Polyclinic : Most God Damned excuse I Have ever heard!!!
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Of course everyone hopes it to be that way, the first and the last consultation. Who enjoys seeing the doctor so many times?Originally posted by dragg:you are wrong. i have never visited polyclinics again after the first consultation.
but i cant say of private clinics.
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i always hav to wait damn long to see a doctor in a polyclinic...(i go to cck polyclinic)
i rmb i once had high fever n flu n cough n a bad sore throat....n i saw the waiting time: 3 hrs......i was already pissed off....so i went to see private doc instead....
n polyclinic doc do not give antibiotics if u had sore throat or mouth ulcer...damn it!
seriously, it is v sian to wait so long.....n the doctors are slow........ -
but bedok polyclinic is not that slow leh.
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Wait 3 hours, and then not prescribed Antibiotics for sore throat???Originally posted by hiphop2009:i always hav to wait damn long to see a doctor in a polyclinic...(i go to cck polyclinic)
i rmb i once had high fever n flu n cough n a bad sore throat....n i saw the waiting time: 3 hrs......i was already pissed off....so i went to see private doc instead....
n polyclinic doc do not give antibiotics if u had sore throat or mouth ulcer...damn it!
seriously, it is v sian to wait so long.....n the doctors are slow........
Bluddy hell! The gov might as well not bother with providing this kind of Half-assed Healthcare!!!! -
Okay give me a flawless suggestion then. Shutter bug.Originally posted by ShutterBug:Then, WHY call it a Polyclinic for the common public???
If you can't provide adequate medical services, say so pr just don't bother and leave it to Red Cross lah!!
Otherwise, the gov should do something CONCRETE to solve this waiting problem!!
Why are they drawing million dollars salaries for???
For Half baked ideas and solutions???
For all the Tax and CPF requirements, of course people will expect RETURNS in form of service!!!!!
Every doctor see you for 1min? Anyhow checkup?
Poly clinic is damm cheap liao. If you cant wait go spend $20~30 at a family clinic.
If you are poor. Bo bian. The goverment setup polyclinic consider considerate liao
And people are already taking polyclinic for granted. Dun feel like going to work or school. Just spend $3 lo.
From what i see. There obviously students and adults just want to take mc skip sch and work. And from what i see this is 30% of the population that goes to poly clinic.
If the service better we just take things for granted. I ensure you there will be more students that happy happy just go there take mc.
Liddat Q time even longer. -
Flawless suggestion? I thought our PAP is so FLAWLESS! Should never make or provide flawed solutions like the decades old Polyclinic!Originally posted by Xephone_xenon:Okay give me a flawless suggestion then. Shutter bug.
Every doctor see you for 1min? Anyhow checkup?
Poly clinic is damm cheap liao. If you cant wait go spend $20~30 at a family clinic.
If you are poor. Bo bian. The goverment setup polyclinic consider considerate liao
And people are already taking polyclinic for granted. Dun feel like going to work or school. Just spend $3 lo.
From what i see. There obviously students and adults just want to take mc skip sch and work. And from what i see this is 30% of the population that goes to poly clinic.
If the service better we just take things for granted. I ensure you there will be more students that happy happy just go there take mc.
Liddat Q time even longer.
The problem with the long wait isn't the length of time the docs takes to examine a patient, it is the lack of doctors WILLING to work in Polyclinics! Why is there a lack of doctors in Polyclinics?? Our glorious gov should bluddy well know why! They made it such that very few docs wants to work there! They can improve circumstances so that docs will work there, but they either can't be bothered or too busy inflating their revenues to over-pay their own ministers!!!
People who go there to fake a sick leave to obtain MC; if many succeeded in obtaining MCs, then there are just too many UNQUALIFIED doctors who can't even tell a fake patient from a genuine one, let alone accurately daignose and remedy illnesses!!!!! WTF?!?!
Setting up a Polyclinic is considered considerate??
NO! It's their FARKING DUTY of a government the people voted for!!!! -
Seems like you're saying it is because of the considerate government, we have polyclinics and we should be contented or even be thankful with their service at present state?Originally posted by Xephone_xenon:Okay give me a flawless suggestion then. Shutter bug.
Every doctor see you for 1min? Anyhow checkup?
Poly clinic is damm cheap liao. If you cant wait go spend $20~30 at a family clinic.
If you are poor. Bo bian. The goverment setup polyclinic consider considerate liao
And people are already taking polyclinic for granted. Dun feel like going to work or school. Just spend $3 lo.
From what i see. There obviously students and adults just want to take mc skip sch and work. And from what i see this is 30% of the population that goes to poly clinic.
If the service better we just take things for granted. I ensure you there will be more students that happy happy just go there take mc.
Liddat Q time even longer.
Assume from what you 'see', these 30% of local population, on daily basis, apart from the 30%, how much of the percentage are those who goes to polyclinic just for the sake of taking medical cert?
This problem doesn't only encompass people who are not geniunely ill.
I feel that it should not be the case of 'if we improve, they will want more from us.' Instead of seeing the trying efforts from the clinics, the news article seemed to send the message of finger pointing at the patients.
There are people with real needs however, they are unable to afford medical/consultation fees.
I suggest not over blowing the proportion of patients who visit polyclinics for other reason to patients who truly needs attention. -
Im sorry but you know how tiring it is to go see a doctor when you are sick, & to even wait for 3 to 4 hours for the doctor when you wanna just go home to rest is really $%$^@$%!Originally posted by Xephone_xenon:Okay give me a flawless suggestion then. Shutter bug.
Every doctor see you for 1min? Anyhow checkup?
Poly clinic is damm cheap liao. If you cant wait go spend $20~30 at a family clinic.
If you are poor. Bo bian. The goverment setup polyclinic consider considerate liao
And people are already taking polyclinic for granted. Dun feel like going to work or school. Just spend $3 lo.
From what i see. There obviously students and adults just want to take mc skip sch and work. And from what i see this is 30% of the population that goes to poly clinic.
If the service better we just take things for granted. I ensure you there will be more students that happy happy just go there take mc.
Liddat Q time even longer. -
what talking you?Originally posted by Xephone_xenon:Okay give me a flawless suggestion then. Shutter bug.
Every doctor see you for 1min? Anyhow checkup?
Poly clinic is damm cheap liao. If you cant wait go spend $20~30 at a family clinic.
If you are poor. Bo bian. The goverment setup polyclinic consider considerate liao
And people are already taking polyclinic for granted. Dun feel like going to work or school. Just spend $3 lo.
From what i see. There obviously students and adults just want to take mc skip sch and work. And from what i see this is 30% of the population that goes to poly clinic.
If the service better we just take things for granted. I ensure you there will be more students that happy happy just go there take mc.
Liddat Q time even longer.
do you mean that the doctors also happy happy give MC? -
it depends on how you want to look at it, half full or half empty.
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Actually one solution to alleviate the shortage is to bring in the nurses and/or pharmacists to be the front line of medical diagnostics. Most countries face a shortage of doctors hence the change of this system.
Frankly, if you are sick and just want medication, head down to your nearest pharmacy. All of our pharmacists are qualified to diagnose problems. It is just the common believe that only doctors know anything about health problems.
From personal experience, during my army days i got foot-rot from sharing showering facilities...(yeah i know my fault for not wearin slippers). i went to see my old gp... family doctor of dunno how many years...he gave me a steroid cream. 1 small container 30g, $32! The itching stopped...but heck the foot-rot play hide and seek with me for half a year. I got fed up with having to pay so much ( i bought 3 bottles over that period actually) that I walked into my nearest pharmacy, and tried to look for alternative and asked for advice from the lady at the counter. I recommended one "local" brand..mycoban...and now my foot rot problem solved(in 1 month)!
In another case i found out Panadol, or it's common name paracetomol cost only 3 CENTS PER tablet if you are willing to buy generic products....I never buy Panadol brand medication again after finding out i got cheated for over 10 years.
And dont look down on nurses. What they can observe/have in knowledge is comparable to a doctor with similar years of experience because they(nurses) work hand in hand with the doctors in addition to looking after the patients. In hospital, i dare say i put more trust in an experienced nurse say privately against what a newbie doctor anyday.
After this, i concluded
If you want MC/surgery then you have to queue at the polyclinic, otherwise a pharmacist is more than sufficient to look after your usual sickness IE you want to just get well.
Perhaps if the Medical COUNCIL is willing to open the health industry in this way then life will be better for us citizens. Cause for your information, the medical council is run by Docs(majority). In my personal opinion, they are in a way , unwilling to admit to the fact that they are not the only source of health information/treatment in the area of general ailments as it would lower prestige of the profession of "Doctors".
When you know friends who are pharmacists, nurses and talk to them about what they know vs what doctors know, you will understand their "plight" of being squeezed and looked down by "professionals"
EDIT: No i'm not involved in anyway medical profession myself...but after hearing whether my reservists buddies(pharmacists & nurse Yeah male nurse! I know, he's quite a nice guy actually
) have to say, i feel i should speak up for them. -
Wow!! You guys raise many points.
1. Polyclinic ----> government subsidizes. If you can afford you should not be there. Currently we don't have means testing so all subsidies are blunt, ie. if you are driving a mercedes (fully paid-up), live in a fully paid-up bungalow, have a thriving million dollar business, don't declare GST, and underdeclare income - you still get subsidies. And some still complain about healthcare costs.
2. Pharmacists have some knowledge of treating common ailments. But currently, Singapore Drs prescribe and dispense in the same clinic setting. This is convenient to patients but a second step of professional check for complex patients using many medications (polypharmacy) is not there. The pharmacists have for years been trying to get the government to stop this practice but unsuccessfully. If implemented -healthcare costs will triple. Reason - Docs in Singapore do not charge economic consultation charges (ie. about $100 to $200 for a 15-min consult) - so they make their money from selling the medications they prescribe (total package) - $25 to $30 for a 5-min cough and cold visit. Real docs elsewhere will have you strip down into exam gowns, the visit is 15-minutes. The clinic nurse weighs you, takes your BP, and temperature. What you pay is what you get.
3. By the way, you should even need to see docs for simple cough and colds - just get meds over the counter and call in sick. The problem is that some companies have a "policy" of only accepting government clinic issued MCs which is actually discriminatory - so far no one has brought such a charge towards these companies. A Singapore Medical Council registered Dr is the same and all MCs are and should be equal and legitimate, but companies actions are incomprehensible and increases healthcare costs - if you have cough and cold, and take medications, you are a danger to yourself and others (drowsy from meds, fever -?SARS/Bird flu). Just call in sick and stay at home for a couple of days - if not better, then see Dr. Straight away save $200 from having to see a doctor un-necessarily.
4. Common cough and colds are due to viruses - taking antibiotics do not help. All current clinical guidelines discourage the use of antibiotics for upper respiratory tract infection. Because antiobiotics are priced too cheaply in Singapore - there is blatant abuse without adequate diagnostics. The commonest bacterial throat infection is Strep throat and you can get a quick throat swab but the kit costs as much as the antibiotics if not more - so Dr prescribe antibiotics when the patient wants it because they get "lambasted" for being "expensive", ordering "un-necessary" tests. So Singapore medicine gets set back to the stone age of rampant un-necessary antibiotic use and creation of super-bugs. -
Taken from today's TODAY.
Patients should not get upset if they have to wait
Letter from JEFFREY LAW LEE BENG
TODAY'S Singaporeans are becoming increasingly impatient and irrational; they are fastidious about services and facilities at public polyclinics and hospitals.
During the old days, nobody dared raise a whimper about poor service, long waiting times and other bugbears because they regarded the healthcare staff and doctors as special professionals who should not be doubted or questioned. Waiting patiently for half a day then to consult the doctor was commonplace.
These days, patients tend to feel upset and obnoxious when they wait for about an hour or so before consultation time. Perhaps they are better educated and aware of their rights and expectations. Also, various avenues of filing complaints are open at all times.
Due to the vast improvement in service and amenities, our polyclinics will continue to attract more people seeking medical treatment. Waiting for a few hours is really not too much, especially when you are in air-conditioned premises with medical literature and newspapers to while away your time.
Seeing the doctor is not a daily or weekly affair; we do so as and when the need arises, sometimes in three or four months. A little patience will go a long way towards making that trip to the clinic a worthwhile one.
After all, it is common for people to wait for hours to catch a glimpse of their favourite actors or camp overnight for a National Day Parade ticket, not to mention the two-hour queue for that famous barbecued pork come Chinese New Year. -
Obviously, the writer is another mouthpiece for the 146th. (Since 146th is the mouthpiece of Gahmen, the writer is the mouthpiece of a mouthpiece. What was that monster?)Originally posted by shade343:Taken from today's TODAY.
Patients should not get upset if they have to wait
Letter from JEFFREY LAW LEE BENG
TODAY'S Singaporeans are becoming increasingly impatient and irrational; they are fastidious about services and facilities at public polyclinics and hospitals.
During the old days, nobody dared raise a whimper about poor service, long waiting times and other bugbears because they regarded the healthcare staff and doctors as special professionals who should not be doubted or questioned. Waiting patiently for half a day then to consult the doctor was commonplace.
These days, patients tend to feel upset and obnoxious when they wait for about an hour or so before consultation time. Perhaps they are better educated and aware of their rights and expectations. Also, various avenues of filing complaints are open at all times.
Due to the vast improvement in service and amenities, our polyclinics will continue to attract more people seeking medical treatment. Waiting for a few hours is really not too much, especially when you are in air-conditioned premises with medical literature and newspapers to while away your time.
Seeing the doctor is not a daily or weekly affair; we do so as and when the need arises, sometimes in three or four months. A little patience will go a long way towards making that trip to the clinic a worthwhile one.
After all, it is common for people to wait for hours to catch a glimpse of their favourite actors or camp overnight for a National Day Parade ticket, not to mention the two-hour queue for that famous barbecued pork come Chinese New Year. -
He obviously thinks being sick is fun.Originally posted by Hogzilla:Obviously, the writer is another mouthpiece for the 146th. (Since 146th is the mouthpiece of Gahmen, the writer is the mouthpiece of a mouthpiece. What was that monster?)
How do I know that? He equates waiting to see the doctor with queueing up for BBQ pork or waiting to see your favourite singer. -
^
Aiya, the LAW LEE BENG probably never see a doc at polyclinic before. -
I would like to tell this Mr JEFFREY LAW LEE BENG, that last time ah, Policeman wear bermuda shorts, and that last time you can also buy a bowl of Kway Tiow Soup for only 0.30 cents.Originally posted by shade343:Taken from today's TODAY.
Patients should not get upset if they have to wait
Letter from JEFFREY LAW LEE BENG
TODAY'S Singaporeans are becoming increasingly impatient and irrational; they are fastidious about services and facilities at public polyclinics and hospitals.
During the old days, nobody dared raise a whimper about poor service, long waiting times and other bugbears because they regarded the healthcare staff and doctors as special professionals who should not be doubted or questioned. Waiting patiently for half a day then to consult the doctor was commonplace.
These days, patients tend to feel upset and obnoxious when they wait for about an hour or so before consultation time. Perhaps they are better educated and aware of their rights and expectations. Also, various avenues of filing complaints are open at all times.
Due to the vast improvement in service and amenities, our polyclinics will continue to attract more people seeking medical treatment. Waiting for a few hours is really not too much, especially when you are in air-conditioned premises with medical literature and newspapers to while away your time.
Seeing the doctor is not a daily or weekly affair; we do so as and when the need arises, sometimes in three or four months. A little patience will go a long way towards making that trip to the clinic a worthwhile one.
After all, it is common for people to wait for hours to catch a glimpse of their favourite actors or camp overnight for a National Day Parade ticket, not to mention the two-hour queue for that famous barbecued pork come Chinese New Year.
Last time ah, also don't have COE, ERP, GST, and people were told to stop at only 2 children.
I also ah, want to ask Mr Law, what KOCK is he talking??? -
This one from today's Straits Times Forum.
IT APPEARS The Straits Times Forum page devotes far too much attention to complaints of one sort or another about the public health-care system in Singapore. I think this practice should not be encouraged as the correct forum for such complaints (or feedback) rightly belongs to the customer or patient relations department of the clinic or hospital concerned.
The complaints pertain to specific situations and circumstances and do not involve larger issues of the health-care system, which most of us know is of a higher standard. The polyclinics and hospitals see thousands of cases and if administrative or medical problems are encountered by specific patients and their families, the newspaper should not give them a 'public' airing.
By constantly allowing specific complaints to be published, The Straits Times does great disservice to dedicated medical professionals who are already overstretched in what they do. In fact, by publishing the complaints, ST has unwittingly impugned the reputation of our public health-care system, since most complaints appear be groundless upon investigation.
I sincerely hope that in 2007, The Straits Times will cease to publish these complaints in the Forum page. The unhappy writers of those letters should give their feedback or complaint to the clinic or hospital concerned and they will certainly get a satisfactory reply. If not, they can always take their complaint further with the Singapore Medical Council and if need be, resort to legal action.
Lim Chin Siew -
He wrote as if it's a joyous thing to celebrate when going to a polyclinic.Originally posted by shade343:Taken from today's TODAY.
Patients should not get upset if they have to wait
Letter from JEFFREY LAW LEE BENG
TODAY'S Singaporeans are becoming increasingly impatient and irrational; they are fastidious about services and facilities at public polyclinics and hospitals.
During the old days, nobody dared raise a whimper about poor service, long waiting times and other bugbears because they regarded the healthcare staff and doctors as special professionals who should not be doubted or questioned. Waiting patiently for half a day then to consult the doctor was commonplace.
These days, patients tend to feel upset and obnoxious when they wait for about an hour or so before consultation time. Perhaps they are better educated and aware of their rights and expectations. Also, various avenues of filing complaints are open at all times.
Due to the vast improvement in service and amenities, our polyclinics will continue to attract more people seeking medical treatment. Waiting for a few hours is really not too much, especially when you are in air-conditioned premises with medical literature and newspapers to while away your time.
Seeing the doctor is not a daily or weekly affair; we do so as and when the need arises, sometimes in three or four months. A little patience will go a long way towards making that trip to the clinic a worthwhile one.
After all, it is common for people to wait for hours to catch a glimpse of their favourite actors or camp overnight for a National Day Parade ticket, not to mention the two-hour queue for that famous barbecued pork come Chinese New Year.
I couldn't follow his train of thought on the last para. -
Basically, if a Public Facility or Service is GOOD, who will complain???Originally posted by googoomuck:This one from today's Straights Times Forum.
IT APPEARS The Straits Times Forum page devotes far too much attention to complaints of one sort or another about the public health-care system in Singapore. I think this practice should not be encouraged as the correct forum for such complaints (or feedback) rightly belongs to the customer or patient relations department of the clinic or hospital concerned.
The complaints pertain to specific situations and circumstances and do not involve larger issues of the health-care system, which most of us know is of a higher standard. The polyclinics and hospitals see thousands of cases and if administrative or medical problems are encountered by specific patients and their families, the newspaper should not give them a 'public' airing.
By constantly allowing specific complaints to be published, The Straits Times does great disservice to dedicated medical professionals who are already overstretched in what they do. In fact, by publishing the complaints, ST has unwittingly impugned the reputation of our public health-care system, since most complaints appear be groundless upon investigation.
I sincerely hope that in 2007, The Straits Times will cease to publish these complaints in the Forum page. The unhappy writers of those letters should give their feedback or complaint to the clinic or hospital concerned and they will certainly get a satisfactory reply. If not, they can always take their complaint further with the Singapore Medical Council and if need be, resort to legal action.
Lim Chin Siew
Look at Public Transport - how many times have they increased their fares??? Did people complain? YES! Because the service is the same, but the fare always increase!!! -
I feel that the worst thing about this Polyclinic Long Wait issue, is that it is a DECADES old problem, that was NEVER improved upon!!
Whay you think people are now so FED UP!?! -
What is this guy talking about? He's writing to Straits Times to Complain about people who complains? Wah, clap leh. *Sacarsm*Originally posted by googoomuck:This one from today's Straits Times Forum.
IT APPEARS The Straits Times Forum page devotes far too much attention to complaints of one sort or another about the public health-care system in Singapore. I think this practice should not be encouraged as the correct forum for such complaints (or feedback) rightly belongs to the customer or patient relations department of the clinic or hospital concerned.
The complaints pertain to specific situations and circumstances and do not involve larger issues of the health-care system, which most of us know is of a higher standard. The polyclinics and hospitals see thousands of cases and if administrative or medical problems are encountered by specific patients and their families, the newspaper should not give them a 'public' airing.
By constantly allowing specific complaints to be published, The Straits Times does great disservice to dedicated medical professionals who are already overstretched in what they do. In fact, by publishing the complaints, ST has unwittingly impugned the reputation of our public health-care system, since most complaints appear be groundless upon investigation.
I sincerely hope that in 2007, The Straits Times will cease to publish these complaints in the Forum page. The unhappy writers of those letters should give their feedback or complaint to the clinic or hospital concerned and they will certainly get a satisfactory reply. If not, they can always take their complaint further with the Singapore Medical Council and if need be, resort to legal action.
Lim Chin Siew -
There is a definite shortage of doctors in all areas of the govt service.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Do you know how many patients a polyclinic doctor gets to see in a day? I have worked in a polyclinic before and my record was 120 patients, but I don't think I hold the all-time record.
And it was horrible..even if I had no breaks for toilet and if patients mysteriously apparate one after another in my office, all I had was just 4 mins for each patient in an 8-hour day. If one patient needs more time because he has a complicated medical problem, if you need to do a minor surgical procedure etc, you have even less time for the other patients.
Obviously the examination was far from detailed and I could not allow patients the time to talk about their problems. Patients had to be hurried through their history, a rapid check through the case notes, a quick physical examination and then a quick prescription before pushing them out for the next patient. Totally unsatisfactory for both doctor and patient....but I could clear the crowd. Patients did not have to wait hours to see me but the quality suffers. I have tried the other alternative and gave patients the time and attention they required. But then patients would have to wait for hours..
Many polyclinic doctors left to start their own clinics. If we are going to work so hard for the modest salary we were getting, we might as well work hard for more money in our own clinics. Patients were ungrateful and angry over the long waiting time, despite the fact that doctors were struggling to keep up and do their best. Eventually, leaving the service becomes a very attractive option. With fewer and a high turnover of doctors, polyclinics suffer from a chronic shortage of doctors. The problem is compounded by the increasing number of junior doctors who decide to specialize instead of doing general practice.
There are only two solutions: retain local doctors by increasing remuneration for polyclinic doctors but that is politically disastrous. The public will refuse to understand the problem and will castigate the government for raising salaries for doctors and increasing healthcare costs. The only other solution is to bring in more cheap, foreign doctors into the polyclinics. The government has already taken in doctors from India, Pakistan and Myanmar. But patients complain about communication problems...perhaps it is time to bring in doctors from China as well.
Singaporeans want high quality healthcare quickly and cheaply. There is a streak of gangsterism in their demand...'I want good healthcare and I want it now and I want it cheap. You cannot find anyone to offer such a service? That's your problem 'cos you are the government.'
Since Singaporeans will not pay more and yet want shorter waiting times at the polyclinics, the way forward is to bring in more foreign doctors, particularly from PRC to deal with the non-English educated population.
What could possibly be the reason for that? Perhaps the overly stringent requirements, coupled by multiple interviews and character assessment is beginning to show its limitations?
How many 'experts' sitting in front of the panel can truly assess whether an interviewee will indeed follow up on his/her promise and take the hypocritical oath with soleumn sincerity? What is the percentage of bond-breakers within the medical profession?
And for those that break bond, how many others are denied a place in their desired profession? It's a simple demand and supply. Singapore youths are not devoid of talent; it's merely the limitation of the system in place that denies them a chance.
The system must be tweaked to best meet the current constraints. We have people who join the medical industry because of peer pressure, because of parental pressure, because of namesake, because of string-pulling and because of behind-the-scene 'players' who dictate who gets the slots and who doesn't.
While i agree we need considerable character to meet the demands of being a doctor, shouldn't we also review the entry criteria for those aspiring to be doctors?
Not every problem has a solution but this one does. Why are the powers-that-be ignoring the obvious?
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Pls read the article on Forum today the poor writer mom had to make 3 visits to A & E to get stitches ...
Some of the senior doc in govt hosp are very snob.. there was once I was very ill and was hospitalised , the senior doctor consultant or whatever accuse me of malingering ... though I was given a 1 week hospitalisation leave after discharge... i just went back to work the moment I was discharged .... I simply dun have a choice cos my work is piling... have MC also no use...
Curse that bloody doctor!! -
What nonsense is this? Medication in the polyclinics is highly subsidised and that's one reason why polyclinics are in the red. Singaporeans do not know what they are complaining about. Let the polyclinics stop giving out medicine and doctors just prescribe for you to buy your medication from Guardian pharmacy then. Then you will know the true price of medication.Originally posted by charlize:Dispense more medication, earn more money.
People already complaining about the high prices of medication from the polyclinics.