Free Education and Medical Care : Fact or Myth?
-
Strange, it seems that she already shared on it... prehaps an inability on your part to accept that I suppose?Originally posted by Gazelle:care to share with us how you get away from paying income tax with an income of 36K? Fake claim I suppose? -
Are you even thinking with your brain?Originally posted by Gazelle:You should proof to me that as a whole, the australians are gaining more benefits than what they pay in income tax.
If a nation's populace could gain more benefits than what the nation collectively pays through taxes, where should the excess funding come from?
Shed some light on this new-found economic theory of yours - it could provide the ultimate solution to global poverty. For all you know, this could be the greatest knowledge ever bestowed upon humanity since the sliced bread...
-
perhaps you want to explain why is that so?Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:Strange, it seems that she already shared on it... prehaps an inability on your part to accept that I suppose?
-
My mistake because I never earnt 36k before in Australia - in Singapore I would earn less than 36k- maybe 30k at the time of my departure. Yes ,both sides still pay taxes.Originally posted by Gazelle:care to share with us how you get away from paying income tax with an income of 36K? Fake claim I suppose?
Ok so 36 k in Australia , you pay 6660 dollars worth of taxes. In Singapore , 30k , you pay 3500 worth of taxes. What can you claim back in Australia vs Singapore in benefits?
However if you note the part about me having student ship and with a good accountant in Australia- you can claim back everything. If let's say , I took up unsubsidised study which cost me 6k per year and I claim for every expense in my study. So in total my course fee and my expenses are 6660 and IF I earnt 36k - my tax would have been 6660 dollars but because I paid it up in full - my tax is utterly offset. It is legal and it has been done by quite a few people I know. Get over it
. Tax is offset.
Singapore, you can claim course fees only up to 3.5k. Tax offset but if your course costs 8k - you only got back ...what 3.5k? 4.5k your own money .
Then let's talk doctor fees- Australia medicare rebate - pays up to 31 dollars for a doctor's consultantation. I offset my cost of seeing a doctor.
In Singapore, doctor charges you 31 dollars. You have to pay without the benefit of a medicare rebate. Heck you still have to pay in Polyclinic .
Then if you get hit by a car, you have to stay in the ICU, HDU and then general ward for 10 days. In Australia, public health system - 0 dollars. In Singapore, get to know a cardiothoracic surgeon because the bill will probably give you a heart attack. Ok lets say B2 - so you have to pay 5k in total (guestimate). No security there - the government will chase you for payment.
Now let's talk property- in Australia - you have no taxes to pay on your principal residence so you can buy a one million dollar house and not worry about property tax. That is legal and that is what I am doing - not worrying about my property. In Singapore - I think still must pay property tax of 4% regardless of income right?
So let's say - if my property in Australia is 350k , and it is my principal residential address. I pay nothing.
In Singapore, you still pay taxes on what the government calls annual value.
Then let's talk study and work related equipment. Under ATO's rules, you can claim anything you bought for study or work.
In Singapore, $0 claiming of items you bought for study or work.
So ....pay higher in Australia - for me it is worthit with the security net in place. But in Singapore , you are a 36k a year worker - yes your tax is lower, you pay for your own healthcare and you pay property tax, not forgetting that you cannot claim for your work/study equipment , you pay GST on those. You lose your job , you still have to freaking pay property tax. Even after tax in Australia , I still earn more than what I earn in Singapore. HAHAHA
I have never escaped taxation in Australia. I just continue to study and then offset my taxes this way. My pay in Australia has never been in the lower tier of taxation. It has been near the mid- top tier brackets-so I don't get away from paying income tax at all.
And ya , if I was in Singapore, I don't have earning power with the pathetic pay I would have got there. Don't believe? Go ask Ged or Rhonda how often I fly from Canberra to Melb. HAHAHAHA
As far as I know, I go to an accountant so that I don't get screwed by ATO for filing anything that should not be claimed.
This is ATO's territory. And they are like the IRS of America. -
double posted
-
Do we need to continue this debate any further?
First, we have proven that Australia's free healthcare and education is a fact, not myth.
Secondly, in the entire history of Sgforums Speaker's Corner, Gazelle has never failed to "win" any argument.
Thirdly, he normally starts out on the right track but tends to deviate into "arguing for the sake of arguing", focusing on words, rather than the hard truth.
By the way, do we need to engage in a debate with someone who thinks with his "small head" rather than with the one on top of his torso?
Here is a true story about a colleague that shock me!!
It was a Friday nightÂ…..one of my female colleague was cheonging with her friends at Mohd Sultan and........ at about 11plusÂ….she send me a sms to ask if I am around and if I could give her a lift back later.......of course out of kindness......I say yesÂ….......so I pick her up at about 1.30am and headed back to her placeÂ…Â…Â…but as usual.Â…Â…..there is no such thing as a free ride Â….....so decided to ask if we can hang-out somewhere to chit-chatÂ…Â…and we did..Â…..so we end up sitting in the car at the park near her place.....as usual.Â…Â…we chat and smoke some cigarette........and then....... I POP the golden question Â…Â….ask if I can kiss her again (this is not our first)..Â…...and as expected the answer is WHY?......(stupid question isnt it?, which also mean YES)....Â…..at that momentÂ…my heart was beating twice as fast while waiting for her answerÂ…..so I didnÂ’t even border to answer her and immediate move towards her and started kissingÂ…Â…..at that timeÂ…....she was still wearing her working attitire......, which is a tight fitting, black color short skirt (FYI her legs are flawless and she doesnt wear stocking).....so the thought of moving up her legs immediately came to my mind (actually I have been thinking about this for awhile)...Â….....at first I was afraid she will slap me or something.....so decided to touch her thighs and feel her tendernessÂ….......to my surprise...there was no resistance at all.......so I started to play the cats and mouse game by moving slowly and arouse her further....and holy cow!!!Â…....the next thing I know.....she was pulling my hands up her skirt.......
Knowing that it has been at least 20 hours since she took her last showerÂ…so I decide to avoid moving under her panties......Â….and instead...I ask her to touch meÂ…..and to my bloody surpriseÂ…Â…she automatically unbuckle my belt and unzip my pants and masturbate for meÂ…Â…....it was like auto pilot.....she seems to know what exactly i want........Â…the next thing you knowÂ…Â…she was actually giving me a BJÂ…Â….......If you think this is shockingÂ…Â…read onÂ…Â…..
Since we are doing this is a public placeÂ….....i was really worried that there will be peep tomÂ…or worst police patrolÂ…......as I donÂ’t want to be caught with my pants down (literally :lol Â….....so at the time....i was half shiok and half worriedÂ…Â….But since this is a once is a life time opportunity...I decide not to put the night to wasteÂ…....so I took my chance and play along with herÂ….......then I slowly........lift up her skirt and unbutton her blose........expose her her black underwear and bra........which looks pretty expensive to me...Â…Â…..and start touch herÂ….....at that point onwards...Â….......i was so damn aroused that I told her that I cant take it anymoreÂ…Â….....and its gonna cum!!! !Â…Â….and holy cow!!!!Â…Â…instead of stopping and reaching for some tissue paper......she continue BJ me and got even fasterÂ…..and eventually I have no choice but to ejaculated into her mouthÂ…Â…Â…..
After thatÂ…..she just turn around and look at meÂ…..her hair was abit messyÂ….and started to play with my cum in her mouthÂ…Â…in my mindÂ…..i was thinkingÂ….manÂ…..youÂ… SHOCK ME!!!!!Â…..
This is a true story that happens about 3 years ago..... -
Originally posted by Rock^Star:
Rock^star, it has been proven time and time again that you are incapable to delivering what you promise,
Oh goodness, can't you answer my question first before I answer yours? You know what's courtesy?
[b]How did you arrive at the figure of $149.3 b for Australia's income tax revenue??
As usual, you answer mine, then I answer yours. I promise.[/b]
We are still waiting for your explaination about the S$10.6b benefit Singaporeans is getting and about your tax/benefit ratio which you have been trying to teach us.
May I know what exactly are you trying to proof by quoting my thread from BAR? To prove that I a man or proof that you are still a kid? -
Looking at the way you twist arguments, is there a need for me to explain myself any further?Originally posted by Gazelle:Rock^star, it has been proven time and time again that you are incapable to delivering what you promise,
We are still waiting for your explaination about the S$10.6b benefit Singaporeans is getting and about your tax/benefit ratio which you have been trying to teach us.
May I know what exactly are you trying to proof by quoting my thread from BAR? To prove that I a man or proof that you are still a kid?
Believe it or not, I am satisfied at how I derived the S$10.6 billion figure and I don't think it's worth my time debating with you in this thread anymore.
My point is: if you had wanted to be taken seriously in Speaker's Corner, you should have kept your dark secrets to yourself. A man who boasts about his sex exploits and talks politics, cannot be taken seriously. So rant and twist all you want, you are a goner as far as this forum is concerned. -
Originally posted by Rock^Star:
Rock^Star,
Looking at the way you twist arguments, is there a need for me to explain myself any further?
Believe it or not, I am satisfied at how I derived the S$10.6 billion figure and I don't think it's worth my time debating with you in this thread anymore.
[b]My point is: if you had wanted to be taken seriously in Speaker's Corner, you should have kept your dark secrets to yourself. A man who boasts about his sex exploits and talks politics, cannot be taken seriously. So rant and twist all you want, you are a goner as far as this forum is concerned.[/b]
Appreciate if you could stop giving yourself excuses after excuses for not to do what you have promised, because it is so obvious that you are just incapable, weak, and a super liar.
And to say that because I post something in BAR I am not qualify to post in Speakerscorner, it just pure stupid!! That can only tell us that you are someone with no sex life.
Guess you are the reason why Singapore is rank so lowly on sex life. -
Whether I use excuses a not as you deem it, let people here judge. I have a clear conscience as far as I'm concerned.Originally posted by Gazelle:Rock^Star,
Appreciate if you could stop giving yourself excuses after excuses for not to do what you have promised, because it is so obvious that you are just incapable, weak, and a super liar.
And to say that because I post something in BAR I am not qualify to post in Speakerscorner, it just pure stupid!! That can only tell us that you are someone with no sex life.
Guess you are the reason why Singapore is rank so lowly on sex life.
There are many here who have advised you to use your brain when you post, not your butt.
It's so obvious that Australia's free healthcare and education has been proven. Yet, you still insist on arguing. Now, that's stupidity, blockhead, dingbat, lamebrain, imbecile, halfwit, simpleton, tomfool, cretin or what? And a refusal to accept the truth equates to arguing for argument's sake.
Everyone should have a good sex life. However, I mentioned "boasting about sex exploits and talking politics". Can you tell the difference? If you can't, let me know again. -
There is no such thing as a free lunch.
Social security,free healthcare and education comes with a price of high income tax.
It is all well worthit because you can go on as a person who is working currently and knowing that if anything happens to you - the one off income tax the country took from you will also look after you.
Better than having a country who tax your income lowly and then progressively tax your assets ( which is abit of tax upon tax upon tax) but does not provide for you in your time of need. That creates unneccessary stress because you depend on a job for survival and without that job, you will be left out in the cold . -
fymk,Originally posted by fymk:There is no such thing as a free lunch.
Social security,free healthcare and education comes with a price of high income tax.
It is all well worthit because you can go on as a person who is working currently and knowing that if anything happens to you - the taxes the country took from you will also look after you.
Better than having a country who tax your income lowly but does not provide for you in your time of need. That creates unneccessary stress because you depend on a job for survival and without that job, you will be left out in the cold .
Are you aware the the Australian government has choke up more than A$500b worth of foreign debt to finance the country's economy and do you think that the current australia system is sustainable? -
If you talk the talk, you better walk the walk. If you cant next time just dont talk and act like you are so smart.Originally posted by Rock^Star:Whether I use excuses a not as you deem it, let people here judge. I have a clear conscience as far as I'm concerned.
There are many here who have advised you to use your brain when you post, not your butt.
It's so obvious that Australia's free healthcare and education has been proven. Yet, you still insist on arguing. Now, that's stupidity, blockhead, dingbat, lamebrain, imbecile, halfwit, simpleton, tomfool, cretin or what? And a refusal to accept the truth equates to arguing for argument's sake.
Everyone should have a good sex life. However, I mentioned "boasting about sex exploits and talking politics". Can you tell the difference? If you can't, let me know again.
You and your stupid...tax/benefit ratio.. -
If you don't know, will it not be in your professional medical interest to come up with the data to prove my 'aspersions' to be wrong - if such data is available ?Originally posted by oxford mushroom:
Original post by Atobe:
What evidence do you have that the poor people in Singapore did not die without healthcare and education ?
Will it not be a consequential fact that those who are poor will probably be ignorant of their illness due to their poor education, and will not be familiar with any available medical help until they have reached an advanced stage of illness ?
How many of the poor that finally reach Class C ward in a severe stage, will actually walk out fully recovered, compared to those with the same illness in Class A or Class B1 or B2 wards ?--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't know...you tell me. It is easy to cast aspersions without a shred of evidence, although that's what you are very good at. Back up your arguments with solid facts and figures, although I expect you have come from the same mold as that clown CSJ, great for making allegations but never able to back up with facts.
NPNT
'casting aspersions' is different from 'allegations' - if you cannot know the difference try to educate yourself with some online Dictionary between an Idiom and the Word.
Are you disputing the fact that there exist a larger number of Singaporeans living as the ''underclass citizens'' and are the main cause of the overcrowding situation in the Class C wards despite the larger apportioning of space to Class C then to the other Classes ?
Are you also also disputing the acknowledged growing number of aged, as well as a growing numbers in the low income group - and are the obvious cause of the overcrowding situation in Class C wards ?
The fact is clear that the Government is abusing the Citizens sense of responsibility towards healthcare cost by continuously 'shifting the burdern of healthcare finance' onto the Singaporeans.
As was stated in the referenced article, the government share of healthcare had shrunk from 65% in 1965 to 25% in Year 2000.
With the government hospitals operating to compete as private hospitals, and with bottom lines to be looked after, can the underclass get any better medical help in times of emergency ?
With a shortage of doctors and medical staff to add to the existing problems, can we expect the same level of ''professional'' medical attention given to the massive numbers of Class C patients compared to those in Class A or even B wards ? -
Heard of natural resources?Originally posted by Gazelle:fymk,
Are you aware the the Australian government has choke up more than A$500b worth of foreign debt to finance the country's economy and do you think that the current australia system is sustainable?
As long as Australia does not go the way of USA's debt, I say it is fine.
Singapore choked up about 24 billion. Now if we look at how big Australia with its natural resources and how small Singapore is. Do you think Singapore is able to sustain its debts ? -
With all respect, if my gut instincts are right, you should be a loser in real life. A champion in sex exploits, perhaps.Originally posted by Gazelle:If you talk the talk, you better walk the walk. If you cant next time just dont talk and act like you are so smart.
You and your stupid...tax/benefit ratio.. -
[quote]Originally posted by Rock^Star:
With all respect, if my gut instincts are right, you should be a loser in real life. A champion in IMAGINARY sex exploits, perhaps.[quote] -
Originally posted by Rock^Star:
Rock^star,
Now, open your eyes and prepare to stretch your vestibular canals.
You have made two errors in stating that Australia's income revenue is S$149.3 billion/yr. Just admit the error and do not mislead. Otherwise, prove how you got this figure.
First error: S$149.3 billion / yr. There's no such thing as per year. Income revenue changes from year to year.
Second error: The correct figure should be A$185 billion.
Allow me to explain the concept of benefits to you. Since we are referring to budget and income tax in this topic, benefits simply refers to all social, economic, health, education etc inputs as stated in the budget. This is located under "interest expense", "capital transfers" and "current transfers".
Let me explain to you the benefits/tax ratio.
[b]Australia:
Their income tax revenue for 2006-2007 is A$185 billion.
http://www.budget.gov.au/2006-07/myefo/html/03_part_3-03.htm Table 7
The benefits input for 2006-2007 is A$144 billion
http://www.budget.gov.au/2006-07/myefo/html/03_part_3-09.htm
Table 14
Benefit/tax ratio: 0.78 (2 dec pl)
Singapore:
Their income tax revenue for 2006 is S$13.8 billion.
http://www.mof.gov.sg/budget_2007/revenue_expenditure/attachment/Revenue_Estimates.pdf
The benefits input for 2006-2007 is S$10.6 billion
http://www.mof.gov.sg/budget_2007/revenue_expenditure/attachment/Expenditure_Estimates.pdf
(Pg 6 of 8 )
Benefit/tax ratio: 0.77 (2 dec pl)
According to the budget of the two governments, for every A$1 of tax the Australians pay, they receive A$0.78 in return. For every S$1 of tax Singaporeans pay, we receive S$0.77 of benefits.
Moreover, Australian's healthcare is free, what about ours? Oh, I forgot that our civil service is one of the highest paid in the world. People don't praise the social and edcuational benefits there for nothing.
I have asked you:
1) to explain your figure of S$149.3 b but you kept pushing the ball to me. Can't you see that I need to have a look at your explanation before I commence my benefit/tax ratio presentation??
I can only speculate that you have gotten the wrong figure but are too proud to admit.
2) I genuinely and sincerely ask you to prove the "naysayers" wrong and you mistake it for aggression. Since you have dug out the information, why not carry it through to the end? Perhaps you are afraid of a sinister attack from me.
3) I believe you are trying to corner me by asking me to explain the term "benefits". Well, it's really simple. Refer to my explanation above.
Please do not misunderstand me; I do not argue for the sake of arguing. If I'm wrong, I'm ready to face the truth....unlike you. Have you forgotten my advice to you before? Refer below.
"I have nothing to prove and given any other day, I will still beat you.......for your desire to prove one wrong is greater than your hunger for the truth."
Do try to channel your energy for better uses like responding to my post on HDBs and retirement here.
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=261207
Thanks and appreciate your effort.[/b]
You promise us to explain how you come out with the S$10.6b benefit as stated above? another empty promise? -
Ok, if you insist. Look under "development estimates outlay" and under "Revised FY 2006" on pg 6 of 8 in the relevant link provided.Originally posted by Gazelle:Rock^star,
You promise us to explain how you come out with the S$10.6b benefit as stated above? another empty promise? -
Any reason why you didnt want to use social development expenditure and economic (manpower) development on page 12?Originally posted by Rock^Star:Ok, if you insist. Look under "development estimates outlay" and under "Revised FY 2006" on pg 6 of 8 in the relevant link provided. -
Sure I have my reasons. Tell me why I should that first.Originally posted by Gazelle:Any reason why you didnt want to use social development expenditure and economic (manpower) development on page 12? -
I suggest that you take your time to answer. Do look through the entire statistics carefully.Originally posted by Gazelle:Any reason why you didnt want to use social development expenditure and economic (manpower) development on page 12?
Don't screw up yah. -
What has taxes got to do with your free education and medical care benefit in Australia bashing forum?Originally posted by Gazelle:If you talk the talk, you better walk the walk. If you cant next time just dont talk and act like you are so smart.
You and your stupid...tax/benefit ratio..
What is your agenda? You are playing with economics but you seem to know nothing about it. -
I have read it through many times and I am still going to question you is your have selectively provided the wrong info just to support your case?Originally posted by Rock^Star:I suggest that you take your time to answer. Do look through the entire statistics carefully.
Don't screw up yah. -
So based on the statistics, you can't tell if my $10.6 billion is the correct figure or not?Originally posted by Gazelle:I have read it through many times and I am still going to question you is your have selectively provided the wrong info just to support your case?
This above sentence of yours tells me you have little idea on how to analyse statistics.
If you cannot decipher the report, then how are you going to contribute sensible comments. Why should we waste time and continue on this debate then?