It's the economy, stupid.
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Of course it is funded. But the difference is that regardless whether you actually put a cent in, many governments guarantee you get something.Originally posted by kramnave:You do realise that every pension fund is funded by the citizens ? only that we fund it personally for ourselves rather than for our neighbour ?
In Singapore, you don't. So why are you echoing what i just said? -
Exactly ! Why should i pay more tax so that someone who has never paid tax in his whole life get a pension ? Governments that pay pension are already scaling back on benefits and whether funds can still afford to do so is still a big question mark. There are no guarantees if you would like to do some research.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Of course it is funded. But the difference is that regardless whether you actually put a cent in, many governments guarantee you get something.
In Singapore, you don't. -
Has it occurred to you that not everyone is so fortunate to break out of the poverty cycle? Would you let him die just so that you yourself can benefit?Originally posted by kramnave:Exactly ! [b]Why should i pay more tax so that someone who has never paid tax in his whole life get a pension ? Governments that pay pension are already scaling back on benefits and whether funds can still afford to do so is still a big question mark. There are no guarantees if you would like to do some research.
It might do you some good, to remember what led to the French Revolution. -
He is not only having down syndrome, he is starting to have impotence problem as well.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Gazelle, when are you going to stop smiling like you have Down's Syndrome? -
Donate 10% of your salary to someone who has yet to break out of the poverty cycle ?Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Has it occurred to you that not everyone is so fortunate to break out of the poverty cycle? Would you let him die just so that you yourself can benefit?
It might do you some good, to remember what led to the French Revolution.
At a point of time where people are complaining about the compulsory annuity, GST hike, 1-2 cent increase in bus fares etc you are telling me that we should pay more tax ? A system that many countries find difficult to maintain going into the future ? -
What difference does it make? Your CPF is already a form of tax. As it is, we pay in total some 36% tax thereabouts. And furthermore, you get small sums a month for some decades or so, or a smaller large sum. Do you even enjoy all of it?Originally posted by kramnave:Donate 10% of your salary to someone who has yet to break out of the poverty cycle ?
At a point of time where people are complaining about the compulsory annuity, GST hike, 1-2 cent increase in bus fares etc you are telling me that we should pay more tax ? A system that many countries find difficult to maintain going into the future ?
How many countries find it difficult? Sweden isn't complaining, neither is Finland. The latter mind you, had the unfortunate circumstance of suffering under Soviet influence. -
CPF = Tax....Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:What difference does it make? Your CPF is already a form of tax. As it is, we pay in total some 36% tax thereabouts. And furthermore, you get small sums a month for some decades or so, or a smaller large sum.
How many countries find it difficult? Sweden isn't complaining, neither is Finland. The latter mind you, had the unfortunate circumstance of suffering under Soviet influence.
I am sure the sheep will believe you and I hope you could volunteer to tell your boss that you dont want to pay tax, so dont need to contribute CPF in your acccount.. 
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That's because idiots like you have no knowledge of economics. Go back to school and don't come back here just to salivate.Originally posted by Gazelle:CPF = Tax.... I am sure the sheep will believe you and I hope you could volunteer to tell your boss that you dont want to pay tax, so dont need to contribute CPF in your acccount..
And quite frankly, I think i can do a better job than the Govt's idea of annuities. So stop salivating like a retard. -
It is unique in Singapore, people pay the gahmen for their pension while the gahmen is not giving any pension to the people instead are planning to get the people buy annuity to have their pension (?).
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You dont need to study economics lah..just go to any coffeeshop and ask the uncle and auntie if they prefer CPF or income tax...Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:That's because idiots like you have no knowledge of economics. Go back to school and don't come back here just to salivate.
And quite frankly, I think i can do a better job than the Govt's idea of annuities. So stop salivating like a retard. -
Talk to an uncle and auntie who have zero knowledge about anything?Originally posted by Gazelle:You dont need to study economics lah..just go to any coffeeshop and ask the uncle and auntie if they prefer CPF or income tax...
Perhaps you should go check whether you went for some accidental lobotomy. I think your brain got removed by accident.
No need to study economics? That is by far, one of the most stupid statements I have ever heard from you. Are you sure you went to school and attended university? Or did you spend all day at home sucking thumb and drooling like a retard? -
U.S, Australia, Sweden, Finland etc..throw in the whole Europe. They had faced or are facing problems. Problems due to an ageing population. Pension on a PAYG system are destined to face massive woes. Its simple. Less workers are paying tax for an increasing number of retirees. Even Sweden had a pension reform where personal contributions are directed to an retirement investment plan. Australia introduced compulsory superannuation. Employers pay 9% and the opposition is clamouring for 15% with plans to encourage citizens to contribute as well. Doesn't all these smell of CPF ? Govt of these countries are trying to migrate out of the mess while we want to get ourselves into it ?Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:What difference does it make? Your CPF is already a form of tax. As it is, we pay in total some 36% tax thereabouts. And furthermore, you get small sums a month for some decades or so, or a smaller large sum. Do you even enjoy all of it?
How many countries find it difficult? Sweden isn't complaining, neither is Finland. The latter mind you, had the unfortunate circumstance of suffering under Soviet influence.
To add on, you are guaranteed your CPF as it is yours. Pension comes from general tax and it is guaranteed to you provided there is a balance left. The amount fluctuates from time to time. CPF is not a tax to us, it probably is to the employer. -
Alright, so they also have problems, but so do we. On the practical side, we are highly unlikely to enjoy the full benefits of our CPF, not withstanding that the CPF itself is used for housing, medicare and so forth. Don't forget that these countries do not have housing costs as high as ours. To enjoy the full benefits, requires you to live decades beyond the age of 67. Do you think you will live that long?Originally posted by kramnave:U.S, Australia, Sweden, Finland etc..throw in the whole Europe. They had faced or are facing problems. Problems due to an ageing population. Pension on a PAYG system are destined to face massive woes. Its simple. Less workers are paying tax for an increasing number of retirees. Even Sweden had a pension reform where personal contributions are directed to an retirement investment plan. Australia introduced compulsory superannuation. Employers pay 9% and the opposition is clamouring for 15% with plans to encourage citizens to contribute as well. Doesn't all these smell of CPF ? Govt of these countries are trying to migrate out of the mess while we want to get ourselves into it ?
The real trial will come when the people born in the baby boom in the 1960s and 1950s start taking their money back.
CPF is tax in the sense that if one looks at the supply demand curve, it exerts the same effect as a normal tax would. -
CPF = Tax??? HAHAHA....Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Talk to an uncle and auntie who have zero knowledge about anything?
Perhaps you should go check whether you went for some accidental lobotomy. I think your brain got removed by accident.
No need to study economics? That is by far, one of the most stupid statements I have ever heard from you. Are you sure you went to school and attended university? Or did you spend all day at home sucking thumb and drooling like a retard? I hope you dont disclose which sheep school/university you are from.. -
You must really be a retard now. Clearly you lack the mental faculties to analyse anything beyond the propaganda sheet.Originally posted by Gazelle:CPF = Tax??? HAHAHA.... I hope you dont disclose which sheep school/university you are from.. -
Yes. Then we can prove whether or not the CPF board are good trustees of the fund. The funds are supposedly not invested in risky investments Temasek are involved in.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Alright, so they also have problems, but so do we. On the practical side, we are highly unlikely to enjoy the full benefits of our CPF, not withstanding that the CPF itself is used for housing, medicare and so forth. Don't forget that these countries do not have housing costs as high as ours.
The real trial will come when the people born in the baby boom in the 1960s and 1950s start taking their money back.
I wouldn't say that their housing costs are not as high as ours. If you want to compare city living ( Singapore being one), houses in most developed cities are pricey. The only problem is poor Singaporeans do not have a cheaper equivalent in their suburbs. -
Well, most people in the West live in the suburbs. Those that live in cities often earn a fair bit, like those working in banks in New York.Originally posted by kramnave:Yes. Then we can prove whether or not the CPF board are good trustees of the fund. The funds are supposedly not invested in risky investments Temasek are involved in.
I wouldn't say that their housing costs are not as high as ours. If you want to compare city living ( Singapore being one), houses in most developed cities are pricey. The only problem is poor Singaporeans do not have a cheaper equivalent in their suburbs.
In some sense of the word, CPF is the most cost effective solution for a government that wants to spend as little as possible on its citizens, while maintaining a huge treasury for its own uses. How the money is used is a good question, and the opposition has never managed to get answers. It is quite likely to be pooled with the money that GLC and Temasek use. Our reserves are estimated to be 100-330 billion in total. I doubt all the surpluses will ever account for that. -
I pity those people who try to engage in any form of debate with you..Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:You must really be a retard now. Clearly you lack the mental faculties to analyse anything beyond the propaganda sheet.
Time is $$.. -
Temasek has denied holding CPF funds since their investments are subjected to significant risk. They do not invest reserves as well.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Well, most people in the West live in the suburbs. Those that live in cities often earn a fair bit, like those working in banks in New York.
In some sense of the word, CPF is the most cost effective solution for a government that wants to spend as little as possible on its citizens, while maintaining a huge treasury for its own uses. How the money is used is a good question, and the opposition has never managed to get answers. It is quite likely to be pooled with the money that GLC and Temasek use.
And yes, that is the problem ! Singaporeans do not have a suburb to go to. -
Do you even know what a supply demand curve is?Originally posted by Gazelle:I pity those people who try to engage in any form of debate with you..
Time is $$.. 
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Denial is one thing, but when you are talking about reserves potentially as large as 330 billions, something odd is happening. Where does it come from? Our yearly surpluses aren't so large to fill up 330 billion in a couple of decades.Originally posted by kramnave:Temasek has denied holding CPF funds since their investments are subjected to significant risk. They do not invest reserves as well.
And yes, that is the problem ! Singaporeans do not have a suburb to go to. -
Don't mix Temasek and GIC. GIC invests the reserves. Temasek does not. Unfortunately we do not know where the reserves are invested. If not i also spend money follow
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Well Temasek gets its money from somewhere. Doesn't matter Reserves or not.Originally posted by kramnave:Don't mix Temasek and GIC. GIC invests the reserves. Temasek does not. Unfortunately we do not know where the reserves are invested. If not i also spend money follow -
Temasek got $354 million from the reserves in 1974. Thats it.Originally posted by Fingolfin_Noldor:Well Temasek gets its money from somewhere. Doesn't matter Reserves or not. -
And where did the few billions to invest in Shin Corp come from?Originally posted by kramnave:Temasek got $354 million from the reserves in 1974. Thats it.