We should outsource our electricity needs to Malaysia!!!!!!
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Yes of course. But power is just a whole diff thing.Originally posted by maurizio13:Ermmm, in case you don't know, we import a whole lot of other agricultural products from Malaysia, not restricted to poultry and eggs.
Why do u think we are looking into alternatives of water source? -
Ermmm, with or without the vital supplies, do you think our electricity production plant will sustain an artillery bombarbment or other missiles?Originally posted by vito_corleone:how intelligent you are, leaving vital supplies to potential enemies.
During times of war, all the vital installations will be targeted.
Hehehe
Don't think linearly. -
The government wants to make more money because they can produce recycled water at a lower cost.Originally posted by Pitot:Yes of course. But power is just a whole diff thing.
Why do u think we are looking into alternatives of water source?
Lower cost means higher profits.
In a war, do you really think we'll have water supply even though we have our own distillation plant and reservoir. -
I'm not a general but it is well known that we will be reasonably capable to defend out airspace well.Originally posted by maurizio13:The government wants to make more money because they can produce recycled water at a lower cost.
Lower cost means higher profits.
In a war, do you really think we'll have water supply even though we have our own distillation plant and reservoir.
And pls do not forget, electricity for malaysians is one price. Electricity for singaporeans is another.
Wads the point of outsourcing if they charge us higher? -
You "might" be able to defend the airspace, but can you defend against an artillery bombardment with shells containing chemical or biological agents?Originally posted by Pitot:I'm not a general but it is well known that we will be reasonably capable to defend out airspace well.
And pls do not forget, electricity for malaysians is one price. Electricity for singaporeans is another.
Wads the point of outsourcing if they charge us higher?
Remember they have a big area, they can withstand your bombings, but we can't sustain any bombings at all, because our development is too clustered. One artillery bombardment in Shenton Way and we can amithabuddha. -
What makes you think they will charge us higher? The cost for electricity in Australia and USA, when converted to Singapore dollars, all range around 13 to 14 cents per Kwh. I would be overjoyed if they charge us 15 cents/Kwh as compared to the 21.64 cents/Kwh Singapore Power charges us.Originally posted by Pitot:I'm not a general but it is well known that we will be reasonably capable to defend out airspace well.
And pls do not forget, electricity for malaysians is one price. Electricity for singaporeans is another.
Wads the point of outsourcing if they charge us higher? -
again, i am not a general but it is well known that we employ a forward defence policy.Originally posted by maurizio13:You "might" be able to defend the airspace, but can you defend against an artillery bombardment with shells containing chemical or biological agents?
Remember they have a big area, they can withstand your bombings, but we can't sustain any bombings at all, because our development is too clustered. One artillery bombardment in Shenton Way and we can amithabuddha.
which means we take the war to them. if we are fighting on sg land, tats it. liao.
so it shld push most arty out of range.
btw, back to power. i dont wan to turn this into mil nuts. -
politicsssssssssOriginally posted by maurizio13:What makes you think they will charge us higher? The cost for electricity in Australia and USA, when converted to Singapore dollars, all range around 13 to 14 cents per Kwh. I would be overjoyed if they charge us 15 cents/Kwh as compared to the 21.64 cents/Kwh Singapore Power charges us. -
You are making baseless speculation.Originally posted by Pitot:politicsssssssss -
Originally posted by maurizio13:You are making baseless speculation. its getting late and i'm getting lazy to type.
1) i know ur trying to prove that Power is overcharging us.
2) u are using the argument as something to prove your point.
say all you want. -
You mean they are not overcharging us?Originally posted by Pitot: its getting late and i'm getting lazy to type.
1) i know ur trying to prove that Power is overcharging us.
2) u are using the argument as something to prove your point.
say all you want.
What argument am using to prove my point?
You can see from all the data which I collected from the websites, I don't perform witchcraft. -
You mean they are not overcharging us?Originally posted by Pitot: its getting late and i'm getting lazy to type.
1) i know ur trying to prove that Power is overcharging us.
2) u are using the argument as something to prove your point.
say all you want.
What argument am using to prove my point?
You can see from all the data which I collected from the websites, I don't perform witchcraft. -
http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v3/printable.php?id=167136Originally posted by maurizio13:How much subsidies does the Malaysian government provide? Do you have any data on it? If you compare the price of electricity in Australia, it is only slightly more than the Malaysian price. Malaysian oil might be subsidize, unless you have some significant data, you can't quantify the degree of subsidy.
"..... The price of electricity in Malaysia is subsidised due to the cap in the price of natural gas which is being used in 70 percent of the power plants.
Petroliam Nasional Bhd (Petronas) sells natural gas to TNB at RM6.40 per unit which is 79 percent below than the market price of RM30 per unit.
Dr Lim said Petronas has to import an additional 500 million British thermal units (btu) of natural gas from Indonesia at market price to meet the current market demand of 2.5 billion btu as it could only supply two billion btu of gas." -
knnb
i still feel that e govt is cheating our $ 
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They dun need war to stop vital supplies to us... They need small quarrels only... If they think that we are v needy of vital supplies and we are not capable of producing them, they will rise price... Simple law of supply and demand...Originally posted by maurizio13:Ermmm, with or without the vital supplies, do you think our electricity production plant will sustain an artillery bombarbment or other missiles?
During times of war, all the vital installations will be targeted.
Hehehe
Don't think linearly.
Let them earn, might as well let our government earn... -
u feel???? u sure that is the correct word to use?Originally posted by Chelzea:knnb i still feel that e govt is cheating our $ 
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The figures you gave doesn't doesn't tell us anything about the cost of generating 1 Kwh of electricity at all. It just tells us that it's subsidised, but you still don't know what it takes to produce 1 Kwh of electricity.Originally posted by yoongf:http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v3/printable.php?id=167136
"..... The price of electricity in Malaysia is subsidised due to the cap in the price of natural gas which is being used in 70 percent of the power plants.
Petroliam Nasional Bhd (Petronas) sells natural gas to TNB at RM6.40 per unit which is 79 percent below than the market price of RM30 per unit.
Dr Lim said Petronas has to import an additional 500 million British thermal units (btu) of natural gas from Indonesia at market price to meet the current market demand of 2.5 billion btu as it could only supply two billion btu of gas."
Based on the California Energy Commission, the Levelized Cost of producing 1 Kwh using Natural Gas is 5.18 US Cents. When converted to Singapore terms, it's 8.08 Singapore Cents per 1 Kwh, which fails miserably when compared to the 21.64 Cents/Kwh Singapore Power charges Singapore citizens.
http://www.energy.ca.gov/electricity/levelized_cost.html
You did not provide any answers to why Australia and USA mind boggingly cheap cost of producing electricity, which is like half the price we get from Singapore Power. You didn't produce data to compare the cost of producing 1 Kwh of electricity, you just produced irrelevant data to smokescreen the discussion. -
we had a power failure once recently.Originally posted by mhcampboy:Why is SPower inefficient?
They have lighted my house for like forever without any glitches...
have you forgotten?
of course, that does not mean they are inefficient. -
I managed to find the cost of producing 1 Kwh of electricity under inefficient means, through the use of mobile power generators using diesel.
Diesel is a cheap component from distillating a barrel of oil. 44 gallons are produced from 1 barrel of oil, of which 9.2 gallons are diesel. We will assume that diesel and gasonline & jet fuel are priced the same and the cost of 1 barrel of oil is USD 60
http://www.energyquest.ca.gov/story/chapter08.html
Cost per gallon of diesel:
(USD 60 / 44 gallons) = USD 1.36/gallon of diesel (SGD 2.12 / gallon of diesel)
Diesel engine-generator sets operated at their best efficiency point can produce between 3 and 4 kilowatthours of electrical energy for each litre of diesel fuel consumed, with lower efficiency at part load.
1 US gallon = 3.785 litres
Therefore SGD 2.12 / gallon of diesel is equivalent to 3.785 litres.
We take the average of "3 and 4 kilowatthours of electrical energy for each litre of diesel fuel consumed", we get 3.5 Kwh / litre.
For the SGD 2.12 you pay for 3.785 litres of diesel, it will produce:
3.785 litres X 3.5 Kwh/litre = 13.25 Kwh
Therefore 1 Kwh of electricity generation based on inefficient method is:
SGD 2.12 / 13.25 = 16 cents/Kwh
Under very inefficient means of electricity generation, we can still achieve 16 cents/Kwh. What does this tell us about the 21.64 cents / Kwh Singapore Power charges Singapore citizens? -
Errrr, in case all of you dunno it, I heard from an unconfirm source, Singapore have a two year food reserve hidden somewhere.Originally posted by maurizio13:Ermmm, in case you don't know, we import a whole lot of other agricultural products from Malaysia, not restricted to poultry and eggs. -
Sa la word liao.Originally posted by Chelzea:knnb i still feel that e govt is cheating our $
Should be:
knnb E govt is exploiting us. -
I think the best way to bring down the price of the big E, is to bring in private companies to compete with SPower, just like how M1 was brought in to compete with Singtel (Starhub not included har. The green and the red shares the same boss, M1 boss is two Malaysian and HK company).
Then SPower will be trying it's ways and means to bring down operating cost in order to compete with these companies. -
Don't think it's possible to have so much food reserves. I don't think it's possible, because food will spoil if kept too long.Originally posted by Hogzilla:Errrr, in case all of you dunno it, I heard from an unconfirm source, Singapore have a two year food reserve hidden somewhere.
Arbitarily, let's say 1 person consume 0.25kg of rice a day.
One year he will consume 0.2kg X 365 days = 91.25kg.
4 million singapore will consume:
4,000,000 X 91.25kg = 365,000,000 kg/ year
For 2 years:
365,000,000 kg X 2 years = 730,000,000 kg for 2 years
You know those huge containers at PSA, the big 40 ft container holds 26,680 kg.
http://www.geseaco.com/GESeaCo/ContainerFleet/DryFreightBoxes/
You would need:
730,000,000 kg / 26,680 kg/container = 27,361 containers.
Think you need a volume the size of 27,361 containers to hold everything. -
Its a good thing that our government does not comprise ppl like you.Originally posted by maurizio13:Well, we get our oil from middle east, if middle east doesn't to provide us with oil. What are we going to do? Simple, find another source.
Likewise, we can get some of our energy requirements from Indonesia too.
It also depends on what conflict are you talking about. If it's war, Singapore won't last long, at most 2 weeks to a month, all the aggressor country has to do is block off our sea lanes and we'll starve to death. We are not a self sufficient economy, we rely 100% on imports.
If both countries are in conflict with us, then we should just prepare to starve to death.
Anyway, my point wasn't really about outsourcing, it's more of how much it takes to produce a KiloWattHour of electricity in another neighbouring country and what Singapore Power charges the citizens of Singapore.
Unless Singapore Power can show that 1 KiloWattHour of their electricity is equivalent to 2 KiloWattHour of Suruhanjaya Tenaga (Malaysia). I don't see any reason why they can charge Singaporeans twice the amount.
Block off our sea lanes? Just try. We have the largest stockpile of anti-ship missiles in South East Asia.
Starve to death? You obviously dun noe abt the RSAF and airlift operations using civil resources.
100% imports? Do some research before u make sweeping statements like this.
Have u studied economics before? Why not make it mandatory for the whole world to have equal prices for electricity? -
Do you have any data to back up any of your claims?Originally posted by ^Delta^:Its a good thing that our government does not comprise ppl like you.
Block off our sea lanes? Just try. We have the largest stockpile of anti-ship missiles in South East Asia.
Starve to death? You obviously dun noe abt the RSAF and airlift operations using civil resources.
100% imports? Do some research before u make sweeping statements like this.
Have u studied economics before? Why not make it mandatory for the whole world to have equal prices for electricity?
Not 100% agricultural imports? Last I checked Singapore doesn't have any rice plantation, large vegetable plantation, sugarcane plantation, etc.
There isn't even a need to block off sea lanes, all there needs to be is just some conflict and all ships will avoid this area like a plague.
In order to fire you anti ship missiles, you need to be in range and fire before the enemy fires at you, it's a 50:50 chance, not 100%.
In the law of one price, only one price exist to clear the market. In case you don't know, we have one price for gold, one price for a barrel of oil, etc.
If good cost of computers cost $2,000 in Singapore and only $1,000 in Malaysia, consumers will exploit the difference in price to make a profit, till there exist a common price between the 2 countries such that $1,000 + cost of transportation + small profit.
Makes me wonder if you studied economics.