Nation serving
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In the past,Males were made to serve 21/2 yrs of army for the security sake of the nation
The Financial statues of our nation decades back have made it qutie impossible for singaproe to invest its capital entirely on the military,hence,the need for part time NS men
however,after decades,Why are males still being called up for NS?
Our nation have improved significantly in terms of economy and revenue.
And its bank reserve are enuff to her to hired full time military personel instead of making it a regulation for males of singapore citizen to be enlisted into the military.
and if we're talking abt lack of population,hadnt the tide been turned?
The influx of foreign talents and foreign workers have taken the roles of many lower paid jobs...hence leaving more singaporean jobless..
but unemployment aint the main issue right nw...
The issue is if foreigners have taken much of us singaporean jobs,wun that leave much singaporean jobless?
these ppl can then join the army and given a better pay.
The compulsary enlistment of male into NS might work in the past but now,I feel its not.
A successful person,being to serve the military for 2years means a halt in his life for 2 yrs...
Nt being to persue what hes wants,social circle being affected and contribution to the nation impossible[except NS]
Juz like the case of that talented violinlist.
It makes singapore difficult to advance and improve its area of areas
For growth there has to be a paid price
Juz like being militarily strong,spending of money is inevitable
and for the growth of nation as a whole,regulation has to be flexible and to change with time -
No offence but this topic discuss until sian liao so I am going to sing an army song....
Here we go again,
Same old sh*t again,
Up and down this....
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Cb la
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bro, frankly i dont understand what you trying to say.
encourage more FT so more singaporean men can join army to creat jobs for men?
during NS, why not much NS men join regular forces leh? and pay in many army formation are already high enough.
army has not shortage of regular forces and i still believe NS should be made compulsary for all men for a small nation like singapore.
you might feel NS is a waste of time, but when you start having kids and your kids walk down the streets and return home safely everyday, you start appreciating the job you have done 10 years ago and feel proud about yourself.
we should get FT to do NS and not FT to do our jobs so we can join army.
2.5 years in NS and 10year ICT is enough bro. -
What i was trying to pinpoint is that since the influx of foreigners is inevitable,The govert can use incentive and higher pay packages to make it much appealing for those who fidn it tough to look for jobs to enlist into the army willingly,and not pull some desperate 18 yrs old kid into the NS.Originally posted by reyes:bro, frankly i dont understand what you trying to say.
encourage more FT so more singaporean men can join army to creat jobs for men?
during NS, why not much NS men join regular forces leh? and pay in many army formation are already high enough.
army has not shortage of regular forces and i still believe NS should be made compulsary for all men for a small nation like singapore.
you might feel NS is a waste of time, but when you start having kids and your kids walk down the streets and return home safely everyday, you start appreciating the job you have done 10 years ago and feel proud about yourself.
we should get FT to do NS and not FT to do our jobs so we can join army. 2.5 years in NS and 10year ICT is enough bro.
Times are different,U dun make some stupid law and pull a kid into the military,not to mention the FUK up PAY.
Currently,the revenue and reserve our nation have i believe dosent requries the govertment to continue holding on to such regulation.
they can afford to hire full time personel -
yahOriginally posted by olala:What i was trying to pinpoint is that since the influx of tourist is inevitable,The govert can use incentive and higher pay packages to make it much appealing for those who fidn it tough to look for jobs to enlist into the army willingly,and not pull some desperate 18 yrs old kid into the NS.
Times are different,U dun make some stupid law and pull a kid into the military,not to mention the FUK up PAY.
Currently,the revenue and reserve our nation have i believe dosent requries the govertment to continue holding on to such regulation.
they can afford to hire full time personel
n im voting pap out 
they have a choice n so have 1 
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I think NS should stay.
This 2 years that young men spent in the SAF is not wasted, the young men grew stronger mentally & some physically. Got to know people from all walks of life. Make new friends.
Many brotherhood like relationships are carved out from the SAF.
We learn about cultural diversity comes united as a nation when everyone regardless of race & religion (perhaps background is omitted; white horse) kiss the same floor when your SGT knock everyone down.
I have a friend Mr Wong Wah Poh Paul (HQ ARMCEG/MNT COY) currently in UK studying. Having grown up his whole life in Liverpool, he speaks only British accented English. He finds that NS helped him positively towards building his character and opened his vision to a wider horizon. Paul also contributed greatly towards the sports culture in the unit and he plays fantastic soccer & tennis.
And being an ex-sergeant, he said it helped him a lot to have better leverage against his competitors back in UK. In school and he believes even in the working world.
Looking beyond economic gains, NS is not as simple as we think. -
time may have passed, everything may have changed, but 1 fact still remains. We cannot depend on anyone else, but OURSELVES to defend the nation.
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Freedom of choice....best way is just go overseas...then don't need to serve...better yet...renouce citizenship....but make sure you get the passport over the other side first.....then can withdraw all your cpf...cos you no longer a citizen....to me I live by one simple principle.....if you can't beat them...quit...
my motto is to each his own...if our forefathers left their lands for a better life(and they were no considered disloyal), then we can do the same to...to each his own....we become the new generation of emigrants.... -
I see the positve effect than NS will have...both socially and as well as self charecter building.however,This isnt the point which I'm Talking abt.Originally posted by nanren4ever:time may have passed, everything may have changed, but 1 fact still remains. We cannot depend on anyone else, but OURSELVES to defend the nation.Originally posted by nanren4ever:time may have passed, everything may have changed, but 1 fact still remains. We cannot depend on anyone else, but OURSELVES to defend the nation.
What u stated is true...and applies for all nation however,I dun think its appopriate to juz pass a regulation and make ppl serve the army against their wishes.A positive benifits to the nation is one thing but know that rights and choices is another.
Earlier post I've said that since our nation has become more wealthier[as said by LHL on national tv] shnt they put a halt to this regulation which have been in effect for the past decades?
back then ns was compulsary bcuz of the lack of funds but now?
Is the govertment still in the 1960's?
I think so.
Why so?cuz they are opening doors to FT as tho we are in the 1960's when singaproe has juz embarked on large scale industrailisation programs and need FT to develop the economy...
Doing away with the 2 yrs NS will allow the males to contribute to the nation economically and by logic,reduce the need for too many FT.[well unless the govertment still believes foreigners are better no matter what]
As for ns?Are they still thinking that they are not generating enough revenues to employ full time military personel?
Wasnt lack of funds the reason for implementing this national service back then?
since we are doing so well economically,It's fair that they do away with this stink.
Instead of them pulling ppl in thinking it will instill loyalty to the country,it went against them.I doubt many will feel loyal to the country after NS,most are even more fed up and the reason why they are staying in singapore is bcuz they do not have the means to migrate. -
We cant even have a 4 or even a 3 star general in the army if ther are no regular service man dude. This show u how small in no. our army is compare to our neighbours.
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As long as you would serve or be willing to fight for your new home, by all means.. no one will say a bad thing.Originally posted by Coquitlam:Freedom of choice....best way is just go overseas...then don't need to serve...better yet...renouce citizenship....but make sure you get the passport over the other side first.....then can withdraw all your cpf...cos you no longer a citizen....to me I live by one simple principle.....if you can't beat them...quit...
my motto is to each his own...if our forefathers left their lands for a better life(and they were no considered disloyal), then we can do the same to...to each his own....we become the new generation of emigrants....
and then there are those who run away from nation to nation. -
i do agree that some are cowards running from one naation to anotherOriginally posted by LazerLordz:As long as you would serve or be willing to fight for your new home, by all means.. no one will say a bad thing.
and then there are those who run away from nation to nation.
But why cant the govt let us voluntarily serve on our own than pull the males in?
even those who are untrained,when face to protect their love ones will take up the guns rite -
just a simple question here.Originally posted by nanren4ever:time may have passed, everything may have changed, but 1 fact still remains. We cannot depend on anyone else, but OURSELVES to defend the nation.
If ur country treats u like a 2nd class citizen and gives all benefits to outsiders. Leeching ur hard earned money from u time and time again.
when war breaks out, would u defend UR COUNTRY or UR FAMILY? -
Can you be sure that the number of willing volunteers can support the defence policy and current armed posture of Singapore today?Originally posted by olala:i do agree that some are cowards running from one naation to another
But why cant the govt let us voluntarily serve on our own than pull the males in?
even those who are untrained,when face to protect their love ones will take up the guns rite
I don't think defence is something we can afford to mess around, even the bloody liberal inside me thinks that it's a no-argument situation. Military operations around the world are on the upswing, personal safety index is dropping like flies in winter and I think no nation with conscription today will end it totally.
What I would like to see is a more robust and mature system to channel different citizens into alternative non-military national service, for example consicentious objectors and the like; through careful verificiation of these people, making sure that they are not kengsters who convert to siam NS. Plus making sure these numbers do not impact adversely on our military readiness status.
This is something that can be done, if we actually bother to work on it. -
Originally posted by LazerLordz:
Can you be sure that the number of willing volunteers can support the defence policy and current armed posture of Singapore today?
I don't think defence is something we can afford to mess around, even the bloody liberal inside me thinks that it's a no-argument situation. Military operations around the world are on the upswing, personal safety index is dropping like flies in winter and I think no nation with conscription today will end it totally.
What I would like to see is a more robust and mature system to channel different citizens into alternative non-military national service, for example consicentious objectors and the like; through careful verificiation of these people, making sure that they are not kengsters who convert to siam NS. Plus making sure these numbers do not impact adversely on our military readiness status.
This is something that can be done, if we actually bother to work on it.
Might be aheived if the govt bothered to work on it
But any attempt in reform?i see none
and can we not forget the fact that the govt taking care of FT are making us feel out of place?
where shld our loyalty then stem from? -
So that's why we need a more robust political system that is attuned to civil society reform and lobby groups.Originally posted by olala:
Might be aheived if the govt bothered to work on it
But any attempt in reform?i see none
and can we not forget the fact that the govt taking care of FT are making us feel out of place?
where shld our loyalty then stem from?
What is going on now, is just the govt talking. They are just one factor in a State.
Loyalty is to the place you grew up, the memories that you have of your childhood, your first love etc. It's never solely about the stuff they dish out to you on NDP parades.
What do you feel when you arrive home after a long day? A sense of relief? The fact that you and your family live in peace? I guess it's one of those intangible things in our little individual story.
National history does not equate to personal history, it's just one part of it. -
U meant an more IRON FIST?Originally posted by LazerLordz:So that's why we need a more robust political system that is attuned to civil society reform and lobby groups.
What is going on now, is just the govt talking. They are just one factor in a State.
Loyalty is to the place you grew up, the memories that you have of your childhood, your first love etc. It's never solely about the stuff they dish out to you on NDP parades.
What do you feel when you arrive home after a long day? A sense of relief? The fact that you and your family live in peace? I guess it's one of those intangible things in our little individual story.
National history does not equate to personal history, it's just one part of it.
yes memories,childhood and family do play a part however,if the govertment arent gonna improve the situiation to make the ppl feel in palce,are we obliged to stay on and serve?[and i mean basic need of the ppl]
Wuldnt it be better to flock to a nation where humans rights are respect and with loyalty,we'll serve the country willingly?
An effiecient govertment in the begining dosent means a smooth journey for the nation,leaders do make blunder and the evidences are showing. -
Lol. Not IRON FIST.Originally posted by olala:U meant an more IRON FIST?
yes memories,childhood and family do play a part however,if the govertment arent gonna improve the situiation to make the ppl feel in palce,are we obliged to stay on and serve?[and i mean basic need of the ppl]
Wuldnt it be better to flock to a nation where humans rights are respect and with loyalty,we'll serve the country willingly?
An effiecient govertment in the begining dosent means a smooth journey for the nation,leaders do make blunder and the evidences are showing.
The complete opposite. By robust, I mean stronger democratic institutions as opposed to the Party Rule effect.
Somehow along the way, we traded off human development for economic development. But by Maslow's hierarchy of needs, we have to eventually develop human security, although it is not in a normal timeline sort of fashion.
How fast will this take, could determine the sense of belonging for the current generation.Those who can leave , have done so and are working abroad. Most Singaporeans I know living abroad, still hope that one day we will be a freer and more caring society. -
Useless talk,wat we had served is this bunch of FTs la!!!
Let them take over loh ,we surrender to these FTs!!! -
I only hope the the future generations will be able to move on to somemore if there is no proper development of this society
will not be difficult for them to do so bcuz the high standard of living and low pay dosent amount to much savings to be brought overseas...but one things for sure...hoping that education wuld allow them opportunity in a coutry that balance FT. -
self-defeatist.Originally posted by foomwee88:Useless talk,wat we had served is this bunch of FTs la!!!
Let them take over loh ,we surrender to these FTs!!!
much as I detest the over-influx of FTs...I really think you should get a grip on life.. no point going crazy. -
NS or the conception of citizen soldiers is not just about military defence. It is also a very good policy to development community spirit over individualism and helps blend the society. The idea being to throw the black, brown and yellow guy into the same mud pool and they will crawl out looking the same. Same deal goes to the rich and the poor, they will wear and eat the same thing in SAF.
According to scholars, the future military will be a small professional groups of military units, so en masse conscripts are not likely to be the focus of our military anymore. But NS is still a very good form of National Education and I foresee greater flexibility and shorter NS in the future.
I also think that perhaps NS can be broaden to include other pple like females and new PR and citizens too. But instead of focusing on military, send them for some courses that develop them in terms of national education and team building. -
Aiyah. The bottomline is, Olala is just feeling farked up that he will need to go NS soon...
Thats why he kpkb so much...
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No it is notOriginally posted by mhcampboy:Aiyah. The bottomline is, Olala is just feeling farked up that he will need to go NS soon...
Thats why he kpkb so much...
feeling a waste of time to serve is juz one factor
theres a whole lot of overwhelming factors which juz dosent permit me to serve a nation like this
And com on..dun tell me i gotta serve military for this country jzu bcuz i was born on this soil
If so,the whole of Lebanese wuld have taken arms already