Look what Israel is doing to the Palestinians --
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I used to regard that Israel is just and is the Victim..
But recent years, I have change my opnion.. and realised that I has been duped by media conditioning... I'm not advocating that all palestinians actions are correct. Then recently, I realise what else can they do ?? The US gives 30% of their billions dollar foreign aid to them, which mostly are for military, and Vitoe any known UN security council resolution (which stands at 81 now)... couple this with the extensive US media propaganda machine.. really what else can they do ???
Their lands were, indeed, occupied, dispite what we are reading in the news paper. The map of 1948 and the map know cliam by the Israel and US are very different. The Israelis are actually expanding settlements in the west bank... despite their road plans with the US. The 14 month cease fire by HAMAS are actually one sided only - Israel did not.. Israel continues to bomb the common Palestinians for retaliations discriminately...
Here's a good article about the west current situation.Every road out of Bethlehem is blocked by mounds of dirt and a checkpoint. Imagine driving along as you have always done, between Hampstead, say, and Regent's Park, when you come upon a barrier of earth thrown up the night before. Soldiers stand at the barrier in full battle gear, yelling at you in a strange language or a pidgin version of your own. They tell you to get out of your car - you're not allowed to drive here any more. If you're allowed to carry on, you will do so on foot. They yell at you to line up and they take their time checking your papers, questioning you - Where are you going? Why do you want to go there? Prove to me that your daughter/best friend/dentist/music teacher lives there. A few metres away you can see the new highway that cuts across your old road. Cars are speeding along on it, driven by men and women of that other people, the people that the soldiers belong to.
http://www.thewe.cc/contents/more/archive/december2003/now_the_landscape_itself_has_changed.htm
We stand at one of these checkpoints, my son taking photographs of the pedestrians waiting to be allowed to walk to the next village. Two soldiers leave the checkpoint and stride towards us, raising their M16s to the level of our heads and shouting: "No photographs! Give me your camera. You! No photos."
"Where's the notice that says no photography?" we call.
"Everyone knows. Give me the camera. I can shoot you. You take photo of me..."
"We took photos of the people waiting."
"You took photo of me. I can shoot you..."
"What's the problem? Are you ashamed of what you're doing? Show me the paper that says we can't take photos." This is Tony, our Palestinian guide. He's a film editor with an international press agency and has a US passport.
"I don't need no fucking paper. I can shoot you, that's my paper."
"Show me the paper."
"This is Israel, I do what I like. I can shoot you. Here I do what I like."
"This isn't Israel. This is the West Bank."
"West Bank? What is this West Bank?" The soldier turns to his friend questioningly.
My son tries to chip in but I stamp on his foot.
"Look: in there, is Palestine. You do what you want. Here is Israel. In your country, can you take pictures of secret soldiers?"
After a bit more of this Tony gets out his mobile and phones the army. The soldiers take off their shades and turn into unhappy young men: "You think I like to do this? You think I like to stand all day wearing this, and this, and this? This I have to do so my mother is safe in Tel Aviv." We suggest it might be a happier situation all round if they did this on the green line. "Green line? They can creep under the green line. Look: we give them everything. They always want more. We give them land, we give them water, we give them electricity. They want more..."
"But you are stealing these people's land. What about the settlements?"
"That is for the politicians. We don't know about that. It is the politicians." They go back to the checkpoint. We keep the camera. Tony has to take our photos to the army censor for clearance within 48 hours. -
Every Land in Isreal when their independence was purchased by the Jews themselves... Naturally they have the rights to claim the land as theirs... Same thing as Singapore forbiding Malaysian from Staying in Singapore as they like.
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i won't put it past the palestinians to execute their own citizens in order to make israel look bad...
click here => The Second Draft
download the clips and watch them... then you'll understand the reason for my words above..
that being said, BOTH sides of this conflict are at fault, but it seems that only one side is being condemned for the violence...
think about that for a while
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Every Land in Isreal when their independence was purchased by the Jews themselves... Naturally they have the rights to claim the land as theirs... Same thing as Singapore forbiding Malaysian from Staying in Singapore as they like.
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Was there any financial transaction by the Jews to gain their independence - similar to the British East India Company paying a negotiated sum of money to the Sultan of Johor for the permanent use of a large island - later to be known as Singapore ?Originally posted by banzie:Every Land in Isreal when their independence was purchased by the Jews themselves... Naturally they have the rights to claim the land as theirs... Same thing as Singapore forbiding Malaysian from Staying in Singapore as they like.
Throughout the chequered history of the Palestine, there were already resident Christians, Muslims and Jews living in peace next to each other as established communities.
It was the push of overseas Jews for a permanent home in the Biblical land of birth that later caused apprehension, as their overseas funds began to buy up local land, and resulted in the eviction of the local causing a social-political frictions as the delicate social-economic-political balance was tilted in favor of a growing Jewish community that began to be more assertive to its existence.
Historically, the Jews lost its political existence in this piece of geographical area known as Palestine since the Roman Empire; and this region was continuously occupied throughout history by various outside forces, with the European Colonial Powers occupying at the same time during the 19th Century.
After World War 1, the British Colonial Office had allowed for the managed migration of small number of Jewish immigrants into the Palestine, which caused consternation amongst the local Arabs - as it will upset the delicate economic-political-social status quo that existed for so long.
This managed migration of Jews became an exodus after World War 2, and Jews began to find their own passage to their Promised Land, and some were assisted by the Jewish Underground Movement - who were waging a clandestine war with the British Colonial Office.
Do the Jews have a right to move back to a geographical area which they have claimed as their birthplace based on Ancient History ?
Their move into this geographical region will necessitate the eviction of existing residents, so as to make room for new arrivals - with the new room for new arriving migrants being either forced onto the local residents by legislation, or private transaction; and with the weaker and larger Muslim community being at the receiving end of this immigration policy.
This has been the major cause of the "unhappiness" amongst the local Muslim residents, who see their future politica-economicl-cultural-social status quo being affected with an increase in the Jewish population; and which can only result in a diminishing to the social-political-economic-cultural rights and identity of the Muslim community.
Israel was threatened from the beginning of its creation, as its birth was deemed to be illegitimate and forced onto the local scene by foreign occupying forces, and made at the expense of the historical residents of the land occupied.
The industry and genius of the Jewish people allowed them to survive and battle against the odds that challenged and thrown at them; and that they were able to survive and overcome the natural-political-military-economic challenges throughout the last fifty years, surely have left the region with a fait accompli to the existence of Israel.
It is unfortunate that the continuous threat from the local Muslim community to turn back the clock of history has resulted in the incremental violent response from the State of Israel - both militarily, economically, and politically.
Each suicide bombing resulted in retaliation against the family of the suicide bomber, whose homes were bombed in return by the Israeli Defense Force.
The Great Wall of Israel is the latest response to block all easy access across a long and porous border that Israel shares with the various neighbors - which has all the various negative elements swearing to destroy Israel and threaten the safety of the Jewish communities.
In defending itself against the terrorist threats, it is jarring to note that Israel has ignored all international practises and treaties by building the Concrete Wall outside of recognised boundary lines. In the process, the Israeli built Concrete Wall had displaced more legitimate Communities - (mostly Muslims) - from the land that the Muslims have owned for generations.
Israel had built the Great Concrete Wall based on military defensive strategic and tactical considerations, and not on politically recognised border lines.
The political history of this region, and the intransigence of the attitudes from all sides towards each other will cause the Biblical prediction to come true - when the brothers begin to fight with each other, the House will come down.
The Jews and the Arabs both recognised Abraham as their Father, and this is according to both Biblical and Koranic records, as well as in the Jewish Torah.
They are brothers living in a divided House.
If they cannot resolve their differences, and with outside interference and support - (Iran's future Nuclear Bomb and a hostile Iranian attitude that swears to the destruction of Israel), surely the House will collapse. -
I agreed that both Palestinians & Israel did not make things good, both did something wrong.
The Land was indeed sold to Israel. Something already sold the previous owner have no rights at all. The expanding of Jews immigrant should be done co-ordinated with Land owners.
Like Singapore fishermans have no rights to go into Malaysia's water to do fishing. Like I will not comment on my old house what colors have been painted by the new owners.
I notice a strange behaviours, "They don't like to disscuss things." National pass-time seems to be argumentative / dispute. Not like Singapore's national pass-time is lining up. kekekeke -
At least you know a significant part of the foreign aid wont end up as expense for a dear leader's birthday celebration fiesta
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I did a search for famous jews and i am quite shocked by the list....
http://www.helsinki.fi/~pjojala/Wikipedia_Famous_Jews.htm
they include
Roman Abramovich, Russian billionaire
Steve Ballmer, US CEO of Microsoft (Jewish mother)
Boris Berezovsky, Russian billionaire
Michael Bloomberg, US politician, founder of Bloomberg News
Sergey Brin Russian-born US co-founder of Google
Michael Dell, US founder of Dell Inc.
Larry Ellison, US CEO of Oracle Corporation
Alan Greenspan, US economist, chairman of the US Federal Reserve
Andrew Grove, Hungarian-born US co-founder of Intel
William Paley, US billionaire who built CBS
Mayer Amschel Rothschild, German banker, first of the Rothschild family
George Soros, Hungarian-born US billionaire, investor, philanthropist
Laurence Tisch, US billionaire, owned CBS
Ted Turner, Founder of CNN
Woody Allen, US comedian
William Fox (Fox Film Corporation; 20th Century-Fox)
Michael Eisner (Paramount Pictures; Disney Studios)
David Geffen (Warner Brothers; DreamWorks SKG)
Steven Spielberg (DreamWorks SKG)
Louis B. Mayer, (the "M" of MGM)
Jack Warner (Warner Brothers)
Lew Wasserman (Universal Studios) -
It is just regrettable what is going on there. It is just another mark on what is an ongoing cycle of violence brought about by an ongoing cycle of events. I believe the most immediate solution is the creation of a peace kepping force to the region, to serve as a buffer between Israel and the Palestinians and the Lebs. It is essential that the world does not allow this proxy war to result in full scale confrontation between Israel and what are the real players in this poker game - the Syrians and the Iranians. With the state the global economy is right now, a war would sky rocket the price of oil, and bring the world to the brink of yet another global reccession.
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Lee Ah KiatOriginally posted by kilua:I did a search for famous jews and i am quite shocked by the list....
Toh Chin Koo
Lim Teck Ti
Chong Wai Fong
.....
"Jews of the Orient" -
uhh... one more thing:
"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa. While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."
(PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, in a 1977 interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw.) -
Read the recent history of Israeli - Arab wars and will realise that the Israelis have to be ruthless in dealing with their hostile neighbours. The Arabs want them to become extinct.
Jews have contributed much to humanity. 171 Nobel winners are of Jewish ancestry. It's better to have thewm as friends, even if it's for our own selfish reasons. -
That's something many people cannot understand. They think that the Arabs/muslims/etc actually have a deep love for jews and that if the jew just stop attacking their neighbours, there will be everlasting peace in the middle east.Originally posted by googoomuck:Read the recent history of Israeli - Arab wars and will realise that the Israelis have to be ruthless in dealing with their hostile neighbours. The Arabs want them to become extinct...
Many people tell me their simplistic version of a solution. That the jews should give education, medical aid and food to the poor, starving muslims. Don't worry, they won't use your food to feed their terrorists. Give money to the plaestines, don't worry, they won't use it to buy bombs. -
Look at it this way: Israel is a marked nation the moment it was created. It is not a war between nations. It is a war between religions, and beliefs. Zionists vs Muslims. Israel has no choice but to act the way it is acting now. When the Arab nations waged wars against Israel in the past, weren't they wrong? Let's face it, they do not want a non-Arab nation in the Middle East. Israel had to strike to defend its own integrity.
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the US will not intervene because israel is effectively being used in proxy by the US to wipe out anti-US hizbollah elements at no expense to the US..why would they intervene? they're already tied down knee deep in ira and afghanistan
