PAP: Stop Screwing Around with Peoples' CPF - Think Harder..
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Statistics have shown that few Singaporeans meet the minimum sum at age 55. This statistic is expected to drop even further if nothing is done to rectify it.Originally posted by kilua:Why is the govt willing to believe a group people who would not be disciplined to save without being forced, would make good retirement plans and achieve good returns? Does the govt really believe that the older generation which generally had lesser education would acquire financial knowledge on their own and retire comfortably?
Does this mean that Singaporeans are poor savers? Or is it that high HDB prices over the years, coupled with interest repayment snowballed over decades have finally taken its toll on CPF retirement funds?
It is not that Singaporeans are poor savers. It is the exorbitant costs of HDBs that result in a huge depletion of retirement funds.
Even if a Singaporean's HDB may appreciate in value over the years, it is but after all a paper asset if one does not sell it. Every Singaporean may only buy one HDB. If he sells the house, he still has to find another roof.
Even if a Singaporean sells the HDB for profit, there are strict restrictions imposed on the number of times one may do so. Seriously, how many want to uproot from a place they call home? -
Wow really ah?? You so knowledgeable one!Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:Whether for or against CPF per se, the many postings here are not that objective with many that are heavy on political overtones. But this one by pearlie27 on whether CPF members actually own the money in their CPF accounts is more interesting and challenging. Why?
First, CPF is borned out of an Act of Parliament. Indirectly, it means the voters agreed (for those who don't agree with my statement, hold your horses here for the time-being) thru their representatives in parliament.
Btw, i wasn't the one who said what you credited to me. i was quoting NMP Siew Kum Hong who is a lawyer by profession. -
So, in that case, there is no problem with annuity and cpf lah.Originally posted by Rock^Star:Since the law has made it such that the employer's contribution goes into the Singaporean's account lawfully under his name, then it should be his money.
Whose retirement is that money meant for anyway? For the individual, not the govt's.
When a CPF member dies, the amount is distributed as per nomination or will. None of it goes to the govt. It is the individual's money at the end of the day.
Let me check with other blokes here. -
Maybe the government should make sure that the money in your bank account cannot be withdrawn till your retirement too.
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Might be a good idea. My relatives have cheated my grandma of her savings in the bank.Originally posted by charlize:Maybe the government should make sure that the money in your bank account cannot be withdrawn till your retirement too. -
After Lee Hsien Loong becomes PM,he has come up with so many "monkey show",like got one time,want to buy eggs also very hard.Now he comes up with this Annuity scheme,i dont know how many more monkey show he is going to perform.
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That's all you can say?Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:Might be a good idea. My relatives have cheated my grandma of her savings in the bank. -
Why you worry? The MAJORITY have endorsed them the power with their support and there is nothing u can do. This is called democracy. I think eventually all the MAJORITY will be smiling contented that they given the rare chance of a lifetime opportunity to own an annuity scheme even if it means when they die b4 85, their cpf money flows into the POOL, i.e. still in CPF vault. they will love it, I am sure, judging by the past almost 50 years of proven track record. You should thank the MAJORITY. Majority, take a bow.Originally posted by drawer:After Lee Hsien Loong becomes PM,he has come up with so many "monkey show",like got one time,want to buy eggs also very hard.Now he comes up with this Annuity scheme,i dont know how many more monkey show he is going to perform. -
Hmmmm .... my grandma is dead, do you want to speak to her?Originally posted by Rock^Star:That's all you can say? -
Using your grandma as a tool to sidetrack from a debate....brilliant.Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:Hmmmm .... my grandma is dead, do you want to speak to her?
Do comment to my earlier posts on CPF as a trust. -
To say, "I sense sarcasm" is a huge understatement.Originally posted by reddressman:Why you worry? The MAJORITY have endorsed them the power with their support and there is nothing u can do. This is called democracy. I think eventually all the MAJORITY will be smiling contented that they given the rare chance of a lifetime opportunity to own an annuity scheme even if it means when they die b4 85, their cpf money flows into the POOL, i.e. still in CPF vault. they will love it, I am sure, judging by the past almost 50 years of proven track record. You should thank the MAJORITY. Majority, take a bow.
Its sad that the cries of the minority are not heard, and the majority, either tempted or coerced into endorsing parties. Hence, re-establish the fact that the majority doesn't always make the best decision. -
http://singaporemind.blogspot.com/
Malaysian EPF cannot make it lah....!
Why isn't the Malaysia govt as smart as the PAP when it comes to managing EPF?
Their GIC equivalent can just issue risk free bonds guaranteed at 3.5% then make the EPF buy these bonds, take this money to invest and keep the returns for themselves for the hard work and risk they are taking.
Without doing this bond issuance, they now have to return all this money to EPF holders - stupid. The EPF guarantees a minimum of 2.5% by law and since its inception has never gone below 4% (the worst year was 2002 when it returned 4.25%...it regularly returns 7-8%). Imagine how much money their GIC equivalent could have made if they are able to keep these returns. Thank goodness we Singaporeans are lucky have smart govt and a great CPF scheme to go along.
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http://www.abcmoney.co.uk/news/232007123054.htm
Malaysia's Employee Provident Fund H1 investment income up 39 pct - report
Published : Thu, 23 Aug 2007 12:51
By : Agencies Print this Story
var addthis_pub = 'abcmoney';
KUALA LUMPUR (Thomson Financial) - Malaysia's state pension fund, the Employees Provident Fund (EPF) reported Thursday that its investment income in the first half grew 38.6 percent to 9.8 billion ringgit from 7.1 billion a year earlier, according to the official Bernama news agency.
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EPF's unaudited first-half results showed income from equities rose 141 percent to four billion ringgit, accounting for 40.8 percent of the fund's generated income, the report said.
EPF chief executive officer Azlan Zainol said returns on its equities portfolio were encouraging but EPF 'will remain cautious as investments in the equities sector pose relatively higher risks over most other instruments.'
Azlan said a total of 58.6 billion ringgit in funds were invested in the equities market in the first half.
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Accumulated investments amounted to 301.4 billion ringgit as of end-June, he said.
He said income derived from money market instruments rose 79.7 percent to 592.4 million ringgit from 329.7 million last year.
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Loans and bonds contributed 2.8 billion ringgit to the funds's total investment income, while income from investments in Malaysia Government Securities and property accounted for 2.4 billion and 23.3 million ringgit respectively, he said.
(1 US dollar = 3.48 ringgit) -
Many keen to put more money in CPF, says Dr Ng
Singaporeans are asking how to make top-ups, a development the minister views as positive feedback
By Lynn Lee
ACROSS Singapore, many people want to put more money into their Central Provident Fund (CPF) accounts to get the higher interest rates to be given from January.
They have been asking the CPF Board how they or their family members can make such top-ups, said Manpower Minister Ng Eng Hen in an interview with The Straits Times.
Dr Ng sees their query as positive feedback from the ground on last month's announcement in Parliament of changes to the CPF system.
'They would not ask this, if they could get better interest elsewhere,' he said.
The CPF Board will follow up on their query and give them customised advice and help, added the minister.
A major change in the CPF system is the one percentage point rise in interest rate for the first $60,000 in all accounts.
But only $20,000, at most, can be from the Ordinary Account, which now pays 2.5 per cent in interest a year.
For the Special, Medisave and Retirement accounts, the current interest is a fixed 4 per cent. This too will change.
It will be replaced with the return on 10-year Singapore Government Securities plus one percentage point.
However, for the next two years, the Government has assured CPF members that these accounts will get at least 4 per cent.
The other changes are: CPF members will, over time, get the monthly Minimum Sum payouts only at age 65, not the current 62; and they must buy a longevity insurance that will give them a monthly sum at age 85 until they die.
The changes are to bolster Singaporeans' retirement savings and ensure they have enough for their old age.
But the last two measures - the delay in the Minimum Sum payout and the compulsory longevity insurance - have caused concern.
Dr Ng acknowledged that most people are not sure if they would live that long.
They also worry about the cost of the longevity insurance or annuity, despite Government assurance it will be a small part of their Retirement Account.
To allay their fears, he has asked the committee looking at how best to introduce annuities to 'seriously consider' giving people the option to decide whether to get their insurance payout earlier or later.
It is almost three weeks since Dr Ng announced the CPF changes on Sept 19.
While he feels there is 'general acceptance' of them among Singaporeans - whom he says are 'very sensible people' - there is one thing he would have done differently.
He would put in 'bold print' the link between the extra one percentage point interest and annuities, and that the extra CPF people get will be more than enough to pay for the longevity insurance.
This approach would have satisfied nine out of 10 Singaporeans, who 'trust the Government to take care of them, and prefer more reassurance than explanation'.
This message was in Dr Ng's speech, but it came after he had painstakingly laid out the rationale, details and consequences of the changes.
Said Dr Ng: 'We were trying to be pure and we were trying to explain to them that we were changing the interest rate system and how it was being done.'
This explanatory approach is preferred by the other 10 per cent who want to be 'involved in the process'.
Both approaches are necessary, he said, adding that the exercise was a learning experience. 'Government must be patient and take the time and effort to explain to different groups with varying needs and circumstances.'
[email protected] do you believe all these? -
They are not the words of MM hen...Originally posted by Lin Yu: do you believe all these?
It is the work of the director of communications, aka spin doctor. -
who would want to put money in a bank that promise more interest but cannot promise you that you can live to see the money returned to youOriginally posted by googoomuck:They are not the words of MM hen...
It is the work of the director of communications, aka spin doctor. -
were we not told that our media is credible?Originally posted by Lin Yu: do you believe all these?
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If you wait until the average life expectancy of the population hits 85 before introducing compulsory annuities, it will be far too late. Have you even stopped to think about the kind of principal and the amount of premiums that will be necessary to generate a decent payout when most of the population will live past 85 and yet the majority have not even begun to pay into an annuity? Given that many Singaporeans do not even have enough CPF funds to meet the minimum sum, delaying compulsory annuities until the crisis hits is myopic and irresponsible.Originally posted by Rock^Star:And introducing annuities when our life expectancy has still a long way to go before hitting 85 is definitely deplorable.
The key word is "for the benefit of beneficiaries". Since they are handling our money, they have to do it well.
And that is precisely the attitude of the opposition parties and their supporters. They are great ostriches indeed! -
Questions:Originally posted by oxford mushroom:If you wait until the average life expectancy of the population hits 85 before introducing compulsory annuities, it will be far too late. Have you even stopped to think about the kind of principal and the amount of premiums that will be necessary to generate a decent payout when most of the population will live past 85 and yet the majority have not even begun to pay into an annuity? Given that many Singaporeans do not even have enough CPF funds to meet the minimum sum, delaying compulsory annuities until the crisis hits is myopic and irresponsible.
And that is precisely the attitude of the opposition parties and their supporters. They are great ostriches indeed!
> Did CPF worked? If yes, why the need now for Annuity? Will Annuity work?
> "myopic and irresponsible" is precisely the cause for which an Annuity is now COMPULSORY.
..realy, who are the Ostriches?
...and what other forms of dances will they perform around the CPF Totem Pole instead of providing REAL solutions that don't tug at the pockets of Singaporeans?? -
Use your fcuking brain lah. Have you seen the first page where I posted?Originally posted by oxford mushroom:If you wait until the average life expectancy of the population hits 85 before introducing compulsory annuities, it will be far too late. Have you even stopped to think about the kind of principal and the amount of premiums that will be necessary to generate a decent payout when most of the population will live past 85 and yet the majority have not even begun to pay into an annuity? Given that many Singaporeans do not even have enough CPF funds to meet the minimum sum, delaying compulsory annuities until the crisis hits is myopic and irresponsible.
And that is precisely the attitude of the opposition parties and their supporters. They are great ostriches indeed! -
he must plan something useful to justify his million dollar pay, if not just sit there do nothing ppl will complainOriginally posted by drawer:After Lee Hsien Loong becomes PM,he has come up with so many "monkey show",like got one time,want to buy eggs also very hard.Now he comes up with this Annuity scheme,i dont know how many more monkey show he is going to perform. -
just like to re-focus on the topic that someone is screwing around with something. I dun think so leh. Why? because if so, the MAJORITY would not be song already. They have made the decision and that is the ultimate endorsement that they are not screwing their money.
how can one say that when A is screwing B in the wrong area, B still smile and give endorse? cannot be right? So, the MAJORITY do not feel there is screw. -
I have another question - the 2% increase in GST was meant to help the poor. Could it not have fit into the funds for those above 85, of which are very few of them?Originally posted by HyperFocal:Questions:
> Did CPF worked? If yes, why the need now for Annuity? Will Annuity work?
> "myopic and irresponsible" is precisely the cause for which an Annuity is now COMPULSORY.
..realy, who are the Ostriches?
...and what other forms of dances will they perform around the CPF Totem Pole instead of providing REAL solutions that don't tug at the pockets of Singaporeans??
Regards -
That would have gone against the government ideology of workfare as opposed to welfare. I don't think they will shoot themselves in the foot like this.Originally posted by Melvin Tan:I have another question - the 2% increase in GST was meant to help the poor. Could it not have fit into the funds for those above 85, of which are very few of them?
Regards -
Guys and Gals,
I suspect the MAJORITY (I may be one of them ) are appreciating the marvellous things and policies being implemented to their hard-earned CPF money such that there is no complain from them by way of petition. At least not in any obvious manner whatsoever.
Silence means Acceptance has been signed-off ? I think.
We thus cannot even say that the MAJORITY is APATHETIC. How can they be when its their hard-earned blood and sweat money earned over long periods of time (major part of their living hours at least 70%) that is being 'good goodly' affected by the changes in the policies? I really think the MAJORITY (maybe me included ) should identify the great talent that came up with this idea and world class bombastic solution (that is solid until the cannot solid the anymore already liao lor) and thank him or her (nowadays , you never know. Many women talents hor) with the bottoms of our bottomest bottom heart .
So, I feel that the MAJORITY has once again endorsed the changes and ACCEPT it as good for them. When they die <85, their remaining money goes to a pool not taken out at their time of death, which is inevitable, for one and all , regardless of any ding dong. no matter how power you are the ful. Without this MAJORITY (maybe me included ) how can the rulers be the rulers? -
PAP keeps up their CRAP, over time Singapore may eventually experience a similar revolt or uprising like what's happening now in Myanmar...
If that happens, I bet their "democratic" facade will come down like a veil revealing the exact same brute Military Rule....