That's why we still need foreign workers
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THE precision engineering industry suffers from a serious image problem.
Singaporeans see it as a dirty and smelly business and are avoiding it in droves.
So despite creating about 2,000 jobs each year in the last two years, only about one in three has been taken up.
Precision engineering, or PE, includes metal stamping and machining parts for the semiconductor, aerospace and automotive industries.
'The situation is very bad. Almost half of the industry's workforce of 50,000 is made up of foreigners,' said Dr Moh Chong Tau, chairman of the PE Industry Skills Training Council, set up by employers to provide training.
'Young Singaporeans, even the engineers, prefer to work in the city and dress smartly. It's also very hard to attract them because of the misconceptions and myths of this industry.'
This is happening despite a higher entry-level salary for the PE industry.
A tool and die maker with GCE O levels, for example, can earn between $1,700 and $2,302 a month. In comparison, a customer service clerk with GCE A levels takes in just between $1,200 and $1,550.
The difference is largely because a PE worker gets more training, both before and on the job, said the Workforce Development Agency (WDA).
However, the popular picture of the PE worker is not an attractive one. 'The perception is that he is dirty, smelly, works on a lathe all day, grinding away at metal pieces,' said WDA director (manufacturing and construction division) Jeffrey Lam.
Worse, most people perceive the work as being done in hot and humid workshops.
This is no longer accurate as many companies have air-conditioned their work areas. Said Dr Moh: 'The environment is actually very clean and fully automated.
'We use a lot of computers. If you are good at playing computer games, you'd have no problem doing the work.'
The industry generated an output of $20 billion in 2005, a figure that should reach $28 billion by 2018.
But the labour shortage is worrying because of its direct impact on other sectors, in particular, manufacturing.
Said Mr Lam: 'Some people call the PE industry the mother of manufacturing industries. It produces the tools, moulds, components, and machinery to support other manufacturing activities including electronics, pharmaceuticals, aerospace.'
For example, in aerospace, PE is needed to produce landing gear and engine cases.
If the labour problem persists, PE companies here would migrate to countries like China, where manpower is in abundance, said Dr Moh, who is also president of PE company Makino Asia.
To attract more Singaporeans, the WDA is developing a nationally recognised training programme for the industry.
The Workforce Skills Qualifications, or WSQ, helps upgrade workers by developing career paths and giving them structured training.
It may also be packaged into apprenticeship or scholarship schemes.
Straits times 22 Mar -
That's why we still need foreign workers .
Because we need to have a few more cases like SIA dropping nut bolts from their flying aircrafts on foreign residences or loose screws left on a Qantas aircraft .
How many nut bolts one need to demolish a suburb though ....that's my question. -
A tool and die maker with GCE O levels, for example, can earn between $1,700 and $2,302 a month. In comparison, a customer service clerk with GCE A levels takes in just between $1,200 and $1,550.
it way under paid in SG. period.
oh.... Singaporean please go lower... "everyone" trying to under cut each other.
the top will play this game for as long as in control and while all is going on, they keep increasing their own pay check.
2nd level ie the bosses will maintain his own profit while lower tender by cutting the workers pay in order to pay the top.
workers level, in order to pay for his house loan, daily needs, he need a job where by he (buey yam bou gou kaim, buey tenk bou gou tni.) buy salt not salty enough, buy sugar not sweet enough
just one example, a new construction safety supervisor getting 1.8k in 1998 and today 9 years later, a same new construction safety supervisor is oni getting 1.6k.
why? with 9 years site experience. this poor guy is cutting his own pay in order to stay employ to get day pass.
with growing GDP, GST, medical fee, the poor guy remain lowly paid and the new guy is getting 12% less compare to 9 years ago? sad, disgusted. -
The GNP and GDP per capita does show each of the individual income earn by Singaporean.. It only show an average of.
The rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer. -
SG had more push factors for it citizens than pull factors. it has all the pull factor for FT at the same time the push factor is working on those FT as well.
how many has left, how many have came and left. who really stay in the end?
maybe one day we will see all MIW in SG and we will see who need who by than...
clapping clapping.... well done to MM LKY, SM GCT, PM LHL... -
You seem to be sweeping suggestions that only foreign workers make mistakes. Statistically, far more local workers are guilty of shoddy work, simply because there are more of them.Originally posted by fymk:That's why we still need foreign workers .
Because we need to have a few more cases like SIA dropping nut bolts from their flying aircrafts on foreign residences or loose screws left on a Qantas aircraft .
How many nut bolts one need to demolish a suburb though ....that's my question.
It does not matter if the worker is local or foreign, as long as he does his job well and his productivity justifies his pay. -
$2k pay for an O level holder is pretty good salary but as the newspaper article mentioned, Singaporeans would rather go for white collar jobs that pay less and then grumble about the low salary. If such workers will take up jobs in precision engineering and wafer fabs, we won't have to hire so many foreign workers.
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It does not matter if the worker is local or foreign, as long as he does his job well and his productivity justifies his pay.
justifies pay
as in how MIW justifies "his" pay
well done. -
Originally posted by oxford mushroom:$2k pay for an O level holder is pretty good salary but as the newspaper article mentioned, Singaporeans would rather go for white collar jobs that pay less and then grumble about the low salary. If such workers will take up jobs in precision engineering and wafer fabs, we won't have to hire so many foreign workers.
wafer fabs... located at where? traveling time? transport cost? end up same if work in customer service??? justifies his pay??? please choose.
well done... -
No I am making general assumptions about the foreign talent policy not working at all.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:You seem to be sweeping suggestions that only foreign workers make mistakes. Statistically, far more local workers are guilty of shoddy work, simply because there are more of them.
It does not matter if the worker is local or foreign, as long as he does his job well and his productivity justifies his pay.
SIA dropped from no. 1 to 7 after FT policy
People jumped off MRT tracks - started after FT policy
People complaining about no jobs - After FT policy
If I have time - I can think of many things which are negative about FT policies.
You don't encourage loyalty under the FT policy and without loyalty , you don't encourage the best quality of work . -
wafer fabs... pay 5k.... who dun want?
but its not going to happen.
if they can pay FT 2k why pay you 5k?
frog living in the well will say that the sky is oni this big.... -
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleTOC&specialReportId=9000182&articleId=9004787
check here to see how low your pay is. remember, SG is world class now... so please, dun come barking say India, China, Vietnam etc are much more lower than SG. -
How true is this report nobody knows.........
To this 1 example, there are probably 5 other cases of Singapore companies hiring foreigners instead of locals when the job is not beyond the abilities of locals. I've personally seen the administrative functions of quite a few companies staffed by 90% foreigners (Malaysians) coz locals are presumably more expensive to hire....?
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arent you making a sweeping statement too?Originally posted by oxford mushroom:$2k pay for an O level holder is pretty good salary but as the newspaper article mentioned, Singaporeans would rather go for white collar jobs that pay less and then grumble about the low salary. If such workers will take up jobs in precision engineering and wafer fabs, we won't have to hire so many foreign workers.
what makes you think all singaporeans would rather go for white collar jobs that pay less and then grumble about the low salary?
just because of the above report? -
Not true. Lean and mean US companies have always rewarded performance with top dollars but are equally quick to fire in a recession or when the employee does not measure up.Originally posted by fymk:You don't encourage loyalty under the FT policy and without loyalty , you don't encourage the best quality of work .
What's the use of a loyal piece of dead wood? They cannot go anyway either..
Locals or foreigners...as long as the employee performs, that's the one to keep. -
Read the newspapers...facts do not lie. If Singaporeans are willing to work in precision engineering and wafer fabs, Lim Swee Say wouldn't have to keep harping about the need for FT to run these factories.Originally posted by dragg:arent you making a sweeping statement too?
what makes you think all singaporeans would rather go for white collar jobs that pay less and then grumble about the low salary?
just because of the above report? -
If foreigners can do the same job for less money there is no reason why an employer shouldn't go for FT.Originally posted by :How true is this report nobody knows.........
To this 1 example, there are probably 5 other cases of Singapore companies hiring foreigners instead of locals when the job is not beyond the abilities of locals. I've personally seen the administrative functions of quite a few companies staffed by 90% foreigners (Malaysians) coz locals are presumably more expensive to hire....?
Your allegations are also totally off the mark. Singapore labour laws do not allow a company to hire 90% foreigners..since when can you get so many work permits? If you are not spinning lies, name the company and I will report it to MOM.
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where is that frog?
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smlj.... ribitOriginally posted by Joshua1975:where is that frog? -
Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Read the newspapers...facts do not lie. If Singaporeans are willing to work in precision engineering and wafer fabs, Lim Swee Say wouldn't have to keep harping about the need for FT to run these factories.Originally posted by Joshua1975:
wafer fabs... located at where? traveling time? transport cost? end up same if work in customer service??? justifies his pay??? please choose.
well done... -
ljtk.Originally posted by King Toad:smlj.... ribit -
Lean and mean US companies always fire anyone without hesitation who does not perform. They also have transparent business reporting unlike Singapore.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Not true. Lean and mean US companies have always rewarded performance with top dollars but are equally quick to fire in a recession or when the employee does not measure up.
What's the use of a loyal piece of dead wood? They cannot go anyway either..
Locals or foreigners...as long as the employee performs, that's the one to keep.
Temasek has not performed and instead incurred a few billion dollars in fines ( which translate to losses) by the Thai government - how come the CEO was not fired? How come even in a downturn , ministers are still upping their pay while people are complaining of their jobs being taken away by foreigners and the GST is being hiked?
That loyal piece of dead wood could also be referred to your NS and NS reservist men. They don't have an advantage over foreigners in job employment because of their obligations to the country. Are you willing to ditch all those men who spent 2 - 2.5 years of the life in training to favor foreigners?
Loyal piece of dead wood - in Australia, there is a lot of them there but they do take pride in their work. Australia is booming even when their labor costs and wages are high. And yes they do favor their locals more unlike Singapore.
I am not saying to cancel the foreign talent policy absolutely. I am asking for a fairer one . Only take in people when the skill market is short. Not just take them all in.