Welfarism is bad - tax and recover all costs is worse!!!
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Like the issue of ministers' pay, if there is going to be any comparison, comparison should be fair and above board and should have been benchmarked against the wage or remuneration and not the capitalist or boss categories.
There has been a fundamental error in the way ministers have made comparison of their pays with those of CEOs or successful entrepreneurs in the private sector.
Similary, if Singaporeans indeed must expand overseas and go regional there has to be certain accountable and transparent guidelines and principle.
If government must use the public taxes to invest them in overseas projects, like Shin Corp, Global Crossing or Bangalore, or Russian Townships, ministers must exercise great care to make sure that it will not result in huge losses as has happened in Shin Corp.
No companies or governments in this world will ever retain the services of any of their CEOs or managers who have caused such huge losses and yet go on to promote them in higher offices or grant them bonuses after such disastrous records.
So something is seriously wrong in the present investments of public taxes in overseas project. There will be more losses and disasters if there is no action taken to redress such huge losses.
Moreover a policy should be implemented to benefit all or majority of citizens. If such foreign investments should benefit only the government in hoarding surpluses to look good and give more bonuses to their own MPs, ministers and civil servants, the country will not gain the support of the people.
For the past 41 years, the government only governs to tax and recover all costs to the fullest degree even by way of creative accounting, double-charging on lands or rentals on public buildings or transport or utilities.
There has been a lack of accountability and transparency in the running of the government so far in public taxpayers' investments overseas.
There has to be clear policy to benefit the people in such areas of government. If there is none, and everything has to depend on summary statements of ministers or insight or foresight of leaders, there is no point to go on investing their tax monies in such overseas projects.
If government must practise avoidance of welfarism, fine. Then if such a policy is adopted, then government must take care not to over-tax and recover all costs. It should try to let citizens survive on their own economic competitiveness and not jeoparidize their retirements or medicare. The principle in a non-welfare state should be spelt out - if government does not help its people in creating jobs or social and cultural benefits then don't over tax and squeeze them dry.
But Singapore seems to have gone to the other extreme of taxing the citizens fully such as double charges on land or triple charges on vehicles and recovering all costs of essential services against the people by corporatization of such services to give them excuses in increasing fees and charges.
In a welfare state, government has the right to tax and recover all costs to pay for welfare. In a anti-welfare state like Singapore, its government spends only the minimum on citizens so there is no justification on principle or facts to charge the citizens more than nominal administrative fees.
In a non-welfare state, it would be immoral then for the government to refuse to help the citizens to keep increasing taxes and recovering all essential expenditures as Singapore has done and has been doing.
Let the comparison be fair if Singapore ministers want to quote welfarism as the excuse for its policy of not helping citizens in times of crisis.
It surely cannot have the cake and eat it. It is now enjoying all the benefits of not having to help its citizens and at the same time accumulating all the taxes into surpluses and reserving all rights to squeeze the citizens through all forms of taxes, direct, indirect and using excuses of all kinds to get them to pay.
So think again if anyone wants to talk about the danger of welfarism as practised in Australia, UK, Europe. We are certainly not having a welfare state but we may be producing a monster of government which keeps increasing its own surpluses while not lifting a finger to help them and squeezing them dry.
Even if we need to recover some costs the govenment should first only be entitled to recover only the consumption items but it has reserved its fullest right to recover any costs it likes until the citizens cannot survive resulting in so many family problems now ...suicides, low child birth, migrations, family disharmony, divorces etc. -
Cant even compare with HK???that why my relatives r all in HK dont enev bother about Spore!!
The old ppls especially in HK they can get at least S$500 pm w/o working but our old ppls here hve to take rubblishs frim the dustbin,poor old pppls in Spore!!! -
Well said. But I doubt if our govt practice any accountability.
They don't even reprimend the ministers when they made mistakes could we expect the govt to fire Temasek's CEO, our dear PM's wife??
All that they'll say is that Temasek is an independant company that does not report to the govt, althought its funding comes from the govt.
Sigh, I've already given up on Singaporeans. Yes, Singaporeans and not the Singapore govt.
We are the creator of our own monsters everytime we choose to vote them back into office regardless of the mistakes and injustice they've done.
Our ministers? Just listen to what they say and you'll know what calibre they are off. I doubt if they'll even make it to senior management if they are in the private sector; let alone CEOs.
But then again, Singaporeans... it is your choice. -
You think we hv a choice.. How many of the oppositions are Mr Chiam and Mr Loh, who can really work for the people. On top of that, not every PAP is NATO or pure crap (out to suck u dry then hang u out to dry).Originally posted by anonymouscoward:Well said. But I doubt if our govt practice any accountability.
They don't even reprimend the ministers when they made mistakes could we expect the govt to fire Temasek's CEO, our dear PM's wife??
All that they'll say is that Temasek is an independant company that does not report to the govt, althought its funding comes from the govt.
Sigh, I've already given up on Singaporeans. Yes, Singaporeans and not the Singapore govt.
We are the creator of our own monsters everytime we choose to vote them back into office regardless of the mistakes and injustice they've done.
Our ministers? Just listen to what they say and you'll know what calibre they are off. I doubt if they'll even make it to senior management if they are in the private sector; let alone CEOs.
But then again, Singaporeans... it is your choice.
It is just that good ones are hard to come by. I am not siding them but be fair to some who work hard for the people who voted for them.
Next point to outline is,
This group of 'Better ones' are not in the position to determine what can be invested and what cannot be done. Or maybe they do, but always got shot down by the one on top of them.
Furthermore, the newer generation of Minis are much more arrogant, so say them not or you will be label wayang, suck harder or make u bankrupt
So what can an ordinary SGean do under such circumstances ?? We are stuck unless we migrate !!
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Well said!!!Originally posted by robertteh:Like the issue of ministers' pay, if there is going to be any comparison, comparison should be fair and above board and should have been benchmarked against the wage or remuneration and not the capitalist or boss categories.
There has been a fundamental error in the way ministers have made comparison of their pays with those of CEOs or successful entrepreneurs in the private sector.
Similary, if Singaporeans indeed must expand overseas and go regional there has to be certain accountable and transparent guidelines and principle.
If government must use the public taxes to invest them in overseas projects, like Shin Corp, Global Crossing or Bangalore, or Russian Townships, ministers must exercise great care to make sure that it will not result in huge losses as has happened in Shin Corp.
No companies or governments in this world will ever retain the services of any of their CEOs or managers who have caused such huge losses and yet go on to promote them in higher offices or grant them bonuses after such disastrous records.
So something is seriously wrong in the present investments of public taxes in overseas project. There will be more losses and disasters if there is no action taken to redress such huge losses.
Moreover a policy should be implemented to benefit all or majority of citizens. If such foreign investments should benefit only the government in hoarding surpluses to look good and give more bonuses to their own MPs, ministers and civil servants, the country will not gain the support of the people.
For the past 41 years, the government only governs to tax and recover all costs to the fullest degree even by way of creative accounting, double-charging on lands or rentals on public buildings or transport or utilities.
There has been a lack of accountability and transparency in the running of the government so far in public taxpayers' investments overseas.
There has to be clear policy to benefit the people in such areas of government. If there is none, and everything has to depend on summary statements of ministers or insight or foresight of leaders, there is no point to go on investing their tax monies in such overseas projects.
If government must practise avoidance of welfarism, fine. Then if such a policy is adopted, then government must take care not to over-tax and recover all costs. It should try to let citizens survive on their own economic competitiveness and not jeoparidize their retirements or medicare. The principle in a non-welfare state should be spelt out - if government does not help its people in creating jobs or social and cultural benefits then don't over tax and squeeze them dry.
But Singapore seems to have gone to the other extreme of taxing the citizens fully such as double charges on land or triple charges on vehicles and recovering all costs of essential services against the people by corporatization of such services to give them excuses in increasing fees and charges.
In a welfare state, government has the right to tax and recover all costs to pay for welfare. In a anti-welfare state like Singapore, its government spends only the minimum on citizens so there is no justification on principle or facts to charge the citizens more than nominal administrative fees.
In a non-welfare state, it would be immoral then for the government to refuse to help the citizens to keep increasing taxes and recovering all essential expenditures as Singapore has done and has been doing.
Let the comparison be fair if Singapore ministers want to quote welfarism as the excuse for its policy of not helping citizens in times of crisis.
It surely cannot have the cake and eat it. It is now enjoying all the benefits of not having to help its citizens and at the same time accumulating all the taxes into surpluses and reserving all rights to squeeze the citizens through all forms of taxes, direct, indirect and using excuses of all kinds to get them to pay.
So think again if anyone wants to talk about the danger of welfarism as practised in Australia, UK, Europe. We are certainly not having a welfare state but we may be producing a monster of government which keeps increasing its own surpluses while not lifting a finger to help them and squeezing them dry.
Even if we need to recover some costs the govenment should first only be entitled to recover only the consumption items but it has reserved its fullest right to recover any costs it likes until the citizens cannot survive resulting in so many family problems now ...suicides, low child birth, migrations, family disharmony, divorces etc.
Here, we have a freaking and merciless govt dictating us. -
Well, you can look at the new batch of MPs from this year's elections.Originally posted by justcooler:You think we hv a choice.. How many of the oppositions are Mr Chiam and Mr Loh, who can really work for the people. On top of that, not every PAP is NATO or pure crap (out to suck u dry then hang u out to dry).
It is just that good ones are hard to come by. I am not siding them but be fair to some who work hard for the people who voted for them.
Next point to outline is,
This group of 'Better ones' are not in the position to determine what can be invested and what cannot be done. Or maybe they do, but always got shot down by the one on top of them.
Furthermore, the newer generation of Minis are much more arrogant, so say them not or you will be label wayang, suck harder or make u bankrupt
So what can an ordinary SGean do under such circumstances ?? We are stuck unless we migrate !!
The first thing they want to do for the people?
Dance hip hop at the Chingay parade.
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Can someone please enlighten me,Originally posted by charlize:Well, you can look at the new batch of MPs from this year's elections.
The first thing they want to do for the people?
Dance hip hop at the Chingay parade.
what does MP's have to do with Chingay? then,
what does Chingay have to do with hiphop? wondering,
what does hiphop have to do with politics? thinking,
what has SG politics done for the country? -
These are questions you should ask your MPs in their weekly meet the people sessions in your constituency.Originally posted by pinkish purple papayas:Can someone please enlighten me,
what does MP's have to do with Chingay? then,
what does Chingay have to do with hiphop? wondering,
what does hiphop have to do with politics? thinking,
what has SG politics done for the country?
But please don't come back and tell me they are too busy taking up dance classes. -
In my humble opinion, the usage of public taxes accumulated through past successful investment for new oversea investment is not without its merits. The oversea financial investment not only bring monetary returns but the sincere help offer to the underdeveloped nation can means that diplomacy or friendship can be forge that are beneficial to citizens of both partner nations in the long run.
Faced with the force of globalisation and rising cost of living, future increment in taxes cannot be keep in check for long. The way to tackle this knotty problem is through foresighted and systematic investment and with the returns, able to offset the taxes-recovery in the fiscal balance sheet. However, I am against using purely public taxes to fill the investment plans and perhaps it will be clearer if the government can somehow manage to draw a line between the blurry concept of funds solely for public welfarism and funds for investment.
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True wnough foreign investment is important however are they getting optimum returns or did they share the returns with the citizen. Obviously the MPs are trying to run the state like a private company thus we the citizens are the stakeholder. The accountability of the company to the stateholder is less than minimum. We aren't even allow to look at the company's returns of its different policiesOriginally posted by TooFree:In my humble opinion, the usage of public taxes accumulated through past successful investment for new oversea investment is not without its merits. The oversea financial investment not only bring monetary returns but the sincere help offer to the underdeveloped nation can means that diplomacy or friendship can be forge that are beneficial to citizens of both partner nations in the long run.
Faced with the force of globalisation and rising cost of living, future increment in taxes cannot be keep in check for long. The way to tackle this knotty problem is through foresighted and systematic investment and with the returns, able to offset the taxes-recovery in the fiscal balance sheet. However, I am against using purely public taxes to fill the investment plans and perhaps it will be clearer if the government can somehow manage to draw a line between the blurry concept of funds solely for public welfarism and funds for investment. -
One fine day, our gov may just announce they are going to implement Welfarism - when votes for them dwindles dangersouly low for them!
Just like Casinos - when avenues for money making dwindled, suddenly casinos are a great idea!
LPPL gov!!