Poor service at SGH
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Up against people who don't know much, it's a thankless job.Originally posted by plusminusdaisy:i'm a doctor in a government hospital. and i've been overworked. feel like i'm in a thankless job and i am counting the days when i can quit this profession.
Up against people who acts as if they know a lot, it's even worse.
Who's not counting to leave their profession?
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If doctors are overworked, I would like to know WHY, are they overworked?
Also, if they are UNDERPAID, I'd wanna know WHY, they are UNDERPAID?
If UNDERPAYING causes them to be OVERWORKED, and which in turn causes them to join the private sectors, I'd want to know WHY, can't something be done to RETAIN doctors in gov hospitals?
All the proud proclamation of being The First in everything, a Hub for everything, a Biomedical super center for all the medical eggheads come and contribute, we sure as hell are lacking in basic healthcare.. WHY???
Because doctors in gov hospitals are OVERWORKED, UNDERPAID, and UN-APPRECIATED.
WHY, WHY, WHY?
Dig into this... where's the ROOT CAUSE???
If the government knows how to say that they need MORE MONEY to stay UN-CORRUPTED, why can't they also understand the NEEDS of The People, and the People's Doctors???
Like doctors always say; "..don't just treat the symtpoms, treat the cause of the symptoms." -
How overwork is it?Must u do OT?If u are really overworked,u should complain to Health Minister.Originally posted by plusminusdaisy:i'm a doctor in a government hospital. and i've been overworked. feel like i'm in a thankless job and i am counting the days when i can quit this profession. -
The only irony to it all is we're still getting monkeys in exchange for gold - and monkeys like you are living proof of that.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:You pay peanuts, you get monkeys. If you want rapid, high quality service from highly trained professionals, you've got to pay more. Unfortunately losers like you cannot afford me
I'd be amazed if monkeys would actually require the expertise of self-delusional losers, much less humans.
Oh, what a pity. According to the monkey above(and I never knew the NHS hired monkeysOriginally posted by plusminusdaisy:i'm a doctor in a government hospital. and i've been overworked. feel like i'm in a thankless job and i am counting the days when i can quit this profession. ), you're actually worth your weight in gold for the menial workload you're entrusted with in a paid healthcare here. 
Could you clarify if the monkey above is being delusional? (or do you need a vet for that?) -
What purpose does it serve complaining to gold-receiving losers blessed with the intellect of a monkey?Originally posted by PRP:How overwork is it?Must u do OT?If u are really overworked,u should complain to Health Minister.
If you need any evidence of the capabilities of such species, just look out for the one in this thread. -
How i wish i can film everything by the doc in this thread,make a documentary on the healthcare of Singapore and send it to some film fest.
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Originally posted by walesa:
I don't think there's a need to clarify. I've seen some doctors in hospitals who work two days straight without rest.
Oh, what a pity. According to the monkey above(and I never knew the NHS hired monkeys ), you're actually worth your weight in gold for the menial workload you're entrusted with in a [b]paid healthcare here. Could you clarify if the monkey above is being delusional? (or do you need a vet for that?) [/b]
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Because they pay top salaries for their staff and patients pay top dollars to get medical treatment.Originally posted by ShutterBug:It all boils down to 'how much they have done to improve on these hospitals handling ability'. After 40 years, it is inexcusable!
What about large countries like USA? How come they can find a way to handle peak periods?
If you have medical insurance in the US, you get treatment. If you do not have insurance or ready cash in hand, you have to look elsewhere mate -
Root cause is that Singaporeans whine about healthcare costs but still want the best treatment. You want to pay $8 to see a GP? Then you must expect to wait. With such cheap consultation rates, everyone flocks to the polyclinics and government hospitals. Of course the doctors will take longer to see everyone. You will have to wait unless we hire more doctors. But you don't want to pay more...what do you expect? Why should doctors work for free?Originally posted by ShutterBug:Dig into this... where's the ROOT CAUSE???
I say bring in cheap doctors from India, Bangladesh and China for those who want to pay $8 to see the GP and those who want C class rates in public hospitals. -
The root cause of all the unhappiness of the citizens is not with the doctors or nurses or any staff.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Because they pay top salaries for their staff and patients pay top dollars to get medical treatment.
If you have medical insurance in the US, you get treatment. If you do not have insurance or ready cash in hand, you have to look elsewhere mate
The blame as usual was always placed on the doctors or nurses or teachers or some other.
When our ministers some years ago decided to charge for all land and infrastructure costs, against all the government services in computation of their fees and charges, they had failed to realize when government acquired the lands and infrastructures using taxes or land acquisition laws to do so, they would be double charging on lands and infrastructures if they try to recover such costs at the service level.
They gave some excuses like lands being scarce or the need for fair allocation so as to make monies on such freely acquired or tax-funded lands twice.
All the URA and HDB land sales fetching billions were pure profits then as lands were recovered separately from the end users as well.
Despite such huge profits URA/HDB are making on free lands they are still charging such costs on all medical, housing and utility services which drive up the costs of living and presses down on doctors' and nurses' wages.
This system of taxing and cost recovery leads to high medical fees where large percentages are going towards paying to doubly on lands and infrastructure leaving little for the doctors and nurses who are therefore short-changed in their wages.
If ministers are more proactive and truly our talents then they should point out such wrongful over-charging through creative accounting and give the economy a chance to become competitive again as PSA has found out in the Port Pelepas saga.
The government is making too much profits from both the front end and end users and that is why because of such wrongful and immoral method of government it keeps making hidden and budget surpluses at the expense of the people.
The hidden profits made by URA, HDB and government departments in such a method of double charging on lands and infrastructures come to at least S$2 billions per annum which are not disclosed in the normal budgets presented to parliament.
When the ministers stop such creative double charging on lands and infrastructures which were long paid for by citizens in the original land acquisitions and taxation, all will be well for Singaporeans who will then be freed of the current burdens they are struggling with.
Check how URA/HDB acquired lands and how they used taxpayers' monies to acquire the lands and how they charged for lands all over again despite being paid for previously by citizens the whole picture will become very clear that there is too much profiteering going on - citizens do not even understand this simple fact why doctors and nurses or staff are not at fault over the costs or high fees or over their wages. -
Well, you've always got to take the accounts of monkeys with a pinch of salt, eh?Originally posted by ndmmxiaomayi:I don't think there's a need to clarify. I've seen some doctors in hospitals who work two days straight without rest.
Afterall, I am supposed to believe affordable and effective public healthcare is non-existent despite evidence (or maybe I'm supposed to believe what the NHS provides is actually third world health service) to the contrary...
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Grow up kiddo...An arrogant ignoramus like you will not get far. Read the facts:Originally posted by walesa:Well, you've always got to take the accounts of monkeys with a pinch of salt, eh?
Afterall, I am supposed to believe affordable and effective public healthcare is non-existent despite evidence (or maybe I'm supposed to believe what the NHS provides is actually third world health service) to the contrary...
"People in Britain underestimate the time they would have to wait for an NHS operation, a survey suggests
The poll of 1,000 people, by TNS on behalf of Norwich Union Healthcare, showed most expect to wait five months for a hip operation.
Most wait nearer 11 months, independent medical researchers Dr Fosters said.
Patients also had unrealistic expectations for other operations and many said they did not know where to go to find out waiting times.
For knee surgery, the public were prepared to wait for three months and expected to wait for five months.
The actual wait for a knee replacement is a year, data from Dr Foster suggests...."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3749801.stm -
Originally posted by oxford mushroom:
So how are self-delusional monkeys like you preparing to come to terms with facts?
Grow up kiddo...An arrogant ignoramus like you will not get far. Read the facts:
"People in Britain underestimate the time they would have to wait for an NHS operation, a survey suggests
The poll of 1,000 people, by TNS on behalf of Norwich Union Healthcare, showed [b]most expect to wait five months for a hip operation.
Most wait nearer 11 months, independent medical researchers Dr Fosters said.
Patients also had unrealistic expectations for other operations and many said they did not know where to go to find out waiting times.
For knee surgery, the public were prepared to wait for three months and expected to wait for five months.
The actual wait for a knee replacement is a year, data from Dr Foster suggests...."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3749801.stm[/b]
Besides citing an outdated link (I'm sure news articles from May 2004 are very pertinent to the harsh realities in May 2007 indeed ) and ominously overlooking more recent (at least, more recent than May 2004) developments and news on improvements in waiting times at NHS institutions, I'm sure you've done a pretty good job at convincing eggprata (and others who aren't exactly living in self-denial) the A&E services offered by free NHS institutions is actually worse than your paid public healthcare offered by your masters.
I, too, am convinced nincompoops living in self-denial would actually find it more prudent to spend 7 hours at the A&E of a paid public healthcare than 4 hours at the A&E facility of a free public healthcare. -
What a joke! Shooting yourself in both feet?Originally posted by walesa:So how are self-delusional monkeys like you preparing to come to terms with facts?
Besides citing an outdated link (I'm sure news articles from May 2004 are very pertinent to the harsh realities in May 2007 indeed ) and ominously overlooking more recent (at least, more recent than May 2004) developments and news on improvements in waiting times at NHS institutions, I'm sure you've done a pretty good job at convincing eggprata (and others who aren't exactly living in self-denial) the A&E services offered by free NHS institutions is actually worse than your paid public healthcare offered by your masters.
I, too, am convinced nincompoops living in self-denial would actually find it more prudent to spend 7 hours at the A&E of a paid public healthcare than 4 hours at the A&E facility of a free public healthcare.
First, waiting times in the NHS have fallen because they have spent millions of pounds hiring more doctors like us. Second, the NHS is not free...if you earn above £100 a week (the 'earnings threshold') and up to £670 per week you pay 11 per cent of this amount as 'Class 1' NICs (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/Taxes/BeginnersGuideToTax/DG_4015904). Third, there is a waiting list for the first consultation to see a consultant, not even to talk about waiting list for the hip replacement. How long is the waiting list? Oh sure, it has fallen...only a third of patients now have to wait one year to see theor consultants. Great, isn't it?
In any case, imbeciles like you don't have to worry about long waits at A/E. We may be doctors but we aren't not God. There is no cure for the lack of a brain. -
You can check the NHS waiting times from its website (http://www.nhs.uk/england/aboutTheNHS/WaitingTimes/Search.aspx)...If I have a fall and injured my back..(a number of forumners here talk about prolapsed discs), how long will I have to wait to get the surgery I need?
Put in my area code and this is what I get:
"Inpatient waiting times for Spinal Injuries
The table below shows the waiting times for Inpatient appointments in Spinal Injuries within England.
The hospital trusts are sorted by distance from your postcode (nearest first). You can also sort by waiting time.
Some kinds of treatment (or specialties) are divided into more specialised areas, which are called sub-specialties.
Click on a trust to see its sub-specialties - if there are none you will see consultants' waiting times instead.
Trust Shortest wait (days) Longest wait (days)
Salisbury NHS Foundation Trust 124 124
The waiting time depends on which consultant you see. The chart shows the longest and shortest times for each trust.
Hospital and trusts
All hospitals are managed by NHS trusts, which are responsible for making sure that the hospitals provide high quality health care, and that they spend their money efficiently. Trusts often manage more than one hospital, and they can include other organisations such as health centres.
Note: this is for an injury....an urgent problem. If you have a chronic back problem, good luck to you! By the way, some services have been withdrawn and you cannot even find it. Try to look for hip replacement surgery elsewhere -
Not a bad attempt for a monkey to remain self-indulgent and delusional indeed.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:What a joke! Shooting yourself in both feet?
First, waiting times in the NHS have fallen because they have spent millions of pounds hiring more doctors like us. Second, the NHS is not free...if you earn above £100 a week (the 'earnings threshold') and up to £670 per week you pay 11 per cent of this amount as 'Class 1' NICs (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/Taxes/BeginnersGuideToTax/DG_4015904). Third, there is a waiting list for the first consultation to see a consultant, not even to talk about waiting list for the hip replacement. How long is the waiting list? Oh sure, it has fallen...only a third of patients now have to wait one year to see theor consultants. Great, isn't it?
In any case, imbeciles like you don't have to worry about long waits at A/E. We may be doctors but we aren't not God. There is no cure for the lack of a brain.
Firstly, while the argument is indeed admirable for a monkey, it's not hard to overlook the fact that waiting times have indeed been reduced between May 2004 and February 2006, is it? While, given your sycophantic tendencies, it's probably hard for you to come to terms with the fact that the waiting times at NHS institutions today aren't anything close to the May 2004 figures cited, it must be even harder for gnomes to accept that waiting times have indeed been reduced - even if that's a result of an increase in hiring more doctors. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
Secondly, so how does paying your National Insurance render NHS "not free"? While the NIC provides an avenue of tax for the government to fund its NHS program, there's nothing that precludes one from seeking treatment whose value outweighs what one pays for NIC, is there? I don't suppose a monkey could distinguish taxation from healthcare, eh? To convolute the picture (and safeguard your argument) further, why not go further and make a case of how socially irresponsible it must be for the NIC - along with the other taxes and duties - to be funding the dole and other social benefits?
Then again, why should I be surprised sycophants would regard it a better deal to pay for your paid public healthcare through Medisave (which provides medical coverage to a level you can afford) than paying for National Insurance (a scheme which exempts the unemployed and low-income earners from paying, but still offers the same extensive medical coverage that is the NHS) which offers extensive and free medical care through the NHS.
Thirdly, for all the ills and inadequacies within the NHS (which no one ever claims to be perfect), it must be a paradise to have access to a paid healthcare whose emergency department delivers timely responses within 7 hours, eh? I'm sure someone down with severe stroke or other cardiac issues would welcome these facilities over one which doesn't charge at the point of delivery and respond in under 7 hours.
Given your specious - albeit foolishly courageous - polemics, I'd be amazed that you have got anything that remotely resembles a brain (much less one that functions). -
Originally posted by oxford mushroom:
Sure, and I see a delusional monkey conveniently overlooking the fact that someone who has suffered a severe stroke would actually have his interest worse served by accessing the paid public healthcare whose A&E's waiting times actually outlast that of the A&E of a free public healthcare institution's...
You can check the NHS waiting times from its website (http://www.nhs.uk/england/aboutTheNHS/WaitingTimes/Search.aspx)...If I have a fall and injured my back..(a number of forumners here talk about prolapsed discs), how long will I have to wait to get the surgery I need?
Put in my area code and this is what I get:
"Inpatient waiting times for Spinal Injuries
The table below shows the waiting times for Inpatient appointments in Spinal Injuries within England.
The hospital trusts are sorted by distance from your postcode (nearest first). You can also sort by waiting time.
Some kinds of treatment (or specialties) are divided into more specialised areas, which are called sub-specialties.
Click on a trust to see its sub-specialties - if there are none you will see consultants' waiting times instead.
Trust Shortest wait (days) Longest wait (days)
Salisbury NHS Foundation Trust [b]124 124
The waiting time depends on which consultant you see. The chart shows the longest and shortest times for each trust.
Hospital and trusts
All hospitals are managed by NHS trusts, which are responsible for making sure that the hospitals provide high quality health care, and that they spend their money efficiently. Trusts often manage more than one hospital, and they can include other organisations such as health centres.
Note: this is for an injury....an urgent problem. If you have a chronic back problem, good luck to you! By the way, some services have been withdrawn and you cannot even find it. Try to look for hip replacement surgery elsewhere [/b] -
Where's your evidence? Waiting times at A&E are lengthened by folks like eggprata whose injury is not at all life threatening. A GP would have been able to deal with it. Those with life threatening conditions will be able to jump queue and get treated first. Kengsters trying to get MC and those with minor ailments can afford to wait.Originally posted by walesa:Sure, and I see a delusional monkey conveniently overlooking the fact that someone who has suffered a severe stroke would actually have his interest worse served by accessing the paid public healthcare whose A&E's waiting times actually outlast that of the A&E of a free public healthcare institution's...
As for you, you don't have a brain, so it does not matter whether or not you get a stroke -
Brilliant stuff from a self-disguised NHS staff with the intellect of a monkey indeed.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Where's your evidence? Waiting times at A&E are lengthened by folks like eggprata whose injury is not at all life threatening. A GP would have been able to deal with it. Those with life threatening conditions will be able to jump queue and get treated first. Kengsters trying to get MC and those with minor ailments can afford to wait.
As for you, you don't have a brain, so it does not matter whether or not you get a stroke Nothing more to harp about NHS being "not free", eh? Why not advance your case on how even the "dole" isn't free, since it's funded by the NIC?
Evidence? If you'd been following this thread from the start, you should have little trouble missing bic_cherry's post on the third page, eh? Then again, how could I not understand sycophants - in their over-zealous attempts to extol the virtues of their masters - have a knack of overlooking such unfavourable facts.
I'm sure a gazelle would love to have a brain like yours - or has it already got one? -
Originally posted by walesa:
You must have failed your English Comprehension. Seeing that you are severely challenged linguistically, may I point out that the wait of the patient was not due to any lack of attention by A/E doctors but due to the lack of hospital beds. If there are no beds available, they aren't available.
Brilliant stuff from a self-disguised NHS staff with the intellect of a monkey indeed. Nothing more to harp about NHS being "not free", eh? Why not advance your case on how even the "dole" isn't free, since it's funded by the NIC?
Evidence? If you'd been following this thread from the start, you should have little trouble missing [b]bic_cherry's post on the third page, eh? Then again, how could I not understand sycophants - in their over-zealous attempts to extol the virtues of their masters - have a knack of overlooking such unfavourable facts.
I'm sure a gazelle would love to have a brain like yours - or has it already got one?
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The NHS is definitely not free. It is paid for by a heavy taxation and national insurance payments. In contrast, Singaporeans pay too little for public hospitals and polyclinics, resulting in the long waiting times. The Minister is right to bring in means testing: force those who can afford it to seek treatment in the private sector. We have a problem of distribution: too many patients in the public sector whilst too many doctors leave for the more lucrative private sector. Simple mismatch of demand and supply.
If losers like you will pay more taxes, we would be able to build more hospitals and hire more doctors. -
I'm amazed you could even string a sentence in English, much less understand one!Originally posted by oxford mushroom:You must have failed your English Comprehension. Seeing that you are severely challenged linguistically, may I point out that the wait of the patient was not due to any lack of attention by A/E doctors but due to the lack of hospital beds. If there are no beds available, they aren't available.
In your over-zealous and stoic defence of this regime, I see you've conveniently - or perhaps, through your limited intellect, been unable to comprehend - omitted something which has nothing to do with beds.
It isn't free to whom? The consumer? So is your warped intellect actually telling you patients are required to pay at the point of seeking treatment at a NHS institution?When we checked on him in the observation area, he was in a serious state. He was having fits and barely conscious, and his mouth was; foaming. No one attended to him.
It was only when we cried that a patient service officer quickly picked up my dad's file and called for someone to push him away. . When my dad finally got to the ward, it was past 2am. And we had arrived at the A&E department about 7pm; it took more than six hours before my dad was seen by a neurologist.
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I suppose your command of English doesn't permit you to comprehend the fact no one attended to a stroke patient until attention was called for and that it actually took 6 hours before the patient was attended to by a neurologist has nothing to do with the dearth of beds, eh?
[quote]Originally posted by oxford mushroom:The NHS is definitely not free. It is paid for by a heavy taxation and national insurance payments. In contrast, Singaporeans pay too little for public hospitals and polyclinics, resulting in the long waiting times. The Minister is right to bring in means testing: force those who can afford it to seek treatment in the private sector. We have a problem of distribution: too many patients in the public sector whilst too many doctors leave for the more lucrative private sector. Simple mismatch of demand and supply.
If losers like you will pay more taxes, we would be able to build more hospitals and hire more doctors.
I see, in your desperate attempt to defend this regime's deceptively generous taxation, you've resorted to conveniently lump the British tax system with the inadequacies of its social policies, while failing to consider the wonderful deal you must be getting for the taxes you pay in a fascist regime. Is that all "ignoramuses" like you can come up with? Not bad for a loser, really.
For all your grand rhetoric and tireless endeavour in presenting (outdated) "facts" in highlighting the inadequacies of the NHS, I'm still awaiting something more concrete than senseless drivel to suggest this regime has actually channelled an adequate portion of public funds to its spendings on healthcare.
Afterall, I'm sure it says a lot about a regime - and its sycophants - that spends SGD2.28 billion on healthcare for a population of 4 million, compared to Labour spending £104 billion (or SGD312 billion) on NHS that covers a population of 60 million, doesn't it? In your stoic defence, I suppose we ought to believe the British taxmen actually collect 130 times more taxes than Singapore, which helps to explain the "too little" efficient services provided by public hospitals.
On the basis of such a precedence, what's there to actually suggest, should taxes be increased, you're going to get more hospitals and doctors, instead of a ruling elite writing a bigger paycheck and selling more spin?
That said, I'm pretty sure this regime still has a lot to be proud of - for a start, brainless cronies oblivious to the harsh realities of life are more than welcomed. -
Dude,you think i've got nothing better to do in life than to go to A & E,wait for 7 long hours before i get stitches.And before going to A & E,i had gone to my private GP,not polyclinic.He sent me to polyclinic as he did not have the stitches.So i went to polyclinic,doc said foot was badly swollen and he highly suspected a fracture and said i needed a xray.That was the main reason why i got sent to A & E.So,i made the mistake of not thinking twice and went to our beloved SGH.And thanks to polyclinic,they had done some minor dressing.
Where's your evidence? Waiting times at A&E are lengthened by folks like eggprata whose injury is not at all life threatening. A GP would have been able to deal with it. Those with life threatening conditions will be able to jump queue and get treated first. Kengsters trying to get MC and those with minor ailments can afford to wait.
As for you, you don't have a brain, so it does not matter whether or not you get a stroke
But i go in SGH,with bleeding still occuring but little,they tell me wait there till a doc comes.And only 1 doctor on duty? Thats absurd isn't it.Ok,so why don't polyclinic get xray facilities? Wouldn't that be better? Save time like you say?
Can't you face the cold hard truth? While waiting for the specialist to see me,there was a man whose whole right leg was bleeding,again not so much,and the nurses/doctors didn't even offer him minor dressing.His son had to get tissues and clean the blood.
To say our taxes are low? Look around you -
I say whoever's in charge of SGH and the minister for Health outght to be FIRED!!!Originally posted by eggprata:Dude,you think i've got nothing better to do in life than to go to A & E,wait for 7 long hours before i get stitches.And before going to A & E,i had gone to my private GP,not polyclinic.He sent me to polyclinic as he did not have the stitches.So i went to polyclinic,doc said foot was badly swollen and he highly suspected a fracture and said i needed a xray.That was the main reason why i got sent to A & E.So,i made the mistake of not thinking twice and went to our beloved SGH.And thanks to polyclinic,they had done some minor dressing.
But i go in SGH,with bleeding still occuring but little,they tell me wait there till a doc comes.And only 1 doctor on duty? Thats absurd isn't it.Ok,so why don't polyclinic get xray facilities? Wouldn't that be better? Save time like you say?
Can't you face the cold hard truth? While waiting for the specialist to see me,there was a man whose whole right leg was bleeding,again not so much,and the nurses/doctors didn't even offer him minor dressing.His son had to get tissues and clean the blood.
To say our taxes are low? Look around you -
The worst part about the whole sorry scenario here is, that they KEEP increasing fees in every direction reasoning cost of operation has gone up, but the general service standards are ALWAYS lacklustre! It's like pedalling against the current in a canoe!!!
To the Gov.:
For the sake of the PEOPLE, please show us the GOODS for the price you have been asking for, and are still demanind for! Justify your demands, damn it!
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The waiting time must have increased exponentially since you started work.Originally posted by oxford mushroom:What a joke! Shooting yourself in both feet?
First, waiting times in the NHS have fallen because they have spent millions of pounds hiring more doctors like us. Second, the NHS is not free...if you earn above £100 a week (the 'earnings threshold') and up to £670 per week you pay 11 per cent of this amount as 'Class 1' NICs (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/Taxes/BeginnersGuideToTax/DG_4015904). Third, there is a waiting list for the first consultation to see a consultant, not even to talk about waiting list for the hip replacement. How long is the waiting list? Oh sure, it has fallen...only a third of patients now have to wait one year to see theor consultants. Great, isn't it?
In any case, imbeciles like you don't have to worry about long waits at A/E. We may be doctors but we aren't not God. There is no cure for the lack of a brain.