Are Singaporeans Discourteous?
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Fact is that, the older one gets, the more resistant to change you are. Poorly worded it may be, what I wanted to suggest is that as Singaporeans as a whole are a stubborn and apathetic community and factoring in the resistance to change older people would put up, it would almost be a forgone conclusion that nothing will come out of trying to change them, but that is just my point of view.Originally posted by pearlie27:young man,
older folks are more suspicious of kind gestures simply because they are more experienced and not because of what you claimed - firmly rooted tradition or hard life. they probably had been conned or heard enough of con stories. aren't most scams started with some sweetener or nice act?
i really don't understand what you meant by "No helping the majority of them. Just have to wait till they die.
And yes, there are many well moderated forums with mature members around, why dont you just google (or yahoo) for 'forum code of conduct' and look for rules pertaining to flame or derogatory terms. Also, amongst other things, double, triple, quadruple, pentuple etc posting is also generally frowned upon - the edit button is there for a reason. -
You should take your arrogance to those forums you mentioned.
Here, we all have parents. -
courtesy and well-mannered behavior speaks of a person's substance and family background.Originally posted by Daniel-Lim:Tests such as these have to be viewed in the context of how they were conducted.
As a Singaporean, i would say that generally we are courteous compared to many countries in Asia. But we are far from being courteous enough.
Courtesy is a form of generosity of spirit. Many people do not understand this. Like many things else, we have only a very shallow understanding of true courtesy.
For many Singaporeans, courtesy is just a facade, a thin veneer. We still get rude very quickly as a people. On the roads drivers are still aggressive, people still get impatient easily etc.
A very simple illustration.
I was in Vancouver recently, and I was surprised at how quiet the roads are. Not just that they have less traffic - which is the case, surely. But even in some of the congested popular areas, you find that the drivers there rarely use their car horns. This is patience, this is also true courtesy, good manners. Which is unfortunately not that common in Singapore.
Wealth is not a measure of a good family, the ability to groom educated and well-mannered children is. -
i tend to agree that we are not a very courteous lot. this is probably due to our fast-pace lifestyle. we become impatient and intolerant and have no time for social grace.Originally posted by Daniel-Lim:Tests such as these have to be viewed in the context of how they were conducted.
As a Singaporean, i would say that generally we are courteous compared to many countries in Asia. But we are far from being courteous enough.
Courtesy is a form of generosity of spirit. Many people do not understand this. Like many things else, we have only a very shallow understanding of true courtesy.
For many Singaporeans, courtesy is just a facade, a thin veneer. We still get rude very quickly as a people. On the roads drivers are still aggressive, people still get impatient easily etc.
A very simple illustration.
I was in Vancouver recently, and I was surprised at how quiet the roads are. Not just that they have less traffic - which is the case, surely. But even in some of the congested popular areas, you find that the drivers there rarely use their car horns. This is patience, this is also true courtesy, good manners. Which is unfortunately not that common in Singapore. -
You know what, that is relative. If I see some hot chick, I'll hold the door for her. If I see some ugly shit, I'll just walk through the door. So does that make me a courteous individual if I held the door for the chick? But just walked on when i encounter that ugly shit?
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The Japanese are a very courteous people....no question about that. Wonder if they bowed to their victims before raping the women, murdering the babies and beheading civilians.
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i feel that most sporean forums that appeal to the general singaporean crowd have members that tend to lash out whenever they feel they are targeted.Originally posted by altolize:Fact is that, the older one gets, the more resistant to change you are. Poorly worded it may be, what I wanted to suggest is that as Singaporeans as a whole are a stubborn and apathetic community and factoring in the resistance to change older people would put up, it would almost be a forgone conclusion that nothing will come out of trying to change them, but that is just my point of view.
And yes, there are many well moderated forums with mature members around, why dont you just google (or yahoo) for 'forum code of conduct' and look for rules pertaining to flame or derogatory terms. Also, amongst other things, double, triple, quadruple, pentuple etc posting is also generally frowned upon - the edit button is there for a reason.
most of the time the mod's behaviour would be seen as encouragement whenever he/she exhibits a bullying attitude with other members cheering the mod on. such behaviour traits are usually not present when average age of members range around 30 and above,its basically how we behave in our daily life, when we push others around to get what we want even if we're in the wrong.
didn't some guy posted something about a bullying culture? -
I think courtesy is overdone in campaigns (which are a waste of public money) and too culture specific . The ugly singaporean image is just created by a media, which has nothing better to do since there is not much events going around in small Singapore, and I am over it.
I would put it this way:
You have some singaporeans who are discourteous
You have some Brits who are discourteous (wait til you go to london and see what I mean)
You have some Aussies who are discourteous
You have some Dutch who are extremely blunt and discourteous
You have someone in the world who is discourteous
Likewise you have some people in those countries who are courteous .
Same everywhere in the world. -
No point in bringing up war storiesOriginally posted by oxford mushroom:The Japanese are a very courteous people....no question about that. Wonder if they bowed to their victims before raping the women, murdering the babies and beheading civilians.
They are very courteous to you in your country
They are very courteous to a white man in their country
They see a chinese in their country - they got only one thing to do - sigh and say out loudly and rudely "chukogujin" or "Gaijin"!
That is unless the Chinese is some billionaire out to buy them out in some company.
The girls - if you are their "friend" and you wear something that looks like some brand - they just grab your collar to "confirm" what "brand" it is .
Money always bring out courtesy in all people of the world
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Can the teachers handle the bullies? Answer is no. There seems to be an emphasis on getting 'great students' and encouraging them to become 'great teachers'. Those 'great students' ususally made the worst teachers around. Some will simply collaspes and cry when bullied by students. Another class of teachers are the 'nice pay! let's teach!' type. Their only concern is their monthly salaries. Got bullied? Theres your own bloody problem!
I had a teacher back in pri sch, who started smoking once he step out of the school. Not the perfect role-model, but he definitly have no problem handling the class. Another teacher in sec sch came into class and warned the students about horseplaying; "Most of the nonsense you people are doing, I have already done." -
singaporean just trying to be singaporean. the singaporean way.
why do we need to change ourselves just to please the foreigners. since they are here, they should change their mindset and adapt the local way. that is one of the very reason why we travel. to experience the foreign culture, good or bad.
i freq china. i dont expect every chinese to be courteous to me. since i m there, i will respect the local ppl. if you find a courteous one then good luck. if cant, why grumble over it?
the foreigner should just learn how to adapt life oversea instead of expecting them to adapt to their culture. -
It's the same in Hong Kong. If you dress well, come in a limousine and enter a Loius Vuitton shop, everyone will be extremely courteous to you. If you arrive on foot in a T-shirt, shorts and slippers, the shop keepers will tell you to go to Temple Street. "The things in the shop are too expensive, you cannot afford it..."
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you are really damn jialat.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:The Japanese are a very courteous people....no question about that. Wonder if they bowed to their victims before raping the women, murdering the babies and beheading civilians.
we are talking about courtesy. not about war atrocities 60 yrs ago. -
vancouver, hmmmmm ...................Originally posted by Daniel-Lim:Tests such as these have to be viewed in the context of how they were conducted.
As a Singaporean, i would say that generally we are courteous compared to many countries in Asia. But we are far from being courteous enough.
Courtesy is a form of generosity of spirit. Many people do not understand this. Like many things else, we have only a very shallow understanding of true courtesy.
For many Singaporeans, courtesy is just a facade, a thin veneer. We still get rude very quickly as a people. On the roads drivers are still aggressive, people still get impatient easily etc.
A very simple illustration.
I was in Vancouver recently, and I was surprised at how quiet the roads are. Not just that they have less traffic - which is the case, surely. But even in some of the congested popular areas, you find that the drivers there rarely use their car horns. This is patience, this is also true courtesy, good manners. Which is unfortunately not that common in Singapore.
*rubs chin ...... well ... perhaps you were lucky enough not to run into those asian punk gangs there ......
but yeah, you're right .... Old Lee once remarked that social graces will come after Singapore reaches a certain stage of economic development; that is to say, a wealthy society will naturally evolve into a gracious society .......
well ... I don't see that happening at all ...... -
Graciousness and wealth are not related. Old Lee was wrong.
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singaporean onli focus on being lumber one in airline, lumber one in AAA grade studies everything u c is superfical, onli matrix, i cried when i bk here, bk in matrix.
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exactly ....Originally posted by LazerLordz:Graciousness and wealth are not related. Old Lee was wrong.
but what's the solution ? ....
like i said in a post earlier in this thread, methinks what really makes a society a nice place to live is the people around you ....
but how can we build a gracious society ? ... 40 years of national building has shown that social engineering, big money campaigns and all that, doesn't work .... singaporeans still litter, public toilets are still not flushed, and we certainly are still rude and intolerant to each other .....
so .... perhaps it's something for the socialogists out there to chew on; do societies evolve ? ... or they are molded from the inherent characteristics of their citizens ? ... -
Illustrates the point: people are courteous to only certain people..it's not really courtesy, just discriminationOriginally posted by dragg:you are really damn jialat.
we are talking about courtesy. not about war atrocities 60 yrs ago. -
Not totally wrong...if there are three of you fighting over a bowl of porridge, the one who lets another go first will die of starvation. By natural selection, the selfish one will survive. Evolutionists also talk about the 'selfish gene' that allow our species to overtake other animals.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Graciousness and wealth are not related. Old Lee was wrong.
Courtesy is easy if you do not have to worry about your next meal. It's a tough message but it's true. -
I don't see how in hell, our society can be wealthy enough for social graces to materialize, when costs are escalating every year and the rich poor gap ever widening.Originally posted by Fatum:vancouver, hmmmmm ...................
*rubs chin ...... well ... perhaps you were lucky enough not to run into those asian punk gangs there ......
but yeah, you're right .... Old Lee once remarked that social graces will come after Singapore reaches a certain stage of economic development; that is to say, a wealthy society will naturally evolve into a gracious society .......
well ... I don't see that happening at all ...... -
you're right, .... I agree that life is inherently a darwainian process, when it comes to the crunch, I suppose everyone would switch on their most elemental instincts, however, in societies, wealth != graciousness and courtesies ....Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Not totally wrong...if there are three of you fighting over a bowl of porridge, the one who lets another go first will die of starvation. By natural selection, the selfish one will survive. Evolutionists also talk about the 'selfish gene' that allow our species to overtake other animals.
Courtesy is easy if you do not have to worry about your next meal. It's a tough message but it's true.
but since you mentioned japan above, I think that's a very good case in point, (perhaps it's because they are such a homogenous society), they have managed to forge a collective spirit that can take them through lots of adversities, they have a relatively huge population cramped onto a small space, and they have evolved common courtesies, tolerance and respect for the others that makes their restricted space tolerable, contrast that to other north east asian societies (one can easily guess which one in particular I'm trying to drive at), okie, perhaps in that particular society, not everyone have "arrived" yet, but they are certainly getting there rapidly ... but that society has evolved very differently than japan, living there can be highly stressful, cos you'll have to deal with the worser side of human nature every single day ...
so what shall it be for singapore ? ... you know, I sometimes cringe when i think of the day when we have 6 million citizens (plus FTs and FWs), all cramped into our little red dot ... -
i thought the wealthier the people get, the less gracious they'll become???
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wealth doesn't always translate into graciousness and respect for other people, infact, if you ask me, wealth tend to push people to the opposite direction ....Originally posted by ShutterBug:I don't see how in hell, our society can be wealthy enough for social graces to materialize, when costs are escalating every year and the rich poor gap ever widening.
but anyhow, to side track a bit, from a purely economic point of view, the rich and poor gap is simply a social consequence that we have to accept, there shall always be haves and have-nots in a society, some people shall have to slog all their lives for pittance, while others, like yourself, can be successful entreprenuers ... I agree though, that the rich-poor gap is something we have to keep track of, but that's fodder for another thread eh ...
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we should stop comparing the "guai lo" country to singapore.
we should just be ourselves.
those want to be courteous should start from yourself and should not expect any return smile of watsoever. unless u are in a high class resturant or boutique. this common singaporean dont earn hell alot of money but they are under hell alot of stress. -
i'd have to agrre that older citizens, especially grumpy upper-middle-aged women and men are the most discourteous of all, and also the scum of society eg. ah bengs & ah lians, mat punks(note term punk, meant to seperate these bastards from our normal malay compatriots) and of course the ultra-conservative singaporean fella who never utters a word