An observation of the true impact of GST
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The question is, how are we going to decipher whether its a true GST reason, or true cost increase reason, or just unscrupulous move?Originally posted by sgdiehard:What matters is whether the costs of goods for the hawkers increase or not? if there is no increases in the costs of noodle, the costs of oil...but he increases his selling prices, then this is unscrupulous, GST increase is used as an excuse, just like petro price increases (but diesel no increase) and transportation cost increase.
It is wrong to increase GST, but to use what is wrong to benefit oneself cannot be right!
The fact is, authorities find it so difficult to pursue errant corporations and find proof of corporate fraud, who is going to spend the resource to go and check the small fish (hawkers, small retailers etc)???
In the end, it is precisely these people that will cost the cost of living of the average singaporean to go up by a lot (the addition of all these increases will result in a heavier burden on every one of us)
I do not believe that CASE nor any other govt bodies are able to tackle the problem of identifying errant small retailers effectively. -
This I fully agree.Originally posted by soul_rage:The question is, how are we going to decipher whether its a true GST reason, or true cost increase reason, or just unscrupulous move?
The fact is, authorities find it so difficult to pursue errant corporations and find proof of corporate fraud, who is going to spend the resource to go and check the small fish (hawkers, small retailers etc)???
In the end, it is precisely these people that will cost the cost of living of the average singaporean to go up by a lot (the addition of all these increases will result in a heavier burden on every one of us)
I do not believe that CASE nor any other govt bodies are able to tackle the problem of identifying errant small retailers effectively. -
How does that give the hawkers the right to levy GST for the goods/services they render? The bottomline is they still don't collect SGD1 million in revenue per annum.Originally posted by Rock^Star:Well, many corporations like supermarkets, furniture stores, department stores, cinemas etc charge GST and these are places where Singaporeans frequent.
A hawker may not earn more than $1 million per year but he still spends at these places. Unscrupulous to increase prices? Maybe, but the GST increase caused this ripple effect.
Note I'm not deliberating on the reasons behind hawkers raising their prices - regardless of whether they are actually justifiable. All I'm saying is, hawkers (most anyway), unlike other commercial entities generating revenues above SGD1 million per annum, cannot use the GST explicitly as the reason for increasing their prices... -
Hmm, today went to Boon Lay, saw quite a decrease in number of people. Although my friend said that its very crowed, it was even more several months ago, I could hardly walk in Jan 07 when I went there.
Definitely an impact crater has formed... -
time to grow my own vegetables.
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Today found out that my sugar cane drink has gone up from $1 to $1.20
My usual bowl of noodles at $3, has shrunken quite a bit
less minced meat
less pork
less 1 fish ball
etc...
Does anyone have the same feeling as me? I find that I am withdrawing money more regularly, and my money disappears faster. -
inflation !!!
and with the GSS just over, the next few months gonna see us all tightening our belts. and cost of living goes up and up, further aggravated by the 2% gst increase.
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walesa, i think the hawkers mean that their suppliers of ingredients such as oil, rice, sugar, noodles, etc... have increased their prices due to the gst increase. Most of these suppliers would have been large companies that are gst-registered.
so the oil, rice, sugar, etc are now more expensive to the hawkers. so the hawkers pass these cost increases to us.
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I get your point, but the fact remains hawkers (which just about cover most since only a select handful would actually yield revenues of $1 million per annum), despite having to shoulder higher operation costs from their suppliers, are not legitimately allowed to use GST as the de-facto reason for the price increase. Addressing the point someone mentioned earlier, it's precisely practices like these which makes it impossible for anyone to effectively clamp down on GST-related profiteering practises...Originally posted by Elodan:walesa, i think the hawkers mean that their suppliers of ingredients such as oil, rice, sugar, noodles, etc... have increased their prices due to the gst increase. Most of these suppliers would have been large companies that are gst-registered.
so the oil, rice, sugar, etc are now more expensive to the hawkers. so the hawkers pass these cost increases to us.
Of course, there're a billion ways to get round that loophole if they want to increase the prices - for a start, they could just give the excuse of an increase in operation costs or they could very well not give a reason at all. -
This is dumb; there is NO WAY to curb or control or stop business operators - be they hawkers or MNCs - from passing the increased in GST to us consumers. This is the same stupidity is their idiocy to introduce Casinos and then setup an agency or sorts to curb locals from Irresponsible Gambling....
It smacks of LPPL all the way...! How stupid can they get??
Even if hawkers are not allowed to charge extra because of increased in GST, their prices will still NEED TO go up because of material or supply cost increase due to the same cause. In the end, we pay more for a bowl of noodles or eat less of what we usually get for S$2.50 bowl of say, Prawn Noodles...
Either pay more, or be short changed for the amount we pay.
And the government says this is to help the poor... right...
Is it helping ANYONE now apart from themselves as the government who insisted on the increase??? -
This is what I am highlighting as well, Thanks ShutterbugOriginally posted by ShutterBug:This is dumb; there is NO WAY to curb or control or stop business operators - be they hawkers or MNCs - from passing the increased in GST to us consumers. This is the same stupidity is their idiocy to introduce Casinos and then setup an agency or sorts to curb locals from Irresponsible Gambling....
It smacks of LPPL all the way...! How stupid can they get??
Even if hawkers are not allowed to charge extra because of increased in GST, their prices will still NEED TO go up because of material or supply cost increase due to the same cause. In the end, we pay more for a bowl of noodles or eat less of what we usually get for S$2.50 bowl of say, Prawn Noodles...
Either pay more, or be short changed for the amount we pay.
And the government says this is to help the poor... right...
Is it helping ANYONE now apart from themselves as the government who insisted on the increase???
My grudge with the Govt is that, instead of makinglife better for citizens, they now give retailers/businesses more excuses to raise price. As I mentioned before, who can stop these people from raising prices becoz of GST, but gave a reason of increased costs? No one checks on them, and even if the govt says no one should profit from GST, its stupid, becoz its almost impossible to enforce.
In the first place, what is the reason for raising GST??? Help the poor or kill the poor?
Only the stupid animal Gazelle cannot see the truth, I hope the rest (anti or pro PAP) can see what the GST is doing NOW.
GST is to KILL the poor and make the rich richer -
Originally posted by walesa:
and the govt is NOT helping by increasing the GST.
I get your point, but the fact remains hawkers (which just about cover most since only a select handful would actually yield revenues of $1 million per annum), despite having to shoulder higher operation costs from their suppliers, are not [b]legitimately allowed to use GST as the de-facto reason for the price increase. Addressing the point someone mentioned earlier, it's precisely practices like these which makes it impossible for anyone to effectively clamp down on GST-related profiteering practises...
Of course, there're a billion ways to get round that loophole if they want to increase the prices - for a start, they could just give the excuse of an increase in operation costs or they could very well not give a reason at all.[/b]
in the 1st place, why increase GST, when revenues are still healthy and huge?
I hate their statement 'Its better to increase in good times than in bad times'
The precise STUPID excuse they gave to retrench people in good times than in bad times, resulting in total loss of loyalty of companies, and making the society an even colder place to leave it. -
Government always talk c0ck...Originally posted by soul_rage:and the govt is NOT helping by increasing the GST.
in the 1st place, why increase GST, when revenues are still healthy and huge?
I hate their statement 'Its better to increase in good times than in bad times'
The precise STUPID excuse they gave to retrench people in good times than in bad times, resulting in total loss of loyalty of companies, and making the society an even colder place to leave it.
You think in Bad Times they will not increase or implement any of their Hard Knocks Policies???
Good Times, Bad Times, they will still INCREASE....
They are treating the people of Singapore like RETARDS...!!!
Because they know they can come up with the LAMEST of excuses or reasons and get away with it, coz... NO ONE dares protests...
But I Tell you, even a tamed domestic dog will one day bite when teased often and long enough... -
I am giving my fellow Singaporeans 1 last chance in the next elections. I will wait and see if the majority wake up their idea yet, and start giving the opposition a better voice.Originally posted by ShutterBug:Government always talk c0ck...
You think in Bad Times they will not increase or implement any of their Hard Knocks Policies???
Good Times, Bad Times, they will still INCREASE....
They are treating the people of Singapore like RETARDS...!!!
Because they know they can come up with the LAMEST of excuses or reasons and get away with it, coz... NO ONE dares protests...
But I Tell you, even a tamed domestic dog will one day bite when teased often and long enough...
If the next election, I see my fellow Singaporeans still behaving stupidly, then I will have truly given up on this land, coz at the end of the day, its hard to stand up and make yourself heard, when the rest don't want to chip in. -
I really salute u on this point but I wonder if local here can be crtical minded like the other tiger such as Korea, HK or Taiwan. The govt seemed toOriginally posted by soul_rage:I am giving my fellow Singaporeans 1 last chance in the next elections. I will wait and see if the majority wake up their idea yet, and start giving the opposition a better voice.
If the next election, I see my fellow Singaporeans still behaving stupidly, then I will have truly given up on this land, coz at the end of the day, its hard to stand up and make yourself heard, when the rest don't want to chip in.
praising themselves for the contributio for the past forty years. -
They smart to conduct election during good economic times.Originally posted by ShutterBug:Government always talk c0ck...
You think in Bad Times they will not increase or implement any of their Hard Knocks Policies???
Good Times, Bad Times, they will still INCREASE....
They are treating the people of Singapore like RETARDS...!!!
Because they know they can come up with the LAMEST of excuses or reasons and get away with it, coz... NO ONE dares protests...
But I Tell you, even a tamed domestic dog will one day bite when teased often and long enough... -
Who ever said increasing GST is good? Well, besides those criminals living in an utopia totally disconnected from reality. The flaw of this system stems from an overly-lax tax system which disproportionately favours the rich - in their desperate attempt to balance the books and sustain their bottomline, the fascists would obviously need to tax elsewhere to make up for the shortfall.Originally posted by soul_rage:and the govt is NOT helping by increasing the GST.
in the 1st place, why increase GST, when revenues are still healthy and huge?
I hate their statement 'Its better to increase in good times than in bad times'
The precise STUPID excuse they gave to retrench people in good times than in bad times, resulting in total loss of loyalty of companies, and making the society an even colder place to leave it.
It'd be unimaginable to think the richest people in any first world country actually enjoy the same staggered income tax rates up to a pre-determined ceiling, beyond which they enjoy a flat income tax rate of 20% - truth is, in most first world countries, it'd be a luxury if you even had a 20% flat rate for the top echelon, nevermind a staggered tax system that peaks at 20%.
What I'm trying to highlight is the legitimacy of using GST as a valid reason in raising prices. Put it this way : if you patronised a restaurant with an annual turnover of $1 million, chances are the difference (ie.5% and 7% GST) you pay for a meal (let's assume you're having the same dish at the same price) would be clearly demarcated on your bill upon payment. In that sense, you can see that your overall price has increased and that can be categorically - and legitimately - stated on the receipt. Evidently, this option is not available to hawkers on the basis that the hawkers cannot explicitly state the increase in prices is due to GST - that said, they can use just about any other method to raise prices. It's obvious this regime's foolish attempts (or at least, that's what their propaganda is supposed to do
) to clamp down on GST-profiteering to further reinforce its self-proclaimed "altruistic" motives are in vain simply because it's practically impossible to enforce. -
I just pop by the regular shop that I patronized yesterday to pick up some showering foam and facial products
Turns out the 2 regular shower foams I used had gone up one by 30 cents, and the other by 40 cents.
facial cleansers all went up generally by 10 to 30 cents
I read somewhere that the govt said there is no increase in prices of most products.
Again, I feel that all their reports are disconnected from the public. I have seen so many price increases, and yet they continue to insist there is not much increase overall. -
7%, the value look very small, but added become very big. Raw material increases by 7 %, sell to manufacturer increase by 7%, sell to seller increase by 7%, sell to customer increase by 7%, everything increase by 7%, etc. Overall added up is more than 7%. In the end transfer to customer. Media will interview people who will still said, it 2% increase, it OK, as long as service improved.
Overall, no improvement made but become worse. after a few year, it will increase again. This is just a indirect way of sucking income from the poor through tax. GST just a beautiful name of tax. It is called Government Sucking Tax.
A lot of cheap food stuff in the supermarket snap up in few minutes while the expensive stuff is left to rot. -
Government raises costs of supplies, and denies business operators their rights to raise prices to cover running costs?
I just wonder, how can they raise GST and not expect cost of common hawker foods to not go up as well?
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GST profiteering cases rise to highest level this year
By Wong Mun Wai, Channel NewsAsia | Posted: 15 July 2007 1733 hrs
SINGAPORE: The number of cases involving companies investigated for GST profiteering has shot up sharply to its highest level this year.
Latest statistics from the Committee Against Profiteering show the number of cases reported increased from 40 cases for the whole of June - to 57 this month (as of 12 July).
The bulk of the cases (36) relate to food - 23 concern stalls and 13 restaurants.
14 involve other companies such as carparks and a chain pharmacy.
Eight cases were deemed not relevant by the Committee.
The GST went up on 1 July.
In a separate survey covering close to 1300 stalls from hawker centres and coffee shops in June and earlier this month, 4.8 per cent (61 stalls) were found to have raised their prices.
Nearly half of them (27) came from central Singapore.
The least number came from the north-eastern zone.
The Statistics Department says the increases range from 10 to 50 cents.
Lower-priced items, like drinks, went up by 10 cents, while those selling at higher prices tended to increase by a bigger margin of 50 cents.
The survey was conducted 11-15 June and 2-6 July. - CNA/yy -
Just a little super simplified mathematics...Originally posted by jetabt767400:You can read my other post in related article.
I finish all the money given liao, it was like so little...
But I will continue looking for more related and interesting things...
GST increase = 2%
300 dollars from GST package
Amt to spend = 300 / 0.02 = SGD15000 before the offset package is spent finish on the extra GST.
However,
Suppose effective price increase = 5%
Suppose u get 100 dollars from the GST package.
That means u hv to spend SGD2000 to have use the the 100 dollars on that GST package.
For 2nd case, of course if you look at 100 dollars, it's little. But it is meant to offset extra GST, which means you hv to spend at least 2000 SGD to use up 100 dollars from the package... -
From http://singabloodypore.wordpress.com/2006/11/14/two-unrelated-matters-gst-increase-and-corporate-tax-decrease/Originally posted by walesa:Who ever said increasing GST is good? Well, besides those criminals living in an utopia totally disconnected from reality. The flaw of this system stems from an overly-lax tax system which disproportionately favours the rich - in their desperate attempt to balance the books and sustain their bottomline, the fascists would obviously need to tax elsewhere to make up for the shortfall.
It'd be unimaginable to think the richest people in any first world country actually enjoy the same staggered income tax rates up to a pre-determined ceiling, beyond which they enjoy a flat income tax rate of 20% - truth is, in most first world countries, it'd be a luxury if you even had a 20% flat rate for the top echelon, nevermind a staggered tax system that peaks at 20%.
What I'm trying to highlight is the legitimacy of using GST as a valid reason in raising prices. Put it this way : if you patronised a restaurant with an annual turnover of $1 million, chances are the difference (ie.5% and 7% GST) you pay for a meal (let's assume you're having the same dish at the same price) would be clearly demarcated on your bill upon payment. In that sense, you can see that your overall price has increased and that can be categorically - and legitimately - stated on the receipt. Evidently, this option is not available to hawkers on the basis that the hawkers cannot explicitly state the increase in prices is due to GST - that said, they can use just about any other method to raise prices. It's obvious this regime's foolish attempts (or at least, that's what their propaganda is supposed to do ) to clamp down on GST-profiteering to further reinforce its self-proclaimed "altruistic" motives are in vain simply because it's practically impossible to enforce.
1) SingaporeÂ’s goods and services tax will be increased by 2 percentage points 7 percent to finance social programs and help people with low incomes, local media cited the prime minister as saying Monday.
2) “When we implement the GST increase, it’s not a GST increase, it’s a package which will fully offset the impact of GST for these groups and begin to strengthen the safety nets and tilt the balance in favor of the lower income Singaporeans,” said Lee, according to radio station 938Live.
3) Lee also said income tax rates could be lowered in future, 938Live reported.
Pt 1
Means PAP not good enough to find other sources of income to finance their so called social programs?
Pt 2
A GST increase is not a GST increase? wtf is this guy saying... How can he tilt the balance in favour of the lower income Singaporeans when he himself has never started from one, nor fully understand the lifestyle and mindset of one?
Pt 3
In the past, income tax decrease and GST increase came together. That was still agreeable because u will be taxed more if and only if u spend more. But now? GST just increase without any increase in income. The CPF contribution from employers has not yet been restored to the previous high, and they want to increase the GST? His "could be" will most likely means NO WAY.
All in all, this GST increase is rather uncalled for. Yes, the GST package do help a little, but that little is never sufficient to cover a long-term GST increase; it is sufficient only for the short term.
From ministry of finance:
1) A surplus of $1.1 billion was expected for FY2007 during the budget speech.
=> You mean they couldn't draw from the surplus to finance pt 1?
2) The GST Offset Package will cost $4 billion over five years.
=> Wouldn't this 4 billion already finance a lot of social programs? Why rise the GST and give the Offset package?
The GST package does tilt the balance towards lower income, but ever so slightly. It is based on the assumption that lower income spend less, and thus pay less GST than those who spend more (the rich). There are surely other ways to achieve this, and that's the job of the PAP. -
The GST package does tilt the balance towards lower income, but ever so slightly. It is based on the assumption that lower income spend less, and thus pay less GST than those who spend more (the rich). There are surely other ways to achieve this, and that's the job of the PAP.
Ditto that. They should quit yabbering and start showing us why we're overpaying them for. We want results, solutions, not empty talk and sneaky taichi... -
That's a point not too hard to miss, is it? I'd imagine anyone with an IQ in the range of 3 digits to be able to work that out.Originally posted by eagle:Pt 1
Means PAP not good enough to find other sources of income to finance their so called social programs?Originally posted by eagle:Pt 2
A GST increase is not a GST increase? wtf is this guy saying... How can he tilt the balance in favour of the lower income Singaporeans when he himself has never started from one, nor fully understand the lifestyle and mindset of one?
Pt 3
In the past, income tax decrease and GST increase came together. That was still agreeable because u will be taxed more if and only if u spend more. But now? GST just increase without any increase in income. The CPF contribution from employers has not yet been restored to the previous high, and they want to increase the GST? His "could be" will most likely means NO WAY.
All in all, this GST increase is rather uncalled for. Yes, the GST package do help a little, but that little is never sufficient to cover a long-term GST increase; it is sufficient only for the short term.
If someone could make a comfortable living through committing arm robberies repeatedly and get away scot-free, would you expect him to halt his crime sprees on his own accord? More importantly, would you find it reasonable to expect a robber - who risks his freedom through his criminal actiivities - to share his loot? That should answer those two issues you raised comfortably.Originally posted by eagle:Does this bunch of tyrants care a hoot if their logic make sense? After all, the correlation drawn between GST and income tax variations is no more significant than telling a monk not to worry about the ensuing increase in the price of hair gel.
From ministry of finance:
1) A surplus of $1.1 billion was expected for FY2007 during the budget speech.
=> You mean they couldn't draw from the surplus to finance pt 1?
2) The GST Offset Package will cost $4 billion over five years.
=> Wouldn't this 4 billion already finance a lot of social programs? Why rise the GST and give the Offset package?
If you ever need a rational explanation governing the conduct of the tyrants running this regime, just think along the lines of the modus operandi that govern the principles of organised crime - that is certainly one parallel this regime has in abundance with their more notorious mates. -
Hey hey, not that I don't want to vote for the opposition, but I don't get to vote cause I live in Tanjong Pagar GRC...Originally posted by soul_rage:I am giving my fellow Singaporeans 1 last chance in the next elections. I will wait and see if the majority wake up their idea yet, and start giving the opposition a better voice.
If the next election, I see my fellow Singaporeans still behaving stupidly, then I will have truly given up on this land, coz at the end of the day, its hard to stand up and make yourself heard, when the rest don't want to chip in.