MM Lee owes Singaporeans an apology
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Yes I think I lost the argument... Vote for the opposition if u want to and let all hell break loose... BUT bear the consequences yourself!
I cannot deny that some of your arguments make sense but do you think that the opposition will be able to solve those problems? I still believe that it is better to let the experienced party handle such issues through our feedback rather than throwing the problems to greenhorns...
I'm going for lunch... Bye guys! Be back later... -
i quote(not fully) from WP
"We are not ask to form another govt. We WANT ALTENATIVE VIEWS" -
it does make sense 1 way of another....have DID you GIVE YOURSELF a CHANCE?Originally posted by freakass:Yes I think I lost the argument... Vote for the opposition if u want to and let all hell break loose... BUT bear the consequences yourself!
I cannot deny that some of your arguments make sense but do you think that the opposition will be able to solve those problems? I still believe that it is better to let the experienced party handle such issues through our feedback rather than throwing the problems to greenhorns...
I'm going for lunch... Bye guys! Be back later... -
You have come out of our debate an honourable person.Originally posted by freakass:Yes I think I lost the argument... Vote for the opposition if u want to and let all hell break loose... BUT bear the consequences yourself!
I cannot deny that some of your arguments make sense but do you think that the opposition will be able to solve those problems? I still believe that it is better to let the experienced party handle such issues through our feedback rather than throwing the problems to greenhorns...
I'm going for lunch... Bye guys! Be back later...
I still don't agree with your last view though. Nobody said that the opposition is going to form the government. What I want is for them to gain experience and maybe after 2 or 3 elections take over from the PAP. For others it's just for Power check.
Whatever it is, that debate should only re-open at least after this elections. -
Well freakass my friend, I really understand you, however getting older means we have more experience, however, you cannot tell others you know better or even more, we live in the Internet age, and information is just a finger tick away, respect is not a problem with you, neither did we ever believe you are not a old gentleman, but admittedly, we all can learn from one another!Originally posted by freakass:Yes I think I lost the argument... Vote for the opposition if u want to and let all hell break loose... BUT bear the consequences yourself!
I cannot deny that some of your arguments make sense but do you think that the opposition will be able to solve those problems? I still believe that it is better to let the experienced party handle such issues through our feedback rather than throwing the problems to greenhorns...
I'm going for lunch... Bye guys! Be back later...
the word for myself is: adapt and change, and if you feel comfortable to side with lao Lee..so be it, telling others to vote like you did - is like going to Mr.Lee's Peer group in Singapore Island Club or the Clubhouse and saying you've to get better ideas...or...
SIR...U r on the wrong turf! Cheerio to your good self! -
Originally posted by Pronewbie:
Don't fly when you haven't learn how to walk..at least birds also needed to hoop before lifting..
[b]
b]
Rush will not get result..that is another chinese saying..
Learning must pay.. -
Ok I should have said more than 2 elections instead. My apologies. I was busy refuting his points I lost touch of mine
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Defamation means in writing, legally. So one cannot be sued for defamation for calling other people "riffraff". Not possible to sue for slander either, but I believe legally - without influence of PAP over law circles - such a person could have been sued for innuendo.Originally posted by TooFree:Lets view it in another different light.
The members in the group you have mentioned may had held reputable standing in the private sectors or in any other fields. However, they may not be creditable enough to hold office in the political sector.
The usage of 'riffraff' may be harsh but labelling not deframatory remark is unavoidable in election period.
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since when learning is easy?Originally posted by king108:Don't fly when you haven't learn how to walk..at least birds also needed to hoop before lifting..
Rush will not get result..that is another chinese saying.. Learning must pay.. -
nowadays old ppl still have to make living ok...
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work until they die or kanna deported.....Originally posted by kaobeikaobu:nowadays old ppl still have to make living ok...
http://asia.news.yahoo.com/060417/5/singapore203544.html
Monday April 17, 10:17 PM
Government shortlists potential sites to build retirement village
SINGAPORE : The government has shortlisted a few potential sites for the construction of a retirement village, and the National Development Ministry is currently studying the details.
The sites are on a 30-year land lease.
And one of them will be picked to test market demand for such villages.
In an exclusive interview with MediaCorp's Channel 8, Health Minister Khaw Boon Wan said in the past, the idea of building retirement villages was put on the back burner as Singapore's problem of an ageing population was not as serious as that in Europe and America.
The Singapore market was also too small for retirement villages to be commercially viable.
But the prospects have since changed.
With a rapidly ageing Singapore population, Mr Khaw said in five years' time, retirement villages will become economically viable.
One obstacle is the high costs of land in Singapore.
"My personal view is, our land is expensive. But we have nearby neighbours in Johore, Batam and Bintan. The elderly want to reach their doctors within half to one hour. So retirement villages in neighbouring countries is possible, barring the cross-border hassle. It is best to find cheap land on short leases," said Health Minister Khaw Boon Wan.
- CNA /ls -
You mean Libel is defamation that has been published or written don't you. And Slander is defamatory material that is spoken.Originally posted by pikamaster:Defamation means in writing, legally. So one cannot be sued for defamation for calling other people "riffraff". Not possible to sue for slander either, but I believe legally - without influence of PAP over law circles - such a person could have been sued for innuendo.
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Oh great... After our beloved and respected elderly has contributed to the growth of Singapore's economy for the past few decades, the PAP would like to build retirement villages IN NEIGHBOURING COUNTRIES instead in Singapore.Originally posted by duotiga83:work until they die or kanna deported.....
http://asia.news.yahoo.com/060417/5/singapore203544.html
Monday April 17, 10:17 PM
Government shortlists potential sites to build retirement village
SINGAPORE : The government has shortlisted a few potential sites for the construction of a retirement village, and the National Development Ministry is currently studying the details.
The sites are on a 30-year land lease.
And one of them will be picked to test market demand for such villages.
In an exclusive interview with MediaCorp's Channel 8, Health Minister Khaw Boon Wan said in the past, the idea of building retirement villages was put on the back burner as Singapore's problem of an ageing population was not as serious as that in Europe and America.
The Singapore market was also too small for retirement villages to be commercially viable.
But the prospects have since changed.
With a rapidly ageing Singapore population, Mr Khaw said in five years' time, retirement villages will become economically viable.
One obstacle is the high costs of land in Singapore.
"My personal view is, our land is expensive. But we have nearby neighbours in Johore, Batam and Bintan. The elderly want to reach their doctors within half to one hour. So retirement villages in neighbouring countries is possible, barring the cross-border hassle. It is best to find cheap land on short leases," said Health Minister Khaw Boon Wan.
- CNA /ls
Imagine a scenario whereby I have to get past the Custom checkpoints, followed by risked getting robbed in JB, and then I can get to visit my grandparents! How about asking our elderly ministers to retire in these proposed retirement villages in Johore? Singapore has the land to build casino, but not retirement villages for our elderly. Is making profits more important than taking good care of our elderly? Is this the mentality of the ruling PAP?
Let's talk about the working elderly population. Would you really want to see your elderly parents or grandparents serving you at the fastfood restaurants? Should'nt they deserve something better after contributing so much for the growth of Singapore's economy? -
just think abt our pledge.
we the people of singapore
pledge ourselves as 1 united people
regardless of race,language or religion.
so why should "he" say on the tv that the people at potong pasir will only get their chances for upgrading their housing?
if we are all united why must we then judge the people and divided the people into people who support my group and people against my group.
we are all singaporeans....all the same. since we are taught not to be bias against others, should they do the same?
We are taught to be realistic. we all know that opp are the minority seats holders. abt 2:48.
Even if the final decision still lies with the majority. we still hopes that there will be more people reflecting the view the people.
Not all opps are bad. They are some good guys. Look at potong pasir. He has done a lot of the people. why he keep gtg the votes, people know that they loses the chances of upgrading and still support him. Sometimes having capable people in ur wings does not equal to actual work done or geniune sincerity.
Potong Pasir all the way man...if i stay in tat area i will choose u also.
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The govt should not try to zero down all the opp.
cos they have to remember when the coin has 2 sides.
Cos they reflect the differences of each other.
reflecting the good will only show if u compare it with the not so good.
if it is a monopoly situation, it be like having no choice for people.
Then no matter how well u done it people won't know. cos they nothing to be compare with it at all.
he say we just wanna see fight. Actually, we wanted more transparent, more control.
we wanna data protection law to protect us, more control, more choices and in fact we wanna a better singapore.
Sometimes, u may think u are good, so good and u get used to it. and start slow down ur pace. The currect govt is not bad, but it can always be improve.
More people who has differents views should come forward. Just that not much people dare to fight for their own rights -
With regards to the low unployment rate, I am not sure whether the report below is relevant. Unemployment rate also includes the foreign labourers and workers. So using some simple maths, you can work out that the overall unemployment percentage will drop. However, this rate does not include the unemployment rate for the locals!
http://www.mom.gov.sg/PressRoom/PressReleases/20060201+Employmentsituationinfourthquarter.htm
Whenever I make comparisons, I prefer to compare apples with apples, not apples with oranges. By comparing Singapore with Indonesia, Somalia, etc, basically you are being unfair. Should the Brazilian footballers feel thankful for their high football standard after comparing the state of Singapore football? Or should they continue to improve themselves? The PAP tried to benchmark Singapore to Switzerland's living standards. So how far have we reached?
The majority of the forumners here support the opposition because we would like them to check on the PAP. I have to admit, they do not have the quality of the PAP candidates, and I still prefer PAP to be the ruling party, but we want is accountability and checks.
A self proclaimed first world government like PAP surely do not need to resort to suing politicians bankrupt, gerrymandering, threats of upgrading and using the carrot-and-stick policies to win people's votes. Even MM Lee himself admitted it is never a level-playing field in politics. Perhaps if the PAP wants to gain the people's respects, they should rule Singapore with more sincerity and passion, allowing more freedom to people, and not rule with an iron fist. Perhaps that's why Singapore has one of the highest emigration rate per capital in the world. Ironically, SM Goh's daughter is also a "quitter" happily staying in London.
source: http://www.bartleby.com/151/fields/26.html
By the way, I am also scared that I will be sued for typing this out. I don't know which citizen living in a country ruled by a "first world" government would have such apprehension.
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HiOriginally posted by jusgal:just think abt our pledge.
we the people of singapore
pledge ourselves as 1 united people
regardless of race,language or religion.
so why should "he" say on the tv that the people at potong pasir will only get their chances for upgrading their housing?
if we are all united why must we then judge the people and divided the people into people who support my group and people against my group.
we are all singaporeans....all the same. since we are taught not to be bias against others, should they do the same?
We are taught to be realistic. we all know that opp are the minority seats holders. abt 2:48.
Even if the final decision still lies with the majority. we still hopes that there will be more people reflecting the view the people.
Not all opps are bad. They are some good guys. Look at potong pasir. He has done a lot of the people. why he keep gtg the votes, people know that they loses the chances of upgrading and still support him. Sometimes having capable people in ur wings does not equal to actual work done or geniune sincerity.
Potong Pasir all the way man...if i stay in tat area i will choose u also.
Sometimes I also wonder why Potong Pasir and Hougang residents are discriminated. They recite the Singapore pledge, pay GST, pay their taxes, serve their NS and yet they suffer this kind of discrimination. Do the "first-world" government PAP regard these residents as nothing but political pawns?
"Staying together, moving ahead". How ironic their slogan for this election is, judging by the way they discriminate these residents. After attending the WP rally, I am amazed by the number of WP supporters. They are defiant, fiercely loyal to WP and truly love the party and its chairman Mr Low Thia Khiang. I wonder how many people who voted PAP have such qualities.
I also personnaly feel that I have more in common with the opposition party members. The PAP MPs are mostly managers, CEOs, veteran doctors and lawyers and almost all of them hide behind appointed ministers in the GRCs to enter parliament. The opposition members, with similar education background like the majority of the heartlanders, have to fight for every vote. How many of them are willing to risk their career just to enter politics to serve people, yet knowing that their chance of being an MP is that small? -
You are practising democracy..I like this style.Originally posted by Cindyfeh: -
I tell u, to the PAP, other ppl r all nuts, whether they r graduate, lawyer or doctor, if u r in oppositions u r NO GOOD, that is their mentality, they cant say u r good. bcos they r here to defend their seats. MM sure say nonseanse abt u.Originally posted by duotiga83:i quote(not fully) from WP
"We are not ask to form another govt. We WANT ALTENATIVE VIEWS" -
Democracy that is even in our original proclaimation just our liberty too but what had happened since 1965 ?
see that original proclaimation and declaration :
"Now I LEE KUAN YEW Prime Minister of Singapore, DO HEREBY PROCLAIM AND DECLARE on behalf of the people and the Government of Singapore that as from today the ninth day of August in the year one thousand nine hundred and sixty-five Singapore shall be forever a sovereign democratic and independent nation, founded upon the principles of liberty and justice and ever seeking the welfare and happiness of her people in a more just and equal society.
(Signed) LEE KUAN YEW Prime Minister of Singapore Dated the 9th day of August, 1965." -
Oh i am sure you have some stories from africa as well, or maybe philippines. Please share with us.Originally posted by will4:I really felt if some people can go to Indonesia n take a look, they will not be cynical as before n pointing to anybody in particular.
When u mentioned about poor people, I went back to Indonesia n travelled from Jakarta to Surabaya by vehicle. Throughout the entire journey, the village still in bad condition although people can have a roof or makan their daily meal. TB or diarahea still caused many infant to die. Nobody to turned to.
We should not compare ourselves with places like Hong Kong, Korea or Taiwan to make ourselves unhappy. It is best to compare the worst places.
We should also avoid comparing with Indonesian Chinese or philippino chinese or Thai Chinese. -
Phillipines is not much different from Indonesia. Corruption there almost the same as Indonesia.Originally posted by kilua:Oh i am sure you have some stories from africa as well, or maybe philippines. Please share with us.
We should not compare ourselves with places like Hong Kong, Korea or Taiwan to make ourselves unhappy. It is best to compare the worst places.
We should also avoid comparing with Indonesian Chinese or philippino chinese or Thai Chinese.
Spore should be benchmarked with HK or Korea cause these countries not to include HK also achived success in their economies. Corruption in HK is low like Spore. Look carefully at Korea, their products is almost penetrating Spore. -
I had been to western Countries and lived there many years, and my daughter was born there, and now she just graduate with honours and intend to live there as a foreigner. I still want to live here, not because Singapore is a better Country ..but because my own culture and kinship are all here. I am not going to compare with the western Country, Singapore is far behind in many ways..Originally posted by will4:Phillipines is not much different from Indonesia. Corruption there almost the same as Indonesia.
Spore should be benchmarked with HK or Korea cause these countries not to include HK also achived success in their economies. Corruption in HK is low like Spore. Look carefully at Korea, their products is almost penetrating Spore.
However in the 1970s I used to lived and had a business in Brunei..I know K.B Seria, and B.S. Begawan well enough to know the people pf Brunei are not exactly happy even though they had plenty of money and oil money which all have a share somehow, and the reason a host of them migrated to elsewhere in the West are no different from Singapore. They had no personal liberty and no prospective for themselves or their children, so many went to live in Vancouver, Canada where they re-settle and build new homes.
If you folks want to see Sounteast Asia, try visit J.B. first, and ask about the price of a landed property, a car, and find out how just to survive there.. those people are far happier though poorer in comparison with us with our 5 Cs...Car, Condo, etc...like :Singapore:
- One Wife
- Two Children
- Three Bedroom Condo
- Four Wheels
- Five Figure Salary
And indeed, that is why 'Singapore is solid'!
Malaysia? Well, Malaysia's Rules of Simple Living are the following:
- Five Children
- Four Wives
- Three Figure Salary
- Two Wheels
- One-Storey Link House
So would you want to go live in M'sia when you have a choice?
Why Singapore had so many things and people still migrate elesewhere:
I honestly can say we have become all good slaves of the garmen
Have no fear..just enjoy your life as a good slave in your Country! -
Originally posted by alien2:
Why do you want to benchmark against the lesser states?No nation progresses backwards..
I had been to western Countries and lived there many years, and my daughter was born there, and now she just graduate with honours and intend to live there as a foreigner. I still want to live here, not because Singapore is a better Country ..but because my own culture and kinship are all here. I am not going to compare with the western Country, Singapore is far behind in many ways..
However in the 1970s I used to lived and had a business in Brunei..I know K.B Seria, and B.S. Begawan well enough to know the people pf Brunei are not exactly happy even though they had plenty of money and oil money which all have a share somehow, and the reason a host of them migrated to elsewhere in the West are no different from Singapore. They had no personal liberty and no prospective for themselves or their children, so many went to lived in Vancouver, Canada where they re-settle and build new homes.
If you folks want to see Sounteast Asia, try visit J.B. first, and ask about the price of a landed property, a car, and find out how just to survive there.. those people are far happier though poorer in comparison with us with our 5 Cs...Car, Condo, etc...like :Singapore:
- One Wife
- Two Children
- Three Bedroom Condo
- Four Wheels
- Five Figure Salary
And indeed, that is why 'Singapore is solid'!
Malaysia? Well, Malaysia's Rules of Simple Living are the following:
- Five Children
- Four Wives
- Three Figure Salary
- Two Wheels
- One-Storey Link House
So would you want to go live in M'sia when you have a choice?
Why Singapore had so many things and people still migrate elesewhere:
I honestly can [b]say we have become all good slaves of the garmen
Have no fear..just enjoy your life as a good slave in your Country! [/b]
The Bruneian Chinese diaspora experience is not a valid nor salient point in the debate about quality of life and why Singaporeans migrate. -
It's not benchmarks, there are none ..just from my POV like those who said the home tuff is fair and let's look around..they tooOriginally posted by LazerLordz:Why do you want to benchmark against the lesser states?No nation progresses backwards..
The Bruneian Chinese diaspora experience is not a valid nor salient point in the debate about quality of life and why Singaporeans migrate.
are 
all narrow minded.. just like cagey chicken coop up in a little place, and we shout. "see for yourself, all those terrible countries like Phillipine..Sri Lanka..China..India..all like this so we are far better? " are we?
REcommended a reason here:
http://www.sgwiki.com/wiki/Unfair_system_in_Singapore%3F