Lower The Cost Of Living
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Originally posted by oxford mushroom:
Look you are a foreigner,what do you know about what our reservist had being trained in.We are trained in the external defence of singapore and not internal disaster management during our full time service.That portion of internal disaster management is under the civil defense area and the police,so if you do not know what you are talking about,you should not go into that area.
Reservists have completed their training in NS, whilst full-time servicemen are [b]undergoing training. Don't you see the difference?
Anyway, I do not advocate using these any of these personel...the training will take too long. My post is in response to the question of small government. Beware that the civil service becomes stripped to its bones and unable to respond in an emergency. We need professionals to do such a job.[/b]
i see,and my reponses was to casino_king's post about using reservists,which certain does not make sense -
What makes you think I am a foreigner? When I did my national service you were probably not even born.Originally posted by Aveme:Look you are a foreigner,what do you know about what our reservist had being trained in.We are trained in the external defence of singapore and not internal disaster management during our full time service.That portion of internal disaster management is under the civil defense area and the police,so if you do not know what you are talking about,you should not go into that area.
i see,and my reponses was to casino_king's post about using reservists,which certain does not make sense
There are too many Singaporeans who whine about the cost of living but are not prepared to accept a lower wage and a lower quality of life that will enable costs to be lowered.
You want to own a flat and you want a salary higher than the foreigner who accepts a lower wage and stays in a small room with another room mate. To employ you, your employer will have to levy higher charges and so raise the cost of living for other Singaporeans.
Khaw Boon Wan is right: lower cost of living also means lower wages. Unfortunately too many Singaporeans just cannot understand that. -
well ok,i misunderstood what you said just now when you said me and many malaysians rent a room,i took that to mean that you are a malaysian too.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:What makes you think I am a foreigner? When I did my national service you were probably not even born.
There are too many Singaporeans who whine about the cost of living but are not prepared to accept a lower wage and a lower quality of life that will enable costs to be lowered.
You want to own a flat and you want a salary higher than the foreigner who accepts a lower wage and stays in a small room with another room mate. To employ you, your employer will have to levy higher charges and so raise the cost of living for other Singaporeans.
Khaw Boon Wan is right: lower cost of living also means lower wages. Unfortunately too many Singaporeans just cannot understand that.
K maybe in your generation of NSF,you guys were trained in disaster management but it is certainly not done for the more recent batches (at least till 10 years ago since i enlisted 10 years ago)
Your point is certainly wrong about lower wage=cost can be lowered.After the financial crisis,wages were cut accross broad,CPF cuts as well as most people accepting a wage cut to keep their jobs,but did cost go down? No,cost of every other thing went up instead, with critical area being the very daily transport neccessity,going up even when the company is already earning record profit.And no i am not whining about the cost of living as i have even agreed in some part of this thread that i know that rise in cost is inevitable.I am only concerned about the cost of living for the lowest 20% income bracket household,and that is what i had being talking about all this time in this thread that there is not enough being done to help this really really needy group. -
Originally posted by will4:If they can afford to come here to look after their granchildren, should they be rich enough?
Fellows Will4, they are rich in china -
I am only concerned about the cost of living for the lowest 20% income bracket household,and that is what i had being talking about all this time in this thread that there is not enough being done to help this really really needy group.
People in the Car forum often say that speeding doesn't kill, it is unsafe driving that does. It is not the high costs of living that hurt, but the gap between income and expenditure. To close that gap, you either increase your income or spend less and accept a lower standard of living.
Costs of living will rise if Singapore is going to attain a Swiss standard of living. The solution for the bottom 20% of the population is not to cut costs of living, which will hardly be possible, but to raise their income.
Why are they at the bottom of the heap? Is it because they lack the education and skills to compete?
In any case, there will always be the bottom 20%. Not everyone can be top in class...there will always be one at the bottom. I am saying that the Singaporean at the bottom is better off than the foreign worker who paid his agents thousands of dollars to work for $600 a month in Singapore and yet has enough money to send home.
Of course more can be done to improve the lot of our poor citizens. The solution has to be skill upgrade. And I reject the argument that uncles in their 50s cannot be trained to handle a new job. It will be painful and the pay will be poorer but it is better than being jobless.
If you cannot earn more and yet want to retain your standard of living, then one solution is to leave Singapore and live in a third world country where the costs of living are much lower. I have seen villagers in China who save for months to afford a new bicycle. If our bottom 20% live there, they will not have to worry about costs of living
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lower our salaries? if only government can lead by example by lower their '1st class salaries'. they are not worth as MUCH!Originally posted by oxford mushroom:What makes you think I am a foreigner? When I did my national service you were probably not even born.
There are too many Singaporeans who whine about the cost of living but are not prepared to accept a lower wage and a lower quality of life that will enable costs to be lowered.
You want to own a flat and you want a salary higher than the foreigner who accepts a lower wage and stays in a small room with another room mate. To employ you, your employer will have to levy higher charges and so raise the cost of living for other Singaporeans.
Khaw Boon Wan is right: lower cost of living also means lower wages. Unfortunately too many Singaporeans just cannot understand that. -
That I agree...Originally posted by 798:lower our salaries? if only government can lead by example by lower their '1st class salaries'. they are not worth as MUCH!
If only Clinton or even Tony Blair will take the job.. -
It is generally agreeable that cost of living will go up,but with regards to this group i am referring to,is it not possible to really put in the hardwork to locate such families and concessionary can be given to them?Originally posted by oxford mushroom:People in the Car forum often say that speeding doesn't kill, it is unsafe driving that does. It is not the high costs of living that hurt, but the gap between income and expenditure. To close that gap, you either increase your income or spend less and accept a lower standard of living.
Costs of living will rise if Singapore is going to attain a Swiss standard of living. The solution for the bottom 20% of the population is not to cut costs of living, which will hardly be possible, but to raise their income.
Why are they at the bottom of the heap? Is it because they lack the education and skills to compete?
In any case, there will always be the bottom 20%. Not everyone can be top in class...there will always be one at the bottom. I am saying that the Singaporean at the bottom is better off than the foreign worker who paid his agents thousands of dollars to work for $600 a month in Singapore and yet has enough money to send home.
Of course more can be done to improve the lot of our poor citizens. The solution has to be skill upgrade. And I reject the argument that uncles in their 50s cannot be trained to handle a new job. It will be painful and the pay will be poorer but it is better than being jobless.
If you cannot earn more and yet want to retain your standard of living, then one solution is to leave Singapore and live in a third world country where the costs of living are much lower. I have seen villagers in China who save for months to afford a new bicycle. If our bottom 20% live there, they will not have to worry about costs of living
It is not only about lowest 20% as i agree that there will always be a lowest 20% but it is about the lowest 20% who cannot cope with the cost of living that should be of concern.If the lowest 20% can cope,then there is nothing wrong.It is not just about skill upgrade but whether after such skill upgrade will companies employ them since they will mostly fall under the older group of workers and companies are mostly hesitant to employ such a group when they think they can employ a younger foreign worker who they think will be able to learn faster on the job.So they have competition from foreign workers as well as the age barrier and as such any move to help increase the income is not as easy as just talking about it
Eg,We have concessionary transport fare for students and the elderly as well as other such kinda differential price offerring to run their business.Such price differential plans are not new and certainly still bring a profit for the company.Maybe there can be a new catergory set up? Not in the form of a direct price plan but what i have suggested in the form of coupons price discount for the really essential items like rice,that only after they are properly targeted to be really unable to cope with the cost of living will such coupons be given.Given that for most of such household,there will come a point in time where they will become better off (found a better paying job thru help after retraining,or maybe the children has finished their schooling and can help out in the household income),such a system can then be withdrawn from them.The main thing is that such a group should be closely tracked as i believe that most people of such a group are not lazy and if given adequate help,they may soon stand up on their own feet.
And about what you said of relocation,it is certainly irresponsible,these group of older workers contributed so much to what singapore is now.We really should not be encouraging them to leave for a cheaper country,they are still our fellow singaporeans.And to that,Mr Khaw Boon Wah certainly is very irresponsible by him claiming tht those who cannot afford the cost of living here will be given the choice to retire in retirement village in JB,Batam and bintan aka almost saying that if you cannot afford the cost here,you should go die else where -
The water conservation tax should stay, as water is a strategic resource which we cannot afford to waste.Originally posted by dragg:now that PAP has gotten the strong mandate that they relished what are the things that they should or can do to lower the standard of living?
for a start i think they should remove the water conservation tax.
Look at the present situation. We rely on Malaysia for water. Legal agreements or otherwise, this is a vulnerability on our part.
What about Newater? The production of Newater requires energy, the cost of which has been rapidly rising. We import all our energy. As such, while Newater allows us to circumvent some of the vulnerability of depending on Malaysia for raw water, we are clearly NOT 'out of the woods'. We are still vulnerable to disruptions to our energy supplies with the Newater solution.
Hence, we need the tax to encourage water conservation.
There are other ways to contain costs, like capping fare increases for public transport.
regards,
siginah -
we pay for our personal water consumption.Originally posted by siginah:The water conservation tax should stay, as water is a strategic resource which we cannot afford to waste.
Look at the present situation. We rely on Malaysia for water. Legal agreements or otherwise, this is a vulnerability on our part.
What about Newater? The production of Newater requires energy, the cost of which has been rapidly rising. We import all our energy. As such, while Newater allows us to circumvent some of the vulnerability of depending on Malaysia for raw water, we are clearly NOT 'out of the woods'. We are still vulnerable to disruptions to our energy supplies with the Newater solution.
Hence, we need the tax to encourage water conservation.
There are other ways to contain costs, like capping fare increases for public transport.
regards,
siginah
i dont see why the tax is necessary. -
the tax is to make people feel the pinch so they refrain from using too much,it is not referred to water conservation for nothing.As much as i feel cost of living has to be controlled,water is too precious for people to waste so this is actually necessaryOriginally posted by dragg:we pay for our personal water consumption.
i dont see why the tax is necessary. -
i have suggested in the form of coupons price discount for the really essential items like rice,that only after they are properly targeted to be really unable to cope with the cost of living will such coupons be given
Giving a 30% discount for rice will not help the poorest 20% of the population. What about transport, housing, healthcare and so on? Give out more welfare? Who's paying? Not me...
Those who cannot compete in a globalised economy will suffer a salary drop unless they emigrate to cheaper economies. That is a fact and unless people recognize the facts, you will not solve the problem. -
And to that,Mr Khaw Boon Wah certainly is very irresponsible by him claiming tht those who cannot afford the cost of living here will be given the choice to retire in retirement village in JB,Batam and bintan aka almost saying that if you cannot afford the cost here,you should go die else where
Nobody is forcing you to do anything. You can die in Singapore alone in a one-room flat and be discovered a week later when you are decomposed and crawling with maggots. Or you can live out your last days in a nice retirement home attended by foreign nurses and maids. -
Well if the govt make better use of their tax collected,such an amount could actually be subsidied from there?eg the govt does so much unnecessary road work,digging up stuff and filling them in again,unnecessary changes to all the bus stops (there were quite a few such changes island wide a few years ago),spending unnessarily on plush goverment building,cutting back on minister's salary and lots more way that they govt did not make full efficient use of tax payer's money.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Giving a 30% discount for rice will not help the poorest 20% of the population. What about transport, housing, healthcare and so on? Give out more welfare? Who's paying? Not me...
Those who cannot compete in a globalised economy will suffer a salary drop unless they emigrate to cheaper economies. That is a fact and unless people recognize the facts, you will not solve the problem.
Also it is a fact that when GST was introduced,it shifted the tax burden of the country onto the poorer people,since in the first place when they were having very low income,they were not subjected to much income tax,so GST made them worst off,if cos of this,it subjected them to further hardship,should not more to made to help them?
Not solving the problem also does not means we should abandon our citizens who had worked hard during our Nation building years? -
well maybe you will think it is nice since maybe you are more cosmopolitian but to our older more ordinary generation,this is their land,their country,if they have to die,they will want to die on their own land and not on foreign soil (since they worked so hard to help build up our nation and is proud of it)Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Nobody is forcing you to do anything. You can die in Singapore alone in a one-room flat and be discovered a week later when you are decomposed and crawling with maggots. Or you can live out your last days in a nice retirement home attended by foreign nurses and maids. -
what has the water conservation tax got to do with water wastage?Originally posted by Aveme:the tax is to make people feel the pinch so they refrain from using too much,it is not referred to water conservation for nothing.As much as i feel cost of living has to be controlled,water is too precious for people to waste so this is actually necessary
we pay according to the amount of water we used.
are you going to start using more water just because the water conservation tax is removed?
the water conservation tax serves no purpose at all. whether it is imposed or not does not affect water consumption. -
well i think it does,maybe not you but there are people who feel the pinch of a higher price and will be more prudent in using their water.I think you have seen reports of farmily who recycle some portion of their water usage,eg water from the washing machine is drained to a separate container and used for some other purpose.Water is too precious to singapore that is why we have to set a barrier to help as much as possible to conserve water.If such a tax is removed and people feel that water is more affordable,surely less will give a second thought on trying to use as little as possible.Cost of living can be looked at from other areas to help.Originally posted by dragg:what has the water conservation tax got to do with water wastage?
we pay according to the amount of water we used.
are you going to start using more water just because the water conservation tax is removed?
the water conservation tax serves no purpose at all. whether it is imposed or not does not affect water consumption. -
One of the minister has made a ridiculous remark that Singaporeans should cut down their bathing time in order to save water. To clean yourself and enjoy a bath is an only simple pleasure by most poor Singaporeans. That silly remark might have irked many poor Singaporeans,it might have cost them many precious votes in the last general election! Why we need to pay 3 types of taxes for water? Singapore has so many reservoirs, are we really short of water? Why most reservoirs released so much water to the sea especially after a heavy downpour?
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yes singapore is v short of our own native source of water,if not we will not have to import water from malaysia and there is so many arguements on the water selling price to singapore.If we are not short of water,do you think we need to resort to reverse omosis in the form of NewWater?If tommorow Malaysia turn off their water supply to singapore and refuse to turn it on,singapore will be in a deep crisis.Originally posted by Heartlander:One of the minister has made a ridiculous remark that Singaporeans should cut down their bathing time in order to save water. To clean yourself and enjoy a bath is an only simple pleasure by most poor Singaporeans. That silly remark might have irked many poor Singaporeans,it might have cost them many precious votes in the last general election! Why we need to pay 3 types of taxes for water? Singapore has so many reservoirs, are we really short of water? Why most reservoirs released so much water to the sea especially after a heavy downpour?