Just to Look Good, Singapore Signs On...
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UN declares Int'l Day of Nonviolence – and get this, Singapore signs on
19 Jun 07
The 61st UN General Assembly voted lasted Friday to mark International Day of Nonviolence each year on October 2 - the birthdate of Mahatma Gandhi.
Gandhi was the spiritual and political leader of India, leading the struggle for India's independence from the British Empire.
Appropriately, India's Minister of State for External Relations Anand Sharma introduced the resolution which was adopted by the 192-member body, including Singapore.
But while the PAP Government outwardly supported the resolution (what else could it do if it didn't want to come across looking like the despot that it is) it continues to prosecute democracy activists who take part in nonviolent action to push for political freedom in Singapore.
Mahatma Gandhi, born October 2, 1869, preached and practised nonviolent civil disobedience to authoritarian governments in order to empower the ordinary citizen.
Now that the world's body, including the Singapore, has recognised the relevance and significance of nonviolence as a means to secure freedom and justice, does the SDP's call for nonviolent action still seem so out-of-place? -
so.. let me ask.. if singapore doesn't sign on the thing, you'd be here ranting about it too?
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I'm more concerned about Singapore's refusal to ratify the Convention on the Rights of the Child.
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No, I'd rather they be themselves and not act Saintly...Originally posted by the Bear:so.. let me ask.. if singapore doesn't sign on the thing, you'd be here ranting about it too?
Basically, stop the masquerade... -
We also didn't use any violence against our opposition, only sue them till they bankrupt. Non-violence prosecution for non-violence disobedience.
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in other words, sign and be damned by you, not sign and still be damned by you...
this is the type of ranting i was talking about when said that asswipes like CSJ drain the well of sympathy so much that the crap he sprouts become just noise to be ignored.. and so when real things come up, people desensitised by the pathetic bleating of CSJ ignore it, throwing it into the same bin as CSJ...
you are doing the same here...Originally posted by ShutterBug:No, I'd rather they be themselves and not act Saintly...
Basically, stop the masquerade... -
Oh then what is this forum for, if not for 'ranting' as you so often termed?Originally posted by the Bear:in other words, sign and be damned by you, not sign and still be damned by you...
this is the type of ranting i was talking about when said that asswipes like CSJ drain the well of sympathy so much that the crap he sprouts become just noise to be ignored.. and so when real things come up, people desensitised by the pathetic bleating of CSJ ignore it, throwing it into the same bin as CSJ...
you are doing the same here...
As much as you are entitled your opinions/views, I am too equally entitled.
No?
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There seems hypocrisy involved with this Government getting Singapore to be a signatory to ''Non-Violence''.
This government has resorted to frequent covert physical abuse towards those detained by the Internal Security Department.
One would have found such interrogation techniques acceptable towards those who advocate obvious violence to achieve their dubious agendas.
However, should such methods be tolerated when applied onto Politicians from the Alternative Parties, or even ordinary Singapore Citizens who are political active and can pose a credible political challenge to the status quo ?
If the ex-Solicitor General Francis T. Seow had not revealed in his memoir - ''To Catch A Tartar'' - one would not have known of the methods employed by the ISD towards a Singaporean.
More atrocious is the politically motivated charges levied at political enthusiasts who are also active in the Church responsibility towards society - as in the scandal of the 'Marxist Plot' in Singapore during 1987.
The 'physical abuse' towards a common citizen - a woman - during interrogation shows clearly that there were no legal evidence to back-up the politically motivated charge of a 'Marxist Plot'.
By subjecting these accused 'Marxist Plotters' under the ISA rules of release - the purpose was achieved in undercutting the support to JBJ's Workers' Party, who had the brilliant support of young and professionally educated political activists, and who were at the same time active in the social work of the Church.
Singapore's participation in this UN sponsored ''Non-Violence'' can only be seen as an attempt at deceiving the World Community. -
What exactly did Singapore sign on to, i.e. what is the contractual obligation? 'Non-violence' sounds very vague leh. If ISD arrests you and put you in prison, it's not violent unless they beat you up what.
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Oh no.. the ISD doesn't beat people up...Originally posted by Panache1976:What exactly did Singapore sign on to, i.e. what is the contractual obligation? 'Non-violence' sounds very vague leh. If ISD arrests you and put you in prison, it's not violent unless they beat you up what.
once in there, they buy them ice creams and whisper sweet nothings into their prisoners' ears...
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The main issue here IMO, is not whether they sign or not. Damned by some because of :Originally posted by the Bear:in other words, sign and be damned by you, not sign and still be damned by you...
this is the type of ranting i was talking about when said that asswipes like CSJ drain the well of sympathy so much that the crap he sprouts become just noise to be ignored.. and so when real things come up, people desensitised by the pathetic bleating of CSJ ignore it, throwing it into the same bin as CSJ...
you are doing the same here...
"But while the PAP Government outwardly supported the resolution (what else could it do if it didn't want to come across looking like the despot that it is) it continues to prosecute democracy activists who take part in nonviolent action to push for political freedom in Singapore."
So signing on just makes it worse. -
You should be more concerned about this regime's refusal to acknowledge the Geneva Convention as the basic principle upon which the right to fundamental human rights is founded.Originally posted by LazerLordz:I'm more concerned about Singapore's refusal to ratify the Convention on the Rights of the Child. -
And the labour camps in North Korea run by their National Security Agency must be the ultimate paradise where utopia becomes reality on this planet. So much for national security...Originally posted by ShutterBug:Oh no.. the ISD doesn't beat people up...
once in there, they buy them ice creams and whisper sweet nothings into their prisoners' ears... 
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one word sums it all 'hypocrisy'
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Sign - wrong
Don't sign - wrong
In other words, some are so dead set against the PAP that whatever it does/doesn't is wrong.
Rather than write so much, be a sage. Preach and practise what you say. -
why neber sign up for press freedom day? -
Intersting...... have you been 'invitited to drink coffee' at ISD before......Originally posted by ShutterBug:Oh no.. the ISD doesn't beat people up...
once in there, they buy them ice creams and whisper sweet nothings into their prisoners' ears... 
or have you just heard this from someone who heard it from someone else who heard it from someone else's uncle......
Its funny that you are sooo sure what happens inside the ISD ...... -
Too many 'damn if you do, damn if you don't' SUPER SAGE around here..... sometimes just can't help but find it funnyOriginally posted by ndmmxiaomayi:Sign - wrong
Don't sign - wrong
In other words, some are so dead set against the PAP that whatever it does/doesn't is wrong.
Rather than write so much, be a sage. Preach and practise what you say. -
Originally posted by ndmmxiaomayi:Sign - wrong
Don't sign - wrong
In other words, some are so dead set against the PAP that whatever it does/doesn't is wrong.
Rather than write so much, be a sage. Preach and practise what you say.Originally posted by hloc:
It is not about being ''dead set against the PAP'', or about being ''damn if you do, damn if don't''.
Too many [b]'damn if you do, damn if you don't' SUPER SAGE around here..... sometimes just can't help but find it funny [/b]
It is about blatant dishonesty and hypocritical behaviour that blemish the honor and good name of Singapore with the hypocritical politics at work.
Are the reports from different Singaporean individuals of the treatments that they received from the ISD agents, insufficient to prove that violence has been used ?
These are ordinary Singaporeans - Francis T Seow (ex-President of the Law Society), Tang Fong Har, Teo Soh Lung, - all with their hearts for a more democratic Singapore that can only benefit Singaporeans, but treated as dark threats to Singapore's well being.
Then there were those who were incarcerated for nearly 20 years - the most infamous detainee being Chia Thye Poh ?
Who are those others being incarcerated for such long periods and all from the Barisan Socialist Party (except for the last person in this list) - Ho Piao, Dr Lim Hock Siew, Dr Poh Soo Kai, Lee Tse Tong, and Said Zahari; and why were charges never brought against them for trial in an open court ?
Is Singapore's internal security so weak that independent witnesses can be subject to Communist threats for giving evidence against these men who are incarcerated under the ISA ?
Those who have been incarcerated under the Internal Security Act should be brought to an Open Trial as soon as the situation has stabilised to allow for all evidence to be scrutinised and the prolonged incarceration be made legal.
While we need to be discerning with the source of information, surely with research works done by a young Singaporean will enlighten us to the abuse of the Internal Security Act towards politically active Singaporeans.
Violence of any kind should be avoided - why should we expect other countries to lead the way on such matters ? -
You do realise that either way is wrong because the PAP does not want to admit what it has done and people like you condone the PAP's actions?Originally posted by ndmmxiaomayi:Sign - wrong
Don't sign - wrong
In other words, some are so dead set against the PAP that whatever it does/doesn't is wrong.
Rather than write so much, be a sage. Preach and practise what you say.
Would you like go into exile to fully understand what you are condoning? -
I didn't write that I condone their doings. It's only a few very general sentences that I wrote.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:You do realise that either way is wrong because the PAP does not want to admit what it has done and people like you condone the PAP's actions?
Would you like go into exile to fully understand what you are condoning? -
on the contrary.. from the TS point of view, he will condemn them no matter what they do...
THAT is the long and short of what we are saying...
putting 'hypocrisy' and all that.. is just rationalising...
pardon me but i think the slips of all the self-professed 'PAP haters' here is showing..Originally posted by Atobe:It is not about being ''dead set against the PAP'', or about being ''damn if you do, damn if don't''.
It is about blatant dishonesty and hypocritical behaviour that blemish the honor and good name of Singapore with the hypocritical politics at work.
Are the reports from different Singaporean individuals of the treatments that they received from the ISD agents, insufficient to prove that violence has been used ?
These are ordinary Singaporeans - Francis T Seow (ex-President of the Law Society), Tang Fong Har, Teo Soh Lung, - all with their hearts for a more democratic Singapore that can only benefit Singaporeans, but treated as dark threats to Singapore's well being.
Then there were those who were incarcerated for nearly 20 years - the most infamous detainee being Chia Thye Poh ?
Who are those others being incarcerated for such long periods and all from the Barisan Socialist Party (except for the last person in this list) - Ho Piao, Dr Lim Hock Siew, Dr Poh Soo Kai, Lee Tse Tong, and Said Zahari; and why were charges never brought against them for trial in an open court ?
Is Singapore's internal security so weak that independent witnesses can be subject to Communist threats for giving evidence against these men who are incarcerated under the ISA ?
Those who have been incarcerated under the Internal Security Act should be brought to an Open Trial as soon as the situation has stabilised to allow for all evidence to be scrutinised and the prolonged incarceration be made legal.
While we need to be discerning with the source of information, surely with research works done by a young Singaporean will enlighten us to the abuse of the Internal Security Act towards politically active Singaporeans.
Violence of any kind should be avoided - why should we expect other countries to lead the way on such matters ? -
Read my last paragraph. Words alone can't do anything. Changes come when there's interaction.Originally posted by Atobe:It is not about being ''dead set against the PAP'', or about being ''damn if you do, damn if don't''.
It is about blatant dishonesty and hypocritical behaviour that blemish the honor and good name of Singapore with the hypocritical politics at work.
Are the reports from different Singaporean individuals of the treatments that they received from the ISD agents, insufficient to prove that violence has been used ?
These are ordinary Singaporeans - Francis T Seow (ex-President of the Law Society), Tang Fong Har, Teo Soh Lung, - all with their hearts for a more democratic Singapore that can only benefit Singaporeans, but treated as dark threats to Singapore's well being.
Then there were those who were incarcerated for nearly 20 years - the most infamous detainee being Chia Thye Poh ?
Who are those others being incarcerated for such long periods and all from the Barisan Socialist Party (except for the last person in this list) - Ho Piao, Dr Lim Hock Siew, Dr Poh Soo Kai, Lee Tse Tong, and Said Zahari; and why were charges never brought against them for trial in an open court ?
Is Singapore's internal security so weak that independent witnesses can be subject to Communist threats for giving evidence against these men who are incarcerated under the ISA ?
Those who have been incarcerated under the Internal Security Act should be brought to an Open Trial as soon as the situation has stabilised to allow for all evidence to be scrutinised and the prolonged incarceration be made legal.
While we need to be discerning with the source of information, surely with research works done by a young Singaporean will enlighten us to the abuse of the Internal Security Act towards politically active Singaporeans.
Violence of any kind should be avoided - why should we expect other countries to lead the way on such matters ?
Edit: I should add that this is just another general statement. -
Come to think of it, who even abides by the geneva convention anymore?Originally posted by walesa:You should be more concerned about this regime's refusal to acknowledge the Geneva Convention as the basic principle upon which the right to fundamental human rights is founded.
Certainly not the US -
Originally posted by the Bear:
How have you objectively conclude the TS point of view that ''he will condemn them no matter what they do....'' ?
on the contrary.. from the TS point of view, he will condemn them no matter what they do...
THAT is the long and short of what we are saying...
putting 'hypocrisy' and all that.. is just rationalising...
pardon me but i think the slips of all the self-professed 'PAP haters' here is showing..
Didn't he state the obvious situation with his opinion that
''But while the PAP Government outwardly supported the resolution (what else could it do if it didn't want to come across looking like the despot that it is) it continues to prosecute democracy activists who take part in nonviolent action to push for political freedom in Singapore.''
How should one interprete such actions with any other choice of words that can be alternative to ''Hypocrisy'' ?
Is it not ironical that you will deride the TS when he was more neutral in his stance towards the end :
''Now that the world's body, including the Singapore, has recognised the relevance and significance of nonviolence as a means to secure freedom and justice, does the SDP's call for nonviolent action still seem so out-of-place ?''
If at all, the slips have been made by the government more than by anyone in this Speakers' Corner, and it shows how the government will continue with a straight face in their relationship with the World Community.
This clearly shows that in the World of Politics, lines blurr when political accomodation is required between willing partners.
Unfortunately, the Ruling Party is unwilling to accomodate Singaporeans, but will do so with anyone or anything 'Foreign' - when it suit their political agenda.