An Open Letter of Catherine Lim to PM Lee Hsien Loong
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The Saints have reached the pinnacle of their holy endeavors, why will they have any ideals when they have no need for anything that resemble the materialistic needs of man ?Originally posted by Daddy!!:ideals belong to the saints. human beings are afterall human beings: mostly sinful.
I can assure you that even democracy will screw Singapore up. dont be so simple minded, tunnel vision.
singapore has already one formidable government and you want to change it even before the cracks appear? you think democracy is a super-glue? democracy will bring in politicians who are like actors, only look good on the surface.
What makes you think that the cracks have not appeared in Singapore ?
Is the formidability of the Singapore Government seen from a point of strength or from a point of desparation to keep the glue together before everything get busted open and the skeletons are spilled out of the cabinet ?
Democracy is not necessarily a super-glue to fix the cracks, but is certainly a huge spot lamp to light up all the dark secret corners that this government attempt to shore up its formidiblity to prevent any Alternative Parties from gaining political power, and all the scandolous secrets will be spilled open.
If Singapore is truly a First World Country as LKY claim, why are there no transparency in Government ?
Why are Government Records continuously held as TOP SECRET classification for more then FORTY YEARS, when other First World Countries will open up their archives after THIRTY YEARS - to allow studies to be made and prevent mistakes from recurring ?
It is obvious that the more formidable a government tries to be, the more reasons to doubt its condition - history has shown the falseness in Nazism and Communism in their challenge to Democratic Institutions. -
NKF under TT Durai has clearly shown that things can look pretty good on the outside but is rotten on the inside.
NKF under TT Durai has clearly shown why transparency and accountability is so important.
NKF under TT Durai has shown that dishonorable people can win defamation suits even when the accusations against them are true.
Even after the example so claerly set by NKF under TT Durai, we still have people support despotic dictators unwilling to let democracy as you say, shine its light into dark corners. -
Thanks for the attention given to my post which I hope you will appreciate that my consistency has been with accuracy in historical facts influencing our current views.Originally posted by CX:And what's your consistency? to question the view of others with rhetorical questions to contradict and deride others?
To start a flame war?
It is dangerous when current views are based on assumption of facts that are ''inaccurate'' or simply carelessly derived from hearsay, or gossip, or pseudo-intellectual thinking.
Flame war is part of history, and if those who persist in twisting historical facts that have been clearly documented with established facts, surely the willful perpetrator deserves to go up in flame.
How would you treat the Japanese Right Wingers who insist that the Nanking Massacre did not occur, or the brilliant Iranian President insisting that the Holocaust was a figment of Israeli propaganda backed by the West ?
Can these be simple differences in opinion ?
''NATO'' ?
Something's wrong with us today... Not just with the government, but going by the gist of this thread too... We're trying to be more open and inclusive to diverse views but intellectual arrogance or pure and simple "NATO" gets in the way...
Each of us have our own contribution in society, by labelling others as ''NATO'' - have you questioned your own contribution to eradicating the grieviances that you may have in common with others ?
Does it not reflect a certain degree of ''intellectual arrogance'' towards others whom you think are ''NATO'' ?
The problem with many Singaporeans today is that they have allowed LKY's effort to succeed at ''Filling the Stomach, and Dull the Brain''.
It is a pity that highly educated Singaporeans will willingly gloss over the many 'contradictions' of LKY and his MIW clones in Government, and prefer to tow the line - exchanging their political rights for material gains.
You are correct that Catherine Lim's piece is aimed at encouraging this MIW Government to be more open and inclusive to diverse views.
Have you realised that implicit in her call, she is calling for more liberal political space to be returned to Singaporeans ?
With the present difficult level of quality in the ordinary lives of Singaporeans today, do you seriously believe that Singaporeans complain simply for the sake of complaining ?
I don't believe in complaining just for the sake of complaining (which many singaporeans seems to be very good at...)
I also don't believe in arguing for its own sake.
The question of freedom of speech, or a more open, inclusive Singapore, is largely sterile.
With the Government Ministers and Civil Servants honing their skills in giving oblique replies that are ''non-replies'' - literally stone-walling - surely you can understand Singaporeans for having so much to complain about ?
This piece is the gem from your deliberate analytical effort.
Even in the best of places, pple cannot eat democracy. If freedom of speech and political openness can achieve the greater good of better jobs, better economic opportunities and ensure the nations survival as a cohesive and viable entity, then its simply horses for courses.
There are valid arguments that suggests this to be so... the Knowledge Based economy is not about drones assembling cheap products in a production line. Its about intellectual capital being able to work in an attractive place that provides the environment that best taps their know-how and fosters innovation.
It is still about bread and butter issues.
Where do you think we should move from this point of your understanding ?
Can Singapore's present political environment allow any intellectual space for the intellectually challenged to progress in step with other advanced countries ?
Is POLITICS merely about political parties competing with other political parties to gain political points to form the next government ?
Or does POLITICS also involve the total complex relations between people living together, carefully managing their affairs for the purpose of economic, social and cultural advancement as a community and-or nation ?
Under such circumstance, is POLITICS not the responsibility of all Citizens and not the exclusive realm of Professional Politicians - so as to allow the community / nation to progress?
Unfortunately, questions need to be asked in order that one do not make the wrong assumption and end up with a useless endless arguments that should have been a civil discussion or debate of ideas.
Singapore is not yet such a place because of its relative restrictiveness.
In proceeding with this civil discussion, may we have counter-arguments or alternative views instead of just rhetorical questions?
How can Singapore not yet be such a place when even LKY has already claimed that Singapore has already attained First World status in his memoirs written more then five years ago ?
What are you referring to with your term ''relative restrictiveness'' ?
Are you referring to the current state of ''political restrictiveness'' that exist for the last four decades ?
Or is Singapore not ready for full democracy due to the ''relative restrictiveness'' of Singapore's physical size that makes Singapore vulnerable if there is no political cohesion ? -
Your good laugh seems to look more agonising than pleasure.Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:Like I said before, you never failed to solicit a good laugh from me - hahaahh. You will and always be covered in the pile of crap. That's in your DNA but you forget about that. That's why your colour don't change. I have no envy of your political vibes and have no wish to be in pole position like you. Try shifting again, maybe the pile will move.
''hahaahh'' - seems more like the 'pile of crap' have been squashed.
Can we believe your statement that you have ''no envy of your political vibes and have no wish to be in pole position like you'' ?
Even LKY has been dishonest in introducing another to be the future PM of Singapore, only to take the position for himself - can a 'pile of crap' be depended on with such publicly declared statements of low ambitions ?
Try as you like in turning the table around, you will find it hard to stick it on me, as I have not been fed crap in similar ways as your ''stoopid daddy and mummy''.
If my colors do not change, should we doubt that yours will ?
Afterall, the 'pile of crap' is known to be desparate to be 'TheGoodEarth'. -
The next generation of political leaders will have to tackle such NKF problems. Such problems were caused by lack of accountability and transparency happening under authoritarian rule where clever but self-serving individuals took refuge to screw up the masses.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:NKF under TT Durai has clearly shown that things can look pretty good on the outside but is rotten on the inside.
NKF under TT Durai has clearly shown why transparency and accountability is so important.
NKF under TT Durai has shown that dishonorable people can win defamation suits even when the accusations against them are true.
Even after the example so claerly set by NKF under TT Durai, we still have people support despotic dictators unwilling to let democracy as you say, shine its light into dark corners.
This is a reflection of the current political patronage to all the elites also known as protectionism.
Unless this protectionism happening all over the organizations from NKF to Temasek, Hougang Fire and the latest Sembmarine multi-million losses due to abuse and malpractices is recognised earlier as a major ill of our authoritarian rule and tackled fully and effectively there will be many more elites taking advantage of the authoritarian system which has already manifested in many self-interests among men of position. -
Originally posted by Atobe:
hmmmm .... thank you for making me laugh again ..... hahaahha. Your political vibes are of course dusty antics that a magic broom could easily sweep away. Your stoopid daddy and mummy did not feed you crap but pile you in one!
Your good laugh seems to look more agonising than pleasure.
[b]''hahaahh'' - seems more like the 'pile of crap' have been squashed.
Can we believe your statement that you have ''no envy of your political vibes and have no wish to be in pole position like you'' ?
Even LKY has been dishonest in introducing another to be the future PM of Singapore, only to take the position for himself - can a 'pile of crap' be depended on with such publicly declared statements of low ambitions ?
Try as you like in turning the table around, you will find it hard to stick it on me, as I have not been fed crap in similar ways as your ''stoopid daddy and mummy''.
If my colors do not change, should we doubt that yours will ?
Afterall, the 'pile of crap' is known to be desparate to be 'TheGoodEarth'.
[/b] -
Now it seems that there are some improvement in your on-line behaviour giving considered thought before making a weak attempt at laughter to redeem your composure.Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:hmmmm .... thank you for making me laugh again ..... hahaahha. Your political vibes are of course dusty antics that a magic broom could easily sweep away. Your stoopid daddy and mummy did not feed you crap but pile you in one!
Is my ''daddy and mummy so stoopid'' - in the manner that you have described other parents - that they will place me deep in crap ?
Surely, you do not know the love that parents have towards their children, as your resentful remarks towards parents seems to have arisen from your experience in being mistreated by your own parents - otherwise why will you address other parents as ''stoopid'' ?
If a magic broom can so easily sweep away your perception of my political vibes as being dusty antics, why have you not produced that magic broom from your 'pile of crap' ?
Are you still at nursery stage believing in magic brooms ?
Surely, we can understand your desparation of a magic broom now one to sweep away the 'pile of crap' that you somehow continue to lay all over the place with each posting. -
hahahaha, how come you didn't point out h and the positioning of h? hmmm .... actually hor ... the magic broom was somebody else' idea I used to sweep your antics. The beauty of postings here and there it that you can make use of ideas. As for your question on nursery, it is better to ask the person who gave me the idea to sweep you!Originally posted by Atobe:Now it seems that there are some improvement in your on-line behaviour giving considered thought before making a weak attempt at laughter to redeem your composure.
Is my ''daddy and mummy so stoopid'' - in the manner that you have described other parents - that they will place me deep in crap ?
Surely, you do not know the love that parents have towards their children, as your resentful remarks towards parents seems to have arisen from your experience in being mistreated by your own parents - otherwise why will you address other parents as ''stoopid'' ?
If a magic broom can so easily sweep away your perception of my political vibes as being dusty antics, why have you not produced that magic broom from your 'pile of crap' ?
Are you still at nursery stage believing in magic brooms ?
Surely, we can understand your desparation of a magic broom now one to sweep away the 'pile of crap' that you somehow continue to lay all over the place with each posting. -
The reason for suddenly dropping comments to alphabet 'h' and describing your effort with a weak laughter to recover yourself - is to gauge if you will respond to a sudden absence in attention given.Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:hahahaha, how come you didn't point out h and the positioning of h? hmmm .... actually hor ... the magic broom was somebody else' idea I used to sweep your antics. The beauty of postings here and there it that you can make use of ideas. As for your question on nursery, it is better to ask the person who gave me the idea to sweep you!
It is not a surprise that a weak mind will catch on to the missing attention and respond accordingly.
If you are going to busy yourself posting here and there, you should learn to be more discerning and circumspect as you will easily grow the ''pile of crap'' that is becoming reflective of your character even in this virtual world.
One can simply pick up the nuances in the quality of the replies that you post - magic brooms ? - are you capable to sweep me off ?
Are you not in a hurry to have me stuck in the ''pile of crap'' ?
You are full of contradictions - which is typical of the .......... -
Dear Robert Teh
I am happy that there are such ppl like Cat Lim who showed their concerns and took the trouble to write.
But I also have this to say. LHL appears to be more engaging, more approachable than LKY. He has this easy manner of him.
But unlike LKY, he seems more resolute in his beliefs and thinkings. Unlike LKY, who pauses before he dismisses a view, LHL has this gesture of brushing off views he doesn't agree with.
My prediction - nothing is going to change for a long time to come. -
Dear 0001000,
It is good to see another digit of people coming to understand the truths and the need for accountability and transparency in our autocratic system of government which only benefit the rich and the elites themselves.
People should continue to play an active part in expressing their views and alternative solutions even if they cannot write so eloquently like Catherine Lim for whatever their worth.
They should not overwhelmed by all the self-praise hypocrisy and constant denials of problems characterizing the current self-glorifying and self-serving autocracy.
Many cyber-agents sent to counter alternate views and solutions of the people have been effectively countered by more objective views and creative views and solutions posted by many citizens on numerous issues and problems.
Isn't your latest loss of right to collect or withdraw your own CPF retirement saving yet another ample proof that the government is only caring for their own superficial governing success and is no longer governing for the greatest benefits of the greatest number.
Do stay engaged here and post your views and solutions too among all active citizens so as to prepare the ground and conditions for change. -
I am confident to say that in sg, there are certainly truely Good people.
Good as in considering 'for' the People. Andrew, Robert, Catherine. They are good people to me.
Look at our MPs, look at what they have 'contributed".
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hahahah, you never fail to make me laugh with your antics. I am contradiction to you bcos I stick you up like no other. You will be in my pile now and ever more to come.Originally posted by Atobe:The reason for suddenly dropping comments to alphabet 'h' and describing your effort with a weak laughter to recover yourself - is to gauge if you will respond to a sudden absence in attention given.
It is not a surprise that a weak mind will catch on to the missing attention and respond accordingly.
If you are going to busy yourself posting here and there, you should learn to be more discerning and circumspect as you will easily grow the ''pile of crap'' that is becoming reflective of your character even in this virtual world.
One can simply pick up the nuances in the quality of the replies that you post - magic brooms ? - are you capable to sweep me off ?
Are you not in a hurry to have me stuck in the ''pile of crap'' ?
You are full of contradictions - which is typical of the .......... -
Thanks for the compliment. I am only a commoner not worthy of the accolade.Originally posted by reddressman:I am confident to say that in sg, there are certainly truely Good people.
Good as in considering 'for' the People. Andrew, Robert, Catherine. They are good people to me.
Look at our MPs, look at what they have 'contributed". -
Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:
Do you seriously believe in yourself that much to even acknowledge being recognised as a ''pile of crap'' ?
hahahah, you never fail to make me laugh with your antics. I am contradiction to you bcos I stick you up like no other. You will be in my pile now and ever more to come.
Try laughing harder to put up a straight face before you even hope to get me stuck in your pile - hahahah - is only a three syllable tone which does not make too much of a realistic laughter.
Is there any difference between you and the 'crap sniffer' in the mutual trait in being expert at derailing any thread ?
Amazing that each time one has lost his credibility and take a short break, the other will re-appear to take over - one producing the 'pile of crap' and one great at being a 'crap sniffer'. -
on the contrary.Originally posted by LazerLordz:He as our next PM = more authoritarian rule. Frankly, he doesn't even have an international stature.
I think he has some experiences. i won't throw that out totally from his previous roles. I think he is caution, he is less vocal or let's say he won't be as gone ho has LHL who would put his opinon first before the nation.
I had once ask foreign diplomat on him, the feedback i got was he is soft spoken but i think that can be changed. -
i don't think she want to get into the politics. she simply want to point out weakness in current state of gov.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Yes, but she has perhaps failed to understand the weakness of the PAP. -
I like reading your entry, was nodding my head in many parts. New to this forum and politics in general. Just makes me sad how the poor struggle to make ends meet in "capitalist" Singapore.Originally posted by robertteh:Thanks for the compliment. I am only a commoner not worthy of the accolade. -
Your antics get more comical every time you get into the pile. hahahhaOriginally posted by Atobe:Do you seriously believe in yourself that much to even acknowledge being recognised as a ''pile of crap'' ?
Try laughing harder to put up a straight face before you even hope to get me stuck in your pile - hahahah - is only a three syllable tone which does not make too much of a realistic laughter.
Is there any difference between you and the 'crap sniffer' in the mutual trait in being expert at derailing any thread ?
Amazing that each time one has lost his credibility and take a short break, the other will re-appear to take over - one producing the 'pile of crap' and one great at being a 'crap sniffer'. -
It seems that you have now decided to accept yourself to be the 'pile of crap' that you have surely revealed yourself to be.Originally posted by TheGoodEarth:Your antics get more comical every time you get into the pile. hahahha
Can anyone be more comical than one who claims to be 'TheGoodEarth' but turn out to be nothing more then a 'PileOfCrap' ?
What happened to your persistent chase for an answer to your ''Question in Red'' that you have been chasing for my reply in the other thread ?
Have you been blowing too hard on the 'pile of crap' and had brilliantly merge the crap onto your face, or have you conveniently found your independence from being stuck in your own 'pile of crap' in RED ? -
Perhaps so.. however, I do not have much confidence in him being the person to further liberalise Singapore.Originally posted by Arapahoe:on the contrary.
I think he has some experiences. i won't throw that out totally from his previous roles. I think he is caution, he is less vocal or let's say he won't be as gone ho has LHL who would put his opinon first before the nation.
I had once ask foreign diplomat on him, the feedback i got was he is soft spoken but i think that can be changed.
Remember, he's the Party Whip. -
I hope this will become an active inter-active forum where people with different independent views and opinions will interact and value-add to their own personal perceptions and experiences with which they could face the future with greater understanding and success.Originally posted by jaggae:I like reading your entry, was nodding my head in many parts. New to this forum and politics in general. Just makes me sad how the poor struggle to make ends meet in "capitalist" Singapore.
By growing such an active citizenry we all could stay engage and prepare ground and conditions for change.