Unemployment really going down?
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We might have been taken for a ride! There may not be even a single new job created last month(Dec 2003).
They should be spending all their time to concentrate on creating jobs, rather than finding ways to manipulate statistics to make them (not us) look good. Let me elaborate.
The news report a few days ago saying jobless rate plunged to 4.5% seems like a miracle to me, unless it is MIW cooking numbers. So I spent today thinking about it, and I now know how the cooking is done!
The MOM has a policy saying that if you are jobless, you MUST register your name with them (travel there, fill up form, etc) and after that, they consider ONE person - you - as jobless. They will let your name exist in their register for THREE months, after which your name will be automatically removed. To reinstate your name in the jobless list, you need to go down again to fill up forms all over again.
The trick is simple - don't care how many out there are jobless, as long as they didn't fill up forms, they DON'T EXIST!!!
This way, they take away the blips from their radar screen! Then they publish news reports saying that 5.5% drop to 4.5% even if less than 0.0001% found jobs. Simple trick isn't it?
Now, imagine if they tweak the 3 months by playing with cut-off dates, or even changing it to 2 months, 1 month, or into 1 week. They can even "make-believe" we have FULL employment!
I propose that they use CPF contributions instead. Anyone whose contribution stopped, had a career history, age 18 to 62, would be counted as unemployed. Reason is that if last month the worker's CPF received no contribution, it will mean s/he hasn't got a job.
What do you guys/gals think of my idea to prevent MIWs from making the jobless population 'disappear'? -
i thought MIW is the army website?
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Hmm, questions questions questions.Originally posted by rasmond:We might have been taken for a ride! There may not be even a single new job created last month(Dec 2003).
They should be spending all their time to concentrate on creating jobs, rather than finding ways to manipulate statistics to make them (not us) look good. Let me elaborate.
The news report a few days ago saying jobless rate plunged to 4.5% seems like a miracle to me, unless it is MIW cooking numbers. So I spent today thinking about it, and I now know how the cooking is done!
The MOM has a policy saying that if you are jobless, you MUST register your name with them (travel there, fill up form, etc) and after that, they consider ONE person - you - as jobless. They will let your name exist in their register for THREE months, after which your name will be automatically removed. To reinstate your name in the jobless list, you need to go down again to fill up forms all over again.
The trick is simple - don't care how many out there are jobless, as long as they didn't fill up forms, they DON'T EXIST!!!
This way, they take away the blips from their radar screen! Then they publish news reports saying that 5.5% drop to 4.5% even if less than 0.0001% found jobs. Simple trick isn't it?
Now, imagine if they tweak the 3 months by playing with cut-off dates, or even changing it to 2 months, 1 month, or into 1 week. They can even "make-believe" we have FULL employment!
I propose that they use CPF contributions instead. Anyone whose contribution stopped, had a career history, age 18 to 62, would be counted as unemployed. Reason is that if last month the worker's CPF received no contribution, it will mean s/he hasn't got a job.
What do you guys/gals think of my idea to prevent MIWs from making the jobless population 'disappear'?
1) I doubt that they have a policy requiring you to register with them.
2) When you are in the list for 3 months etc, is it a service provided from them, WDA etc to assist you in finding a job ? Thereafter if you fail to get a job or refuse an opening, they remove you from the list ?
Our statistics are said to follow the ILO guidelines and i don't think it is as simple as what you implied i.e. don't register, not in "jobless category".
Anyway, it is very possible to be employed and receive no CPF. -
everybody is gainfully employed....yipee
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We might have been taken for a ride! There may not be even a single new job created last month(Dec 2003)
2003? -
Maybe cut and paste from somewhere..Originally posted by Darkness_hacker99:We might have been taken for a ride! There may not be even a single new job created last month(Dec 2003) 2003? -
if u wan to use CPF contribution rates, Self-Employed dont have and only have medisave liabilites which they usually pay once a yr or dont pay at all. how abt informal workers? like those uncle aunties working as cleaner/odd jobs de? dey no medisave liabilites or CPF contribution.
please answer, thanks -
if they're working under a company, the company will pay CPF...clear enough chuckieOriginally posted by speakupforyourrights:if u wan to use CPF contribution rates, Self-Employed dont have and only have medisave liabilites which they usually pay once a yr or dont pay at all. how abt informal workers? like those uncle aunties working as cleaner/odd jobs de? dey no medisave liabilites or CPF contribution.
please answer, thanks -
eh hello, pls think properly. alot of cleaner work as infromal workers. go down to any CPF svc centers and ask. alot of them are daily rated workers so they do not have CPF contributions. and how about those baby sitters? they are employed too wad. but cPF contribution, no-no. not all co. pay CPF, if the worker is daily rated or works only a few days few hrs type, income is still earn but there is no records/CPF contributions.Originally posted by de_middle:if they're working under a company, the company will pay CPF...clear enough chuckie
i got work before at CPF Board at robinson rd, if u think im bs-ing we can meet up i show u my pass. -
then these worker tio pian liao lor.......they collect daily rated then too bad lor...no CPF lor...eh hiau bor chuckie boy boyOriginally posted by speakupforyourrights:eh hello, pls think properly. alot of cleaner work as infromal workers. go down to any CPF svc centers and ask. alot of them are daily rated workers so they do not have CPF contributions. and how about those baby sitters? they are employed too wad. but cPF contribution, no-no. not all co. pay CPF, if the worker is daily rated or works only a few days few hrs type, income is still earn but there is no records/CPF contributions.
i got work before at CPF Board at robinson rd, if u think im bs-ing we can meet up i show u my pass. -
those free lance tuition teacher also boh CPF...
hawker stall owner perharps also never contribute cpf..
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so wad are u trying to prove? i alrdy made my point, how about u? CPF contributions is a bad mean to prove employment.Originally posted by de_middle:then these worker tio pian liao lor.......they collect daily rated then too bad lor...no CPF lor...eh hiau bor chuckie boy boy -
If your monthly salaried worker, it is necessary for company to pay CPF contributions....if not, pls report.....there are recruitment agencies who deduct CPF for temp staff but failed to contribute....
CPF contribution deadline is the 14th of the following month. FYI
chuckie boy boy......listen to me.....lim peh cho payroll eh -
chuckie boy boy, it is thus very difficult to access unemployment rate...so i say we're gainfully employed....thank you MIWOriginally posted by speakupforyourrights:so wad are u trying to prove? i alrdy made my point, how about u? CPF contributions is a bad mean to prove employment. -
hoho u wan play si bo? i dont need to listen to u one, we go down CPF Board leh see who can go to the office. u need to go sign get sticker, i can go in straight lehOriginally posted by de_middle:If your monthly salaried worker, it is necessary for company to pay CPF contributions....if not, pls report.....there are recruitment agencies who deduct CPF for temp staff but failed to contribute....
CPF contribution deadline is the 14th of the following month. FYI
chuckie boy boy......listen to me.....lim peh cho payroll eh -
chuckie boy boy, no need go down CPF board one leh, i can do everything w/o leaving my desk leh...u really boy boy leh....lim peh cho kang cho chap wah ni liao lo.......boy boy, u make me laugh unitl peng lehOriginally posted by speakupforyourrights:hoho u wan play si bo? i dont need to listen to u one, we go down CPF Board leh see who can go to the office. u need to go sign get sticker, i can go in straight leh -
den laugh loh, while i laugh my way to the bankOriginally posted by de_middle:chuckie boy boy, no need go down CPF board one leh, i can do everything w/o leaving my desk leh...u really boy boy leh....lim peh cho kang cho chap wah ni liao lo.......boy boy, u make me laugh unitl peng leh -
how come no longer working there still holding pass and can walk in walk out ?
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secretOriginally posted by kramnave:how come no longer working there still holding pass and can walk in walk out ? -
CPIB officers quite free these few days after the NKF case..
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are those officers trained in RHKOriginally posted by sLeEpWaLkErInG:CPIB officers quite free these few days after the NKF case.. -
yes, with pityin the foo' training and of cos, a helluva lot of jibba jabbaOriginally posted by de_middle:are those officers trained in RHK -
so nice waiting for enlistment...now i wanna step into army camp also cannot liaoOriginally posted by speakupforyourrights:yes, with pityin the foo' training and of cos, a helluva lot of jibba jabba 
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still got work lah, jus pon today n ytdOriginally posted by de_middle:so nice waiting for enlistment...now i wanna step into army camp also cannot liao -
You have a job if you can sell tissue papers or collect cardboard boxes at the rubbish dump.