13% of students who borrowed from parents' CPF accounts have
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go work lah teenagers! what study uni uni uni... end up only start to find work at like 30 years old plus or something
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Seriously, what's wrong if CPF decides to come up with the "as if it has never been touched" policy? The amount of interest to the individual may not be much and it does not really matter. They key is leaving the CPF status quo.Originally posted by dragg:how much do you think the interest is? do you seriously think it will make a difference to your retirement status?
they use the money for investment purposes!!!
Can you not understand this point by looking from their perspective? Or do you choose to look only from your own?
However, you won't be wrong to say that the govt uses the interest as part of their investments. Like a double edged sword.
There used to be a time when CPF stipulated that all CPF investments, if terminated and returned to the CPF, should include interest as well. That ruling has since been removed in 2002.
The main purpose was to keep Singaporeans' CPF meant for retirement status quo. However, the govt then realised that not all investments made money and that many Singaporeans were penalised by paying cash. -
The most curious thing is that the pro-Govt morons always say GIC and Temasek add value to our reserves etc. etc.
The question is, why isn't this "added value" filtering down to us? I guess that's the prize money question, which won't be answered unless... -
Someone forgot to mention that flipping burgers in the UK can net you at least 8 pounds sterling an hour.
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which is roughly if i am not wrong, SGD$24Originally posted by LazerLordz:Someone forgot to mention that flipping burgers in the UK can net you at least 8 pounds sterling an hour. -
Originally posted by jianfish9:
U all still haven realised the focus
Simply outrageous. If I got the money in my cpf to give kids an education then I should be allowed to do so. Whether they want to return me anot is another matter altogether.
How much money I have left in my cpf for my retirement is none of the govt concern. Its not like the government will is going to have to provide welfare to you if you run out of retirement funds. Moreover, the 20k that your kid borrow from your cpf will probably last you an extra year at most.
What type of parents would want their kids to be flipping burgers during their studies? I definitely want to give my child the best and its using my own money.
Education is the best investment.
Yes go on about your monies and how u should manage it.
But truth is the when u run out of your funds,the government has to provides some form of support to you when u are old and do not have the needed funds to see u through.
Although singapore is a no-welfare society,the government however will concern themselve with you because homeless people on the streets tarnish 'beautiful' singapore in the image.
And stop revolving around the "my money my way"
Because most of the times people create shyt but yet they who did it do not have the means to clear it.
To lazerlord:
The poorer students who do not have financial aid yet desperatly want to study will have the determination to pull through the 3 years even if it means flipping burgers after school.
Not everyone submit to external factors like you.
No loan,no cpf and no cash=giving up just like that?
Go on whinning about why do u not hold rights our your cpf saving and how because of that u can't provide higher education for your children.
Facts are those horses aren't going to change their policy any time.
So what are u going to do?
Whine and at the same time pray for a opposition triumph?
Flipping burgers to pay for your educations is HELL ALOT BETTER than those who whines and does nothing to it,waiting around to chance upon miracle.
If so,these people truly fail in life. -
fwah.. u repeated how many sems?Originally posted by 798:to dated, i have this cpf loan, computer loan n study loan (ocbc), it will take me a long time to repay back.
imagine i was irritiated like hell by cpf board of sending me letters over n over again to pay up during my uni days every 6 sems. n i had to waste time sending them defer letters to tell them i am still studying.
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I don't know what you are advocating...Originally posted by boka:U all still haven realised the focus
Yes go on about your monies and how u should manage it.
But truth is the when u run out of your funds,the government has to provides some form of support to you when u are old and do not have the needed funds to see u through.
Although singapore is a no-welfare society,the government however will concern themselve with you because homeless people on the streets tarnish 'beautiful' singapore in the image.
And stop revolving around the "my money my way"
Because most of the times people create shyt but yet they who did it do not have the means to clear it.
To lazerlord:
The poorer students who do not have financial aid yet desperatly want to study will have the determination to pull through the 3 years even if it means flipping burgers after school.
Not everyone submit to external factors like you.
No loan,no cpf and no cash=giving up just like that?
Go on whinning about why do u not hold rights our your cpf saving and how because of that u can't provide higher education for your children.
Facts are those horses aren't going to change their policy any time.
So what are u going to do?
Whine and at the same time pray for a opposition triumph?
Flipping burgers to pay for your educations is HELL ALOT BETTER than those who whines and does nothing to it,waiting around to chance upon miracle.
If so,these people truly fail in life.
That kids should find someway to sponsor their own education and not be provided for by parents?
Then why the hell do parents have to work so hard for if not to care for their childern.
If you are poor, no better way out than investing in a good education. -
Boka, you really show yourself to be one heck of a tar brush Van Gogh.
I truly wonder if you have really lived a life on both sides of the wealth coin, you would be that flippant with your words.
I expected that sort of consideration for the more liberal-leaning opinions of others then.Hardly surprising how libertarianism can fail to take root when all you can wank on is flipping burgers.
Methinks your one-dimensional arguments about students flipping burgers and your comparison to people in the United Kingdom, is flippin bollocks.
Consider yourself entertained, and don't come bleating when they nip away at more of your fundamental liberties which you seem so glad to deem optional. -
Save your breath mate.Originally posted by jianfish9:I don't know what you are advocating...
That kids should find someway to sponsor their own education and not be provided for by parents?
Then why the hell do parents have to work so hard for if not to care for their childern.
If you are poor, no better way out than investing in a good education.
I'm all for kids helping to pay for their own education, but to look down on parents who wish to help their children to acheive a leg-up in life, is something abhorrent and lacking in logic, not to mention simple decency.
If working at Macs can put one through University in Singapore, we wouldn't need any elderly workers anymore. But that is clearly not the case.
Someone needs a lesson in comparative sustainability of actions and wages. -
I say let CPF continue to be used for education, otherwise like Bladez87 put it: "The rich get their education and the poor don't. Rich poor divide worsens."
And lower the prices of HDBs....... Oh no, that can't happen because a lot of Singaporeans will be screwed. So how? Let's all continue to have little money in our CPF for retirement because of high HDB prices.
There's simply no turning back. The govt can only continue to rectify mistake with mistake and now.... by contemplating the removal of usage of CPF for education. -
Ethical aspect.Originally posted by jianfish9:I don't know what you are advocating...
That kids should find someway to sponsor their own education and not be provided for by parents?
Then why the hell do parents have to work so hard for if not to care for their childern.
If you are poor, no better way out than investing in a good education.
I do not directly mean that parents should not support their kids but In scenarios where we have horses pulling strings on policies,shouldn't children step out and work for their educations instead of complaining why they are not able to take the DIRECT route of enrolling Poly after o level or Uni's after NS.
If kids are going to feel angry because they do not have the comfort of hiccup free education then isn't it obvious they are over pampered.
I leave it for u think ponder over the mentality that is inculated within the minds of youngsters.
Financial apsect
I don't have to say more.
No financial aids or restricted acess to funds jolly well means the person work his way up with his bare hands.
Laugh all u want at flipping burgers until u see what most college/uni kids are doing to pay their fees. -
That wasn't at all close to what i meant.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Save your breath mate.
I'm all for kids helping to pay for their own education, but to look down on parents who wish to help their children to acheive a leg-up in life, is something abhorrent and lacking in logic, not to mention simple decency. If working at Macs can put one through University in Singapore, we wouldn't need any elderly workers anymore. But that is clearly not the case.
Someone needs a lesson in comparative sustainability of actions and wages.
What i meant was i look down upon kids who whine because they cannot take the direct smooth path of education.
i do not look down upon those who when unable to pay for their poly fees,serve their NS and save up for poly but i do snigger on those who are unable to enroll into a poly due to financial issues but yet whining instead of doign soemthing about it.
Does that clear the air -
Well, if you want to look at it from in a poly context, then I've not much beef with that.
Personally, poly and jc kids fall into the same zone. No one forces them to go poly at all.. -
why would u want to put the issue of elderly worker into this picture?Originally posted by LazerLordz:Save your breath mate.
I'm all for kids helping to pay for their own education, but to look down on parents who wish to help their children to acheive a leg-up in life, is something abhorrent and lacking in logic, not to mention simple decency.
If working at Macs can put one through University in Singapore, we wouldn't need any elderly workers anymore. But that is clearly not the case.
Someone needs a lesson in comparative sustainability of actions and wages.
but since u said so,i'll tell u why.
Because most people are proud bunches and would rather engage in a more glamourous job to pay for their educations than settle for flipping burgers.
They would rather..
1-whine about the cpf policy
2-loans
All the suffer-free althernatives.
but then again this proves my point about whiney singpaporeans. -
Doesn't make sense.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Well, if you want to look at it from in a poly context, then I've not much beef with that.
Personally, poly and jc kids fall into the same zone. No one forces them to go poly at all..
Why not say forget the degree.
No one force them to go through the agony of seeking financial aid for their uni fees -
Whiny eh?Originally posted by boka:why would u want to put the issue of elderly worker into this picture?
but since u said so,i'll tell u why.
Because most people are proud bunches and would rather engage in a more glamourous job to pay for their educations than settle for flipping burgers.
They would rather..
1-whine about the cpf policy
2-loans
All the suffer-free althernatives.
but then again this proves my point about whiney singpaporeans.
Oh I'm definitely 'avin a laugh. -
Why don't you forgo being connected to the Internet? It's a choice and you won't have to talk to people you deem as whiny as well.Originally posted by boka:Doesn't make sense.
Why not say forget the degree.
No one force them to go through the agony of seeking financial aid for their uni fees
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[b][i]Originally posted by boka:I'm not with the government but this is one policy which i feel should be enforced.
most of the ageing population do not have enough savings for their retirement and if the govenment allow them to withdraw their cpf's for children's education purpose,guess what are these people going to have to eat after they retire?
Singaporean are a bunch of fucktards who thinks A SMOOTH EDUCATION PATH IS NATURALLY THEIRS.
THINK AGAIN.
THEY HAVE BEEN SPOONFED SINCE PRIMARY SCHOOL WITH EVERYTHING PAID FOR BY THE GOVERNMENT.
Thus,they take it for granted that there should be any hiccup along their learning process.
If u don not have the means to support yourself thro uni or poly,then start working and save up.
There's already13% who have not return the $ so i believe this is set to follow a tread especially with mentality of our youngsters.
I always respected the americans who work for few years or some even till they are 50years old before enrolling into a university.
hahaha. boka, u r such a joker. EVERYTHING PAID FOR BY THE GOVERNMENT!!!??? can u wake up ur fucking idea. did u not realize that in many countries, education is either provided for free or at a minimum cost??? e.g: Brunei. Free pri education, and sudsidised fees frm secondary onwards.
Tertiary education in EU is either free or at a minimum cost for its citizens. And non-citizens too, i think. My friend in Germany pays no tuition fee man! how nice!
pappy pappy, come here! *woof woof* -
With the greatest respect, would you consider a robber who robs a million bucks from someone and returns him a thousand as having good intentions?Originally posted by Rock^Star:I believe the govt has good intentions here. The repayment with interest is meant to ensure as if your parent's CPF has never been touched. This helps one towards the accumulation of retirement funds.
After all, isn't all this criminal fund conveniently used as an excuse for the regime to absolve itself of responsibility and obligations to its citizenry - when you further consider this as a viable source of income for their investment purposes (whose returns hardly benefit the "shareholders" to begin with), what could be better?
In essence, how different is this whole scheme of controlling the folks' hard-earned money by force for their own personal use from money-laundering? The only difference between illegitimate money-launderers and those who are empowered to do so is the latter having the backing of some warped Constitution which would be unconstitutional in any part of the free world.
As a matter of fact, if the average Joe had the backing of the Constitution to run such scams, I'm sure everyone would be more than happy to exercise such "good intentions". -
Your concerns are logical, but the reasoning behind this regime's actions (and if you support it, your stance too) is flawed. Fundamentally, the principle here entails the interests of civil liberties and even fundamental human rights.Originally posted by boka:very good point but what happens when u depleted your savings and your children is unable to return or does not want to return.
Put it this way - if you should see your neighbour or mum lose his savings at the legalised gambling avenues, do you have a legitimate right to stop him/her from gambling? I mean, at the end of the day, one has to live with whatever decision one chooses to take - that's life.
The crux of the issue here is having the choice taken away from you and having a bunch of despots making the decision for you, which is binding upon you without your consent. -
given the mainstream now, theres no way a 16 yrs old can afford to pay for his poly education without the help of parents
i m equally disgusted with the rising age limit and the min sum for withdrawal, as mentioned by soemone it is to smoothed the cashflow of our GICs
and i do agree in my opinion, somehow the "wealth made there" wasnt somehow passed down the line
many questions are not answered as well, including the messed up suzhou project, spending 500k to rename "marina bay" , end result is still "marina bay"
or tearing down the few hundred thousand water artefact at power building 2 weeks after they completed it.
they somehow dont see the big picture as us, the common man does,
why are their outstanding debts not paid ?
1. the students are still in NS, NS allowance is so pathetic until my banglas earn more than me when i was in NS, if they want the debt to be repaid . then have some justification on the NS allowance.
2. students jus beginning to work, y debts not paid, cos our students are getting such low pay, someone here wanted to compare US
so let me tell u, US fresh tetiary grads earn ard 40-50k per yr USD as their starting pay,
i give u a more detail example, my sis JC mate migrated to the US earning 17USD per hr as a part time usher, if u convert to 8hrs x 20 work days, she would earn 2.7K USD = $4k SGD, 4k SGD u definitely can get managers with experience here, compare to a part time student usher in US.
publich housing and transport was an essential means of living for many pple ard the world, n mostly are subsidised heavily ard the world
but back here, it has tuned into a money making prophecy , once u signed on the dotted line for ur freaking puny pigeon hole that prolly cost a quarter million
u be bound for debts for the next 2 decades for your life.
my US colleague gave me a good comparison between a normal US citizen and the a normal SG citizen
he mention, SG citizen , u slog n pay for your debts ur whole life, in US, living standards is good, things are cheap n ur pay is high
PLUS ur employer dun require to stay for OT un necessarily
a reason was mentioned, we have to keep the savings for our parents,
if u want to raise the min age withdrawal to keep the workforce going, fine,
BUT, they encouraged local companies to employ the older workforce, i dun see them doing it themselves, older workers are mainly employed jus for manual work, as temps, earning mayb 7 dollars and hr
not to mention, during retrenchment exercises, older workers gets the AXE
so if older workers do get equal employment as the younger workforce, i think this "compulsory savings" thing might not come into critical pay
as army says, if u want to lead, pls lead by example
basically the article, jus looks like crap to me, cos its like a good effort to cover up their own system, if u breakdown the whole system like i did
from NS to housing, to older workforce employment, u will see the big picture
u guys are doomed for milk cows all ur life
well done 66.6% -
do i need to see from their perspective when it comes to my own hard-earned money?Originally posted by Rock^Star:Seriously, what's wrong if CPF decides to come up with the "as if it has never been touched" policy? The amount of interest to the individual may not be much and it does not really matter. They key is leaving the CPF status quo.
Can you not understand this point by looking from their perspective? Or do you choose to look only from your own?
However, you won't be wrong to say that the govt uses the interest as part of their investments. Like a double edged sword.
there used to be a time when CPF stipulated that all CPF investments, if terminated and returned to the CPF, should include interest as well. That ruling has since been removed in 2002.
The main purpose was to keep Singaporeans' CPF meant for retirement status quo. However, the govt then realised that not all investments made money and that many Singaporeans were penalised by paying cash.
why do i need their permission as to when i can use my own hard-earned money?
you are broke and desperate but cant use any of your cpf funds. is that right?
you borrow from a bank and pay sky high interest when you could have actually use your own cpf money? is that right? -
Instead of stopping, they should implement like compulsory installment return to their parent's CPF account after the students start working.
