Is Australia a Racist Country?
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Well , what I can say about all cause of these racism issues is because of failure to integrate and going by multiculturalism. The europeans have this issue as well . They let minority communities go off on their merry way without considering the real consequences. Some minority communities , like the middle eastern or the certain asian groups , have problems with the linga franca of the county . Hence they are left out of jobs and marginalised. So they blame their situation on racism.Originally posted by dreameryb:I don't really want to get embroiled into the arguments here since I am not actually interested in Austalia- it's definitely not on my list of countires where I wish to reside on a permanent basis. Regarding the recency of the articles cited by the TS, most of them are very new. The one titled "Racist White Australia Deports Brown Australian Citizen" was written in May 2005, according to the website. So they may be representative of the current racial tensions exisitng in that country.
It is true that raciasm exists everywhere. But there is a difference in terms of degree and the extent of its occurence. Based on what I have learned, from friends who have travelled to Australia and some of the articles I have read on the topic, it may get pretty nasty in Australia. To have some one in a passing car throw egges at you, and shouting for you to go home is not exactly the best way to make your day. One may argue that unpleasant encouters of this nature are sporadic but they seem to happen fairly frequently in that country such that you may come to the conclusion that it is statistically more likely for an Asian to be subject to racism in Australia than some other countries. I admit this might be a lopsided view. Someone living in Australia on a long term basis may be in a better position to comment on this.
Now when Australia and the Europeans and the Americans implement a test to see if they can pass basic english to survive in the country. People yell out and call it racism. You cannot win either way . I am a firm supporter of Australia's decision to make the english test possible because you need a common language to communicate with the mainstream society and to work as well . My view is that failure to integrate with the general population leads to misunderstandings.
Of course , you have uneducated idiots sporadically yelling out racially explicit comments in rural communities - that is very rare now tho. That does not happen in the metropolitan cities because everyone knows there is a world out there where people are different in their ethnicity ,religion and beliefs.
If Australia was truly racist per say, I doubt you have a Chinese Mayor of Melbourne in Victoria and Australian senators of asian descent from Queensland and South Australia , or even a state premier of lebanese descent in Victoria. Those are people whose parents or ancestors made an effort to integrate into the mainstream society.
My qualification to speak? I lived in Sydney for a year , Melbourne for 4 years and Canberra for almost a year now. Long term enough?
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Originally posted by fymk:
Isnt this as good as saying if you want to migrate to Australia, leave your religion, language and culture at home, and behave like a white man
Well , what I can say about all cause of these racism issues is because of failure to integrate and going by multiculturalism. The europeans have this issue as well . They let minority communities go off on their merry way without considering the real consequences. Some minority communities , like the middle eastern or the certain asian groups , have problems with the linga franca of the county . Hence they are left out of jobs and marginalised. So they blame their situation on racism.
Now when Australia and the Europeans and the Americans implement a test to see if they can pass basic english to survive in the country. People yell out and call it racism. You cannot win either way . [b] I am a firm supporter of Australia's decision to make the english test possible because you need a common language to communicate with the mainstream society and to work as well . My view is that failure to integrate with the general population leads to misunderstandings.
Of course , you have uneducated idiots sporadically yelling out racially explicit comments in rural communities - that is very rare now tho. That does not happen in the metropolitan cities because everyone knows there is a world out there where people are different in their ethnicity ,religion and beliefs.
If Australia was truly racist per say, I doubt you have a Chinese Mayor of Melbourne in Victoria and Australian senators of asian descent from Queensland and South Australia , or even a state premier of lebanese descent in Victoria. Those are people whose parents or ancestors made an effort to integrate into the mainstream society.
My qualification to speak? I lived in Sydney for a year , Melbourne for 4 years and Canberra for almost a year now. Long term enough? [/b] -
For immigrants,Originally posted by Gazelle:Isnt this as good as saying if you want to migrate to Australia, leave your religion, language and culture at home, and behave like a white man
If you want to migrate to Singapore, better integrate with us and understand what the heck the national language is, what the working language is and better not try to insult the locals. Learn the Singaporean culture, and blend in, and stop being such a whiner that locals choose not to speak Mandarin(for PRCs).
Well, there are many of us in Singapore who believe that immigrants should assimilate into our local culture and adapt, is it wrong?
You make the choice to move to a place, you jolly well make the effort to adapt. That is not called giving up on your own culture, it is about taking the best of yours and your new homeland's and creating a hybridised culture within you that you can express yourself outwardly with. There will always be a common denominator that everyone should follow in order to have some stability and not chaos. -
strongly agree. absolutely well saidOriginally posted by dragg:every country has racism.
i am sure not all aussies are racist.
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Originally posted by fymk:
a well given legitimate answer. i've stayed in melb for 6 months back in 2000. love food everything at the crown hotel.. =)
Well , what I can say about all cause of these racism issues is because of failure to integrate and going by multiculturalism. The europeans have this issue as well . They let minority communities go off on their merry way without considering the real consequences. Some minority communities , like the middle eastern or the certain asian groups , have problems with the linga franca of the county . Hence they are left out of jobs and marginalised. So they blame their situation on racism.
Now when Australia and the Europeans and the Americans implement a test to see if they can pass basic english to survive in the country. People yell out and call it racism. You cannot win either way . [b] I am a firm supporter of Australia's decision to make the english test possible because you need a common language to communicate with the mainstream society and to work as well . My view is that failure to integrate with the general population leads to misunderstandings.
Of course , you have uneducated idiots sporadically yelling out racially explicit comments in rural communities - that is very rare now tho. That does not happen in the metropolitan cities because everyone knows there is a world out there where people are different in their ethnicity ,religion and beliefs.
If Australia was truly racist per say, I doubt you have a Chinese Mayor of Melbourne in Victoria and Australian senators of asian descent from Queensland and South Australia , or even a state premier of lebanese descent in Victoria. Those are people whose parents or ancestors made an effort to integrate into the mainstream society.
My qualification to speak? I lived in Sydney for a year , Melbourne for 4 years and Canberra for almost a year now. Long term enough? [/b] -
yes, im adapting to the chinese language here.. but i prefer speaking english main is still my japanese.. s'pore a great place to live, security is very good. i've been telling my friends abt how's s'pore.. bad thing here is I HATE HOT WEATHERS....Originally posted by LazerLordz:For immigrants,
If you want to migrate to Singapore, better integrate with us and understand what the heck the national language is, what the working language is and better not try to insult the locals. Learn the Singaporean culture, and blend in, and stop being such a whiner that locals choose not to speak Mandarin(for PRCs).
Well, there are many of us in Singapore who believe that immigrants should assimilate into our local culture and adapt, is it wrong?
You make the choice to move to a place, you jolly well make the effort to adapt. That is not called giving up on your own culture, it is about taking the best of yours and your new homeland's and creating a hybridised culture within you that you can express yourself outwardly with. There will always be a common denominator that everyone should follow in order to have some stability and not chaos.
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Well, I'm not saying everyone must speak Mandarin, though it's fun and useful to be able to speak more languages.Originally posted by [email protected]:yes, im adapting to the chinese language here.. but i prefer speaking english main is still my japanese.. s'pore a great place to live, security is very good. i've been telling my friends abt how's s'pore.. bad thing here is I HATE HOT WEATHERS....
Welcome here! Haha, the hot weather here is something most of us still can't stand..although we're born here.
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haha. daijoobu desu yo ( no problem )Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well, I'm not saying everyone must speak Mandarin, though it's fun and useful to be able to speak more languages.
Welcome here! Haha, the hot weather here is something most of us still can't stand..although we're born here. -
I don't know why so many people drag in other countries and even including sg. Clearly the title says 'Is Australia a racist country?'
Of cos everybody knows every countries got their own share of racism.
But I believe TS is just trying to have a feedback of all other reader on Australia. Why not just stick to his intention and stay on Australia regarding racism lvl?
My conclusion, Australia got high or medium lvl of racism. Friends and relative visiting Australia kena racist remark. Like ' Fcuk off from here,u yellow scum!'
While they don't encounter such problem in holland and and UK.... Maybe they r lucky but this conclusion is from what i have gather from friends experience and news letter abt Australia. -
I assure, he did invite us to share our views on whether level of racism in Australia is low,medium or high. If we don't make comparisan than we wouldn't know if it's low, medium or high...Originally posted by zenden9:I don't know why so many people drag in other countries and even including sg. Clearly the title says 'Is Australia a racist country?'
Of cos everybody knows every countries got their own share of racism.
But I believe TS is just trying to have a feedback of all other reader on Australia. Why not just stick to his intention and stay on Australia regarding racism lvl?
My conclusion, Australia got high or medium lvl of racism. Friends and relative visiting Australia kena racist remark. Like ' Fcuk off from here,u yellow scum!'
While they don't encounter such problem in holland and and UK.... Maybe they r lucky but this conclusion is from what i have gather from friends experience and news letter abt Australia.
I am sure we heard many comments about PRCs, Banglas in Singapore as well... are we racist? Sometimes I even hear remarks made on our countrymen. Based on this alone, can I say level of racism in Singapore is high? No! Why? Because I make comparisans... with other countries that is. So do you see our point now Mr Zenden? -
I did not leave my religion , language and culture at home. I brought it with me and respect the culture and individuals there. WHEN IN ROME , DO AS THE ROMANS DO , ever heard of that phrase? People will only respect your beliefs if you respect theirs. Likewise you respect their laws as well. Don't tell me if you want to go to Saudi Arabia , you would want to eat traditional bak kut teh and read a bible ( which Saudi Arabia explicitly bans) in the open.Originally posted by Gazelle:Isnt this as good as saying if you want to migrate to Australia, leave your religion, language and culture at home, and behave like a white man
The only thing you have shown is contempt and jealousy of those in search of a better life elsewhere , not racism.
Just because I might be doing better financially in a country with a majority of caucasian DOES not mean anything other than I worked hard for it . Get over yourself .
Bashing a specific country which DOES NOT accept you and where you do not live in doesn't show much of you as a person giving a fair opinion . I have more right to discuss such matters since I DO ACTUALLY LIVE IN AUSTRALIA -
It is everywhere .Originally posted by zenden9:I don't know why so many people drag in other countries and even including sg. Clearly the title says 'Is Australia a racist country?'
Of cos everybody knows every countries got their own share of racism.
But I believe TS is just trying to have a feedback of all other reader on Australia. Why not just stick to his intention and stay on Australia regarding racism lvl?
My conclusion, Australia got high or medium lvl of racism. Friends and relative visiting Australia kena racist remark. Like ' Fcuk off from here,u yellow scum!'
While they don't encounter such problem in holland and and UK.... Maybe they r lucky but this conclusion is from what i have gather from friends experience and news letter abt Australia.
I had friends in UK who complain of racism by neo-nazi groups there who threaten them and one of them got their house sprayed with Get out Chinky. My aunt moved to Holland and she didn't get much of impression that they were as tolerant compared to when she lived in Australia.
So it is dependent on whether it is lucky a person meet a moron who doesn't understand globalism ...it does not mean that a country is racist based on the conduct of an individual. -
You can go to Sammyboy Alfresco Coffeeshop forum and look at all the anti-ang moh slogans and rants too.
Racism goes both ways, and if you know where to find it, there is graffiti on our streets that express xenophobic views too..
But can we say all Singaporeans are racist based on some actions/slogans? No. There is no zero-sum game, therefore the argument about racism is always comparative. -
Singaporeans who insist on hiring Mandarin speakers when the job does not require such a skill are racists. No wonder we need to bring in so many PRC workers....many young Singaporeans cannot even hold a simple conversation in Mandarin.
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LOL. I've noticed that trend too. You see adverts plastered with the requirements, chi speaking preferred when they are probably based only in Singapore.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Singaporeans who insist on hiring Mandarin speakers when the job does not require such a skill are racists. No wonder we need to bring in so many PRC workers....many young Singaporeans cannot even hold a simple conversation in Mandarin.
Haiz racism is everywhere. With globalisation, it is inevitable... -
Most job that posts require Chinese speaking is usually asscociate with telemarkting. Counter staff in medium and small companies. Most of their customers maybe only Chinese educated oldies or old aunt and old uncle who know nuts abt English. As a boss,surely u dont want any single business opportunities to slip off if communcation becomes a barrier,right?Originally posted by bangkokboy:LOL. I've noticed that trend too. You see adverts plastered with the requirements, chi speaking preferred when they are probably based only in Singapore.
Haiz racism is everywhere. With globalisation, it is inevitable...
For example a Chinese medicine companies hired a counter staff to handle call and customer enquires. Since it is Chinese medicine,u don expect many Malay and Indians to call and ask abt the medicine plus most of the Chinese buying ity be the older generation who is not english educated.. I don't see it as racist but business wise. If the person can speak Chinese,I don mind hire other races to handle the call.. -
Then why even bother making english the business medium? I don't believe most Singaporeans are that uneducated as to not speak or understand english.Originally posted by zenden9:Most job that posts require Chinese speaking is usually asscociate with telemarkting. Counter staff in medium and small companies. Most of their customers maybe only Chinese educated oldies or old aunt and old uncle who know nuts abt English. As a boss,surely u dont want any single business opportunities to slip off if communcation becomes a barrier,right?
For example a Chinese medicine companies hired a counter staff to handle call and customer enquires. Since it is Chinese medicine,u don expect many Malay and Indians to call and ask abt the medicine plus most of the Chinese buying ity be the older generation who is not english educated.. I don't see it as racist but business wise. If the person can speak Chinese,I don mind hire other races to handle the call..
I do believe that certain jobs do not need mandarin speakers , i.e. factories, yet they advertise in a form of covert discrimination. Thing is this will backflip on Singaporeans when they can hire PRCs for the job.
One thing for sure , under Australian employment laws , you can advertise for a native speaker or a person from an ethnic background only if you are in accordance with the Equal Employment Opportunities regulations. That clearance is hard to get unless it is a position for an aboriginal health worker etc.
However there are some backyard jobs which asian businesses give to students because they just want to pay them crap , bypass the compulsory superannuation contribution and Australian taxation Office. Those students are exploited badly in terms of their wage being way lower than the legal minimum wage . -
When a chinese company run by mandarin speaking boss ask for a mandarin speaking worker, it is call racist. And when a white company ask for english speaking workers it is ok? white supremacy?Originally posted by fymk:Then why even bother making english the business medium? I don't believe most Singaporeans are that uneducated as to not speak or understand english.
I do believe that certain jobs do not need mandarin speakers , i.e. factories, yet they advertise in a form of covert discrimination. Thing is this will backflip on Singaporeans when they can hire PRCs for the job.
One thing for sure , under Australian employment laws , you can advertise for a native speaker or a person from an ethnic background only if you are in accordance with the Equal Employment Opportunities regulations. That clearance is hard to get unless it is a position for an aboriginal health worker etc.
However there are some backyard jobs which asian businesses give to students because they just want to pay them crap , bypass the compulsory superannuation contribution and Australian taxation Office. Those students are exploited badly in terms of their wage being way lower than the legal minimum wage .
The reason why many manufacturing companies in Singapore prefer PRC workers is because they are the reason why Chinese made products are so cheap and the reason why companies can continue to operate during public holiday. -
Can you hire a Ah Beng that only speak Singlish to work in customer service or import/export department that deals with Europeans and American customer?Originally posted by bangkokboy:LOL. I've noticed that trend too. You see adverts plastered with the requirements, chi speaking preferred when they are probably based only in Singapore.
Haiz racism is everywhere. With globalisation, it is inevitable...
white supremacy is everywhere. -
I hope you have read the survey done by UNSW about the racism in Australia.Originally posted by zenden9:I don't know why so many people drag in other countries and even including sg. Clearly the title says 'Is Australia a racist country?'
Of cos everybody knows every countries got their own share of racism.
But I believe TS is just trying to have a feedback of all other reader on Australia. Why not just stick to his intention and stay on Australia regarding racism lvl?
My conclusion, Australia got high or medium lvl of racism. Friends and relative visiting Australia kena racist remark. Like ' Fcuk off from here,u yellow scum!'
While they don't encounter such problem in holland and and UK.... Maybe they r lucky but this conclusion is from what i have gather from friends experience and news letter abt Australia. -
Note: English is the business medium in Singapore. It is not about white supremacy , even in Australia, the whites learn mandarin to do business in China.
It just depends on where the person wants to go to do business. You speak the linga franca of that country. You work in China - you speak Mandarin. You work in Geneva, you speak french. You work in Malaysia - you speak malay . The list goes on. Business language mediums are just used to bridge communication between countries.
Singaporean textbooks are all in English save for Mother tongue - why? Don't forget our fellow eurasian, indian and malay counterparts . Just because Singapore has a chinese majority doesn't mean that the others should be ignored. Singapore needs a bridging language and english is the selected language which is not the mother tongue of most Singaporeans. Go complain to the Government if you are not happy over what you perceive as white supremacy.
So what language would you suggest to be the business medium of Singapore? You can't use Mandarin as it would seem biased to the other non chinese , you can't use tamil because India has too many languages and it is not commonly used. Your alternative is English or Malay because Singapore's linga franca used to be Malay . I can speak malay enough to survive so it won't be a problem for me.
Are you just jealous that Australia is doing well because it has a white majority population and yet a bulk of minority like me or rhonda even are doing fairly well? Or are you choosing to hammer Australia because you can't get in?
If that is so , you are being discriminatory yourself. So don't talk so much from the armchair , you have no right to judge a country when you NEVER stayed in Australia for the long term to justify your claims.
Mr Tan, you seem to have a discriminatory problem against caucasians yourself. White supremacy , white this and white that and not to mention specially your term "white a$$ " seems to come up in your posts here . Those indicate a form of superiority inferiority complex. -
Bearing in mind my above post about business linga franca and our ENGLISH TEXTBOOKS . I don't seem to recall Singapore being a mini-China to use so much mandarin in doing business.Originally posted by Gazelle:When a chinese company run by mandarin speaking boss ask for a mandarin speaking worker, it is call racist. And when a white company ask for english speaking workers it is ok? white supremacy?
The reason why many manufacturing companies in Singapore prefer PRC workers is because they are the reason why Chinese made products are so cheap and the reason why companies can continue to operate during public holiday.
Singapore have singaporean malays, singaporean indians and singaporean eurasians. Is it fair to them when the national standard operating language agreed upon for business is English and you stem them out of the fair job competition this way?
Not to mention Singapore has 4 official languages . Why official? To ensure equality for all. Why a business medium ? To bridge the 4 major ethnic groups together.
Australia has only 1 official language - English . And it is bonded to the history . Majority of the population speaks english but they still speak their mother tongue. In their high school programs alone, you have mandarin, japanese, french, german, russian, italian etc to choose from . It is also a land of migrants . Even the german/italian/polish/dutch migrants learnt english to survive in Australia - and you call that WhITE SUPREMANCY? HAHAH They are whites too but most of the old migrants didn't speak english until they landed on Australian soil. If there was truly white supremacy - I think there won't even be an offer of mandarin, japanese, vietnamese, indonesian languages to be taught in high school. -
Ah, if it really is a Chinese medicine hall then I am sure I will logically take no offence at that. One famous employer that is particularly picky is our Singapore government. I am not going to say much further, I am sure it is an open secret.Originally posted by zenden9:Most job that posts require Chinese speaking is usually asscociate with telemarkting. Counter staff in medium and small companies. Most of their customers maybe only Chinese educated oldies or old aunt and old uncle who know nuts abt English. As a boss,surely u dont want any single business opportunities to slip off if communcation becomes a barrier,right?
For example a Chinese medicine companies hired a counter staff to handle call and customer enquires. Since it is Chinese medicine,u don expect many Malay and Indians to call and ask abt the medicine plus most of the Chinese buying ity be the older generation who is not english educated.. I don't see it as racist but business wise. If the person can speak Chinese,I don mind hire other races to handle the call.. -
You seem to be very racist lol... racist against whites. Haha I really don't mean to go on the offensive everytime you post. If that seems to be the case I must apologise, but I do hope that we can all paint a more accurate and wider picture.Originally posted by Gazelle:Can you hire a Ah Beng that only speak Singlish to work in customer service or import/export department that deals with Europeans and American customer?
white supremacy is everywhere.
Why can't the ah Beng who speak Singlish communicate with the Westerner?
I deal with foreigners here in Bangkok and my spoken English is horrid. Lol in fact they seem to be very amused by my accent (very china). Who cares about what they feel haha. -
LOL.. My explanation abt hiring chinese speaking worker is more of business sense. I don't know how u all manage to mingle with racism and unfair. In a business world,making money is most important facotr. I can understand why so some companies insist on Chinese employee.. If language becomes a barrier business will be affected. Abt yr so call not believe of high percentage of non-english speaking Singaporean. I can easily dig out many of the non-english speaking singaporean from singapore street of mostly above the age of 50. Yr ignorance is appalling..Originally posted by fymk:Then why even bother making english the business medium? I don't believe most Singaporeans are that uneducated as to not speak or understand english.
I do believe that certain jobs do not need mandarin speakers , i.e. factories, yet they advertise in a form of covert discrimination. Thing is this will backflip on Singaporeans when they can hire PRCs for the job.
One thing for sure , under Australian employment laws , you can advertise for a native speaker or a person from an ethnic background only if you are in accordance with the Equal Employment Opportunities regulations. That clearance is hard to get unless it is a position for an aboriginal health worker etc.
However there are some backyard jobs which asian businesses give to students because they just want to pay them crap , bypass the compulsory superannuation contribution and Australian taxation Office. Those students are exploited badly in terms of their wage being way lower than the legal minimum wage .
I work in a major factory in sg and I can tell u most of the aunties and uncle work in there cannot speak english. I believe this is also the trend in many other factories in sg. Getting a Chinese speaking staff is more of a business wise decision rather than y so call discrimination as most of the population here is Chinese. Of cos,I don expect a big semi-conductor company to demand a Chinese speaking staff. But I am trying to explain that some of this demand on Chinese speaking staff is more on the business itself. A business more associate more with Chinese cultural. Example, A bak Kwa company, A Chinese medicine factory. Chinese food industries company selling shark fin and abalone.
U expect no Chinese speaker involved?
Btw,Sg making english the business medium doesn't mean private company need to strictly follow. In Malaysia, Bahasa Malaysia is the official language but most MNC use english as the official medium. Only the Malaysia gov sector uses Bahasa Malaysia as the medium language...