Why People Leave SG
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i probably did not make myself clear. The aussie who came to singapore started as a low pay shipping sales for a singapore based shipping company, what she did was to find customers to ship through her company from mainly china to singapore or other parts of the world. so she was not expatriate. and she did say there are more opportunities in singapore and she was talking about a sales job over the phone or internet, like a call center. She was talking about opportunities from china, and easier to grab that from singapore than australia. then she began to look for better opportunities and began to find one from Hong Kong who gave her a good one to start a branch in singapore.
now, to add more things in now, if anyone of you here live or lived overseas, surely do not deny that most of significant number of overseas chinese are in the industries like chinese restaurants, chinese super-markets, salons etc. not many are professionals. -
I am sorry but something is wrong with the picture. Either she is australian or Singaporean. If she is Australian, she is an expat - like it or not. I don't believe that she could start off at a low pay shipping sales for a company as a non Singaporean. Either she took you for a ride with that story or she came down probably in the 1980s or 1990s when Australia was still not opening up to China for trade but then she probably had the cash, foresight and was fishing for the opportunity.Originally posted by CannotTahan:i probably did not make myself clear. The aussie who came to singapore started as a low pay shipping sales for a singapore based shipping company, what she did was to find customers to ship through her company from mainly china to singapore or other parts of the world. so she was not expatriate. and she did say there are more opportunities in singapore and she was talking about a sales job over the phone or internet, like a call center. She was talking about opportunities from china, and easier to grab that from singapore than australia. then she began to look for better opportunities and began to find one from Hong Kong who gave her a good one to start a branch in singapore.
now, to add more things in now, if anyone of you here live or lived overseas, surely do not deny that most of significant number of overseas chinese are in the industries like chinese restaurants, chinese super-markets, salons etc. not many are professionals.
Yes alot of overseas chinese are into trades and skills. That has been the ideal of the chinese diaspora. But in order to start a business - u need the cash. -
i see no reason for her to lie to me. and i personally know another female who started at entry level and worked herself up, she married a singaporean.
she was the sales person i talked to. How she got into that job from australia, i did not ask. i only encouraged her to press on. later she got that great opportunity.
why shipping in singapore than australia? because shipping volume in singapore is bigger. call for rates pretending a shipment and compare. i did that, many are singapore based hardly australian ones, even today. normally you choose the cheapest rates possible to increase profit margins.
how she got that, i do know. very frequently there are business dinners where people from all industries come together to exchange contacts. many of these participants are job seekers. she was one of those. and she got it. it was her attitude, her willingness to go for it.
till now, i did not discourage anyone from emigrating. only advice.
i am of the view that when one migrate, i need to plan for the unforseeable and not get stucked. i know another european indian, born, grew and educated there. during the last recession, he told me. he is really foreseeing and afraid of backlash against foreigners which he said includes himself since everyone found earning a living so hard. he wanted to come to singapore but could not. something one must take into account of.
when things are rosy, things are rosy and vice versa.
of course, there are super ones who bought in cash a million aussie dollars bungalow and yet have a landed house at bukit timah for rental. these people migrate without any worries.
if one is a working class, be more careful. make sure you know what you in there for longer term. talk to the retired aussies or ex-singaporean chinese, how they feel about their living. then make your call. in general, what really stopped me going over is the weather. for young people, snow is fun. for old people, it is sickening and induces reumatism. god.
in general, these old people (overseas) have something in common, they are worried about their children's prospects and competition from cheaper labor coming from elsewhere.
to add it in, talk to any american. many of them dont trust their government. the last election was conducted like a third world country, recounting and recounting. it is a strong country with a rich / poor ratio of extreme proportion too.
lets face it. if your attitude is good, you do well where-ever you are. when you emigrate and cut your roots here in singapore, you are taking the risk that singapore's job market might be too competitive for your children who are too used to an easier way of life and they need jobs which they cannot find at your new country. -
Thank you for your kindly advice . I don't have kids and neither do I desire them. I am alittle different - my base in Australia is set - I never went back into Singapore- my property is in Australia already, my career is grounded into Australia and I have half my family here in Australia with me.Originally posted by CannotTahan:i see no reason for her to lie to me. and i personally know another female who started at entry level and worked herself up, she married a singaporean.
she was the sales person i talked to. How she got into that job from australia, i did not ask. i only encouraged her to press on. later she got that great opportunity.
why shipping in singapore than australia? because shipping volume in singapore is bigger. call for rates pretending a shipment and compare. i did that, many are singapore based hardly australian ones, even today. normally you choose the cheapest rates possible to increase profit margins.
how she got that, i do know. very frequently there are business dinners where people from all industries come together to exchange contacts. many of these participants are job seekers. she was one of those. and she got it. it was her attitude, her willingness to go for it.
till now, i did not discourage anyone from emigrating. only advice.
i am of the view that when one migrate, i need to plan for the unforseeable and not get stucked. i know another european indian, born, grew and educated there. during the last recession, he told me. he is really foreseeing and afraid of backlash against foreigners which he said includes himself since everyone found earning a living so hard. he wanted to come to singapore but could not. something one must take into account of.
when things are rosy, things are rosy and vice versa.
of course, there are super ones who bought in cash a million aussie dollars bungalow and yet have a landed house at bukit timah for rental. these people migrate without any worries.
if one is a working class, be more careful. make sure you know what you in there for longer term. talk to the retired aussies or ex-singaporean chinese, how they feel about their living. then make your call. in general, what really stopped me going over is the weather. for young people, snow is fun. for old people, it is sickening and induces reumatism. god.
in general, these old people (overseas) have something in common, they are worried about their children's prospects and competition from cheaper labor coming from elsewhere.
to add it in, talk to any american. many of them dont trust their government. the last election was conducted like a third world country, recounting and recounting. it is a strong country with a rich / poor ratio of extreme proportion too.
lets face it. if your attitude is good, you do well where-ever you are. when you emigrate and cut your roots here in singapore, you are taking the risk that singapore's job market might be too competitive for your children who are too used to an easier way of life and they need jobs which they cannot find at your new country.
Believe me , should I have children , their life will not be easy - they will do as I did in my life- start earning their keep once they are legal to work. I started working at 15 and studying ,and so will they. I am not planning to moddly coddle them. They will learn like I did that the real life out there is not very nice to those who are not streetwise and have no skills in demand . They will learn to pay for their university fees as I did . They won't have a maid at all , I never had a maid. They will learn to keep their room nice and clean , do the laundry and cook. They will pitch in for chores. Basic skills for survival.
There are alot of jobs in Australia frankly - why would the next generation not get a job if they have the appropriate skills? If they want to go to Singapore and work - they can do it as foreign talents - I am not stopping them
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I'd have to ask the relevance of this. I know plenty of tradesmen, like plumbers and electricians, who make pretty decent money, so what, exactly, is the inherent disadvantage of not being a profgessional?Originally posted by CannotTahan:now, to add more things in now, if anyone of you here live or lived overseas, surely do not deny that most of significant number of overseas chinese are in the industries like chinese restaurants, chinese super-markets, salons etc. not many are professionals.
Two things. If you recall your secondary school history lessons, Singapore's geographical position makes it an ideal port - that's why the British colonised it in the first place. Second, shipping is but one of many industries, and while I acknowledge Singapore's advantage in this area, it is not the be-all-and-end-all of industry and business, so to base a blanket conclusion on this one point is ill-advised.Originally posted by CannotTahan:why shipping in singapore than australia? because shipping volume in singapore is bigger. call for rates pretending a shipment and compare. i did that, many are singapore based hardly australian ones, even today. normally you choose the cheapest rates possible to increase profit margins.
So are you saying that if you stay put, you won't have to worry about the future? If anything, the unemployment system in Australia and other countries provides more of a safety net than in Singapore. In Singapore, if you're out of a job and down on your luck, sorry, you're on your own.Originally posted by CannotTahan:i am of the view that when one migrate, i need to plan for the unforseeable and not get stucked.
Also, how do you plan for the unforseeable? It is, after all, called unforseeable for a good reason.
Again, how is Singapore different? If you have evidence that retirees are better off in Singapore than in other countries, I'd be interested in hearing about it.Originally posted by CannotTahan:if one is a working class, be more careful. make sure you know what you in there for longer term. talk to the retired aussies or ex-singaporean chinese, how they feel about their living
This one's begging to be asked - have you tried competing in a non-Singaporean market? On what basis are you forming your opinions?Originally posted by CannotTahan:lets face it. if your attitude is good, you do well where-ever you are. when you emigrate and cut your roots here in singapore, you are taking the risk that singapore's job market might be too competitive for your children who are too used to an easier way of life and they need jobs which they cannot find at your new country.
Don't take this the wrong way, but I can't see enough of a foundation and a knowledge base for you to be dispensing advice, well-intentioned as I assume it to be. I'm quite happily at the top of my game in Melbourne, and knowing fymk personally, I know she's doing well too. As you've said, if you have the right attitude, you'll do well anywhere. Conversely, if you have the wrong attitude, you won't do well anywhere, and if there's any advantage to be drawn from not cutting one's roots, it would be for such people to fall back upon familial support. -
Oh, by the way, on 11 June 2007, SingStat reported the unemployment rate to be 3.6%. Four days earlier, the reported unemployment rate in Australia was 4.2% and falling. It's slightly higher in Australia, but certainly no indicator that it's significantly harder to get a job.
In the past 13 years in Australia, I've spent a total of four weeks unemployed, three of which were deliberately taken after completing university and two days of the remaining being a weekend. I can address your anecdotes with firsthand experience and say that if one is of the mind to do it, getting a job is not a major challenge. -
i was stating what i think are the risks of emigration. it is not risk free or a free lunch. if you migrate as a working professional with a mortgage to repay and get retrenched, same problems. of course, i believe people who take these risks are people who will not let things happen on its own, so called go getters. eventually things would work out in most cases. be happy and be blessed.
perhaps i should have written "my opinions" rather than "advice". -
Are you seriously banking on the probability of an event occuring which is no more realistic than seeing Kim Jung Il ousted from power by democratic means?Originally posted by Coquitlam:hopefully the powers that be will look at it constructively and not find another reason to label us quitters..... -
In simpler terms, what you have is a casanova (with neither the gift of the gab nor deep pockets) wanting a fling with someone with the looks of a Miss Universe, character of Mother Teresa and the intellect of Marie Curie who should preferably be a virgin, yet offers her services at a price below that of the cheapest w-h-o-r-e-house on the planet.Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:In other words, to borrow somebody else’s analogy, our current system is looking for “wild” cats that are willing to work hard and cheap without any welfare strings attached, as opposed to the local “tame” cats that always point out to life beyond the immediate economic realities.
Deal, anyone?
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bcau there r 2 many dogs here!!!!like???????
My frd had just passed away who has many dogs 2 feed and been paid 2 write here,I m not interested in this forum anymore!!!making $ is my utimate aim in Sinkapore,for my daughter cant be admitted to medical f in NUS and we hve 2 pay her full price US 500k in USA now!!!but good also ,no bond attached
Anyway,pls migrate if u can ,my father at the age of 90 also c no future in Sinkapore ,my sons and daughter in law will join me in 3yrs time if I m still ard!!!
Do u know who r the dogs???? -
Let's face it : that ploy is nothing more than a lob-sided propaganda mouthpiece this regime would so yearn for the masses to believe. As alluded in another earlier post by someone(and echoed many times over by many others), for the capable and talented, it's not so much wanting "an easier way of life" that drives them out. Rather, it's the unrealistic fascist-induced, out-of-touch (at least, with the developed free world) market economy where remunerations do not commensurate with their expertise that drives them out...Originally posted by CannotTahan:lets face it. if your attitude is good, you do well where-ever you are. when you emigrate and cut your roots here in singapore, you are taking the risk that singapore's job market might be too competitive for your children who are too used to an easier way of life and they need jobs which they cannot find at your new country. -
Nobody is saying it is a free lunch or risk free. I am just saying that there are alot of opportunities out there in the world , not just only in Australia ,than to be stuck with the mentality of why others should not consider immigration because of repeated government warnings:" why be a second class citizen overseas when you can be first class in Singapore" attitude too long'.Originally posted by CannotTahan:i was stating what i think are the risks of emigration. it is not risk free or a free lunch. if you migrate as a working professional with a mortgage to repay and get retrenched, same problems. of course, i believe people who take these risks are people who will not let things happen on its own, so called go getters. eventually things would work out in most cases. be happy and be blessed.
perhaps i should have written "my opinions" rather than "advice".
Those who emigrated and then went back into Singapore to whine about racism or lack of opportunities - those are not the people to listen to. Those are the ones who did not make an effort to actually integrate within the community of the new country. They will whine and whine til kingdom come.
And then you look at those who went over to Australia and come back to Singapore for a holiday only - those are the ones who made an effort to know how the new country works and play the climbing game.
I notice alot of the students in their first year think like this- Singapore number 1 .....and then second year maybe Singapore is better and on the third year - how do I get PR in Australia?
Why should I be a first class citizen in Singapore- slogging away at my job with no social life because the FT might grab it anyday , follow what the govt dictates to me ,worry about my job so that I can pay off a 99 year lease HDB flat whom my future descendents can't hold on to, pay my own hospitalisation fees when I get old and my health fails, and be told to work in my autumn years when I should be enjoying it?
Sorry Australia has better prospects- career ( I do what I enjoy which is a bonus than to be streamlined into a job I hate) and wealth building - second class or not , I am happy being here and I do see a future here of my superannuation, enjoy my property tax free since it is residential ownership , look after my parent's well being , and the safety net of an almost free public health system which I can afford to jump the queue if necessary because of my private health insurance. And my employer will pay for my further studies and give me study leave on request. Yes I pay a high income tax because it actually gives me a wealth of benefits that Singapore won't.
You cannot think that life in Australia is so easy like that and people cannot compete with Singaporeans when they return. Everything may look free and easy in Australia . The key point - they don't care how you do things - they want results within a certain time. So you can take it easy for 3 days and then slog away for the next 3 days to produce the result. If you don't produce the result within a 6 day timeframe , good luck! -
Employment rises in Q1 but jobless rate up
Brisk hiring rate outpaces productivity; wages on the rise
By NANDE KHIN
THE job market here continued to remain tight in the first quarter as total employment rose by 49,400 and the number of layoffs declined sharply, according to the Ministry of Manpower (MOM).
However, the resident jobless rate of 4 per cent, seasonally adjusted, in March is an increase from December's 3.6 per cent and the 3.5 per cent in March 2006, as more people were attracted back into the workforce by buoyant economic conditions, said MOM in its quarterly report.
The resident rate - which covers Singaporeans and permanent residents - is typically higher than the overall rate which also includes foreigners on work passes.
The overall unemployment rate, seasonally adjusted, also rose - from 2.6 per cent in December 2006 to 2.9 per cent in March this year.
The resident labour supply increased by 17,700 in Q1, as more people entered the workforce, lured by rosy job prospects as a result of the robust economy, said MOM.
This is higher than the average increase over the last two years, when favourable economic conditions also led to an increase in resident labour supply in the first quarter but by a lower average of 10,700.
The buoyant economy also generated a large number of job vacancies which reached 32,200 in March. This is 30 per cent higher than a year ago, but is broadly unchanged from December (32,000).
About seven in 10 vacancies (22,600) in March were in the services sector. Manufacturing added another 7,900 or 24 per cent of the openings while the remaining vacancies were in the construction sector.
Nearly half (14,400) of the vacancies were for professionals, managers, executives and technicians (PMETs).
Weighed down by the increase in job seekers, the seasonally adjusted ratio of job vacancies to unemployed persons dropped to 68 vacancies for every 100 job seekers in March, down from the five-year high of 79 per 100 in December. Nevertheless, this is still higher than the 60 vacancies for 100 job seekers ratio in March 2006.
Far fewer workers (1,964) were also laid off in Q1 this year, compared with the 3,215 retrenched in the previous quarter and the 3,653 laid off in the corresponding quarter a year ago.
In particular, the number of retrenched workers in the manufacturing sector fell sharply from 2,447 in Q4, 2006 to 1,393 in Q1 this year, although the sector still accounted for the majority (71 per cent) of layoffs.
Based on CPF records, 59 per cent of the residents retrenched by private sector establishments with at least 25 employees in Q4 2006 were re-employed by March this year.
However, as employers continued to hire to meet current and anticipated increases in output, job creation has outpaced the growth in output resulting in lower productivity but higher wages, said MOM.
This has resulted in a 1.6 per cent dip in productivity in Q1 over the corresponding quarter in 2006. It represents the second consecutive quarterly decline in productivity after the 0.7 per cent drop in Q4 2006.
Nevertheless, wage pressures have continued to intensify, reflecting the brisk hiring pace.
Average nominal earnings based on CPF records posted a strong year-on-year increase of 5.5 per cent in Q1 this year, higher than the 3.1 per cent in the preceding quarter. After adjusting for inflation, the increase in real terms was 5 per cent and 2.5 per cent respectively -
Gazelle...your articles aren't going to help you much in this debate. As mentioned before in this thread, we're talking about the availability of opportunities, quality of life, and social security, not employment.
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Hey happy shiney people , how do you get a Pitbull to let go? -
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he probably does not see it that way until reality hits him.Originally posted by dakkon_blackblade:Gazelle...your articles aren't going to help you much in this debate. As mentioned before in this thread, we're talking about the availability of opportunities, quality of life, and social security, not employment. -
huh, it's gazelle again. OIC, he is invading here!!Originally posted by fymk:he probably does not see it that way until reality hits him. -
lol if i miss it alot , i can always fly in . Alot of enterprising Singaporeans opening food shops here.....so don't need you to show me pictures.Originally posted by Gazelle: -
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Well I think it's because a large segment is still having an 'immigrant' mentality, wanting to go to a better place to live and work. It's not surprising since majority are Chinese immigrants.
Also they are well educated and speak international language, English.
With this situation, plus some 'push' factor such as high living costs, some people emigrate.
Meat Pao. -
Seems Gazelle has finally dropped all pretenses and shown his true colours by resorting to trolling?
Frankly to use his terms, wild cats are only bred out in the tough conditions of the wild, since he is so enamoured with them he should indeed have no issue with the tame cats of Singapore wanting to experience the tough life abroad and becoming the wild cats he seems to think is so cool.
More seriously he can post all the pictures of food and culture he wants, but seriously can he really post any picture in Singapore that can match the splendour of the Grand Canyon or the Angel Falls? Can we find rolling mountain plains or snow? Do you think our IR resorts and the like can match up to what mother nature has carved for other nations.
Not saying Singapore is bad, but I think by only wanting to emphasise the bad points of other countries and toot our own horn he is but missing the big picture and the true reason why Singaporeans leave and many do not come back.
Are they willing to risk the drugs and guns and crimes because they are stupid and donÂ’t know better? No, the real reason why we are losing are people lies in ourselves, his lionnoisy-style of trying to find solutions to our migration problem by tooting our own horn and highlighting the problems of others is like saying whatÂ’s good about our house and bad about others while ignoring the fire that is in the kitchen.
ItÂ’s not that Singapore is a bad place to stay, but there are strong factors that are alienating the locals from it and until the root is found the problem will contuine and all of GazelleÂ’s attempts to curse the local as a tame quitting cat, paint our local variety of food as worth staying for, and the crime rate of other nations will simply not help the problem at all.
Basically he is just screaming, and rather ineffectively as well.
If he truly wanted to be productive, he ought to face the true root of the problem instead of declaring the local is a tame useless cat and ought to buck up.
The irony is that they are indeed bucking up and becoming wild, that’s why they are leaving the safety and tameness of Singapore. It is the tame cats that stay and take whatever is happening lying down, not saying that all locals are tame cats, but that if you want to find a tame cat, the “quitter” is certainly NOT one.
If anything all too often the “quitter” is the WILD cat that our government is so desperate to keep, to the extent that it has become a problem.
