Anyone please do share your view why we still employ Guka...
-
I'm sure it must be the will of the majority that we see Mugabe in power in Zimbabwe and Castro in power in Cuba too. All elections held on this planet are free and fair beyond question, I bet...Originally posted by Arapahoe:than stop voting them into the parliment. Please do not forget every 4 years we walk and we vote. Than after people received their little extra money from the gov they forgot who they want to vote. -
i did read the thread he was talking about saving money for the poor. Guarding LKY has its origin.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:No one here is complaining about them costing money, if you bothered to read the thread.
People are grumbling that they exist for the sole purpose of defending our politicians. Mind you, they are used to defend some of the most sensitive installations including our MM... -
i do not think that the government worried arm revolution in Singapore more than a Race riot. Unless SAF structure has change from a civilian army to a force of professional armies. Hiring of Gulhkas stand from Race riot. As you may know that Until now this 2 topics are still out of public discussion religion and race.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Does it frakking matter what others do? Or do we have to follow every bad example others set?
Neutral element? Perhaps the PAP was more afraid of a Bolshevik style revolution where the solders join the peasants in a mass revolt.
It is not about comparing bad policy to bad policy but rather to highlight that every country has its own biased in history, its a fact.
when a race riot comes the government only resolute against all race riot and not seemly pro chinese or pro malay is to engage a third element. -
would u not agreed that would be a different threads.Originally posted by walesa:I'm sure it must be the will of the majority that we see Mugabe in power in Zimbabwe and Castro in power in Cuba too. All elections held on this planet are free and fair beyond question, I bet... -
Are you aware the Pentagon (and other security agencies) is obliged to declassify any sensitive/confidential information to the public 25 years after an event ceases? In other words, such information is available to the public - anyone who has the remotest interest in any of their policies will have access to them.Originally posted by Arapahoe:No government can be totally non biased not even the United States. Japanese origin US citizen were put on War relocation Camp during WWII. It only acknowledge during Regan administration. almost 40 years after they won the WAR.
Look at the history of Singapore race riot, and look at now malaysia still implementing bumi policy., look at what happen to singapore after 911. These are not extremist ideas from History book to compare.....These are as real as it gets.
The only neutral element would be Gurkhas against any race all alike.
It's one thing being biased on the pretext of safeguarding national interests for a given timeframe(which just about any sovereign state would exercise when its immediate interests are compromised), but quite a different matter entirely when it comes to being biased to conceal/deceive the masses for an eternity (or at least, intended that way until such regimes fall) on matters that, in truth, only compromises the interests of the ruling elite. -
Not when you're suggesting the regime here is as easily disposable through democratic means via an election as democracies that operate on truly democratic principles...Originally posted by Arapahoe:would u not agreed that would be a different threads. -
yes and singapore history is only how many years again? the 1st generation leaders are still around by the way.....Singapore as a nation is still under test.Originally posted by walesa:Are you aware the Pentagon (and other security agencies) is obliged to declassify any sensitive/confidential information to the public 25 years after an event ceases? In other words, such information is available to the public - anyone who has the remotest interest in any of their policies will have access to them.
It's one thing being biased on the pretext of safeguarding national interests for a given timeframe(which just about any sovereign state would exercise when its immediate interests are compromised), but quite a different matter entirely when it comes to being biased to conceal/deceive the masses for an eternity (or at least, intended that way until such regimes fall) on matters that, in truth, only compromises the interests of the ruling elite. -
i am not implying anything here, u read too much into it. I don;t necessary believe that true democracy truely yield the desire result of Prosperity and peace.Originally posted by walesa:Not when you're suggesting the regime here is as easily disposable through democratic means via an election as democracies that operate on truly democratic principles... -
What history has Singapore got post-1965? Why should any democracy respect the 1st generation of leaders any more than any other citizens to begin with? George Washington did not enjoy any more privileges and rights than any other ordinary citizen when America first had its Declaration of Independence in 1776 - and neither did he need to feed on glories stemming from nurturing a cult personality.Originally posted by Arapahoe:yes and singapore history is only how many years again? the 1st generation leaders are still around by the way.....Singapore as a nation is still under test.
Or are you reading too little into the drivel you'd espoused earlier? Read that response in the right context.Originally posted by Arapahoe:i am not implying anything here, u read too much into it. I don;t necessary believe that true democracy truely bring the following result : Prosperity and peace.
This
was intended to address this :Originally posted by walesa:I'm sure it must be the will of the majority that we see Mugabe in power in Zimbabwe and Castro in power in Cuba too. All elections held on this planet are free and fair beyond question, I bet...Originally posted by Arapahoe:than stop voting them into the parliment. Please do not forget every 4 years we walk and we vote. Than after people received their little extra money from the gov they forgot who they want to vote. -
Then why the heck do we have a bunch of Gurkhas when local soldiers would have sufficed? Are you also implying that Singapore could descend into racial chaos overnight? You also insinuating that this country's minorities cannot be trusted which in fact it is "UNOFFICIAL POLICY" that the Govt actually practices?Originally posted by Arapahoe:i do not think that the government worried arm revolution in Singapore more than a Race riot. Unless SAF structure has change from a civilian army to a force of professional armies. Hiring of Gulhkas stand from Race riot. As you may know that Until now this 2 topics are still out of public discussion religion and race.
It is not about comparing bad policy to bad policy but rather to highlight that every country has its own biased in history, its a fact.
when a race riot comes the government only resolute against all race riot and not seemly pro chinese or pro malay is to engage a third element. -
It is official that Religion and Race are out of the topics even till today. You should understand why this is such a sensitive topics. You can evaluate the situation according to your interpretation of what is the unsaid policy that gov practices. In any race riot occurred Gurkhas, Police will be there not SAF.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Then why the heck do we have a bunch of Gurkhas when local soldiers would have sufficed? Are you also implying that Singapore could descend into racial chaos overnight? You also insinuating that this country's minorities cannot be trusted which in fact it is "UNOFFICIAL POLICY" that the Govt actually practices?
It is only recently that there are new law to allow SAF more authority against terrorist. It serve a function in History and it will continue to do so because of our social demographics.
Government sensitive in this topics I believe comes from the facts that they canÂ’t stop when it start. Until these days and age we still encounter prejudice against minority in Singapore. Ever look at jobs classified ads and it advertised chinese speaking only!!!!!....da!
2nd race riot spillover across the region. For an institution to exist politically in Singapore it will have to be neutral against all races. Any “perceived” oppression against minority will lead to even more hostility from surounding countries. (If you know Singapore is the last country in SE Asia to have official diplomatic relation with China.)
There are chain of event and decision in history that leads to where it is now. I would Not be so judgmental about Gurkhas being sole purposes of defending our leader. Do you not think that a leader need security too? I think this day and age it is relevant.
People are grumbling that they exist for the sole purpose of defending our politicians. Mind you, they are used to defend some of the most sensitive installations including our MM...
[/quote] -
Walesa is that what they thought you in S. to quote, i would prefer your position.Originally posted by walesa:
here is my take.
Singapore is still a nation building mode thru "time". If you are still building something thru "time" you cannot tear it down before it is mature. Right now you are saying this is not what we want its not good enough. Than I say since there is a system of vote than all you can do is vote it down thru the system donÂ’t tear it down and build a new system. Because you have gone thru 40 years, it may not be perfect it is doing something better than the rest in the region. Re-invent within the system not tear it down and start from scratch.
No gov is perfect all has its biased in history, especially early history. And I discourage you to compare current US policy because Singapore history do not have the depth nor being tested to be a nation. (we haven't stand up as an entity against foreign )
Our leadership handover is still at its infant stage of child holding. so stop bring democracy into Singapore because you ain't going to find it. -
Its being smart.
Do you think they would be stupid for you.
In security, there always should be levels.
And each level, has a higher degree of security.
The conscripts defend the perimeter/borders.
The Guards defend the inner circle/capital.
The Elite Guards defend the core/parliament.
The Special Security personnel defend the chief/rulers.
If I were a dictator, I would also follow this format.
I would not bother with what you think. -
Are Gurkhas granted automatic citizenships? Juz wondering coz there's alway a Gurkha winning a marathon or a Big Walk lor.
I see Gurkhas as being loyal not to Singapore but to the people who hires their services. Full stop. -
They live here, they crap here, they have kids born here.
Dont talk nonsense can?
I feel sad that in order for them to siam the problems in their own country they have to relocate themselves over here.
Once settle down here, they are just like you and me.
If people pay you #10K a month would you move to that country and settle down? Yes for some, no for some. Why? some people 10K is nothing.
If it's eq to $100K a month, most would move too.
Dont look down on them. Their lives are different, give them respect for what they contribute to our lives everyday, every moment. -
Originally posted by Araphoe:
Look, quit avoiding facts. It is pretty much obvious in the SAF that there is some unofficial policy against the minority races, particularly evidenced by the lack of minorities in manpower depts, and even if there were, they will be given less sensitive duties. You seem to fail to see that Gurkhas' status is practically that of a private army that is wholely subservient to the Govt who writes its pay check. Essentially the Govt is creating a state within the state, not trusting its own citizens, but regard them as possible suspects and potential coup supporters.
It is official that Religion and Race are out of the topics even till today. You should understand why this is such a sensitive topics. You can evaluate the situation according to your interpretation of what is the unsaid policy that gov practices. In any race riot occurred Gurkhas, Police will be there not SAF.
It is only recently that there are new law to allow SAF more authority against terrorist. It serve a function in History and it will continue to do so because of our social demographics.
Government sensitive in this topics I believe comes from the facts that they canÂ’t stop when it start. Until these days and age we still encounter prejudice against minority in Singapore. Ever look at jobs classified ads and it advertised chinese speaking only!!!!!....da!
2nd race riot spillover across the region. For an institution to exist politically in Singapore it will have to be neutral against all races. Any “perceived” oppression against minority will lead to even more hostility from surounding countries. (If you know Singapore is the last country in SE Asia to have official diplomatic relation with China.)
There are chain of event and decision in history that leads to where it is now. I would Not be so judgmental about Gurkhas being sole purposes of defending our leader. Do you not think that a leader need security too? I think this day and age it is relevant.
[b]People are grumbling that they exist for the sole purpose of defending our politicians. Mind you, they are used to defend some of the most sensitive installations including our MM...
The Govt has shown from time to time to be extremely paranoid, even going as far as accusing some 20 or so activists as Marxists and there after exiling them from the country. What 20 or so activists could do in rousing up the people is quite simply beyond my imagination, more so when they were social workers. Moreover, the Govt has always regarded its citizens with suspicion, and going so far as to discriminate its own citizens in its own army.
In fact, I don't even know what you are trying to support here, beyond some mindless rambling possibly because of you evidently bad English. -
Please dont link so many things together.
SAF policies (are slightly discriminatory in certain areas). This is the same elsewhere in any country with mixed population.
It's the same with females having a glass ceiling in the corporate world.
The Gurkhas as here with purposes. They are very fit and of course the duties with the most demanding requirements are given to those with the best physique and mental stability.
Please tell me where they hire all minorities to protect heads of states. -
Are you this dense and naive, if not stupid? By your stupid if not inane argument, since the Soviet Union under Stalin ordered thousands to the Gulags for potentially conspiring against Stalin, our Govt has every right, and even a blank cheque, to do so against its own citizens? Are you that stupid?!Originally posted by CM06:Please dont link so many things together.
SAF policies (are slightly discriminatory in certain areas). This is the same elsewhere in any country with mixed population.
It's the same with females having a glass ceiling in the corporate world.
The Gurkhas as here with purposes. They are very fit and of course the duties with the most demanding requirements are given to those with the best physique and mental stability.
Please tell me where they hire all minorities to protect heads of states. -
No i'm not.
I dont see Gurkhas being use to herd me to do stuff anyday ever to comply to do what the government says.
Besides, they are useful if we have racial riots again. -
Originally posted by CM06:No i'm not.
I dont see Gurkhas being use to herd me to do stuff anyday ever to comply to do what the government says.
Besides, they are useful if we have racial riots again.
Whatever. Seems that Singaporeans are too timid and are happy with their own Govt being suspicious of them. -
Whatever too. Seems you know everything about how everything is done too. So i'm wrong.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:
Whatever. Seems that Singaporeans are too timid and are happy with their own Govt being suspicious of them.
Besides, i'm not all happy about the Govt. -
The Gurkhas are probably a neutral force per se, but as with the case of any foreign, hired guns, who's to say that in the future, some rogue might not take these boys and serve a hidden agenda?
To be fair though, most Gurkhas don't have a chance of getting residency here after their contract ends. However, I've talked to a few who have settled here and opened businesses, and they are very grateful to Singapore, as Nepal is a place with limited opportunities and chaos.
That's the risk here. -
Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:
In singapore, a large part of soldiers(NSF and reservists) are the peasants.
Does it frakking matter what others do? Or do we have to follow every bad example others set?
Neutral element? Perhaps the PAP was more afraid of a Bolshevik style revolution where the solders join the peasants in a mass revolt. -
The term peasants is frankly, downright offensive. Can we stop using that label for the Singaporean everyman?
-
The Gurkha soldiers are important to us. They are valuable eye candy. Have you seen them jogging near their camps. Oh makes me go into a frenzy! Beautiful pack bodies with a tight a** to boot. Really makes my day.