ST Forum : Reconsider ban on outdoor protests
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IMF/World bank should realise that if this keeps up, perhaps no cities would want to host their meetings in the future ! ... [/b][/quote]
our govt will host it all the way....
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that could have been their hidden motive after all.
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if that is the case we wont see any tenants in suntec.Originally posted by LazerLordz:that could have been their hidden motive after all. -
That guy has got balls.
Stating in the national newspaper that foreigners have more rights than Singaporeans. -
he's the real talent lah.Originally posted by charlize:That guy has got balls.
Stating in the national newspaper that foreigners have more rights than Singaporeans.
DT : Domestic Talent.
new buzzword. -
DT ?Originally posted by LazerLordz:he's the real talent lah.
DT : Domestic Talent.
new buzzword.
Or is it Die Trying? -
Government shld spend on money on LT, local talents. Dun forget, I am also a LT.
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For you, I'd trade you away for one FT.Originally posted by NUS_Superst@r:Government shld spend on money on LT, local talents. Dun forget, I am also a LT. 
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LL - 1Originally posted by LazerLordz:For you, I'd trade you away for one FT.
NUS wannabe - 0
Let the fighting begin. -
let me ask you a question. would you rather see city hall in ruins after the riots and pay even more taxes to fix the damages or live with a ban on potential troublemakers?
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Democracy is all about being allowed our Constitution; right to freedom of speech/expression, and public assembly.
If these are not allowed and instead forbidden, our gov should do well to remove one star (which represents democrcacy) from our national flag and make do with 4 stars.
Change the Sinagpore Pledge as well, omit the word Democracy.
Because we have NO democracy! They are afraid of Democracy! -
democracy doesn't mean that we have to allow chaos to reign ....Originally posted by ShutterBug:Democracy is all about being allowed our Constitution; right to freedom of speech/expression, and public assembly.
If these are not allowed and instead forbidden, our gov should do well to remove one star (which represents democrcacy) from our national flag and make do with 4 stars.
Change the Sinagpore Pledge as well, omit the word Democracy.
Because we have NO democracy! They are afraid of Democracy!
look at what happened to previous international meetings in other cities, that is not democracy, but anarchy in action ...
the goverment is not banning public demostrations completely ... so what's the fuss ? .... does not being allowed to riot and wreck havoc, or thronging the city to a standstill translate to infringement of freedoms ? ... what about my rights to the security of my person and property ?
note also that these protests I high-lighted above were before september 11, 2001, things are different now, it is something we all have to accept, it's easy to snipe at this decision of course, but then again, if something happens, it's also that goverment that'll be blamed eh ? ....
dammed if you do, dammed if you don't ..... nice -
Awwww... come one man...Originally posted by Fatum:democracy doesn't mean that we have to allow chaos to reign ....
look at what happened to previous international meetings in other cities, that is not democracy, but anarchy in action ...
the goverment is not banning public demostrations completely ... so what's the fuss ? .... does not being allowed to riot and wreck havoc, or thronging the city to a standstill translate to infringement of freedoms ? ... what about my rights to the security of my person and property ?
note also that these protests I high-lighted above were before september 11, 2001, things are different now, it is something we all have to accept, it's easy to snipe at this decision of course, but then again, if something happens, it's also that goverment that'll be blamed eh ? ....
dammed if you do, dammed if you don't ..... nice
Letting them come here and protest publicly is like allowing honey bees to come into a Killer Wasps' hive to share honey.
What has Killer Wasps to fear of simple honey bees??? -
We may get to see what new toys the riot police have...nice
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23 000 Police NSFs mobilised for the IMF.
I have friends among them.
No outdoor protests. The life of a foreigner is not worth the fingernail of a Singaporean. -
That is becoz Lee Kuan Yew is still alive,and his mindset is still in the 60's n 70's and he couldnt adjust his thinking back to the reality,which is now-the 21st century,since he is already old n senile.Originally posted by Atobe:
Singapore is already in the 21st Century, and yet we constantly remind ourselves of the vicious circumstances of the 1960s to justify the ban on all forms of public protests.
After his death,which will most likely to happen in the next 5-7 years,most probably he will die of cancer.I am sure our country will be more liberal after his death.Cheers.^^ -
Trick is to stop any protests in the bud before they boil out of control. Time to buy more tasers..Originally posted by Typhoon:23 000 Police NSFs mobilised for the IMF.
I have friends among them.
No outdoor protests. The life of a foreigner is not worth the fingernail of a Singaporean. -
Negative publicity? It's a plus for Singapore brand
I AM surprised to read in your articles on the upcoming International Monetary Fund (IMF)/World Bank meetings that the controversy over the ban on demonstrations will result 'in negative publicity'. That may be true only for a very select group, namely, anti-globalisation protesters.
For Singapore as a brand, its 'strict, no-nonsense reputation' could actually be positive. Which are the target groups that Singapore wants to attract? Mainly two: tourists and foreign talents.
Tourists want a safe and clean environment, beautiful scenery (which the TV pictures from the conference will show), good food, great bargains and a wide choice of goods. They want stunning beaches and to be welcomed by smiling, caring and courteous Singaporeans.
Foreign talents want job opportunities, as little red tape as possible, low taxes, great entertainment, good food, a superb transportation infrastructure - and all in a safe and clean environment.
So if in articles about the IMF/World Bank meetings the brand Singapore comes across as a place that is safe and where work and play are not endangered by violent demonstrations (but where activists are instead given a designated air-conditioned space), then this would be an attractive part of the brand positioning that we need to attract the target groups we want.
Jorg Dietzel
(Straits Times 12 Sep) -
A reminder of what happened last year:Originally posted by ShutterBug:Awwww... come one man...
Letting them come here and protest publicly is like allowing honey bees to come into a Killer Wasps' hive to share honey.
What has Killer Wasps to fear of simple honey bees???
Hong Kong was hit by its most violent street clashes in more than 30 years last night as riot police fought running battles with protesters on the penultimate day of World Trade Organisation talks.
While negotiators inside the conference hall struggled to agree to a watered-down compromise on the future of global commerce, demonstrators outside ratcheted up their attempt to derail a deal that they believe sells poor countries short.
The result was the fiercest fighting this normally sedate commercial city has seen since the 1960s.
Police Commissioner Dick Lee said 41 people - including five police - were injured, but only two of them needed to be kept in hospital. Lee said police have detained 900 people and were determining whether to formally arrest them. 'If necessary we will make arrests. We will not let them go easily,' he said.
Police used water cannon, tear gas and pepper spray to repulse protesters - mostly Korean farmers - who tried to break through their lines with iron bars, wooden poles and battering rams made from steel security barriers.
With the clashes spread out over several hours and locations, there were numerous injuries, including several Koreans and police with bloody head wounds, and a woman who lost consciousness amid a thick, acrid cloud of tear gas. At one point, protesters smashed their way through police lines and entered the outer buildings of the convention centre. However, they were quickly driven out by police using truncheons - and according to one unconfirmed report - rubber bullets.
Miles of roads were cordoned off in the emergency, preventing trade delegates - at least temporarily - from entering or leaving the conference hall at a crucial stage in negotiations. 'The enemy have gathered near here,' explained one young police officer. 'There are hundreds of them, so we have blocked the roads.'
The fighting transformed a whole stretch of the city. The red-light strip of Wan Chai was eerily deserted. Instead of the usual Saturday-night hustle and bustle of prostitutes, strippers and punters, the area was locked down by thousands of grim-faced riot police.
The shopping and dining area of Causeway Bay was similarly blocked off. Instead of traffic and shoppers, the streets echoed with ambulence sirens, the buzz of police helicopters, the rhythmic drumming beaten out by Korean farm women in traditional dress, and the occasional dull crack of a tear gas round.
'We had a permit to protest, but midway along our route the police blocked our way. That is why there was violence,' said Rex Verona of the Asian Migrants Forum. 'Now is a critical moment in the negotiations. We will not allow governments and negotiators to sell us out.'
The demonstrators' anger has been stirred up by reports that negotiators are moving closer to a compromise package that does not include the key demand of many NGOs: an end to European and American agriculture subsidies that are destroying the livelihood of farmers in poor countries. Although there may be a small aid package to ease the disappointment, the most important issues related to global inequality are likely to be deferred to a make-or-break meeting early next year, while the main demands of wealthy nations - related to the service and manufacturing sectors - are pushed to the fore.
It is still far from clear that a deal can be agreed before tomorrow's deadline. The demonstrators want wavering countries - particularly Venezuela, Indonesia, Cuba, South Africa and the Philippines - to veto the plan.
'This protest is geared to strengthen the resistance of developing countries inside the conference centre, so they can block the awful deal that is being discussed,' said Walden Bellow, director of Focus on the Global South, who held out a copy of the proposal on the front line of the demonstration.
Despite the conservative and peace-loving reputation of Hong Kong, many local people who saw the clashes sympathised with the demonstrators.
Dozens joined the protests, some wearing surgical face masks for the first time since the Sars crisis, but this time to conceal their identity and protect themselves against tear gas.
'I'm ready to join the front line,' said one 20-year-old student who gave his name only as Z. 'I've never done this before, but I listen to the anti-globalisation lyrics of bands like Franco American. I'm angry at the WTO.'
Late last night hundreds of protesters were still on the streets: some lying down, some chanting, some drumming, many promising to stay there until morning if that was what it took to get their message across to the delegates.
'We would just like to march to the front of the convention centre so that we can express our opinion,' said Lee Chang Eun, of the Korean Federation of Trade Unions
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,1669943,00.html -
Originally posted by oxford mushroom:
No foreigner would label him/herself as foreign talent. This article basically repeats everything ad naseaum the government says, without much in the way of addressing the negative sentiment that is building up outside our shores.
[b]Negative publicity? It's a plus for Singapore brand
I AM surprised to read in your articles on the upcoming International Monetary Fund (IMF)/World Bank meetings that the controversy over the ban on demonstrations will result 'in negative publicity'. That may be true only for a very select group, namely, anti-globalisation protesters.
For Singapore as a brand, its 'strict, no-nonsense reputation' could actually be positive. Which are the target groups that Singapore wants to attract? Mainly two: tourists and foreign talents.
Tourists want a safe and clean environment, beautiful scenery (which the TV pictures from the conference will show), good food, great bargains and a wide choice of goods. They want stunning beaches and to be welcomed by smiling, caring and courteous Singaporeans.
Foreign talents want job opportunities, as little red tape as possible, low taxes, great entertainment, good food, a superb transportation infrastructure - and all in a safe and clean environment.
So if in articles about the IMF/World Bank meetings the brand Singapore comes across as a place that is safe and where work and play are not endangered by violent demonstrations (but where activists are instead given a designated air-conditioned space), then this would be an attractive part of the brand positioning that we need to attract the target groups we want.
Jorg Dietzel
(Straits Times 12 Sep)[/b]
Rigidity comes at a price.We could certainly do without this international sentiment .. -
Charities threaten to disrupt Singapore World Bank talks
1.00pm Thursday September 14, 2006
By Philip Thornton
The high profile meetings of the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund were in disarray yesterday after the world's leading charities threatened to pull out of the event in protest at heavy-handed policing by the Singapore government.
Oxfam and at least 15 other pressure groups are furious that the authorities have banned 28 activists from entering the country and deported two others.
The police have also forbidden any public protests, insisting that any demonstration takes places in a fenced area inside the convention centre that measures just 10 metres by five metres.
Earlier this year they warned they were prepared to "cane or imprison" protesters who committed violent crimes.
The Washington-based bodies hold their annual meetings outside the US once every three years.
The next in 2009 is due to be hosted by Turkey.
The issue has triggered a high level row between the World Bank, which seeks to relieve global poverty, and the Singapore government.
Paul Wolfowitz, the Bank's president, will today use a face-to-face meeting with the prime minister, Lee Hsien Hoong, to demand that they let in all of the 487 activists that had been given official accreditation.
Kevin Kellems, a senior adviser to Mt Wolfowitz, said the government's action was a "breach" of a formal agreement between the two bodies signed in 2003.
"These individuals have been cleared by their respective home governments and should not have been excluded from our annual meetings, "he said.
"We continue to urge the Government of Singapore to let them participate. We work with these representatives of civil society and we value their role - even when we disagree with what they say."
But several of the charities blamed the World Bank for allowing Singapore to host the event given its record on human rights.
It also warned of a repeat at the 2009 meetings in Istanbul.
Martin Powell at the UK's World Development Movement, who was of the 28 banned from entering Singapore, said the issue was wider than just the individuals involved.
"The key issue is that the World Bank and the IMF knew about Singapore's appalling record on dissent and public assembly and they ignored warnings as this is not the first time this has happened," he said.
He called on the British government to make a public statement condemning to actions and to take it up with the Singapore government.
"The Bank and IMF are allowing Singapore to get away with this. They are sending the message to other countries that they can ignore civil society.
"This underlines their lack of commitment to accountability and transparency. The Bank should not hold meetings in Turkey if they cannot guarantee access for civil society participation."
Max Lawson, a policy adviser at Oxfam, said it was joining 14 other bodies including Greenpeace and Friends of the Earth International in pulling out of a programme of 40 public meetings they had set up with the World Bank.
"We have decided to cancel the two events to support the boycott," he said.
"The Singapore government should have allowed in those who were accredited." Olivia McDonald, a senior policy officer at Christian Aid, said it was poised to join the boycott.
"I get the feeling that having it Singapore is about the businesses and the banks and if there's not the same access for civil society groups that leaves a real question mark hanging over the validity of the meetings."
However she said Christian Aid was torn by the fact that a boycott would also punish small Asian groups that would not benefit from the planned events.
The World Bank defended its decision to hold the meetings in Singapore pointing to the memorandum of understanding signed by its deputy finance minister that committed the government to allow in anyone approved by the IMF or the Bank.
- INDEPENDENT
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10401270 -
within the past few years, this is been quite an interesting example of the creeping erosion of absolute sovereignty of the nation-state. It is an inevitable process that comes about when international organisations come to the fore and possess greater clout than individual states.
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It would be great to read that they suddenly change their minds about holding the meeting here... this would teach our gov they can't always be so high handed when dealing with international bodies!
I don't care what economic losses this may result in, but hey, are we now doing very well or what?? It's not all rosey already is it?
No diff... -
funny thing is that BERI still rates us no.2 in the world.Originally posted by ShutterBug:It would be great to read that they suddenly change their minds about holding the meeting here... this would teach our gov they can't always be so high handed when dealing with international bodies!
I don't care what economic losses this may result in, but hey, are we now doing very well or what?? It's not all rosey already is it?
No diff...
Let's throw up a question here, do you think our workforce has suddenly gone from the pride of Asia to the drain today? Or is the media playing up the negative aspect to make it seem that our workforce is like a pile of horse crap, so that they can perform some managed justification to support the FT policy?
People don't become crap overnight. Something is not fully right here.. -
If they want a wayang show with protests and riots every now and then, they can always go back to Seattle. But if they want some solid decisions without disruptions, they will have to come to Singapore.Originally posted by ShutterBug:It would be great to read that they suddenly change their minds about holding the meeting here... this would teach our gov they can't always be so high handed when dealing with international bodies!
I don't care what economic losses this may result in, but hey, are we now doing very well or what?? It's not all rosey already is it?
No diff...
These NGO protesters have not proven themselves to be mature enough to demonstrtae peacefully. It's true that it's a minority that spoils their image but that's a problem they have to resolve themselves.
Singapore must not condone any acts of vandalism by these hooligans hiding behind the mask of civil protests. Those who have participated in violent disruptions at previous meetings must be banned and deported.