15 years to reach 6.5 million pop.?
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Food, water and a question of stability
By Li Xueying
Feb 14, 2007
The Straits Times
RAISING Singapore's population from 4.5 million to 6.5 million will also raise a host of issues that can pose a threat to stability.
They include making sure there is enough food and water, that the environment is not damaged by pollution and not least of all, social stability.
These factors were highlighted by visiting population expert Joel Cohen at a public lecture yesterday.
One question he posed is whether Singapore's multi-racial fabric can withstand the pressure from the extra two million people - of whom foreign immigrants will form a significant portion. 'If you add four or five more ethnicities to it, will it work?' he asked, in response to a question on whether the new population goal announced last week was an optimum figure.
It is not a question of numbers, he said. Rather, the question to ask is: 'Will my society hold together as layers of heterogeneity are added on top of my current ethnic mix?'
Prof Cohen heads the Laboratory of Populations at the Rockefeller and Columbia Universities in New York.
During his lecture, organised by the Lee Kuan Yew School of Public Policy, he gave a macro view of the world's human population trends and their implications.
But the interest among some in the audience of 100 students and academics was clear - they wanted his views on Singapore's new target of 6.5 million.
Is it optimum, and what are the factors that he will advise the Government to look out for?
While he demurred from commenting specifically on Singapore, Prof Cohen offered some insights on what the country should consider.
Other issues to look at include: Where will the food and water to feed the extra people be coming from? 'Singapore does not grow its food, so it is dependent on a world economy that permits trade. If there is no trade, Singapore is sunk,' he said.
Thus, it needs to determine if the global geo-political situation allows peaceful trading to continue in the long term.
Another factor is whether the country is educating its people sufficiently so that they will 'have something to offer in exchange for food'. As for the environment, the question is: Can the population be transported without pollution?
Singapore's target adds to the ballooning global population that is predicted to grow from 6.6 billion now to 9.1 billion by 2050, assuming the world's fertility rate continues its present pace of decline.
Not every country will boom: The developed world's population will shrink by one million a year, while the developing world's will swell by 35 million each year. -
Originally posted by ShutterBug:
That's what I'd like to know, too. There's already so much resentment towards PRCs, Indian workers... this is just 2 races.. some comments I hear/read are eeriely similar to Australia's racism towards Asians, like from a friend about how she'll "never" patronize the minimart "downstairs" because it's run by PRCs.. or just from reading some PRC-bashing comments off this forum.
[b]Food, water and a question of stability
By Li Xueying
Feb 14, 2007
The Straits Times
RAISING Singapore's population from 4.5 million to 6.5 million will also raise a host of issues that can pose a threat to stability.
They include making sure there is enough food and water, that the environment is not damaged by pollution and not least of all, social stability.
These factors were highlighted by visiting population expert Joel Cohen at a public lecture yesterday.
One question he posed is whether Singapore's multi-racial fabric can withstand the pressure from the extra two million people - of whom foreign immigrants will form a significant portion. 'If you add four or five more ethnicities to it, will it work?' he asked, in response to a question on whether the new population goal announced last week was an optimum figure.
It is not a question of numbers, he said. Rather, the question to ask is: 'Will my society hold together as layers of heterogeneity are added on top of my current ethnic mix?'
[/b]
Next thing you know, we'll be going "Bloody Chinese/Indians, they should just f--- on home!!" -
Yes true, we're dangerously on the edge on this...Originally posted by spinsugar:That's what I'd like to know, too. There's already so much resentment towards PRCs, Indian workers... this is just 2 races.. some comments I hear/read are eeriely similar to Australia's racism towards Asians, like from a friend about how she'll "never" patronize the minimart "downstairs" because it's run by PRCs.. or just from reading some PRC-bashing comments off this forum.
Next thing you know, we'll be going "Bloody Chinese/Indians, they should just f--- on home!!"
I personally HATE PRCs because of their ill-mannerisms and loud character. Not to mention their habit to manipulate, cheat, and greediness...!!
But I admit that I have seen some decent fellows from China... but they are far and few in between.
What enrages me, is that our gov allows them to rob locals of jobs - including minial jobs!! -
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Well, there's really nothing that we can do or say to change anything our gov does.Originally posted by queture:Yes, i agree.
Have youalso witnessed or came across Mongolians, Koreans, Canadians, Germans, Austrians as well in singapore lately? Well, some of them even have such manners and loud characters as well. And many of them are tourist as well as workers.
Due to such implications from local views on visitors from PRC/India, I believe sg is not ready for such advancement. Remember the babaylonian story? I'm quite worried.
A ripple of migration trend has already been taking place and is growing year by year. The gov will just have to wait till crap hits the fan, and then realizes and makes another U-turn just like how they now embraces Casinos in Singapore.... -
Yeah we're crowded enough as it is... and I definitely agree that we, as Singaporean citizens, are very poorly protected in terms of jobs, property ownership.. etcOriginally posted by ShutterBug:Yes true, we're dangerously on the edge on this...
I personally HATE PRCs because of their ill-mannerisms and loud character. Not to mention their habit to manipulate, cheat, and greediness...!!
But I admit that I have seen some decent fellows from China... but they are far and few in between.
What enrages me, is that our gov allows them to rob locals of jobs - including minial jobs!!
But I disagree that decent PRCs people are far & few in betw.. I find that many of us have had very limited exposure to PRCs and are intolerant/ignorant of their culture, so we have a very distorted image of them.. I daresay most PRC from certain highly developed cities of China are at least as cosmopolitan as we are, but I find them more big-hearted & open-minded compared to Singaporeans..
It's really tempting to point and say they're all the same, labelling them "dogs", "prostitutes".. but we should resist because it will destroy our humanity. Besides, there are PRCs who are here to make a decent living.. and who invited them here? Our government!
A common complaint of the middle class & below are that the Singapore elite (rich) stereotype & look down on the "sadder class" (poorer). So it's quite disappointing that we, the middle class, should display the very arrogance & stereotyping we so despise toward a group of people whom we think are beneath us... one would think we would know better after what we've been thru!
My point is, our quarrel is with the government, and not with PRCs who are simply a "consequence" of poor govt policies & regulation.. PAP still thinks they can open the floodgates, have all the goodies without the "consequences" that come with it.
Singapore isn't ready for this. PAP isn't ready. We know it. But it's PAP we should go after.. not our new residents. -
Yes I agree, the root of the problem lies with the government's policy, lets not condemn other nationalities way of life.
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Good point noted!!Originally posted by Lowclassman:Pap wants 4.5 million FTs to out number true singaporeans ...70% of total population now!!!
Or is PAP getting more FTs into singapore to dilute votes that were against them?
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Originally posted by spinsugar:
I agree as well. They're the ones who opened the doors for anyone to come in anyway. Who cares about what they gonna do here. They just need their country's trust for projects to feed their policies and economy stabiliation. We dont have resources from anywhere, except the hot spring.
Yeah we're crowded enough as it is... and I definitely agree that we, as Singaporean citizens, are very poorly protected in terms of jobs, property ownership.. etc
But I disagree that decent PRCs people are far & few in betw.. I find that many of us have had very limited exposure to PRCs and are intolerant/ignorant of their culture, so we have a very distorted image of them.. I daresay most PRC from certain highly developed cities of China are at least as cosmopolitan as we are, but I find them more big-hearted & open-minded compared to Singaporeans..
It's really tempting to point and say they're all the same, labelling them "dogs", "prostitutes".. but we should resist because it will destroy our humanity. Besides, there are PRCs who are here to make a decent living.. and who invited them here? Our government!
A common complaint of the middle class & below are that the Singapore elite (rich) stereotype & look down on the "sadder class" (poorer). So it's quite disappointing that we, the middle class, should display the very arrogance & stereotyping we so despise toward a group of people whom we think are beneath us... one would think we would know better after what we've been thru!
My point is, [b]our quarrel is with the government, and not with PRCs who are simply a "consequence" of poor govt policies & regulation.. PAP still thinks they can open the floodgates, have all the goodies without the "consequences" that come with it.
Singapore isn't ready for this. PAP isn't ready. We know it. But it's PAP we should go after.. not our new residents.[/b]
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Soon, even staying indoors in your little apartments will feel more spacious than going out.
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To the PAP's cyber counter insurgency team:
6.5 million people?! Are the whole lot of you out of your fucking minds?! Do any of you even take public transport or eat at hawker centres or food courts you fucking pricks? Do you not know that overpopulation and the scarcity of resources is threatening our very existence and in the future we might just go to war over land and drinking water?
Thank you. -
Yes,u r right our parents r like Samsui woman from CHINA but not PRC!!!!Originally posted by queture:Yes, i agree.
But maybe you haven't realised there are some local ppl who does have the same manners and characters who displayed in public as well as others. And majority locals are chinese as well whose roots did came from "you know where".
Dont know abt you but I am very proud to be a chinese although I don't really comprehen that well. It's in my blood no matter which angle I looked at myself in the mirror.
And if you also noticed, our country is so tiny and why should our brains or mindset be as well? Our history really isn't that far to justify where we are from orginally.(I only mean the chinese). So, why discriminate on what jobs we chinese have? The government put them in here so to make us work harder and challenge ourselves to work better/against them than letting us put ourselves into denial of their existence.
Remember they were here all along working in minial jobs since WW2?
Remeber Samsui Women???
After the Mao 's cultural revol,they r just a bunch of robbers as a bloody communist taken away and robbed our wealth and everything in China!!!
FFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUCCCCCCKKKKKK PRC!!!!!!
These flies and robbers PRC will take away all of us hardworking fruits in sinkapore very soon,if our stupid sg doesnt know the history!!!! -
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The whole problem with our gov is, they always think that they are 100% RIGHT. Just like they were 100% RIGHT, about Casinos in Singapore decades ago...and now LPPL start building Casinos.Originally posted by av98m:To the PAP's cyber counter insurgency team:
6.5 million people?! Are the whole lot of you out of your fucking minds?! Do any of you even take public transport or eat at hawker centres or food courts you fucking pricks? Do you not know that overpopulation and the scarcity of resources is threatening our very existence and in the future we might just go to war over land and drinking water?
Thank you.
So they will just go ahead and increase the population here until all hell breaks loose, then start making a U-turn....or some other 'smart' sounding term they will coin.
Really sick of all their about-turn policies and initiatives.... -
If I strike 4 D ,we will leave fastest of this sinkapore!!!!!Originally posted by ShutterBug:The whole problem with our gov is, they always think that they are 100% RIGHT. Just like they were 100% RIGHT, about Casinos in Singapore decades ago...and now LPPL start building Casinos.
So they will just go ahead and increase the population here until all hell breaks loose, then start making a U-turn....or some other 'smart' sounding term they will coin.
Really sick of all their about-turn policies and initiatives.... -
I find it very ironic how some of you criticize the foreigners but can't wait to leave sing as well. what makes you think that when you migrate to another country you will have better rights there? So if you criticise the foreigners who are already in sing, then when you move overseas, then the locals there are allowed to criticize you, is it how it should work?
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I wonder if the plan to increase the population until 6.5 million is a sign of desperation that many local leaving for other countries?Originally posted by foomwee88:If I strike 4 D ,we will leave fastest of this sinkapore!!!!! -
Long wait of 7 months to see doctors now, if double population ( even if we increase our doctors and nurses which themselves are in short supply globally), we would need to build more hospitals and clinics to cater to the enlarged population, do we have the SPACE!
CTE jams, traffic congestions, do we have the space to build more roads to accomodate more vehicles?
Also unlike HK, Singapore has a rigid height limit for residential buildings due to obvious reason.
Finally, vast tracts of woodlands already earmarked for military purpose. -
Wait till Mr Mah build apartments the size of a coffin.Originally posted by pie:Soon, even staying indoors in your little apartments will feel more spacious than going out. -
Woohoo.
ERP for anybody who wants to walk along Orchard Road next time. -
our forefathers can live peacefully with other races when
they cook rice by charcoals.
Now in this internet era ,we says we cant.What a shame.
2.SG pop increases from 3.9 m to 4.5 m in 2006.So,100,000 pa ,inclusive SG local born babies!!
3.Singapore 2.0: Integrating new 'software'Singapore News // Wednesday, February 28, 2007.TODAY. -
$*#&^ lah..
Mabok Tongue is saying that 6.5 million is a "planning number" or some bullshit
anyway, i don't think anyone believes him -
have u taken a mrt ride at 6-7am and 6-7pm? now multiply the crowd by 30%.Originally posted by lionnoisy:after GCT took over and he published a book called
The Next Leap.It outlines in year X,SG will have 4 million people .
2.History repeats .Many called crazy.How can the population grows
to that figure.
u hate it or not,Strait Times also forecast SG
will reach 6.5m in 20 years.Longer than my forecast of 15 years.
3.Face the reality.The more is merrier.
yeah the more the merrier... -
u BETTER stay in jurong island or tuas extensionOriginally posted by lionnoisy:less pple ,less competition.
u better stay in Pulau Ubin.or St John Is.
muahahaha -
Singapore will be part of China soon...soon we will have ministers from China too. Soon we will have one country two system too.