How does SAF match up against other REGIONAL armed forces?
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actually i saw the ADJ regarding this information.Now the problem is should i believe it cos i dun really trust their information given compare to JANES.I dun understand these informations janes is normally the 1st to release these information it is really suspicion y ADJ receive these news
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Because OTO Melara 76 mm is already used by all the newer naval ships in RSN. Thus it makes sense to use a common platform, common ammunition. Furthermore, the French 100mm gun does not provide much more benefit than the 76mm gun. If RSN want a bigger and longer range gun, they use choose the US United Defence 5", 62 calibre, Mk 45 Mod 4 naval gun. The new Mk 45 Mod 4 provides Naval Surface Fire Support (NSFS) range of more than 21 nautical miles (37 km) using the Navy's new 5-inch Cargo projectile, the Improved Conventional Munition and an improved propelling charge for all- weather, day/night mission support. It will also provide a over- the-horizon NSFS range of more than 60 nautical miles (120 km) with the near- term integration of the 5-inch Extended Range Guided Munition (ERGM) and propelling charge.Originally posted by Orcishwarrior:Regarding the main gun why must it be oto melara y not the france
main gun??
The gun mount is also redesigned with stealth features. -
From the very limited descriptions of RSN La Fayatte frigates, I think they would most likely end up being looking like the DCN C1800 Frigate (which is in fact a scale-down version of La Fayette). The specs looks suspiciously close (down to the number of crews to man the ship, 60 - exactly what Mindef said), to the limited news available today except for the length of the ship.
But from all available account, these ships will really kick butts!!!
Beware and be warned! -
From the very limited descriptions of RSN La Fayatte frigates, I think they would most likely end up being looking like the DCN C1800 Frigate (which is in fact a scale-down version of La Fayette). The specs looks suspiciously close (down to the number of crews to man the ship, 60 - exactly what Mindef said), to the limited news available today except for the length of the ship.
But from all available account, these ships will really kick butts!!!
Beware and be warned!
Oops, the DCN website for those who are interested:
http://www.dcnintl.com/fiches/fich43b.htm -
nice ship
i especially think that the ASW suite will come in very handy as Sg is quite weak in this aspect at the moment and the region is moving towards either acquiring subs of their own or building up on ASW capabilities.
hee... but it does seem like a colossal mismatch when RSN has an internal exercise and uses these ships to hunt the sjoormen
the writing's on the wall... we need new subs!
won't be putting my money on the scorpene though... not a good idea over-rely on one supplier and not a good idea to buy something which your neighbours already knows inside out... anybody got any thoughts about what subs RSN should get? -
Frankly, I m surprised dat most pple outside the organisation r actually curious abt our naval hardware.Originally posted by CX:nice ship
i especially think that the ASW suite will come in very handy as Sg is quite weak in this aspect at the moment and the region is moving towards either acquiring subs of their own or building up on ASW capabilities.
hee... but it does seem like a colossal mismatch when RSN has an internal exercise and uses these ships to hunt the sjoormen the writing's on the wall... we need new subs!
won't be putting my money on the scorpene though... not a good idea over-rely on one supplier and not a good idea to buy something which your neighbours already knows inside out... anybody got any thoughts about what subs RSN should get? -
Well RSN can still consider Scopene+AIP given Scopene subs are actual tailored to the customer's needs. RSN version can be different in sonar fit, combat system, different topedoes, etc.Originally posted by CX:nice ship
won't be putting my money on the scorpene though... not a good idea over-rely on one supplier and not a good idea to buy something which your neighbours already knows inside out... anybody got any thoughts about what subs RSN should get?
I also think that with a Soojorman purchase, my money in on a new Swedish (Kockum)/German (HDW) sub, either a modified A19 type or a modified German Type 212 (U212). Israeli's Dolphin class is not bad too... -
i would put my money on a kilo class SSK
reputed to be to the quietest SSK in the world...hard to detect...
but kinda big for our waters...hahahahaha -
Designation Project 877 Paltus
Kilo Project 636
Designer Rubin Rubin
Builder Admiralty Shipyard (Sudomekh),
Shipyard 199, Nizhniy Novgorod
[completed at Sevmashpredpriyatiye, Severodvinsnk]
Shipyard 112, Komsolol'sk-na-Amur Admiralty Shipyard
Displacement (tons) 2,300-2,325 tons Surfaced
3,076-3,950 tons Full load submerged 2,350 tons Surfaced
3,126-4,000 tons Full load submerged
Speed (kts): 10-12 knots Surfaced
17-25 knots Submerge 11 knots Surfaced
20 knots Submerged
Dimensions (m): 70.0-72.6 meters long
9.9 meters beam
6.2-6.5 meters draft 72.6-73.8 meters long
9.9 meters beam
6.3-6.5 meters draft
Propulsion: diesel and electric motors
2 x 1000 kW Diesel generators
1 x 5,500-6,800 shp Propulsion motor
1 x 7-blade [? or 6-blade] fixed-pitch Propeller
diesel and electric motors
Diving depth: 240 meters Operational
300 meters Maximum 250 meters Operational
300 meters Maximum
17.5 meters Periscope
Endurance: 6,000 miles With snorkel (@ 7 knots)
400 miles Submerged (@ 3 knots)
12.7 miles At full run (@ 21 knots)
45 days Sea Endurance 7,500 miles With snorkel (@ 7 knots)
400 miles Submerged (@ 3 knots)
?? miles At full run (@ 20 knots)
45 days Sea Endurance
Armament:
Missiles: 8 Strela-3 (SA-N-8 Gremlin) or
8 Igla (SA-N-10 Gimlet)
8 Strela-3 (SA-N-8 Gremlin) or
8 Igla (SA-N-10 Gimlet)
Torpedoes: 6/533 mm Torpedoe Tubes
18 VA-111 (w: c/nucl) Torpedoes or
24 mines
6/533 mm Torpedoe Tubes
18 VA-111 Torpedoes or
24 mines
Systems: radio communications
combat control information system
navigation system
1 MRK-50 (Snoop Tray-2)general purpose detection radar
MGK-400 Rubikon (Shark Teeth) active/passive Sonar
2 Periscopes
[one for commander, one for air defence]
radio communications
combat control information system
navigation system
1 MRK-50E (Snoop Tray-2) general purpose detection radar
1 MGK-400EM Rubikon (Shark Teeth) active/passive Sonar
2 Periscopes
[one for commander, one for air defence]
[/code] -
Joe Black
, I think they would most likely end up being looking like the DCN C1800 Frigate (which is in fact a scale-down version of La Fayette). The specs looks suspiciously close (down to the number of crews to man the ship, 60 - exactly what Mindef said),
Don't think it will be C1800 ship
C1800 ship only 90 m. long and RSN ship ss 110 meter.
Its my understanding its easier to shorten a ship then to lenghten it.
Also as for the RSN next submarines according a Mat posting in another board , he say that Sg will geting mod. A19 boats
He also posted that France
FORCED Sg to buy MM40 
& Aster 15 missles.
For details go to :
http://pub165.ezboard.com/fwarships1discussionboardsfrm16.showMessage?topicID=767.topic
http://pub165.ezboard.com/fwarships1discussionboardsfrm16.showMessage?topicID=767.topic&index=3
[/quote] -
I tho RSN is collaborating with Swedish to develop a new type of stealth vessel. How come recently no more news?
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Initially Sg was trying to develop the stealth ship based on the Swedish Visby design. However, all of a sudden, Mindef decided to go the French way, ordering a scaled-down version of La Fayette instead. The actual reason for this change is never made public.Originally posted by Seant7:I tho RSN is collaborating with Swedish to develop a new type of stealth vessel. How come recently no more news?
I can only guess that there might be a disagreement of how much stealth technology the Swedish is willingly to provide Sg, system and weapon fit issues, cost or probably the associated risks.
However, I have also recently seen a pic of a computer model of ST Marine proposal of a stealth corvette of 85m in length with the standard FAC diseal engines hull type and the La Fayatte like superstructure. -
Actually I dare say that the new frigates will not be the new c1800 OPV. If any of you went to Asian Aerospace 2002, you would have seen 3 new models of the new RSN warships. One of them is and 80m OPV that looks like the Lafayette frigate which is probably a shortened version. The other is the Visby stealth corvette and the third is Italy's new generation stealth FAC. Being curious, i spoke to one of the ST engineers at the show. He mentioned that 80m craft is not the la fayette frigate. As for the swedish stealth platform it would probably be a version of the Visby. Hence, I see a new generation of ships being purchased. The 80 m opv to replace the MCV. And perhaps the Visby to replace the Fearless patrol vessels.Originally posted by thomasct:[b] -
To think you could believe what those mats on Warship1.com said. The only sensible one is Azhar. As for the Aster 15, I think that the purchase is almost a certainty. As for Aster 30, it would depend on the radar fitted on the frigates. If a 3D long range phased array radar is fixed like ARPAR is fixed then it would be a possibility. As for exocet, I suspect that it is just a cover name for something more interesting. Sea launched storm shadow? For a simple reason that RSN will not want to introduce an inferior missile to the harpoon on a new ship.Originally posted by thomasct:[b] -
You mean these?
Here's the read up:
Naval Vessel - 27m Stealth High Speed Interceptor
The 27m Stealth High Speed Interceptor has a very unique Vee-hull designed to provide optimal performance even in prolonged operations in rough sea conditions. The hull and superstructure of the 27m stealth High Speed Interceptor are constructed of a combination of marine grade aluminium plates, profiles and extruded panels. The structural rrangement features an innovative use of the extruded profiles on the exposed decks to provide a higher degree of flatness to achieve low RCS objectives.
Designed as a versatile, multi-purpose platform, the 27m Stealth High Speed Interceptor can
be configured for various missions ranging from light coastal patrol to littoral warfare. Its waterjet propulsion system provides excellent shallow water capacity and high maneuverability.
Depending on the selection of different propulsion specifications, the 27m Stealth High Speed Interceptor is capable of speeds in excess of 35 knots. It's basic configuration is two units of high speed diesel engines and two waterjets. -
Naval Vessel - 81m Stealth Offshore Patrol Vessel
The 81m Stealth Offshore Patrol Vessel (OPV) is designed as a multi-purpose platform to meet the varying needs of navies and coastguards. Designed for excellent performance including speed, fuel economy and sea-keeping capabilities, the 81m Stealth OPV is capable of sustained operation up to sea state 5. Its design includes a platform for landing and take-off operations for a range of helicopters up to 10 tonnes. The vessel is capable of speeds ranging from 23 to 30 knots depending on the propulsion configuration.
Besides low observable features incorporated in the stealth OPV, the vessel is also fitted with self-defence capabilities for enhanced survivability. Vital areas of the ship such as the major shipboard, navigation, communication and combat systems may also be hardened to withstand a certain degree of shock due to underwater explosions. Mechanical and electrical systems are arranged such that there is sufficient redundancy.
The stealth OPV is designed with a high degree of automation for low manning, including a ship control, monitoring and management system (SCMMS). The design also allows for unmanned engine room operations.
The vessel can be fitted with different combat systems for a range of capabilities from coastguard functions to protection against various threats including Anti-surface warfare (AsuW), anti-submarine warfare (ASW) as well as anti air-warfare (AAW). -
The models are NOT RSN ships .Originally posted by Matlaysia:If any of you went to Asian Aerospace 2002, you would have seen 3 new models of the new RSN warships.
They are ST models STILL looking for a launch customer.
NO - did not believed him that why I wrote in my post - "" Information source please or its all Cocktail Talk ??Originally posted by Matlaysia:To think you could believe what those mats on Warship1.com said. . -
Guys true or false it doesnt really bothers me when it comes to most of Singapore technology military hardware.Firstly i felt really annoyed when branco was rolled out or SAR21 was launched
.Can anyone tell me y singapore tech LOVE to derive stuff from other company idea cant they have mind of their own.Now(if these pics are true) see they copy DCN idea and design ,sometime i really desprise singapore technology for being incapable of making its product most of its product design original
they are making people think that we singaporean are running out of idea.
I think i finally understand st produces numerous military hardware but only few foreign countries actually acquire them
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i guess reason y RSN actually drop the idea of visby corvette is because of the fact that military officials wants singapore armed force to be a expeditionary force to fulfil this "expeditionary" stuff a larger ocean going ship is needed.
During the contender bidding
big name such as ingall a northrop grumman company is involve but the reason y DCNI won of course 1st is the price tag and secondly during that time la fayette frigate is the only combatant ship to have earn its reputation for being the 1st true stealth warship(dont start on sea shadow it is only an experimental ship)
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Speaking about aster 15 missile it is confirmed and the probablility of integrating aster 30 virtually zero,since all of u guys here know that aster 30 is a ballistic missile defense shield for the european
countries(i m referring to the present).
I thru storm shadow is still in development....can anyone update me on storn shadow sea launch version.thanks -
hello guys
comments to some of the posts
1. Sjoormen class effectiveness
Even though the challenger class subs are old, they still serve a rather useful purpose and no one knew about the details and extent of the refit program the subs have undergone. It may not be a mismatch as far as you think
Recently a RSN sub had an exercise with a CVBG in the south china sea. The exercise aims include to allow the USN experience in hunting SSK. For 3 days, the whole ASW array of the CVBG was employed within the defined exercise area and yet the SSK could not be found. The SSK however penetrated the defence and was judged to have sunk the carrier.
2. Visby
It could be that the singapore - swedish program was actually to design a MCV replacement. It is plausible as the current known ORBAT has 12 missile craft. It is only logical that when the frigate program is completed, the time would ha ve come to consider the MCV replacements as the MCV would have been 20 years old already
3. NGFS and Frigate fit
I question the authenticity of the ADJ article. It is a malaysian publication and there is a distinct slant in their coverage towards the RMAF. Regarding the exocet mk2 fit, I am curious if true about the choice. It will make better sense from a logistical point of view to adopt a harpoon variant. The capabilities of the harpoon variants are not neccessarily inferior to the exocet. I am hoping for a minimum 100mm calibre on the frigate. Logistically it might make sense to adopt a common gun mount but then for the sake of improve capability, the logistic difficulties should be tolerated. -
One thing ..... I bet my life it would never ever be the KILO class for the sub program
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Originally posted by thomasct:
Sorry I jumped the gun prematurely. As for the potential ST ships, what I meant is that if the OPV has already been designed similar to the C1800, it is highly unlikely that the frigates will be based on the C1800
NO - did not believed him that why I wrote in my post - [b]"" Information source please or its all Cocktail Talk ??
[/b] -
err, i don't doubt your info solaris, but err, which exercise was it that the SG sub 'sank' the carrier after evading its escorts?
sorry if i seem ignorant about this info. . ., but never heard it before -
Funny I've never heard of such an exercise too...
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The RSN and the RSAF I believe conduct exercises with forces on transit on a fairly routine basis. Such series of exercises are known as PASSEX or passage exercises and are not announced publicly. I believe many of you would have known people in service and you can validate the existence of such exercises with them. If you are aquainted with any submariner, do ask them.Originally posted by Shotgun:Funny I've never heard of such an exercise too...
I do not think there is a security breach by me saying the result. Please advice me if you think this result breach milsec.