punishments in schools...shld they be allowed?
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I heard a story from a teacher frd of mine today. Because it's pretty one-sided, so you can choose to take it with a pinch of salt, or not.
Because the "power" of the parents nowadays, teachers don't use corporal punishment, (or should I say, don't use punishment at all) even a little bit of harsh word would incur the parent's wrath.
So, this friend of mine gaze (some of you might prefer the word "stare" ) at a student for being noisy in the class, then the mother of the student came down to school and complain to her (my frd) that the "gaze" is causing pressure to the child and the daughter dun dare to go to school.
I was like WTF? There was no verbal contact, no physical contact, the teacher juse gazed at a student and the mother also can complain. Even Ah Q (a character from Lu Xun's novel) have the right to stare angrily at others, are teachers now worse than Ah Q? -
Well, from all teachers whom i have come across so far...the one who made my frend do recitation for rest of lesson(refer to my much earlier post) is the strictest n harshest of all...although she hardly sent anyone to the DM or principal, she was known for long durations in punishments n shameful ones as well...very often her punishments would last for almost whole lesson if nt whole lesson...n we were onli in primary one then...
for myself, i was once made to stand for the entire lesson for toking..some of my classmates were made to stand in front of class for almost the entire lesson wif their mouths taped up...her punishments r less painful/tiring, mostly shameful...
abt the teacher who meted out the slapping punishment(see 1st post), she doesnt usually punish for long periods...n in tat yr, her punishments were mostly juz standing outside class...onli tat slapping incident plus another incident did she mete out sth diff. for tat incident, she ordered my classmate who was caught toking to stand facing whole class n pull his ears...he was utterly embarrassed...in fact tat was onli time she did tat for toking offences, she wasnt usually particular abt noise level...prob. got out on wrong side of bed tat day... -
hi...yup juz to add on...the harshest teacher i mentioned in my previous post was also known for corporate punishments...she would punish whole class corporately if whole class misbehaves...there were several incidents when we were made to hold our textbks between our teeth for toking...so while the teacher was teaching, we had to bite our textbks...at times, she will make us balance our textbks on our heads...these usually happened when whole class was making a lot of noise.
overall, i would still say tat female teachers r more creative in meteing out punishments...the teacher above is prob. the most creative i have met...she meted out punishments u may nvr have heard of...
i remember another case where a boy wouldnt sit still in his seat...this teacher ordered him to the front n made him sit next to teacher's table n rub his butt to n fro against the floor without stopping...though it didnt last long(less than 5 min), the boy broke down as he felt so embarrassed...the teacher let him off onli after he promised to sit still in his seat... -
juz came across tis case:
it appears there was a teacher who meted out sadistic punishments to her students...unlike most teachers, her basic punishment doesnt involve standing at all. her basic punishment is to make students kneel on the hard floor n pull their ears. tis she would do to those who tok in class, didnt hand up work or didnt bring their books. the duration is usually for the whole lesson.
for repeated offenders, the teacher would mete out even harsher/sadistic punishments. she would either make the students kneel on bottle caps or marbles n pull their ears...other times she would make them carry their school bags above their heads. there were even occasions when students were asked to knee-bend for entire lesson wif bags above their heads.
students who were punished were often left crying at the end. from wad i noe, few were ever able to withstand the torture n sadistic punishments. even though the punishments were effective(cos students hardly dared to repeat their offences), students often lived in fear of tis teacher.
i personally feel tis teacher was way off. wad do u tink? -
Some schools just performed the most sadistic and cruel anti-chinese act imaginable - setting important exam papers on Friday just before CNY, forcing those Chinese students from abroad to cancel their flights home. What kind of teachers do we have today? I shudder to think we are producing a nation of racists.
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oh yes, n from the testimonies i heard regarding tis sadistic teacher. the requirements for kneeling is for the knees to come in full contact wif the hard object(floor, marbles or bottle caps) n legs r to be bent at 90 degrees. when marbles r used, students usually cun last more than 15min...teacher will onli release the students on 2 conditions: 1) its end of lesson, 2) the student is crying in pain...even if the student have been kneeling for a long time, the teacher wil nt release him unless he is crying in pain or its end of lesson.
moreover, the teacher is nt the kind who will mete out punishments n then leave the student alone. she will check on him/her occasionally. she has a habit of walking ard the class as she taught n so was able to spot check on her 'victims' at the same time. students found nt kneeling properly on the hard floor(eg. legs nt bend at 90 degrees) will be made to either kneel on bottle caps or marbles. if ears r nt pulled hard enuff, they may be made to carry their bags above their heads or slap themselves instead.
she often carried a small plastic bag containing marbles n bottle caps in her handbag. when punishment is meted out, she will march student/s to specific spots, place marbles/bottle caps on the floor n then order students to kneel on them. next she will determine wad to do wif their hands. tats when ear-pulling, carrying of sch bags, slapping of oneself comes in.
so from the above, u can see y she was feared by her students. she showed little mercy in her punishments. i noe some who were her 'victims'. all agree tat she is very brutal n sadistic n tat none of them couls withstand the kind of punishments she put them thru. -
its ok for students to be punished. i Dont mind if its not too extreme. Caning in front of everybody is alrite
nowadays, kids are so rude. yaya papaya..and parents think they are doing their kids a favour by not allowing teachers to punish! at home u can punish ur kids..at schools let the teacher punish lah..especially those teenagers. -
to valentinoo:
then wad abt the punishments meted out by the teacher above? do u tink they r too extreme? -
they are waaaaaaay too much. something should be done about the teacher. punishment is one thing, but it's almost as though the punishments meted out bear no thought whatsoever to the physical being of the student.Originally posted by despondent:to valentinoo:
then wad abt the punishments meted out by the teacher above? do u tink they r too extreme? -
anyway, to continue from above, there was a case where the teacher didnt release the student even when he was alredi crying buckets of tears...
it was a case involving vulgarities n rudeness. the teacher heard the student spewing vulgarities in class. infuriated, she ordered him to go to the back of the class to be punished. the student looked at her rebelliously n refused to bulged. he went on to tok back rudely at her. the teacher lost her temper completely n drag the student out of class near the doorway. she then made him kneel on marbles n to slap himself hard continuously. it was a double period tat day so the lesson was 1 hr long. thru out the lesson the teacher kept making sure the student knelt properly n slapped hard. as expected, after abt 15min, the student started crying in pain from his red swollen cheeks n hurting knees. to everyone's shock, the teacher didnt release him. even though she saw him crying, she continued to make him kneel properly n to slap himself hard...the student juz continued crying in pain as he obliged.
it was until end of whole lesson was the student let off. by then, he had been kneeling n slapping for almost 1 hr!!! he even had to be helped up by a fellow student. the teacher then warned the class tat any future usage of vulgarities or rudeness in her class will be punished in such a manner. tat was the onli case when the teacher was totally merciless. from wad i noe, the student limped n had swollen cheeks for the rest of the day.
wad do u forumers tink of tis? i feel its realli sadistic n way off. -
Wow, in the context of the law the teacher has already committed an offence.Originally posted by despondent:anyway, to continue from above, there was a case where the teacher didnt release the student even when he was alredi crying buckets of tears...
it was a case involving vulgarities n rudeness. the teacher heard the student spewing vulgarities in class. infuriated, she ordered him to go to the back of the class to be punished. the student looked at her rebelliously n refused to bulged. he went on to tok back rudely at her. the teacher lost her temper completely n drag the student out of class near the doorway. she then made him kneel on marbles n to slap himself hard continuously. it was a double period tat day so the lesson was 1 hr long. thru out the lesson the teacher kept making sure the student knelt properly n slapped hard. as expected, after abt 15min, the student started crying in pain from his red swollen cheeks n hurting knees. to everyone's shock, the teacher didnt release him. even though she saw him crying, she continued to make him kneel properly n to slap himself hard...the student juz continued crying in pain as he obliged.
it was until end of whole lesson was the student let off. by then, he had been kneeling n slapping for almost 1 hr!!! he even had to be helped up by a fellow student. the teacher then warned the class tat any future usage of vulgarities or rudeness in her class will be punished in such a manner. tat was the onli case when the teacher was totally merciless. from wad i noe, the student limped n had swollen cheeks for the rest of the day.
wad do u forumers tink of tis? i feel its realli sadistic n way off.
if the student is so severely injured by the punishment that he cannot go about doing his normal pursuits [ie, walk, run, move around] for at least 20 days, voluntarily causing grevious hurt.
At the very least, she would have voluntarily caused the student hurt. Slapping a student is normal perhaps, because I have seen it happen when i was skooling once ago. heck, I was even slapped before by more than one teacher. But I digress.
I personally feel that the teacher stepped way out of line here with the 'marbles' punishment. Perhaps the teacher indeed lost her marbles.
Disciplining a student is understandable, but to indulge is such a punishment... the teacher really should know better. Sure, maybe the student is no angel, but surely he didn't deserve such sadistic punishment.
IMO the parent of the kid can either lodge a Police report if the student's injuries are way too serious, or maybe even sue the teacher/skool.
What did the parent of the student do in this case, however? Could you enlighten us? -
the student didnt suffer obvious injuries...he juz had sore knees n swollen cheeks for the rest of the day...as for his parents, they came to confront the teacher the next day but were told y their son was punished so severely...there has been many complaints against tis teacher but each time she is able to justify her actions...
one more thing is tat tis teacher came to tis sch n improved the discipline level...on top of tat, she helped the sch to achieve gd grades at major exams...tats y even though the principal dun agree to some of her punishments, she allow tis teacher to carry on since the punishments produced results...
there r even more harsh punishments i have to share...wil post them soon... -
Despondent this is a bug bear of yours isn't it. It is not enough that you fill another forum with your dross, you had to bring it here.
The problem with you is you are not looking at the big picture and you are approaching the issue from a 'gimme gimme' culture and from a 'rights' perspective.
As I said in the other thread, the ability of teachers to mete out ad-hoc punishment is crucial to the education system. Teachers need to be able to deal with disruptive students for the good of all students. Teachers need to be able to respond to different levels of disruption with different levels of punishment.
You take away that ability and then you are left with Detention, suspension adn expulsion.
Detention clearly will be useless without the ability to back it up with other punishment. You are then left with suspension and expulsion. It doesn't take a quantum physicist to realise that suspension and expulsion will have a greater negative effect on a childs future than ad-hoc punishment meted out by teachers. -
I doubt the veracity of your account. You do yourself and your cause no favours by spouting what is obviously false-hood. Kneeling on a marble for 15 minutes?Originally posted by despondent:anyway, to continue from above, there was a case where the teacher didnt release the student even when he was alredi crying buckets of tears...
it was a case involving vulgarities n rudeness. the teacher heard the student spewing vulgarities in class. infuriated, she ordered him to go to the back of the class to be punished. the student looked at her rebelliously n refused to bulged. he went on to tok back rudely at her. the teacher lost her temper completely n drag the student out of class near the doorway. she then made him kneel on marbles n to slap himself hard continuously. it was a double period tat day so the lesson was 1 hr long. thru out the lesson the teacher kept making sure the student knelt properly n slapped hard. as expected, after abt 15min, the student started crying in pain from his red swollen cheeks n hurting knees. to everyone's shock, the teacher didnt release him. even though she saw him crying, she continued to make him kneel properly n to slap himself hard...the student juz continued crying in pain as he obliged.
it was until end of whole lesson was the student let off. by then, he had been kneeling n slapping for almost 1 hr!!! he even had to be helped up by a fellow student. the teacher then warned the class tat any future usage of vulgarities or rudeness in her class will be punished in such a manner. tat was the onli case when the teacher was totally merciless. from wad i noe, the student limped n had swollen cheeks for the rest of the day.
wad do u forumers tink of tis? i feel its realli sadistic n way off.
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punishments are okay, but there should be a benchmark as to what kind of punishments and the limits that should be set. the sadistic punishment (kneeling on bottle caps, rubbing butt on floor, etc) is certainly way unacceptable. We don't even treat animals in this way!
i can still remember being slapped (for the first and only time in my entire life) in front of the entire class when I was in pri 3. reason?
i walked too fast. -
like i said in my 1st post of tis thread...i am posting tis same topic from another forum...so ppl who have alredi given their comments in the previous forum need nt answer... thank u...
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actually, surprisingly, i noe of ppl who actually went back to sch to visit tat teacher. apparently, though they had been 'victims'of her harsh, sadistic punishments, they stil bother to visit her in sch during teachers' day.
my frend who was one of those who went back said tat the teacher was stil the same except she looks much older now. he went back few days b4 teachers' day one particular yr. according to him, tis teacher is stil as punishing as ever. he n his frends went to a classroom where she was teaching to send their greetings. guess wad they saw? there were 2 boys kneeling on bottle caps at the back of the classroom, slapping themselves. in front of the class was another gal who was kneeling n pulling her ears. they later found out tat those 2 boys were caught behaving rowdily in class b4 her lesson n were exchanging crude words. the gal forgot to bring her bks. well, it seems like a leopard nvr changes its spots. she is stil meteing out punishments that bring forth much pain n shame... -
actually from wad i noe, the form of class of tat teacher is always the main 'victim'... according to my info, the teacher will mark out wif chalk at the start of every yr the specific positions for punishments to take place. she would draw out circles on the floor at the frony n back of the classroom. from wad i heard, she would usually mark out enuff for 10 students...
so when a student is to be punished, the teacher would order him/her either to the front or back of classroom. the student will go to one of the positions marked n do the punishment there. its at these marked positions where kneeling or knee-bending will take place. wads even more interesting is tat the teacher allocated 2 positions for the harshest punishment of all. on these 2 marked positions, she would stick 2 marbles n 2 bottle caps on the marked spots wif double-sided tape. so when a unrepentant offender is being punished, he/she will be ordered to either of these positions for punishment.
for knee-bending punishments, the student will go to 1 of these positions n the teacher will put a chair next to him. the student will then bend his legs down to the level of the chair. the chair will then be removed n the student is to stay in tat position thruóut. from wad i noe, knee-bending is extremely tiring n painful cos its usually accompanied either wif the student's arms being outstretched n his sch bag place on top of his hands or wif the student lifting his bag above his head. most who went thru tis punishment ended up in tears. gals though r usually nt given tis punishment...
gals r usually asked to kneel. they r nt asked to knee-bend due tot he fact tat they r wearing skirts. but even then, the gals r stil nt able to withstand the punishments meted out...from here we can see the intensity n harshness of the punishments. the sucess rate of deterring the students was often very high... -
according to my frend n his classmates, the most torturing punishments r the kneeling on marbles n knee-bending while lifting bag above head. my frend himself was ordered to knee-bend wif bag above his head for nt bringing his bk for 3rd time. from wad he told me, tis punishment is realli unbearable. within 5min, his legs n arms were alredi quite tired. however, the teacher ensured his hands were kept straight up n legs bent properly. needless to say, he ended up in tears n it was onli less than 15min. the teacher kept him there for a full 20min b4 releasing him. even then he wasnt allowed to return to his seat. the teacher made him kneel on one of the marked spots n pull his ears for the rest of the lesson. my frend can nvr forget tat incident...
surprisingly, slapping is nt the worse punishment in terms of pain. cos for slapping, the student can 'cheat' a bit. as long as the slaps produce a sound loud enuff for the teacher to hear, she will let it pass. so the slaps dun have to be very hard though on the long run, they stil do hurt the cheeks. there were incidents though when serious offences were committed n the teacher insisted slaps were hard n painful...
serious offences n unrepentant offenders were often dealt wif very severely. punishments will be extremely painful n wil last for long periods. my frend n some of his classmates were victims of such punishments as they were culprits of serious offences n repeated offences(like the case above). serious offences include vulgarities, fighting in class, playing truant, rudeness to teacher. -
In the first place, when you hurl vulgarities and start a fight, you're more or less deserving of punishment.
Use your brains in the first place and grow up.
In my time, which is not too long ago, people got caned for truancy and had their stuff hurled out to the pool. Did that cause trauma? No.
Most of us who had experienced corporal punishment as a kid in pri or sec school can testify that it helped us realised the gravity of the situation and I still remember that I felt very remorseful after one caning incident.
Did it help stem my rebellious and irascible ways? Definitely I think. -
I've had my share of corporal punishment in school-slapping, caning and I've been through punishment in NS as a whole platoon-starlight parade, short n sharp drill, changing parade, etc.
I must say, it's a wake up call for me. Why? Well, if you dun follow instruction due to your rebellious streak, you deserve to be punished. You just have to pay for your mistakes, and not whine and make excuses.
Look at the younger gen these days. They are so self-centred and rude. Why? Cos during their time at school, where they should be learning about respect to elders, authority, have all been nullified by parents who think nothing of making a huge fuss and demanding an apology or some drastic measures against the teacher, about their child receiving punishment in school.
The child will grow up thinking they can be up to their antics, and when punished by the school, they go whining to their parents. These stoolpit everprotecting parents, will raise hell for the teacher or school, never once stop to consider their child is the cause of the problem.
This child will carry his arrogant behaviour into his NS stint, and whine to their stoolpit parents when they are punished, to the extent that the SAF has to soften their rigid rules. Wat a joke!
When this child goes to work to earn a living, guess wat will become of them? Will they still be able to whine to their parents about the work their bosses pile up on them, or will they be quitters and blame the boss? My guess is, they will be quitters, cos their parents cannot go to the management to make a fuss. The company management will simply tell the child and parent to GFO, in a subtle manner, like making hell to this child's life in the company.
So who lose, the stoolpit child.
And worst part is, this child will repeat the cycle and be a stoolpit parent who won't think twice about breaking a teacher's ricebowl. 
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ok...so wad do u 2 have to say abt tat teacher? r her punishments deserving n appropriate?
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hey, you seem to have a little problem. though you've already posted the same in another forum and received replies from the other forummers, you are still not sure if those teachers did right. may i know how young are you? if you have not done your ns, then you could consult your parents but if you had, then i suggest you seek professional help.Originally posted by despondent:ok...so wad do u 2 have to say abt tat teacher? r her punishments deserving n appropriate? -
He is trying to get someone to agree with him.Originally posted by pearlie27:hey, you seem to have a little problem. though you've already posted the same in another forum and received replies from the other forummers, you are still not sure if those teachers did right. may i know how young are you? if you have not done your ns, then you could consult your parents but if you had, then i suggest you seek professional help.
I think the teacher gets the job done. The students won't suffer longlasting injury lah. And if they don't have the common sense to sound out if they are really injured, then where's the bravado in making trouble before this? -
Please note the words below that was posted by yourself.Originally posted by despondent:ok...so wad do u 2 have to say abt tat teacher? r her punishments deserving n appropriate?the sucess rate of deterring the students was often very high...
So the punishment serves it's purpose doesn't it? So if the punishment doesn't deter the student, is the problem with the punishment or the student?