Singapore Is No Role Model
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how come you so certain SDP must be corrupted?Originally posted by BusSpeeder:if worker's party was to take hold when PAP goes down, its quite supportive. but to some corrupted parties like SDP, we would face hardship with their upbringing of the government.
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well i dunno, it would seem too early really to assume Chee is too corrupted? becuz he doesn't have anything at the moment.. money? hes bankrupt..power? SDP didn't even won a seat.. looks more to me currently he has more to lose than to gain for now. if we will to think that Chee would suddenly garner enuff votes to ouster pap in the next election, that is impossible, but he will no doubt have played a crucial part if more opposition parties win votes in the next election, we won;t really know if Chee is really corrupted unless he has already achieved the status of the power and means which would make him potentially corruptable.. until then i reserve judgment.Originally posted by BusSpeeder:hmmm, you do have a point there. but the truth is, chee soon juan is too corrupted, he wants to gain. he is trying to turn singapore to like what some other countries are right now in present like taiwan or china. chee siok chin is TRYING TO help her brother to most like achieve that target. -
well i dunno, it would seem too early really to assume Chee is too corrupted? becuz he doesn't have anything at the moment.. money? hes bankrupt..power? SDP didn't even won a seat.. looks more to me currently he has more to lose than to gain for now. if we will to think that Chee would suddenly garner enuff votes to ouster pap in the next election, that is impossible, but he will no doubt have played a crucial part if more opposition parties win votes in the next election, we won;t really know if Chee is really corrupted unless he has already achieved the status of the power and means which would make him potentially corruptable.. until then i reserve judgment.Originally posted by BusSpeeder:hmmm, you do have a point there. but the truth is, chee soon juan is too corrupted, he wants to gain. he is trying to turn singapore to like what some other countries are right now in present like taiwan or china. chee siok chin is TRYING TO help her brother to most like achieve that target. -
no need come back liao
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When the KMT was in power, it was busy planning for the return to the Motherland, and retake the Mainland China from the Communist Party.Originally posted by crazyazn:
A good article , unfortunately the SDP's Chee Siok Chin does not realize that Taiwan under the KMT rule was not quite different than that of the PAP's rule, MYJ is no different from LHL or GCT only interested in KMT being in Power not the country. [/quote]
Why should it be unfortunate for SDP Chee Siok Chin to remind Taiwanese not to have Ma to use Singapore as a ''Role Model'' ?
You just hit the nail on the head by remembering that ''the KMT rule was not quite different than that of the PAP's rule'' - so for Ma to voice out that ''Singapore will be a good Role Model' for Taiwan, will this not be regressive for the Taiwanese ?
It is fortunate that Taiwan had SDP Chee Siok Ching bringing this to their attention.
[quote]
Newspapers, magazines, TV and radio networks are owned by the state.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly same during the KMT's Totalitarian rule.
You see, as they the KMT have had a slight majority in the Legislative Yuan, The Pan Blues could have done a lot to help improve the lives here of the Taiwanese, but, they spent the last 7 years, blocking every Bill in the LY and worst of all t, they did not come up with any good alternative plan. The KMT - Quite useless.
All the energy in economics and politics was directed at building a strong and competent Military to perform this task; and the Citizens in the provincial island of Taiwan made large sacrifices in their consumer needs.
The KMT rule is no different from the Communist Party or even Singapore'S PAP - in that all had power emanating from a Single Personality, and the Personality Cult exist in different intensity in all these countries.
All had central planners in driving the economic and political plans for the respective countries, while Singapore was supposedly market driven, both China and Taiwan remained at Civil War; and all economic and political activities are geared towards confrontation.
Try advocating the same kind of politics in Singapore, and work towards an alternative shadow government to that of the PAP, and you will find yourself under pressure from every Government Departments as well as visits from the Internal Security Department.
Taiwanese in China are proud of themselves in every other areas except democracy, and never advocate that kind of democracy for China----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Only a ignorant person believes that. If they even tried to promote and form of Govt not in line with CCP Policy, they would be thrown in jail without trial. !!!
There is no CHINA Today, There is the PRC and there is the ROC.
Taiwan and Taiwanses are an integral part of China, just as Vietnam was rulled for more then 1000 years under Imperial China, and during the entire 1000 years there have been repeated insurrections to break away from the Emperor's grip.
Like Vietnam, Hainan and Yunan could have broken away too, but were easily brought in line.
Taiwan is no different as a valid province of China, as otherwise how could the KMT retreat to Taiwan Island and simply take over a ''foreign land'' that happened to be adjacent to the Mainland China's shore line ? -
with its leader, who is corrupted. ok, i focus on the corrupted chee soon juan, see what the things he has done, to show others about the ruling of singapore by PAP. though of course (i think) he should be proud of singapore, looks at these informations. From Wikipedia:Originally posted by Ito_^:how come you so certain SDP must be corrupted? Civil disobedience at Annual Meetings of IMF and World Bank
though he was right in being complaining about rising incomes, and the hardship of the working people. he was being complacent about what he's doing and insisting on protesting and podcasting until PAP give up, but although he failed. he and his sister keep going on to complain, until PAP fall. SDP is ruled by him and his sister, but don't you all think he is overdoing it? their corruptability is very high, they will corrupt SDP.
On August 22, 2006, Chee announced that he is planning to hold rallies and marches in Singapore during 61st Annual Meetings of the Boards of Governors of the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank Group as part of Singapore 2006 in September 2006 to protest against the rising income gap and raise awareness of the hardship of working-class people in the country. The police application for the protest was rejected on 30 August 2006. Nonetheless, Chee, in the SDP website, continues to urge people to participate in the protest.
On September 9, 2006, Chee started to alert the public to the planned "Empower Singaporeans Rally and March" on September 16, 2006 by distributing leaflets but was stopped by the police to do so. The police then reminded the public that anyone participating in Chee's planned rally and march would be committing an offence.
On September 13, 2006, Chee invited both Mr Paul Wolfowitz, President of World Bank and Mr Rodrigo de Rato y Figaredo, Managing Director of the International Monetary Fund, to his planned rally on September 16, 2006. At a press conference the next day, Chee announced that his application to be a civil society representative to Singapore 2006 as a representative of the Open Singapore Centre, was rejected by the IMF/World Bank. His sister and party's member Chee Siok Chin's application to represent the Alliance for Reform & Democracy in Asia, was approved by the IMF/World Bank but was rejected by the Singapore government.On September 15, 2006, Chee released a podcast that warned Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong that the Singapore 2006 event was a "public relations disaster" for Singapore.
On September 16, 2006, Chee started off the "Empower Singaporeans Rally and March" at 1100 at the Speakers' Corner, Hong Lim Park but was stopped by the police when he started his march. As the police had formed a human barricade to stop him whenever he resumed his march, Chee announced at 1730 that there would be a rally the following day in front of the Parliament House. Nevertheless, Chee was stopped from leaving the park unless he agrees to stop the protest immediately. Left with no choice, he stayed at the park with his party's members and supporters.
On September 17, 2006, Chee announced his plan to continue the protest by remaining at the park until the start of the IMF-World Bank meetings two days away. On September 18, 2006, after hours of negotiations with police, Chee went to Raffles City to hand out pamphlets to the public and he returned to the park. Chee stopped his protest accordingly at noon on September 19 and he concluded that his protest had achieved its purpose. Chee further announced that the just concluded 72-hour protest was only a start. Chee mentioned that for the next few months, more activists would be recruited and trained, and more activities would be organized for the campaign to bring pressure on the Singapore Government to reform. -
okok, don't have to double post. but read this about what he did in 1993.Originally posted by 4getmenot:well i dunno, it would seem too early really to assume Chee is too corrupted? becuz he doesn't have anything at the moment.. money? hes bankrupt..power? SDP didn't even won a seat.. looks more to me currently he has more to lose than to gain for now. if we will to think that Chee would suddenly garner enuff votes to ouster pap in the next election, that is impossible, but he will no doubt have played a crucial part if more opposition parties win votes in the next election, we won;t really know if Chee is really corrupted unless he has already achieved the status of the power and means which would make him potentially corruptable.. until then i reserve judgment.NUS firing and hunger strike
in this case he misused research funds for his own use. read the meaning of misappropriation.
In 1993, a few months after Chee joined the SDP, he was sacked by NUS for alleged misappropriation of research funds. In protest he staged a multi-day hunger strike during which he consumed only water mixed with glucose.In law, misappropriation is the intentional, illegal use of the property or funds of another person for one's own use or other unauthorized purpose, particularly by a public official, a trustee of a trust, an executor or administrator of a dead person's estate or by any person with a responsibility to care for and protect another's assets (a fiduciary duty). It is a felony, a crime punishable by a prison sentence.
it is punishable by crime.
by the crimes he did, do you think he's corrupted now? -
with its leader, who is corrupted. ok, i focus on the corrupted chee soon juan, see what the things he has done, to show others about the ruling of singapore by PAP. though of course (i think) he should be proud of singapore, looks at these informations. From Wikipedia:
er.. since when has defiance amounts to corruption..?
quote:
Civil disobedience at Annual Meetings of IMF and World Bank
On August 22, 2006, Chee announced that he is planning to hold rallies and marches in Singapore during 61st Annual Meetings of the Boards of Governors of the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank Group as part of Singapore 2006 in September 2006 to protest against the rising income gap and raise awareness of the hardship of working-class people in the country. The police application for the protest was rejected on 30 August 2006. Nonetheless, Chee, in the SDP website, continues to urge people to participate in the protest.
On September 9, 2006, Chee started to alert the public to the planned "Empower Singaporeans Rally and March" on September 16, 2006 by distributing leaflets but was stopped by the police to do so. The police then reminded the public that anyone participating in Chee's planned rally and march would be committing an offence.
On September 13, 2006, Chee invited both Mr Paul Wolfowitz, President of World Bank and Mr Rodrigo de Rato y Figaredo, Managing Director of the International Monetary Fund, to his planned rally on September 16, 2006. At a press conference the next day, Chee announced that his application to be a civil society representative to Singapore 2006 as a representative of the Open Singapore Centre, was rejected by the IMF/World Bank. His sister and party's member Chee Siok Chin's application to represent the Alliance for Reform & Democracy in Asia, was approved by the IMF/World Bank but was rejected by the Singapore government.On September 15, 2006, Chee released a podcast that warned Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong that the Singapore 2006 event was a "public relations disaster" for Singapore.
On September 16, 2006, Chee started off the "Empower Singaporeans Rally and March" at 1100 at the Speakers' Corner, Hong Lim Park but was stopped by the police when he started his march. As the police had formed a human barricade to stop him whenever he resumed his march, Chee announced at 1730 that there would be a rally the following day in front of the Parliament House. Nevertheless, Chee was stopped from leaving the park unless he agrees to stop the protest immediately. Left with no choice, he stayed at the park with his party's members and supporters.
On September 17, 2006, Chee announced his plan to continue the protest by remaining at the park until the start of the IMF-World Bank meetings two days away. On September 18, 2006, after hours of negotiations with police, Chee went to Raffles City to hand out pamphlets to the public and he returned to the park. Chee stopped his protest accordingly at noon on September 19 and he concluded that his protest had achieved its purpose. Chee further announced that the just concluded 72-hour protest was only a start. Chee mentioned that for the next few months, more activists would be recruited and trained, and more activities would be organized for the campaign to bring pressure on the Singapore Government to reform.
though he was right in being complaining about rising incomes, and the hardship of the working people. he was being complacent about what he's doing and insisting on protesting and podcasting until PAP give up, but although he failed. he and his sister keep going on to complain, until PAP fall. SDP is ruled by him and his sister, but don't you all think he is overdoing it? their corruptability is very high, they will corrupt SDP. -
Originally posted by BusSpeeder:though he was right in being complaining about rising incomes, and the hardship of the working people. he was being complacent about what he's doing and insisting on protesting and podcasting until PAP give up, but although he failed. he and his sister keep going on to complain, until PAP fall. SDP is ruled by him and his sister, but don't you all think he is overdoing it? their corruptability is very high, they will corrupt SDP. dats not called corruption la.
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well i have no arguments against his misappropriation of the reseach funds..by the way, how much funds did he misappropriated by the way?
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wasn't statedOriginally posted by 4getmenot:well i have no arguments against his misappropriation of the reseach funds..by the way, how much funds did he misappropriated by the way? -
The amount was apparently just to courier(aka DLH/FedEX/UPS etc) a set of papers to the UK or somethin for his wife. Wonder how much is that.Originally posted by 4getmenot:well i have no arguments against his misappropriation of the reseach funds..by the way, how much funds did he misappropriated by the way?
Even the case is dubious at best, as his wife was working for him at that time, I wonder if it was even misappropriated. As Dubious as the convictions on JBJ. -
Correct. His wife was part of his research team. So the issue of misuse of funds is small, and maybe even wrongly accused.Originally posted by Jontst78:The amount was apparently just to courier(aka DLH/FedEX/UPS etc) a set of papers to the UK or somethin for his wife. Wonder how much is that.
Even the case is dubious at best, as his wife was working for him at that time, I wonder if it was even misappropriated. As Dubious as the convictions on JBJ. -
She is just speaking the mind of many Singaporeans and her focus is on PAP. Even she doesnÂ’t write an article to Taipei Times, the foreign media, western media have long time ago started to write about the way/style of PAPÂ’s way of running the country. Our ruling party is so well known for their way of leadership, that is why the western media never hesitate to speak the truth about them. I donÂ’t consider her article a big hoo-ha!!
Ruo yao ren bu zhi, chu fei ji mo wei!!! -
Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Is pride important when the house is burning and you pretend it isn't and just let it burn out of pride?
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Originally posted by Jontst78:
The amount was for SGD200 - as stated by CSJ to Asiaweek.
The amount was apparently just to courier(aka DLH/FedEX/UPS etc) a set of papers to the UK or somethin for his wife. Wonder how much is that.
Even the case is dubious at best, as his wife was working for him at that time, I wonder if it was even misappropriated. As Dubious as the convictions on JBJ.
The case is as dubious as the behaviour of CSJ's detractors as detailed in CSJ's counter arguments to the accusations made.
It is not surprising that so much publicity is given to all Government statements that persist in a common theme of deriding CSJ, but no publicity is given to any of CSJ. -
agreed. chee siok chin is just trying to bring down the reputation of PAP. When PAP goes down(unlikely to happen), news will spread across the media, don't she will think that Singapore's reputation goes down? she doesn't care that? if she don't means she's not loyal to singapore.Originally posted by rane:She is just speaking the mind of many Singaporeans and her focus is on PAP. Even she doesnÂ’t write an article to Taipei Times, the foreign media, western media have long time ago started to write about the way/style of PAPÂ’s way of running the country. Our ruling party is so well known for their way of leadership, that is why the western media never hesitate to speak the truth about them. I donÂ’t consider her article a big hoo-ha!!
Ruo yao ren bu zhi, chu fei ji mo wei!!! -
If Singapore's reputation goes down, its citizens deserve it. They reap what they sow.Originally posted by BusSpeeder:agreed. chee siok chin is just trying to bring down the reputation of PAP. When PAP goes down(unlikely to happen), news will spread across the media, don't she will think that Singapore's reputation goes down? she doesn't care that? if she don't means she's not loyal to singapore. -
This sounds like you are either not from singapore or just an ignorant person who is not loyal to singapore. Why do Singapore's citizens deserve it if our reputation goes down, are you wishing that Singapore's reputation goes down in the many eyes of the world. What you are saying proves that you are not even a Singapore since you yearned that Singapore's reputation goes down. The citizens DO NOT reap what they sow because NOT ALL ARE FULLY SUPPORTIVE OF PAP but instead there are quite a number who supports WP AND SDA. Not SDP, seems like you don't know Singapore well.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:If Singapore's reputation goes down, its citizens deserve it. They reap what they sow. -
I don't care about loyalty. I despise stupid people. Simple as that. If people in SIngapore really care about its reputation, they would do something about it. BUt no, they don't. So the price to be paid shall be paid.Originally posted by BusSpeeder:This sounds like you are either not from singapore or just an ignorant person who is not loyal to singapore. Why do Singapore's citizens deserve it if our reputation goes down, are you wishing that Singapore's reputation goes down in the many eyes of the world. What you are saying proves that you are not even a Singapore since you yearned that Singapore's reputation goes down. The citizens DO NOT reap what they sow because NOT ALL ARE FULLY SUPPORTIVE OF PAP but instead there are quite a number who supports WP AND SDA. Not SDP, seems like you don't know Singapore well.
And I am Singaporean, but I am allergic to stupidity. -
Even if the price is to be paid, it should be paid by the government. Why should the citizens pay for the price? Not all of the people of Singapore do not care about Singapore's reputation. There are people who do care about it. And don't forget that most of Singapore's citizens are mostly from the 1910s-1960s and the 2000s. Do you think they know reputation? Are you imposing that the government should teach them the meaning of reputation? As long as they think that Singapore is safe from threats, they feel that the reputation is ok as it is. Don't just think that the citizens of Singapore are ignorant to reputation that they have to pay the price.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:I don't care about loyalty. I despise stupid people. Simple as that. If people in SIngapore really care about its reputation, they would do something about it. BUt no, they don't. So the price to be paid shall be paid.
And I am Singaporean, but I am allergic to stupidity.
And if you are not loyal to Singapore, try telling that to a normal Singaporean citizen and he/she will most likely tell you: "Get out of Singapore then." You are allergic to stupidity. DO WE CARE? Don't just think that Singaporean citizens are stupid because they DON'T care about the reputation. -
Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:
If Singapore's reputation goes down, its citizens deserve it. They reap what they sow.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:
Unfortunately, Singapore's reputation is no better from the rule of tyranny.
I don't care about loyalty. I despise stupid people. Simple as that. If people in SIngapore really care about its reputation, they would do something about it. BUt no, they don't. So the price to be paid shall be paid.
And I am Singaporean, but I am allergic to stupidity.
Do you know how many are actually politically castrated under the ISA ?
If ''Loyalty'' is worthless then Singapore's reputation as loyal workers will be even more damaging.
Do not be confused with ''political loyalty'' with that of ''loyalty to the Nation''.
Was South Africa's stature demean on the International Stage - even when Nelson Mandela's actual participation and conviction of planting a bomb, and was incarcerated for a period far less than Singapore's Chia Thye Poh ?
Singapore's reputation was not served with the detention of Chia Thye Poh, and it seems that some have still not been released since being arrested in 1977 - and these were not even J.I. type but the more qualified doctoral types from the defunct Barisan Sosialis.
Stupidity are those who believe that the status quo should be kept despite the darkness becoming more overwhelming.
How long do you think the ''Glaring Light of Truth'' can be kept in the overwhelming darkness ? -
Truly agreed.Originally posted by the Bear:well, in their own hatred of the MIW, or in their own delusion, they fail to see that anyone and i mean ANYONE who rubbishes their own country to others, is seen with disgust..
I'm disgusted by people who rubbishes their own country to others.
Imagine an executive manager in CitiBank, sending a formal letter of complain about its management to HSBC asking for help.
What kind of rubbish. Can u imagine how the HSBC CEO will think upon reading the letter?
sigh.... -
You do realise that the Citizens supposedly elected this govt, despite the fact that the only 66% of the people vote? Just how did this Govt come about in the first place? Just where did the people in the civil service, a bungling bunch of fools the people at the top are, come from?Originally posted by BusSpeeder:Even if the price is to be paid, it should be paid by the government. Why should the citizens pay for the price? Not all of the people of Singapore do not care about Singapore's reputation. There are people who do care about it. And don't forget that most of Singapore's citizens are mostly from the 1910s-1960s and the 2000s. Do you think they know reputation? Are you imposing that the government should teach them the meaning of reputation? As long as they think that Singapore is safe from threats, they feel that the reputation is ok as it is. Don't just think that the citizens of Singapore are ignorant to reputation that they have to pay the price.
And if you are not loyal to Singapore, try telling that to a normal Singaporean citizen and he/she will most likely tell you: "Get out of Singapore then." You are allergic to stupidity. DO WE CARE? Don't just think that Singaporean citizens are stupid because they DON'T care about the reputation.
No, I never asked you to care about whether or not I am allergic to stupidity. The point of the problem is that, as Atobe has said, is that you confuse political loyalty with loyalty to country. A country's reputation is how the people make it. If they don't care, well, that's their business.
And you are not being clear here but rather very emotional in your dwelling in patriotism, revealing the time honored fear of many Singaporeans when they realise they are actually Emperors with no clothes. A price will be paid for every action, just as a price will be paid when citizens in their country do not so much as whimper when their Govt abuse its powers for its own ends. There will always a price to be paid. A country that lives in denial thinking that safety is the most important will nonetheless stagnate eventually. Tell people to "Get out of Singapore" is merely a symptom of a larger problem that happens in Singapore; that inferiority complex fostered upon the population by a Govt that constantly blares out the weakness of Singapore to justify some silly policy. The result is a lack of can-do spirit that is dead as a dog as it is. -
You do realise that by your reasoning, if a company has committed a crime, and you fail to report it to the relevant authorities, you are an accomplice to that crime?Originally posted by airgrinder:Truly agreed.
I'm disgusted by people who rubbishes their own country to others.
Imagine an executive manager in CitiBank, sending a formal letter of complain about its management to HSBC asking for help.
What kind of rubbish. Can u imagine how the HSBC CEO will think upon reading the letter?
sigh....
By the same token, if you know something is wrong, but you don't do anything about it, aren't you giving your silent voice of approval to something?
At least some people are trying to spread the word around trying to get people educated, but some decide to act as children and dislike being scolded when they are in the wrong. What happens then? Let the fire continue to burn out of pride? Is pride so important that you would happily let the forest burn and you in it?