Do Military Leaders make good Govt Leaders?
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with regards to the recent news reports on Thailand accusing Singapore
The current person in-charge of Thailand (right after Prime Minister has being voted off) is the Military Leader
Ever since the Military Leader of Thailand took over the running of the GOVT, he started to give comments on UNRELIABLE statements with no proof to fall back on.
The stigma of Singapore Spying on Thailand Issue started with Ex-Prime Minister visiting Singapore on a casual private trip.
Case Study 1:
When the Military Leader knows about this matter, he than remarked that Singapore is Tapping (spying) on Thailand's govt/ political issues since Singapore's Temasek Holdings has just bought over Ex-Prime Minister's share of the Telecommunication Company in Thailand. [claiming that all the records of information shared over the phone is Thailand are being channeled into Singapore.
Case Study 2:
With the visit of Ex-Prime Minister of Thailand coming over to Singapore, Thailand has Immediately Canceled all HIGH LEVEL meetings scheduled with Singapore. Their reason for cancelation of meetings with Singapore govt is due to Ex-Prime Minister revealed Thailand's secrets to Singapore.
Case Study 3:
As the stigma/impression created by the Thailand Govt (Military Leader [in the event of a minister or govt body has lost it's ability to run the country or is voted off, naturally the acting govt person will be the one who has military powers in control) worsen due to increasing Unfriendly Remarks made by Thailand, even normal citizens of Thailand are treating Singapore People/Whatever is related to Singapore as Bad (or something similar)
There's a direct example - The Asian Cup which is Singapore Competing against Thailand for the Soccer Championship.
While they are already bias of Singapore, based on the un-founded remarks made by the Military Leader. They then took their frustrations & their own one-sided view of belief which in-directly contributed to the Thailand Soccer Players and Referee not giving a Professionalism as a Sports Player and Referee.
Example : Singapore Goal Keeper is given a yellow card just for taking slightly longer time in deciding where to kick the ball to.
Another Example : People sitting at the waiting area (the place where back-up players and their coach sits) just verbally shouted / slightly raise their voices and showed some unhappiness (very normal) when Thailand Referee did something - (this part i missed it so not sure), than the Thail Referee give a person at the waiting area a YELLOW CARD.
Is that fair?
Disccussions - Should Military Leaders Take Up the role of Running the Govt/Country when there's a need for some immediate person to take-over
With a person who's expertises lies in Fighting (- Either Win or Lose thinking when it comes to War.) takes over the Country and the GOVT to run the country. Should the people running the country be taking any tests to Judge if they are the situable candidate to run the country. [should they try to change their thinking and start to think in terms of a Win-Win situation and try to be friendly towards Singapore?]
Ever since The day that marks the Visit of Ex-Prime Minister that sparked the Harsh One-Sided Remark on Singapore, Thailand people in Thailand has being hostile (nearing this level) to almost anything that's related to Singapore.
What's next from the Military Leaders?
More accusations perhaps? -
We need businessmen to run the country... being us not being a warring nation.
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do we really need businessmen/businesswomen to run the country?
if it's like what you said, than i don't think i would even want to be in that country if it's being run by business people.
they only care about profits, and not the welfare of people
- look at China, during Bird Flu (chicken stain with H5N1 virus) pandemic in the last 2 years of newspapers reports, there are people who would go to the extent of digging out burried pigs that might have the virus in it.
is it safe to let the country be run by those who really cares only for profits?
or do we need people to run the country who cares for the welfare of the nation and the people living in that country?
Looking at Singapore Today, I seriously don't like the way it's being run, no doubt, comparing it to Singapore in the passed, although Singapore was a 3rd world country in the 1960s, but the govt is TRULY a People's GOVT, providing care and support for every single citizen in Singapore.
But what do we have now in Singapore?
The leaders cares only for profits and reputation.
Singapore is going to be a HUB for nearly everything.
From Science Research Hub (Biopolics - i think i have spelt wrongly - kindly correct me, thanks) to Clubbing Hub with Zouk leading the way (featured in Straits Time) and the Sports Sch (+ the govt wanting to attract talents into Singapore) as well as to make Singapore a stop-over place for talents to train in adjusting to Asian Climate to prepare for Beijing 2008.
Even arts, they also want to be Number 1 when the market Definately 100% isn't ready to be a really Art Nation in Singapore with the Esplanade built some years back, but have yet to bear fruits in making Singapore the Arts Central,although there's some small little results, but that is considered just the stem of the plant, we still don't have the leaves and the flower and the plant to bear fruit for the Arts in Singapore.
Now the govt only cares about profit and frame, although they are promoting us to be entrepeneurs but the loans and tax for SMEs are still quite high and there's a Straight Rule for SME, we have no flexiblity. Even if we were to use our HBD or our own home be it Semi-D and condo to start a home based business, we also have to pay tax (if i didn't remember wrongly), what on earth is going on?
We are already paying for our homes, while we own the homes that we bought it, what rights do the govt have over us when we do our own little business if it starts from our home?
Why the hassle of all those rules?
It's our own Home, we have got rights to do anything and everything in our own home (given that we didn't disrupt the neighbours nor inconveince them in anyway possible)
Military Leaders like Singapore Leaders now only care to Win.
Looking at Singapore Leaders now, to a certain extent, they are also short-shited already.
Cutting in corporate tax, they will lose up to 10million in tax, but with the increase bunden on tax payers - of 7% GST [2% increase] they (govt) will earn up to 16million in GST collected; I've heard this from Radio Channel 95.8 this late morning.
Are we really being taken care of?
Are the Military leaders good Govt Leaders?
I doubt very much so.
Everything i said above are based on my own view (subjective). -
but our pm and few other ministers also ex generals...
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I don't care if the next good leader of S'pore is a butcher, or transvestite, or general, or soccer player, or cleaner. I want him/her to sit in all the cooffeeshops in S'pore and eavesdrop on everybody's converstaions, and with this 1st-hand info, s/he goes ahead to make policies with his/her conscience, rather than his/her wallet, in mind.
www.blueblueheeler.blogspot.com/ -
But I would rather have a businessmen than a soldier. At least most successful businessmen make plans, they have targets and they often have the ability to motivate.Originally posted by the_fallen:do we really need businessmen/businesswomen to run the country?
Most scholars in the army are just ... let's just say I can't trust them with the economics and leading people... and unfortunately in Singapore, I don't know what is the criteria for them chosing the officers for most of them seems to be cockanathans or wayang kias... -
Originally posted by mhcampboy
since when was were our previous and current prime minister ex generals?
but our pm and few other ministers also ex generals...
LKY isn't one what, he's just a graduate from London/New York University of Law in the 1950s.
As for Mr Goh, i'm not sure of his history..
Current PM - i don't think he holds a rank in the NS as general before leh.
the past NDP disc and history didn't state that Current PM is a general leh.
the only that i know is that our Defence minister is a 1star general. that's what i know (correct me if i'm wrong) -
Originally posted by bigmouthjoe
businessmen/businesswomen makes good leaders but are they really good governers for the country?
But I would rather have a businessmen than a soldier. At least most successful businessmen make plans, they have targets and they often have the ability to motivate.
Most scholars in the army are just ... let's just say I can't trust them with the economics and leading people... and unfortunately in Singapore, I don't know what is the criteria for them chosing the officers for most of them seems to be *&%#anathans or wayang kias...
if it's like what you said as per the above - they have the ability to motivate, than why aren't all the bosses of different industry being part of the govt already?
lol..
it's not that easy to be a govener body or to work in the govt..that's a bit side-track, so i will not carry on futher.
back to what you've said.
motivate - motivation
the govt did motivate a lot of the people living in Singapore to give birth to more babies, but why aren't the low birth problem being resolved yet?
motivation will only last for a limited period of time only. at most 24hrs.
regarding the criteria of them choosing people to be in the top position of NS, that's easy, just study hard, be the top few of the cahoot, if not be the LKY schloars' award than sure go into OCS and be promoted fast enough. (like bullet train - provided that they sign on.)
but as for the criteria to be a person dealing with govt issues, that i have yet to check out the details (also side-track of the topic which i written as well; we discuss it when i think of a suitable case study or example to go with it)
now just back to the topic.
military leaders, good leaders?
comments? -
our PM is the youngest ever to be promoted a brigadier general...Originally posted by the_fallen:since when was were our previous and current prime minister ex generals?
LKY isn't one what, he's just a graduate from London/New York University of Law in the 1950s.
As for Mr Goh, i'm not sure of his history..
Current PM - i don't think he holds a rank in the NS as general before leh.
the past NDP disc and history didn't state that Current PM is a general leh.
the only that i know is that our Defence minister is a 1star general. that's what i know (correct me if i'm wrong)
got few ministers also BG's.... but liability for ns over already... -
then the question is, do lousy generals make good ministers?Originally posted by mhcampboy:but our pm and few other ministers also ex generals... 
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how abt LHL?
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The_fallen, if you look up more closely at the past careers of some of our ministers, most, if not all have been at least SAF OS or PSC scholars.
Or like RADM Lui, parachuted into Tanjong Pagar GRC as a new MP after retiring. -
Current ministers with military ranks...
LTC Lim Hng Kiang...minister for trade and industry ...
BG Jimmy Khoo...director of mindef and dsta
BG Lam Joon Khoi...deputy secretary of finance
Rear Admiral Richard Lim....deputy secretary of defence...
BG Tan Chin Tiong....permanent secretary for foreign affairs..
BG George Yeo... minister of foreign affairs...
and still got lots of past and present military leaders in govt.. -
lky graduated from cambridge. lhl hols the rank of BG. during sm's time there was no NSOriginally posted by the_fallen:since when was were our previous and current prime minister ex generals?
LKY isn't one what, he's just a graduate from London/New York University of Law in the 1950s.
As for Mr Goh, i'm not sure of his history..
Current PM - i don't think he holds a rank in the NS as general before leh.
the past NDP disc and history didn't state that Current PM is a general leh.
the only that i know is that our Defence minister is a 1star general. that's what i know (correct me if i'm wrong) -
r u a singaporean?Originally posted by the_fallen:since when was were our previous and current prime minister ex generals?
LKY isn't one what, he's just a graduate from London/New York University of Law in the 1950s.
As for Mr Goh, i'm not sure of his history..
Current PM - i don't think he holds a rank in the NS as general before leh.
the past NDP disc and history didn't state that Current PM is a general leh.
the only that i know is that our Defence minister is a 1star general. that's what i know (correct me if i'm wrong)
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Not to mention LG Lim Chuan Poh, Permanent Secretary for Education, soon to be A*Star chairman. Not sure he'll relish to be in that hot seat though.
Generally, though, I think the military, especially the SAF, tends to breed a rather narrow sort of mentality which is not really suitable to the business of government. Generals and admirals tend to lack understanding of the fundamental principles of politics, economics and diplomacy. The PAP should really examine their policy of recruiting ex-military leaders, or at least the way of educating them. -
Originally posted by vito_corleone
seriously i didn't know the lhl holds such a high rank.
lky graduated from cambridge. lhl hols the rank of BG. during sm's time there was no NS
lol..
you sure about the part on no NS?
NS has being practised in Singapore for decades already since Singapore became independent.
well anyway, that's a bit of side-track already.
are the top people in-charged of running the country make Good Govt Leaders?
as the time passes, with the economy of Singapore improving, i see, hear, and read many people are increasingly having problems with Monetary Issues.
If they (Military Leaders - like what some people said, most of the Top People holds High Ranks in NS) runs the country, although Singapore is functioning well enough, but it only looks good on the surface, not in the interior.
if the leaders are really so good, than why are there still so many problems?
Do we really have good leaders or as military leaders, Do they Have What It Takes to run the country smoothly?
Do they really fullfill the roles that they should be doing by helping citizens to solve their problems or are they just taking our tax-payers' money to gain recognition and frame from other countries by wanting to be No 1 in almost everything possible? -
Originally posted by mhcampboy
where did you find all these information from?
Current ministers with military ranks...
LTC Lim Hng Kiang...minister for trade and industry ...
BG Jimmy Khoo...director of mindef and dsta
BG Lam Joon Khoi...deputy secretary of finance
Rear Admiral Richard Lim....deputy secretary of defence...
BG Tan Chin Tiong....permanent secretary for foreign affairs..
BG George Yeo... minister of foreign affairs...
and still got lots of past and present military leaders in govt..
i would like to know more about the politics of Singapore and the people running the country. -
my dear.. go and run a quick check on google on their names la if u dun believe...Originally posted by the_fallen:where did you find all these information from?
i would like to know more about the politics of Singapore and the people running the country.
some of this ppl i know is based on general knowledge... -
You sure u singaporean?Originally posted by the_fallen:seriously i didn't know the lhl holds such a high rank.
lol..
you sure about the part on no NS?
NS has being practised in Singapore for decades already since Singapore became independent.
well anyway, that's a bit of side-track already.
are the top people in-charged of running the country make Good Govt Leaders?
as the time passes, with the economy of Singapore improving, i see, hear, and read many people are increasingly having problems with Monetary Issues.
If they (Military Leaders - like what some people said, most of the Top People holds High Ranks in NS) runs the country, although Singapore is functioning well enough, but it only looks good on the surface, not in the interior.
if the leaders are really so good, than why are there still so many problems?
Do we really have good leaders or as military leaders, Do they Have What It Takes to run the country smoothly?
Do they really fullfill the roles that they should be doing by helping citizens to solve their problems or are they just taking our tax-payers' money to gain recognition and frame from other countries by wanting to be No 1 in almost everything possible?
anyway.. wad he meant by during SM's goh no NS is... when goh was young.. NS is not implemented yet... -
good military leaders do make good govt leaders !!!
But then there is lots of bad military leaders who manage to get to that position, they make worst govt leaders !!! -
Does anyone expect Lim Chuan Poh to be able to handle the situation at A*star better than outgoing straight-talker Philip Yeo?
Given the fact that the sparring opponent is a member of the Lee family, who has always gone against her father's wishes? The stinging sensation from her defiance against her father's wishes to go to Pre-U at RI instead of attending college at NJC must still be ringing in LKY's ear.
Against the likes of heavyweights such as Dr Lee, can Lim Chuan Poh convince the public that the BIO-MED research in upcoming Biopolis will not be a massive splurging of taxpayers' monies and another expensive tuition fee? Philip Yeo may have managed to flaunt his obvious arrogance with impunity against errant bond-breakers, but his responses against Dr Lee have been nothing short of muted, like a barking dog which has been suddenly muzzled.
In a dog-eat-dog world, where the bigger dog comes out tops, can his final response of 'letting Lim Chuan Poh answer further questions' be a sign of throwing in the towel?
Under the circumstances, can the former chief of defence force (CDF) possibly stabilize the ship? -
Urmm... I wouldn't consider the position in Singapore military to be exactly military. Never experience real war or face terrorist?? All paper and theory and lots of administration work which is so much more to running a business. -
Originally posted by mhcampboy:Current ministers with military ranks...
LTC Lim Hng Kiang...minister for trade and industry ...
BG Jimmy Khoo...director of mindef and dsta
BG Lam Joon Khoi...deputy secretary of finance
Rear Admiral Richard Lim....deputy secretary of defence...
BG Tan Chin Tiong....permanent secretary for foreign affairs..
BG George Yeo... minister of foreign affairs...
and still got lots of past and present military leaders in govt..-
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where have you been? it's done and dusted, even ntuc, town councils, police and the courts are one and the same.....the day pap loses power, the entire country will shut down.....Originally posted by qpicanto:......Will PAP.SAF.GLC,GOVT becoming a single entity?