All Singaporeans are sheeps. Ready for the slaughter!
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Hi, SuperProPAP, he is a kid still studying. Don't know at that moment when he read this forum what was on his mind, strange.Originally posted by SuperProPAP:You start working already? You got eyes to read the freaking newspaper? Please little boy, don't come in and shoot just for the sake of it. You want to defend at least go and read the newspaper first la! -
After election, I asked the friends and relatives working in govt sector, they said they voted for PAP for fear.Originally posted by mett:I don't have concrete proof, nor have I been extensively researching. However, I do have 6 or 7 friends in the govt. sector openly admitting doing so. Granted, that's not even close to a tiny, micro "sample" but it does provide one of the main reasons why you hear so many grumbling murmurs throughout the island and yet no massive impact on the elections. -
Originally posted by royston_ang:
Firstly lets look at the type government we have.
The serial number on ballot papers and recording of voter's registration number made it traceable as to which party I have voted in the election. Therefore, despite the reassurance of ballot secrecy, if I am a civil servant with my job, housing, promotion at stake, I may have probably voted for PAP too to be safe.
mancha, if you are in that position, will you risk everything you have just to vote with a clear conscience?
Ours is never a government with a secret police that round up any dissident at will. Forumers here that spout derogatory remarks against the government and the PAP are still around to continue to do so, atest to that.
Saddam Hussein commanded a 100% mandate from the people of Iraq. If I were in a situation as Iraq during Saddam Hussein's time, I would vote with sense.
But this is Singapore.
There are no secrets in Singapore. When LHL first wife died just after giving birth, the whole of Singapore knew what exactly happened within 2 days.
So how can anyone in Singapore dig up the ballots, look for a particular serial number, without your friend's friend brother, or neighbour knowing about it. It is a political nuclear disaster, if it is ever leaked out that anyone has even attempted to go near the boxes.
Civil servants, who have any clout at all, are educated way above yokels, know that they can vote as they wish with impunity, and no one would know how they voted.
I believe in the system, therefore I will vote the party I want to vote for.
A vote for the PAP is a vote cast in fear, a vote for the SDP must be a genuine vote.
Is that your take? -
With the technological advancement these days, it's not too difficult to attach a small IR or UV camera to a table lamp, the camera would be capable of reading things not visible to the naked eye.Originally posted by mancha:Firstly lets look at the type government we have.
Ours is never a government with a secret police that round up any dissident at will. Forumers here that spout derogatory remarks against the government and the PAP are still around to continue to do so, atest to that.
Saddam Hussein commanded a 100% mandate from the people of Iraq. If I were in a situation as Iraq during Saddam Hussein's time, I would vote with sense.
But this is Singapore.
There are no secrets in Singapore. When LHL first wife died just after giving birth, the whole of Singapore knew what exactly happened within 2 days.
So how can anyone in Singapore dig up the ballots, look for a particular serial number, without your friend's friend brother, or neighbour knowing about it. It is a political nuclear disaster, if it is ever leaked out that anyone has even attempted to go near the boxes.
Civil servants, who have any clout at all, are educated way above yokels, know that they can vote as they wish with impunity, and no one would know how they voted.
I believe in the system, therefore I will vote the party I want to vote for.
A vote for the PAP is a vote cast in fear, a vote for the SDP must be a genuine vote.
Is that your take?
There is no need to use archaic methods of breaking open ballot boxes.
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Forumer/ blogger are responsible for whatever they write in forum/ blog, as the gov may take action against the forumer/ blogger for the remark made. Which is why Singaporeans practice self-censorship for whatever remark they made to protect themselves.Originally posted by mancha:Firstly lets look at the type government we have.
Ours is never a government with a secret police that round up any dissident at will. Forumers here that spout derogatory remarks against the government and the PAP are still around to continue to do so, atest to that.
But this is Singapore.
There are no secrets in Singapore. When LHL first wife died just after giving birth, the whole of Singapore knew what exactly happened within 2 days.
So how can anyone in Singapore dig up the ballots, look for a particular serial number, without your friend's friend brother, or neighbour knowing about it. It is a political nuclear disaster, if it is ever leaked out that anyone has even attempted to go near the boxes.
Civil servants, who have any clout at all, are educated way above yokels, know that they can vote as they wish with impunity, and no one would know how they voted.
I believe in the system, therefore I will vote the party I want to vote for.
A vote for the PAP is a vote cast in fear, a vote for the SDP must be a genuine vote.
Is that your take?
As to LHL wife died just after giving birth, I don't see why the need to make that a secret? Is it top-secret?
There's no secret in Singapore, how do you know? It wouldn't be a secret if you do, right?
Civil servants are educated but when everything they have are at stake, anyone will think twice regardless of their education level. Especially the higher position you are, the greater the stake.
I have no idea if a vote for PAP is out of fear or a genuine vote, but unless the election department of Singapore stop recording ballot paper with the voter's registration number, we will never know.
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You did not get the point about no secrets in Singapore.
Singapore is a small place, and news travel fast.
Somebody always know somebody else's somebody.
And people talk.
So vote tracing cannot be done covertly.
The Fear Factor of the civil servants is largely an exaggeration of the detractors of the government electoral system, rather than the actual fear of the civil servants themselves.
Civil servants are more intelligent than presumed to be. -
What is the purpose of having serial numbers on the ballot paper?Originally posted by mancha:You did not get the point about no secrets in Singapore.
Singapore is a small place, and news travel fast.
Somebody always know somebody else's somebody.
And people talk.
So vote tracing cannot be done covertly.
The Fear Factor of the civil servants is largely an exaggeration of the detractors of the government electoral system, rather than the actual fear of the civil servants themselves.
Civil servants are more intelligent than presumed to be. -
I don't know how true is this.Originally posted by mancha:You did not get the point about no secrets in Singapore.
Singapore is a small place, and news travel fast.
Somebody always know somebody else's somebody.
And people talk.
So vote tracing cannot be done covertly.
The Fear Factor of the civil servants is largely an exaggeration of the detractors of the government electoral system, rather than the actual fear of the civil servants themselves.
Civil servants are more intelligent than presumed to be.
But do you remember the recent election, the issue regarding Mr. Ling How Doong. He came out from the counting center stating that they put the ballot paper under a lamp for an abnormally long period of time. Mr. Ling also said, he does not know why the lamps were there, because the hall was brightly lit without the lamps (I think he said even a blind man can see).
Another issue is about redrawing of the constituency boundary, they keep changing it, suspect that they know the voters ballot, that's why they shift the boundaries to get better margins.
But these are pure speculation, only circumstantial. -
So you believe everything you read in the freaking pro-PAP govt controlled newspaper?Originally posted by SuperProPAP:You start working already? You got eyes to read the freaking newspaper? Please little boy, don't come in and shoot just for the sake of it. You want to defend at least go and read the newspaper first la!
They tell you it is good means it is good? Well done! You are as smart as LHL's son! -
I think you have mixed up gossip and secret. Gossip and rumor travel fast, but secret don't.Originally posted by mancha:You did not get the point about no secrets in Singapore.
Singapore is a small place, and news travel fast.
Somebody always know somebody else's somebody.
And people talk.
So vote tracing cannot be done covertly.
The Fear Factor of the civil servants is largely an exaggeration of the detractors of the government electoral system, rather than the actual fear of the civil servants themselves.
Civil servants are more intelligent than presumed to be.
I already stressed that I have no idea how much influence the fear factor have on the civil servant, unless removal of recording ballot serial number with voter registration number to ensure true confidentiality of the voter's vote. -
Many here prefer gossip and half truth. Since my Navy's days, this must vote for PAP rumor had long been around..... Mainly those ppl who didn't get their promotion will use it as an excuse to 'comfort' themselve why didn't they get a higher rank.Originally posted by royston_ang:I think you have mixed up gossip and secret. Gossip and rumor travel fast, but secret don't.
I already stressed that I have no idea how much influence the fear factor have on the civil servant, unless removal of recording ballot serial number with voter registration number to ensure true confidentiality of the voter's vote.
As to why there is a registration number on each vote...... IMHO, it is so as to check if there really is a voter.... example - the total number of voter in this area is 100. But the total number of votes is beyond that.... lets say 105. Who the heck are this five person
With registration number, both the Opps and the Govt could now trace the names, and find out who & which are the false vote. -
very simple. to make sure the ballet papers are real and authentic when counting votes.Originally posted by googoomuck:What is the purpose of having serial numbers on the ballot paper?
If no serial number, you make copy & make fake ones, and vote as many time as you want.
If no serial number, You issue 100 ballet paper. Dun be surprised you get more than 100 ballet paper in the vote box.
Like our curency, no serial number, counterfeits syndicate suka suak print.
get the idea? -
Originally posted by royston_ang:
So what do u think the PAP Govt can do to you
The serial number on ballot papers and recording of voter's registration number made it traceable as to which party I have voted in the election. Therefore, despite the reassurance of ballot secrecy, if I am a civil servant with my job, housing, promotion at stake, I may have probably voted for PAP too to be safe.
mancha, if you are in that position, will you [b]risk everything you have just to vote with a clear conscience? [/b] Demote u overnight Take away your HDB flat Ur ERP or COE is higher Deny u children a place at school Or send someone killed you WHAT ARE U SCARE OFF 
U are acting in FEAR of something that is not proven at all. All are just rumor spoken in whisper. Why the Hell as a grown person would you be scare What is the worst they could do to you Are you telling me that civil servant gets promotion only after a election year..... on any other years there isn't any promotion -
Not all Singaporeans are sheep - except for a Singapore Gazelle wearing some macho-sheep is always eveready to be slaughtered. -
Originally posted by Atobe:
Atobe... with all due respect, I've always consider you a fair-minded person. U have always been able to support your views with facts & figures.... and also your great master of English.
Not all Singaporeans are sheep - except for a Singapore Gazelle wearing some [b]macho-sheep is always eveready to be slaughtered.
[/b]
But this 'War' between U and Gazelle must stop lah. Most ppl who read and wrote here already knows fully well what type of person Gazelle or even the MIA OxfordMushroom is..... there isn't a point to all this name calling.
And if Gazelle could just stop the name calling him/herself. Sometimes he/she have also a few good pointer or idea. Pls remember we are not CLONES..... non of us could agree on everything. Thats why we must learn to - ''Agree to disagree'' - -
It's an election stratagem.....if you ask the keen observers.Originally posted by Troy437:very simple. to make sure the ballet papers are real and authentic when counting votes.
If no serial number, you make copy & make fake ones, and vote as many time as you want.
If no serial number, You issue 100 ballet paper. Dun be surprised you get more than 100 ballet paper in the vote box.
Like our curency, no serial number, counterfeits syndicate suka suak print.
get the idea? -
Originally posted by hloc:
Many thanks for your kind words, unfortunately there is nothing personal in this sgFroums. It is simple and pure fun with a pure dickhead, who poke his head into any and everything, and having some kind of insatiable masochistic fetish for more pain to be inflicted.
[b]Atobe... with all due respect, I've always consider you a fair-minded person. U have always been able to support your views with facts & figures.... and also your great master of English.
But this 'War' between U and Gazelle must stop lah. Most ppl who read and wrote here already knows fully well what type of person Gazelle or even the MIA OxfordMushroom is..... there isn't a point to all this name calling.
And if Gazelle could just stop the name calling him/herself. Sometimes he/she have also a few good pointer or idea. Pls remember we are not CLONES..... non of us could agree on everything. Thats why we must learn to - ''Agree to disagree'' - [/b]
Its fulfilling his wish to engage any and everyone. -
Yes, the serial number is necessary to ensure that the ballet papers are authentic. But is the ballet papers issued randomly to the voters? Or is each ballet paper issued to a designated voter?Originally posted by Troy437:very simple. to make sure the ballet papers are real and authentic when counting votes.
If no serial number, you make copy & make fake ones, and vote as many time as you want.
If no serial number, You issue 100 ballet paper. Dun be surprised you get more than 100 ballet paper in the vote box.
Like our curency, no serial number, counterfeits syndicate suka suak print.
get the idea?
If the ballet papers are issued randomly to the voters, then the serial number on the ballet paper are not traceable to the voter and the ballet paper still can be authenticated.
However, if each ballet paper is only issued to a designated voter and can't be swapped, then the voters vote can be traced.
I have never gotten a chance to vote due to my GRC so I am not sure which is true, but I do heard of people complaining that they were denied option to swap their ballet paper with another which I don't see any reason why. -
I know what you mean..... but to do as Gazelle is doing only pull u down to his level. Why lower your own standingOriginally posted by Atobe:Many thanks for your kind words, unfortunately there is nothing personal in this sgFroums. It is simple and pure fun with a pure dickhead, who poke his head into any and everything, and having some kind of insatiable masochistic fetish for more pain to be inflicted.
Its fulfilling his wish to engage any and everyone. -
Originally posted by hloc:
Well, I still stick to my opinion that if the ballet paper with serial number are issued only to designated voter, then there will always be possibility of voters' vote being swayed due to fear factor.
So what do u think the PAP Govt can do to you Demote u overnight Take away your HDB flat Ur ERP or COE is higher Deny u children a place at school Or send someone killed you [b]WHAT ARE U SCARE OFF
U are acting in FEAR of something that is not proven at all. All are just rumor spoken in whisper. Why the Hell as a grown person would you be scare What is the worst they could do to you Are you telling me that civil servant gets promotion only after a election year..... on any other years there isn't any promotion
[/b]
On the other hand, if the ballet paper with serial number are issued randomly, then I rest my case and agreed that the process is fair. -
While I don't disagree with you on the fact that each vote could be trace. I have to disagree about whos to blame for the fear factor thing.Originally posted by royston_ang:Well, I still stick to my opinion that if the ballet paper with serial number are issued only to designated voter, then there will always be possibility of voters' vote being swayed due to fear factor.
On the other hand, if the ballet paper with serial number are issued randomly, then I rest my case and agreed that the process is fair.
Example -
It is now the luner 7th mth - Hungry Ghost Festival - It is suppose that Ghost is roaming the world right now. Many Chinese S'porean will avoid travelling, changing house, Married... etc, just in case.
The fact that does Ghost exsist or not is and most likely never be proven. But that won't stop Chinese S'porean behave the way they are behaving.....
Therefore it is the same here...... this rumor have been around since PAP won their 1st election. Everyone here is quoting someone beside him/herself of doing it out of fear..... Non have said - example - that he/she was told that the next promotion would be theirs..... but after the election, their boss now act blur and say the promotion is now no longer on the table.
All we have is a branch of ppl who is scare of shadow..... as if there is a promotion every year. -
Originally posted by hloc:
You said prove it you muthafarker. I shared with you my colleagues experiences and now you are turning it around and scolding them. DO YOU KNOW THE MEANING OF WHAT IF YOU MUTHAFARKER. I showed you examples of people voting for the fucking government because of their fucking fears. Get that into your stupid pig brain.
I sign on 6 yrs in the Navy. Work as a tech onboard a PC (patrol craft), [b]P70 RSS FREEDOM, under 182 SQN in the Navy. ROD in 1998. Work for SMRT as a Train Officer since then..... before SMRT IPO.... consider under Govt also.....
I voted for PAP no because I'm scare of of them doing things to me.... but because I dislike CSJ's party. If it was WP in my area during the last election.... It would then be a hard choice.
So you think that only you work in the government sector.... Grow up lah boy
I'm suppose to 'Burn In Hell' if I don't believe in Christ or some other God..... but that didn't stop me from being a free thinker..... Therefore don't use - "don't want their promotion, flat application to be affected" - as an excuse of your own inability to get what you wanted.
U think ppl who fought for their RIGHTS got it easy Most are dead or in lock-up. If you really have guts to stand for your rights..... then tell your officer to fu*k off about your rank & promotion. Its so sad to see a grown man KPKB and then use the same old excuse. U and ur friend made the choice of chosing your promotion and housing over your RIGHTS...... then who to blame Sign up with the Devil and Burn in Hell...... it is your own choice at the END.
BTW...... in the forum.... no one need to shut up. All have a Right to his/her views. [/b]
I voted for the fucking pap and this is the shit they give, if i fucking hell know what the fuck they will do you think i will given fucking give them my vote. HELL FUCK NO! Those fuckers have abused the trust of the people. -
Care to explain Mindef's top secret policy? It is leaked out so often leh. Just go take a walk at Mindef's top priority places laaa... you will notice some people missing at this places.Originally posted by mancha:Firstly lets look at the type government we have.
Ours is never a government with a secret police that round up any dissident at will. Forumers here that spout derogatory remarks against the government and the PAP are still around to continue to do so, atest to that.
Saddam Hussein commanded a 100% mandate from the people of Iraq. If I were in a situation as Iraq during Saddam Hussein's time, I would vote with sense.
But this is Singapore.
There are no secrets in Singapore. When LHL first wife died just after giving birth, the whole of Singapore knew what exactly happened within 2 days.
So how can anyone in Singapore dig up the ballots, look for a particular serial number, without your friend's friend brother, or neighbour knowing about it. It is a political nuclear disaster, if it is ever leaked out that anyone has even attempted to go near the boxes.
Civil servants, who have any clout at all, are educated way above yokels, know that they can vote as they wish with impunity, and no one would know how they voted.
I believe in the system, therefore I will vote the party I want to vote for.
A vote for the PAP is a vote cast in fear, a vote for the SDP must be a genuine vote.
Is that your take? -
1st of all -Originally posted by SuperProPAP:You said prove it you muthafarker. I shared with you my colleagues experiences and now you are turning it around and scolding them. DO YOU KNOW THE MEANING OF WHAT IF YOU MUTHAFARKER. I showed you examples of people voting for the fucking government because of their fucking fears. Get that into your stupid pig brain.
I voted for the fucking pap and this is the shit they give, if i fucking hell know what the fuck they will do you think i will given fucking give them my vote. HELL FUCK NO! Those fuckers have abused the trust of the people.
4 letters words are not shown on this forum. Pls use method like FU*K to show F U C K..... because now ppl who read your reply will get only *&%$#.... which is pointless.
2nd -
Now I see all this anger over the PAP is because you didn't get what you wanted..... U are really pathetic. U didn't use your brain to think before Voting and now you blame other for your own Vote. U think you are the only one feeling cheated Little Boy..... lesson in life - THINK BEFORE YOU DO SOMETHING. But ok lah..... school fee paid already, next time you know what to do lor.....
3rd -
Read my post above yours....... again...... slowly if you have problem....
You didn't showed me examples of people voting in fear of the government.... you showed me ppl who is in fear of rumor about the Govt. Nobody could help you if you are scare of shadows. I'm scare of GHOST.... does that makes GHOST exsist I'm also scare of Godzilla attacking S'pore.... does that means Godzilla will be coming
As the Old saying goes - Fear is the path to the darkside....
4th -
reyes on page one of this thread have already given you the BEST example of NOTHING WILL HAPPEN TO YOU IF YOU VOTED FOR THE OPPS.
If you & your friend still scare..... then you are askin for it. Don't come here lookin for ppl to comfort you for your own mistake. U grown up already..... deal with the mistake you make on your own like any adult, don't cry or lash out in foul laug. Its time to be a MAN/WOMAN. -
sometimes these arguments are pointless...
some of those anti-PAP bashers are bashing because it's ingrained in them...
right or wrong, as long as the government takes any action, they will just bash the government...
it's a waste of time to argue with them, cos they will never give the government any credit where it's due...