and that discussions stay on topic.
So I think it is only right that SM and MM be elected posts, not nominated ones. At least that way, they are still accountable to the people. -
I respected all Ministers and believed they had established talents beside the qualification they had. Hence, PM should really considered to appoint some of those recognised ones as SM so that they are there to help him with advise. Running of town and garden is the role of a full time MP which should be elected.
Keeping them as SMs will benefit singapore as they are able to create more wealth for us singaporeans. I believed that they will be proud to serve singapore further even after retired. I really treasured their talents and really would beg them to serve our PM for the sake of singapore as appointed SM.
Leave the running of town councils to elected full time MPs. -
Are you suggesting that perhaps all Ministers (Manpower, Defense, Health, Education, Environment, Trade & Development, Home Affairs, etc.) should be political appointtees?Originally posted by king108:I respected all Ministers and believed they had established talents beside the qualification they had. Hence, PM should really considered to appoint some of those recognised ones as SM so that they are there to help him with advise. Running of town and garden is the role of a full time MP which should be elected.
Keeping them as SMs will benefit singapore as they are able to create more wealth for us singaporeans. I believed that they will be proud to serve singapore further even after retired. I really treasured their talents and really would beg them to serve our PM for the sake of singapore as appointed SM.
Leave the running of town councils to elected full time MPs.
Fortunately for us, we have a Westminster system of government where all ministers have to be elected MPs, so at least the executive (government) is accountable to the legislative (parliament), and every 4-5 years there is this thing call an election where citizens can decide if they've done a good job.
If all the ministers were political appointtees, then we would be no different from the American system where the Secretaries serve at the pleasure of the President.
And if you look at (very) recent history, GW Bush has managed to appoint some of the most inept Secretaries and Under-secretaries in the history of the US because of political backslapping (Rumsfield, in particular, was a favorite of Dick Cheney).
No thanks, but I'd stick to what we have now. -
For a parliamentary system, or democracy to work efficiently and effectively, there has to be safeguard against tyranny by those in power through legalistic controls and gerrymandering. Of the three realms of government, now only the executive has power with judiciary and legislative playing second fiddles.Originally posted by king108:I fully agreed that SM is important..Just wondered what is the role and can we have more SM(s). I think will be good for Singapore, as least they are there to help our PM. Your view.
This aspect of our governing system is an undesirable part of our system. This part has to evolve to a more satisfactory balance and check system.
In our case, the basic laws relating to the proper coordination and smooth functioning of our democracy or parliamentary democracy has been overriden by a strong executive through all kind of legalistic gerrrymandering of existing laws which effectively render the constitution a dead document.
Now the executive is the over-domineering branch of government which runs all areas of the government to its wishes and desires to serve the narrower agenda of the party in power. The system is losing its objectivity, accountability and transparency. People are losing their rights to offer views and opinions resulting in many problems.
In our system, the various parties are not working together but are contending with laws passed by the more powerful executives. We have no way to check on gerrymandering of laws from GRC to Sedition Act and self-approval of ministers' inflated salaries and retirement gratuities. More are coming like upgrading of HDB estates priority to citizens who are loyal to the government.
Under this sort of circumstance, it is not quite a good idea to give the leaders additional powers to appoint outside parties to hold executive powers like the MMs or SMs. There will be more gerrymandering with more powers to the few in power leading to corruptions and nepotism which is the greatest danger of all. -
I'm making a wild guess for the main role only ha.........Originally posted by king108:I fully agreed that SM is important..Just wondered what is the role and can we have more SM(s). I think will be good for Singapore, as least they are there to help our PM. Your view.
1) Sucking Monies ?
2) Stealing Monies ? -
His signature is on the new series of the SGD notes
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THe future will not be the same as the present, and definitely not the same as the past. However cruel this may be, unless we freeze Singapore in stasis, experience is going to be increasingly less and less important...Originally posted by king108:I respected all Ministers and believed they had established talents beside the qualification they had. Hence, PM should really considered to appoint some of those recognised ones as SM so that they are there to help him with advise. Running of town and garden is the role of a full time MP which should be elected.
Keeping them as SMs will benefit singapore as they are able to create more wealth for us singaporeans. I believed that they will be proud to serve singapore further even after retired. I really treasured their talents and really would beg them to serve our PM for the sake of singapore as appointed SM.
Leave the running of town councils to elected full time MPs. -
my first impression is of letter S+M = S**K MONEY.
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Please lah..SM = Senior Minister. Hence their pay must be high so that it justified their post..if they are able to earn more for singaporean..Why stop or prevent. However, I am asking for SM to be appointed instead of elected MPs. As we know Fulltime MP are more concerned with our daily surrounding..Unlike Ministers where they are doing things much more demanding. Hence we shall tried all means to retain those that retired to be SM and even considered some of the existing one to be SM so that they can continue to serve singapore regardless they are elected MP or no. Why take the chances on talents...it's a loss to us if they cannot serve..
Hence, appointing SM is good for everyone. -
I really do respect some of the older guards of the PAP. People like George Yeo, Teo Chee Hian.. But what I don't understand is why the they were overlooked for Prime Minister duty. Singaporeans should be allowed to vote for Prime Minister approval, even though he is the only candidate.
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Well, if u really want them, then at least they should be made fully non-partisan i.e. drop out of PAP when they become SMs, or selse the political field will be skewed even further towards them. And btw, why not include CST as an SM too? hmm... he is nearly as old as MM.Originally posted by king108: Please lah..SM = Senior Minister. Hence their pay must be high so that it justified their post..if they are able to earn more for singaporean..Why stop or prevent. However, I am asking for SM to be appointed instead of elected MPs. As we know Fulltime MP are more concerned with our daily surrounding..Unlike Ministers where they are doing things much more demanding. Hence we shall tried all means to retain those that retired to be SM and even considered some of the existing one to be SM so that they can continue to serve singapore regardless they are elected MP or no. Why take the chances on talents...it's a loss to us if they cannot serve..
Hence, appointing SM is good for everyone.
But seriously, I think a first-world country does not need SMs and MMs, because first-world MPs should be able to manage on their own without any help whatsoever. And besides, like I said earlier, times change and we ahve to change along with them. older SMs and MMs will be resistant to change, and this will be detrimental to the nation's future growth.
cheers,
the pikamaster (who salutes GMS and frowns at Gomez) -
Any CEO will wanted his trusted man.. Hence, the SMs I am asking, needed not to be vote in government..They are not to involve in voting in bill. However, they can advise PM. Besides that they are required to carry out duties assigned to serve PM so that singapore can be better.. Wouldn't that be good for us. It is better that he is a party member cause he must have belief else how can we trust him
We must treasure talent..as singapore resource is restricted..We needed to give them the title so that they will be recognised when meeting foreigner minister. ("Senior" is always respected then anyone..and is lower than Prime Minister") That will make their work outside singapore easily.
Support this appointed SM..good for singapore, good for singaporean.. -
1. CEOs want their trusted men to be ranked below them, and not have equal say in the operations of the company unless sanctioned by the CEOs themselves. No CEO wants to have his decisions second-guessed, I'm sure.Originally posted by king108: Any CEO will wanted his trusted man.. Hence, the SMs I am asking, needed not to be vote in government..They are not to involve in voting in bill. However, they can advise PM. Besides that they are required to carry out duties assigned to serve PM so that singapore can be better.. Wouldn't that be good for us. It is better that he is a party member cause he must have belief else how can we trust him
We must treasure talent..as singapore resource is restricted..We needed to give them the title so that they will be recognised when meeting foreigner minister. ("Senior" is always respected then anyone..and is lower than Prime Minister") That will make their work outside singapore easily.
Support this appointed SM..good for singapore, good for singaporean..
2. Any Senior Minister, if appointed, must have a belief. A belief in the ideals of Singapore. NOT a belief in the ideals of PAP. Or any Special Interests Group.
3. Titles are misleading. What matters is what they actually do. Who cares what names they get? Foreign dignitaries, if they are real diplomats, would know to do research ahead of any meeting with personnel in Singapore government. -
Originally posted by lftwgr:1. CEOs want their trusted men to be ranked below them, and not have equal say in the operations of the company unless sanctioned by the CEOs themselves. No CEO wants to have his decisions second-guessed, I'm sure.
2. Any Senior Minister, if appointed, must have a belief. A belief in the ideals of Singapore. NOT a belief in the ideals of PAP. Or any Special Interests Group.
3. Titles are misleading. What matters is what they actually do. Who cares what names they get? Foreign dignitaries, if they are real diplomats, would know to do research ahead of any meeting with personnel in Singapore government. -
I think it about time to really look into the importance of appointed SM instead of elected SM again.
With more SM from current experienced Ministers, PM Lee can get his work done more effectively. They will help singapore to grow and even create opportunties. Without appointed SM, even they are talented, they are not in the position to help PM to solve his problem. (singapore problem) if no elected (touch wood)...
Contested Minister MND Mah, FM Yeo, DM, Lee and even Minister Yacob are qualified with experience and can be considered to be appointed as senior minister. Don't you agree.
I hope we still can have their talent and experience to help our PM, I think they will also most willingly to step forward to serve singapore. Don't they? -
Tell you what, if BG Yeo survives this election, then we'll talk about if he should be SM. After all, we want our SMs to be people we'd want to elect right? Not the rejects who lost favor with the people. The post of SM shouldn't be taken as a glorified retirement scheme.Originally posted by king108:With more SM from current experienced Ministers, PM Lee can get his work done more effectively. They will help singapore to grow and even create opportunties. Without appointed SM, even they are talented, they are not in the position to help PM to solve his problem. (singapore problem) if no elected (touch wood)...
Contested Minister MND Mah, FM Yeo, DM, Lee and even Minister Yacob are qualified with experience and can be considered to be appointed as senior minister. Don't you agree.
And I'm saying this because I think the current SM / MM deserves our respect, and their posts should be held to the highest standards. -
Originally posted by lftwgr: We should plan ahead instead of waiting for result to reveal since we are 1st world standard country.
We treasure talent, FM Yeo is a talent. You agree?.
We wanted talent to serve our nation. You agree?.
Since they have the talent, why no let them help PM to run task assigned. We must not be selfish..we love singapore. Don't you?
Hence, it's should be an honour to let those talent and experienced to become SM so that they can help our PM in creating wealth and opportunties for singaporean. They will be more willing to serve singapore and singaporean, I personally think so.
Plan ahead..I support the idea of retaining talent.