MM Lee keeps boasting of his success causing more offences.
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Before he could give useful advice to others, he should first look into the problems suffered by own ordinary citizens as described in the Little Red Dot caused by his self-centred authoritarian rule which has stagnated the economy into many deep recessions for years.
Owing to fortuitous circumstance like the world recovery in 2004 fueled by China's and India's accelerating growth and his final resort to IR (which by admission was finally allowed over his live body to reversed the continuous deep recessions due to failures to restructure the economy going on for years) Singapore economy finally climbed out of the lethargic property-playing trading style of government seen in 1997-2003.
Without such lucky break by now Singapore would have gone under and be taken over by the more vibrant and technologically driven Malaysia and we might be begging them instead to us back to Malaysia.
That is why MM Lee has really nothing much to boast about especially for the failure at his own economic restructuring talked about for years.
So it is still too early to say even with the IR hype and property rebound that the economy has done well. What we are having is citizens' surpluses which are yet to be put to produce jobs and upgrade the economy.
So Let us be humble and not try to tell the world or our neighbours we are better. Are our ministers capable of taking advantage of the large taxes and surpluses sucked from citizens and our unfortunate IR to restructure it to the value-adding model to produce international brand goods and services to create more value-adding jobs for the citizens.
Until then Singapore ministers could not really claim to any better than any other ministers in other countries. -
ppl make u angry, u dun angry.
if u angry, u fall fer ppl's trick. -
ppl slap the left side of your face, you offer the right side..Originally posted by Hello Kitty:ppl make u angry, u dun angry.
if u angry, u fall fer ppl's trick.
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I think it will be good if he reserve his comments about the animosity between Malaysia and Indonesia (if he have any) ...
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Three of his buddies have had their chairs taken away – suharto, khin nyunt, thaksin.
Anyone still want to buy his idea? I don't think so. -
Proverb" Men are never as good or fortunate as they think"
Let's re-visit the Little Red Dot and decide for yourself how lucky truly are we the Singaporeans. Are we the ordinary citizens better off today as compared with the 1970s and are now truly living in the first world?
PROSE OF LITTLE RED DOT (2nd edition)
In the east was a little red dot,
Too small and scarce of resource,
Said supreme leader to be governed,
By democracy said to be promiscuous,
So he governed the dot with iron-fist autocracy,
In disguise of western democracy,
To shouts of merdeka, got himself elected,
To serve fellow citizens with justice and equity,
Alas as in history he did not write,
Men once given golden opportunity,
Became haughty and **@#ey,
Obsessed with own self glory,
Intoxicated with power hungered more,
Tweaked all laws to serve his own agendas,
Control the legislature, and judiciary,
In supreme parliament made all laws,
That prevented citizens from questioning,
Wrongful acts and policies of ministers,
Passed laws that paid themselves highest salaries,
Not by agreed appointment contracts,
But by afterthought to pay themselves,
The amounts said to be earned by lucky CEOs,
Who earned millions from sweats of investments,
Such salaried they paid themselves,
Surpassed the president's of United States,
Claimed to keep talents and prevent corruptions,
But not enough so they paid themselves,
Bonuses, life-long fees, and director fees,
Double pay added for retiring while working,
They tax, double tax and claim all costs,
Made bogey of medical care and facilities
On ground of sloppy road of welfare,
So taxes collected left as reserves in billions,
To be spent like on golden taps,
Seven wonders, more salaries or annuities,
While peoples live in struggles,
With higher fees, medical, housing and utilities,
Diverse schemes divised to claim more fees,
Size of reserves seem ever growing,
Need for spending seem unending,
Immense profits made from assets and lands,
Already paid and owned by citizens' taxations,
Billions spent not on creating jobs locally,
But in suzhou and other foreign investments,
Like Shin Corp and Barclay,
Billions vanished in thin air,
Some to buy votes with election goodies,
Fearing unhappiness of citizens,
Lleaders tweaked the election process,
Reasoned to ensure racial harmony,
So citizens cannot cast votes to elect individuals,
Who must group in block of 3, 4, 5 or 6,
To compete group of individuals called GRC,
Leaders thus monopolise election process,
Sued any politicians of threats to ruling party,
Till no one left to represent electorate,
To pacify simple peasants and potential rebel,
Goodies were given before election day,
Some as lift and precinct upgrading,
So election became no contests,
But only to vote the ruling party,
After election goodies quickly taken back,
Through GST and all fee increases,
Without showing windfalls from land sales,
Public housing built on people's lands,
Nevertheless charged at market price,
With puny discount boldly called subsidy,
Forever taxes, fees paid and paid,
Under schemes of GLCs and means tests,
Government claims back on services,
Run like MNC with monopoly fee increases,
Years after years government makes monies,
Claims success with numbers and GDP,
From banking to coffin sale all run by elites,
Who got upgraded to CEOs worth millions,
Newspapers were too afraid of truths,
Fears of defamation suits or losing licence,
Reported good news not crusading journalism.
Economy stagnated from lack of motivation,
So leaders cut citizens' wages and CPF,
By open flood gate of cheaper foreign workers,
At the first moment of world recovery,
Quickly glorified as first-world success,
Denied problems as honest mistakes,
Losses as long-term investments,
Recessions caused by narrow meritocracy,
Practical talents unable to excel,
Economy failed from talked about restructuring,
But people are blamed for lack of skills,
Or globalization and other circumstances,
Against oath over leader's dead body,
Self-glorified leaders resorted to casino,
So property values came back to the rich,
Ministers and public servants joined the first-world,
Poor workers' wages dropped to the third,
Propaganda spread vile about democracy,
To dissuade citizens from taking to street,
Citizens getting poorer each day,
So had no savings to pay for higher costs,
So there is a need to rethink on CPF policies,
To cope with ever rising medical care,
Senior citizens' CPF retirement got frozen,
At 55 they could not draw own monies,
Told they live longer so must draw at 85,
Billions of losses on foreign investments,
Eat into citizens' retirement nestegg,
A big crisis to drawdown at 55
New drawdown in annuities from 85,
Till citizens lost their own retirement monies,
So judge yourself citizens of little red dot
Judge yourself denizens of the world,
Do you fancy to be governed like the little red dot,
By suppression, faked democracy, hypocrisy,
On the outside all look good and fine,
It is orderly like police city with no robber,
But look closer it is one bloody red dot,
Stained of many corpses below MRT t -
can someone tell that senile fellow "things don't work that way, ok?"
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He's 84 or 85 years old. He earned his right to boast his achievements. You may de-ride his achievements came at certain costs to Singaporeans. Are we really that worse off? Are we really deprived of our freedom of speech, suffering from economic mis-management, led by corrupt and incompetent people, deprived of good healthcare network. We take many of these benefits for granted. Give the old man his dues, he has earned his right to boast.
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He ineed has done his duty in making this little red dot a success. If u talk about comparing worse off, with the neighbouring countries definitely Spore isOriginally posted by johntoil:He's 84 or 85 years old. He earned his right to boast his achievements. You may de-ride his achievements came at certain costs to Singaporeans. Are we really that worse off? Are we really deprived of our freedom of speech, suffering from economic mis-management, led by corrupt and incompetent people, deprived of good healthcare network. We take many of these benefits for granted. Give the old man his dues, he has earned his right to boast.
in a better position but he is talking about Malaysia. Is it an apple to apple comparison? -
good poetry
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Li Ao is right. This response is typical of the average Singaporeans who are easily satisfied with simplistic material wellbeing lacking the intellectual abilities to check on their government to make them govern with accountability and responsibility.Originally posted by johntoil:He's 84 or 85 years old. He earned his right to boast his achievements. You may de-ride his achievements came at certain costs to Singaporeans. Are we really that worse off? Are we really deprived of our freedom of speech, suffering from economic mis-management, led by corrupt and incompetent people, deprived of good healthcare network. We take many of these benefits for granted. Give the old man his dues, he has earned his right to boast.
That is why the government is behaving arrogantly and even trying to interfere with internal affairs of other countries. They will meet their match. -
Seriously, should you take the seemingly dysfunctional radio-like repeated trumpet-blowing by the deranged that seriously? His words are as believable as Li Peng's on the subject of human rights...Originally posted by robertteh:Before he could give useful advice to others, he should first look into the problems suffered by own ordinary citizens as described in the Little Red Dot caused by his self-centred authoritarian rule which has stagnated the economy into many deep recessions for years.
Owing to fortuitous circumstance like the world recovery in 2004 fueled by China's and India's accelerating growth and his final resort to IR (which by admission was finally allowed over his live body to reversed the continuous deep recessions due to failures to restructure the economy going on for years) Singapore economy finally climbed out of the lethargic property-playing trading style of government seen in 1997-2003.
Without such lucky break by now Singapore would have gone under and be taken over by the more vibrant and technologically driven Malaysia and we might be begging them instead to us back to Malaysia.
That is why MM Lee has really nothing much to boast about especially for the failure at his own economic restructuring talked about for years.
So it is still too early to say even with the IR hype and property rebound that the economy has done well. What we are having is citizens' surpluses which are yet to be put to produce jobs and upgrade the economy.
So Let us be humble and not try to tell the world or our neighbours we are better. Are our ministers capable of taking advantage of the large taxes and surpluses sucked from citizens and our unfortunate IR to restructure it to the value-adding model to produce international brand goods and services to create more value-adding jobs for the citizens.
Until then Singapore ministers could not really claim to any better than any other ministers in other countries. -
He has succeeded in creating a new man in his 'first world' country. Seems that your only concern in life is material gain. You are such a fawner.Originally posted by johntoil:He's 84 or 85 years old. He earned his right to boast his achievements. You may de-ride his achievements came at certain costs to Singaporeans. Are we really that worse off? Are we really deprived of our freedom of speech, suffering from economic mis-management, led by corrupt and incompetent people, deprived of good healthcare network. We take many of these benefits for granted. Give the old man his dues, he has earned his right to boast. -
Your words are so true wor. The 1997 Asian crisis only affected Singapore mah hor? The 9/11 also only affected Singapore and so did the Iraq war of 2003 and not to mention SARS. Singapore was the only country affected by these events that caused the recession. So true lah, your words. Nothing to do, go educate yourselfOriginally posted by robertteh:Before he could give useful advice to others, he should first look into the problems suffered by own ordinary citizens as described in the Little Red Dot caused by his self-centred authoritarian rule which has stagnated the economy into many deep recessions for years.
Owing to fortuitous circumstance like the world recovery in 2004 fueled by China's and India's accelerating growth and his final resort to IR (which by admission was finally allowed over his live body to reversed the continuous deep recessions due to failures to restructure the economy going on for years) Singapore economy finally climbed out of the lethargic property-playing trading style of government seen in 1997-2003.
Without such lucky break by now Singapore would have gone under and be taken over by the more vibrant and technologically driven Malaysia and we might be begging them instead to us back to Malaysia.
That is why MM Lee has really nothing much to boast about especially for the failure at his own economic restructuring talked about for years.
So it is still too early to say even with the IR hype and property rebound that the economy has done well. What we are having is citizens' surpluses which are yet to be put to produce jobs and upgrade the economy.
So Let us be humble and not try to tell the world or our neighbours we are better. Are our ministers capable of taking advantage of the large taxes and surpluses sucked from citizens and our unfortunate IR to restructure it to the value-adding model to produce international brand goods and services to create more value-adding jobs for the citizens.
Until then Singapore ministers could not really claim to any better than any other ministers in other countries. -
Really? How about education, security and harmony? Is your only concern politics?Originally posted by googoomuck:He has succeeded in creating a new man in his 'first world' country. Seems that your only concern in life is material gain. You are such a fawner. -
MM Lee was speaking tonight at the International Conference on Arbitration with repeated emphasis on Singapore government's upholding principle of rule of law.
He said Singapore has an independent judiciary and an efficient police and citizens are free to read anything they like and blog as they like.
Surely if judiciary was independent as claimed the ministers would not be pitching together with intimidations of all kinds and sue Tang Liang Hong for defamation over a minor innuendo remarks against ministers like having made a police report for certain wrong or speaking critical of government in the Cheng San election.
How far are such speeches true? Does he allow reporters of Straits Times to write articles featuring analytical opinions without being taken to task for engaging in crusading journalism.
How many critical letters written to the Straits Times on failed government policies were published?
Does he allow the judiciary to hear the politically motivated defamation suits independently which may not favor his ruling party or which may result in reprimanding of his party for one reason for another?
Can he reveal how was Michael Khoo transferred so soon after he delivered the contrary verdict to the opposition politician against the expectation of his government? -
hmmmm ..... wonder where this creativity comes from? Beautiful prose but alas also stained with acrimony.Originally posted by robertteh:Proverb" Men are never as good or fortunate as they think"
Let's re-visit the Little Red Dot and decide for yourself how lucky truly are we the Singaporeans. Are we the ordinary citizens better off today as compared with the 1970s and are now truly living in the first world?
PROSE OF LITTLE RED DOT (2nd edition)
.............Stained of many corpses below MRT t
Just as matter of curiosity - how many SGreans give up citizenship versus how many who took up permanent residency here. In a recent ST report, I was quite shocked to learn there are about 30,000 Myanmar nationals residing here. How many SGreans are residing in Myanmar? -
If leaders just do their duties as they are elected to do and are not so full of arrogance and boast telling the whole world how good and talented they are will the citizens have put up so many negative views and comments about their self-glorifying leadership talks.Originally posted by outofcontrol225:Your words are so true wor. The 1997 Asian crisis only affected Singapore mah hor? The 9/11 also only affected Singapore and so did the Iraq war of 2003 and not to mention SARS. Singapore was the only country affected by these events that caused the recession. So true lah, your words. Nothing to do, go educate yourself
It is the attitude of leaders which are wrong and if they are wrong no excuses like other people are worse off or how they have conquered the SARs or dengue mosquitoes or prevented fire in hougang will excuse them of criticism.
Don't forget we were the last to recover from the last three recessions and the reason for recovering is not our economic restructuring success but cutting of people's CPF and opening of floodgate to cheap foreign labor at the expense of our own young educated losing their jobs to the foreigners.
The moment the world economy turns the corner our ministers were quick to claim their success without contributing to its true successful restructuring.
They should learn to be humble like Deng Xiao Peng, Hu Jin Tao or Wen Jia Bao, who were prepared to sacrifice their positions of power and concentrate on working diligently and creatively for the people of China without all these boasts.
Our leaders should just concentrate on doing their duties for the people especially when they are so grossly and improperly over-paid to do so and let the people decide where they have done well. Only then will they earn their respect and people will give them respect where credit is due.
If they keep boasting and making comparisons with the worse off nations or people and trying to cover up their own problems then they will get just the opposite effect. -
Every democratically elected government has the sacred duty to maintain security and harmony in the country.Originally posted by outofcontrol225:Really? How about education, security and harmony? Is your only concern politics?
A responsible government will even inculcate politics into people by educating them when they are very young unless thereÂ’s something it doesnÂ’t want the people to know. In that case keeping their stomachs full will do. -
why are there still debates on whether singapore is really a democratic nation when it obviously is not...in any case spore is still doing moderately well..i believe the only people moaning about political issues now are those who have not earned their dues in life but hey life isnt fair right if everyone were rich now i think this forum would be pretty quiet...stop trying to lambaste the government picking at everything they do wrong and focus on what they have done right instead...i believe with this positive outlook we will definately do well in life regardless of whatever the political scene is
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Woah, no shiit. I didn't know we were the last to recover from the last 3 recessions. Please point me to where you got the information from. If you can't, you must be getting delusional. Quite a phenomenon nowadaysOriginally posted by robertteh:If leaders just do their duties as they are elected to do and are not so full of arrogance and boast telling the whole world how good and talented they are will the citizens have put up so many negative views and comments about their self-glorifying leadership talks.
It is the attitude of leaders which are wrong and if they are wrong no excuses like other people are worse off or how they have conquered the SARs or dengue mosquitoes or prevented fire in hougang will excuse them of criticism.
Don't forget we were the last to recover from the last three recessions and the reason for recovering is not our economic restructuring success but cutting of people's CPF and opening of floodgate to cheap foreign labor at the expense of our own young educated losing their jobs to the foreigners.
The moment the world economy turns the corner our ministers were quick to claim their success without contributing to its true successful restructuring.
They should learn to be humble like Deng Xiao Peng, Hu Jin Tao or Wen Jia Bao, who were prepared to sacrifice their positions of power and concentrate on working diligently and creatively for the people of China without all these boasts.
Our leaders should just concentrate on doing their duties for the people especially when they are so grossly and improperly over-paid to do so and let the people decide where they have done well. Only then will they earn their respect and people will give them respect where credit is due.
If they keep boasting and making comparisons with the worse off nations or people and trying to cover up their own problems then they will get just the opposite effect.
If you don't like the attitude of the leaders, then just say so. No need to accuse the government of other things. -
This forums is not just talking about bread and butter issues.Originally posted by coochi:why are there still debates on whether singapore is really a democratic nation when it obviously is not...in any case spore is still doing moderately well..i believe the only people moaning about political issues now are those who have not earned their dues in life but hey life isnt fair right if everyone were rich now i think this forum would be pretty quiet...stop trying to lambaste the government picking at everything they do wrong and focus on what they have done right instead...i believe with this positive outlook we will definately do well in life regardless of whatever the political scene is
taxation, cpf, annuity, healthcare, immigration policies, human rights, unemployment, unfair employment contracts etc....too much to list them all here.
That's what makes it interesting. Otherwise would have joined ypap forum. -
Both the government leaders attitude and their abilities to implement economic restructuring are at issue.Originally posted by outofcontrol225:Woah, no shiit. I didn't know we were the last to recover from the last 3 recessions. Please point me to where you got the information from. If you can't, you must be getting delusional. Quite a phenomenon nowadays
If you don't like the attitude of the leaders, then just say so. No need to accuse the government of other things.
Let the records and facts speak for themselves. Even Dr. Lee Wai Ling could see the shallow thinking behind the biomedical researches going on for years without targeting at the right and workable strategies to produce results.
So if leaders are good and talented they must be able to do better. There is no need whatsoever in refusing to be held accountable to challenge the people with retorts that people must prove what they said.
For example people have been told by HDB many times that the government has subsidised (much like NKF) its low cost housing but it has refused to this day to prove its claim despite the public queries with facts and figures to show HDB had merely given a discount and not a cost subsidy.
To this day both Minister Mah and HDB still refused to provide accurate information on who pay the lands and who sold the lands to SLA and where the profits go to in the first place.
MOM has given some lame figure to show job creations but how many such jobs were created for the citizens as opposed to foreigners and PRs. How does he defined unemployed? Were the long unemployed included in this definition?
The above are just one or two examples to show the people are not at fault but it is the government which refuses to work with accountability and transparency.
If the government continues to refuse to provide accurate and accountable information on job creations and unemployments and this has resulted the NUS professors giving different opinions about unemployment situation or job creation who is at fault? -
Actually, I find that I can't argue much with that. It's just that some people place more priorities on politics and freedom of speech. Personally, I have no interest in politics nor an overwhelming desire to criticize the government.Originally posted by googoomuck:Every democratically elected government has the sacred duty to maintain security and harmony in the country.
A responsible government will even inculcate politics into people by educating them when they are very young unless thereÂ’s something it doesnÂ’t want the people to know. In that case keeping their stomachs full will do.
If their policies are not sound, then lobby for a better one, by all means. But most of the policies are pretty sound anyway. Except maybe for the recent CPF changes. -
Are we really deprived of our political rights? We can still speak in this forum. Although, I am banned from Ypap forum. The point is we can still vote and say our piece against the government. Are we muzzled that tight? Are we banned from voting for the opposition?
Yep, I agree that they can make mistakes in their policies and we can end up paying the price. What's important is that we be given the channel to object to their proposals. I have raised issues with them.
HDB's policy to open the housing loan to the commercial banks was an example that they listened. I know the policy sucks for Singaporeans. Well, at least they think my suggestion is workable.