History has proven that govt that plunder people will fail
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History has been a good judge of countries and leaders so far.
Countries do well because their people trusted their government and will stay to fight for the people and government to attain peace, prosperity and progress.
If leaders simply plunder the wealth of their people by using all kinds of excuses to over-tax its people enriching themselves in the face of people's suffering, such leaders will drive away creativity, entrepreneurship eventually no matter how the leaders try to retain them.
Such leaders may be able to fool some people some of the time but will not be able to fool all people all the time and will eventually create a deep hollow within and fail.
Even imported citizens will see through the ploy and will not believe or trust such leaders and will run away at the first sign of trouble. -
May be Singapore is exceptional. That "good" old man LKY has done so well to protect himself and his party and I believe PAP is failure proof. More so when we have so many singaporeans like the 66.6% still give them the chance to continue to shine.
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Too much monies being taken from people have already increased suicides at the MRT. This is just the tip of the iceberg. There are many divorces and family break-ups and quarrels on money problems as well as reducing marriages, lowering birth rates and increased tensions among locals due to foreigners taking up jobs as their expense.Originally posted by qlqq9:May be Singapore is exceptional. That "good" old man LKY has done so well to protect himself and his party and I believe PAP is failure proof. More so when we have so many singaporeans like the 66.6% still give them the chance to continue to shine.
All these problems will drive us downhill as a country. For now the news every day paint a good picture. Now in reality, it is a cooking pot of discontent gathering steam as days go by. PAP can carry on keeping everything as business as usual but there is no certainty and unrest can be stopped or contained.
There will be unrest and lawlessness due to such problems. -
All i can say is, things will change, time will tell. Good or bad, ask yourself.
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For now the news every day paint a good picture. Now in reality, it is a cooking pot of discontent gathering steam as days go by.
The PAP regime might be using propaganda to neutralise discontent.
This will only have limited effects. -
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't all this boil down to the "money not enough mentality"? As in, ppl complain money not enuf, but nvr complain money is too much.
So what does the govt have to do with it? Isin't this society's problem already? -
How about this boil down to the "money not enough mentality"? As in, gov complain tax not enuf, but nvr complain tax is too much?Originally posted by avgquan:Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't all this boil down to the "money not enough mentality"? As in, ppl complain money not enuf, but nvr complain money is too much.
So what does the govt have to do with it? Isin't this society's problem already? -
Neutralization will not postpone the problem. There may be more suicides.Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:The PAP regime might be using propaganda to neutralise discontent.
This will only have limited effects. -
plundering and paying themselves very high pay is different thing..
plundering = Marcos who wiped out his country's coffers
and the others who ran their country's coffers for insane things like hugeass luxury yachts, palaces.. while the majority of the people can't even find enough scraps and are living below the poverty line near the starvation line..
where people are unable to even get a proper education, proper sanitation... everything like that...
you asswipes are using words which cheapen the suffering of those countries where leaders actually plunder.. those living in garbage mountains, attempting to scrabble a little bit of scrap to sell for a meal..
damn you for that.. you have just cheapened their lives, their suffering..
for your pathetic whiny little political agenda...
aren't you ashamed of yourself? -
Some words used are just insulting... I simply don't agree with them. Singaporeans do suffer under certain policies, but we aren't certainly deprived of necessities, which citizens in some other countries are seriously lacking in due to issues only known to politicians themselves.
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Good point. But, if that's what you're saying, does it mean that:Originally posted by wheelcamp:How about this boil down to the "money not enough mentality"? As in, gov complain tax not enuf, but nvr complain tax is too much?
New govt = Lower tax
Lower tax = ppl more money
Ppl more money = Ppl become happier
Ppl are happier = country more stable?
So the stabilty of the country is dependant on the happiness of the ppl and not the competence of the leaders? -
Alamak...... you ain't 1st day here rightOriginally posted by the Bear:plundering and paying themselves very high pay is different thing..
plundering = Marcos who wiped out his country's coffers
and the others who ran their country's coffers for insane things like hugeass luxury yachts, palaces.. while the majority of the people can't even find enough scraps and are living below the poverty line near the starvation line..
where people are unable to even get a proper education, proper sanitation... everything like that...
you asswipes are using words which cheapen the suffering of those countries where leaders actually plunder.. those living in garbage mountains, attempting to scrabble a little bit of scrap to sell for a meal..
damn you for that.. you have just cheapened their lives, their suffering..
for your pathetic whiny little political agenda...
aren't you ashamed of yourself?
As long as anything is anti-govt...... these ppl will just support.
To TS..... yes, History had proven many things....... So you will also have to wait till History proves S'pore was a failed system lor. Wait ok....... wait....... -
Originally posted by hloc:
So make sure you don't give any ill and negative comments on the PAP gahmen. I am going to store this message of yours and use it in future if need be. Remember, you contributed to negative comments about PAP before.
Alamak...... you ain't 1st day here right
As long as anything is anti-govt...... these ppl will just support.
To TS..... yes, [b]History had proven many things....... So you will also have to wait till History proves S'pore was a failed system lor. Wait ok....... wait....... [/b] -
Why not?Originally posted by avgquan:New govt = Lower tax
Lower tax = ppl more money
Ppl more money = Ppl become happier
Ppl are happier = country more stable?
Both have a part.Originally posted by avgquan:So the stabilty of the country is dependant on the happiness of the ppl and not the competence of the leaders? -
So, corruption is acceptable and should be tolerated, as some people are clearly implying.
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The central idea of the first post is to point out that the trust between singaporeans and its government is eroding over time, which is really something real and can be felt.Originally posted by the Bear:plundering and paying themselves very high pay is different thing..
plundering = Marcos who wiped out his country's coffers
you have just cheapened their lives, their suffering..
for your pathetic whiny little political agenda...
aren't you ashamed of yourself?
One reason for this erosion of trust is the perception of leaders' loyalty to their followers. This can be seen from whether our top leaders truly share in the challenges/suffering of the people, whether policies are made with the intent of benefitting our people, whether they truly listen to our concerns and address them instead of making a pretense of listening.
The people have seen that our top leaders, already the highest paid in the world, will increase their salaries by as high as 20% when many poorer singaporeans struggle to cope with the rising costs of living. There are so many singaporeans, especially our old folks, who struggle to live decently.
Some nursing homes who take care of these old folks survive through donations from fellow singaporeans because the financial support from the government is oh so little. And you can see from those who are living in one room flats that their living conditions can be much improved. Many of these flats are so run-down with paint falling off the walls, and nonfunctioning corridor lights which are left unrepaired for months on end. We feel for them. If the MP knew about this situation, and rightly he must, then also rightly he should take action to address this. Financial resources are always limited but if they are truly concerned about people, then they will find a way to make sure money is used where it is most needed.
It's from all these big and small issues that the people make the judgment of whether their leaders are loyal to them.
Other issues of integrity (moral leadership) and transparency also follows.
Well, right now, im not sure exactly how loyal our government is to our people. -
No problem dude.....Originally posted by qlqq9:So make sure you don't give any ill and negative comments on the PAP gahmen. I am going to store this message of yours and use it in future if need be. Remember, you contributed to negative comments about PAP before.
I never believed that Govt is Sooooo Free as to keep tab on what we said all the time. If they were, many many members here would long ago be drinking coffee with the ISD people......
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Let's see in the next election how much the 66.6% has eroded, with that unpopular spate of recent policies immediately after election.Originally posted by qlqq9:May be Singapore is exceptional. That "good" old man LKY has done so well to protect himself and his party and I believe PAP is failure proof. More so when we have so many singaporeans like the 66.6% still give them the chance to continue to shine.
If dip a lot, I predict LHL will say "I'm disappointed in blah blah blah. PAP is blah blah blah party of elites blah blah, yet Singaporeans decide to cast their votes to the blah blah blah Opposition" -
Nonsense.Originally posted by eagle:Let's see in the next election how much the 66.6% has eroded, with that unpopular spate of recent policies immediately after election.
If dip a lot, I predict LHL will say "I'm disappointed in blah blah blah. PAP is blah blah blah party of elites blah blah, yet Singaporeans decide to cast their votes to the blah blah blah Opposition"
The addition of 1 million new citizens in the near future will show you that the popularity of the incumbent party is increasing. -
Originally posted by charlize:Nonsense.
The addition of 1 million new citizens in the near future will show you that the popularity of the incumbent party is increasing. Agreed. -
this hypothesis is ridiculous
It's the logical equivalent of saying drinking water has been shown to result in death(which is true because you WILL eventually die)
Every form of government in history has fallen in one way or the other. All history has proven about governance is that it doesn't last forever. -
without the people, no one can win. absolutely no one.Originally posted by qlqq9:May be Singapore is exceptional. That "good" old man LKY has done so well to protect himself and his party and I believe PAP is failure proof. More so when we have so many singaporeans like the 66.6% still give them the chance to continue to shine. -
which history are u refering to? when all else failed, they can simply move to the nation where they had stashed billions of dollars plundered from the people. Leaving behind a big pile of crap on the broken throne for people who cares.Originally posted by robertteh:History has been a good judge of countries and leaders so far.
Countries do well because their people trusted their government and will stay to fight for the people and government to attain peace, prosperity and progress.
If leaders simply plunder the wealth of their people by using all kinds of excuses to over-tax its people enriching themselves in the face of people's suffering, such leaders will drive away creativity, entrepreneurship eventually no matter how the leaders try to retain them.
Such leaders may be able to fool some people some of the time but will not be able to fool all people all the time and will eventually create a deep hollow within and fail.
Even imported citizens will see through the ploy and will not believe or trust such leaders and will run away at the first sign of trouble.
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Bump .... bery bery well said arOriginally posted by le cruz:The central idea of the first post is to point out that the trust between singaporeans and its government is eroding over time, which is really something real and can be felt.
One reason for this erosion of trust is the perception of leaders' loyalty to their followers. This can be seen from whether our top leaders truly share in the challenges/suffering of the people, whether policies are made with the intent of benefitting our people, whether they truly listen to our concerns and address them instead of making a pretense of listening.
The people have seen that our top leaders, already the highest paid in the world, will increase their salaries by as high as 20% when many poorer singaporeans struggle to cope with the rising costs of living. There are so many singaporeans, especially our old folks, who struggle to live decently.
Some nursing homes who take care of these old folks survive through donations from fellow singaporeans because the financial support from the government is oh so little. And you can see from those who are living in one room flats that their living conditions can be much improved. Many of these flats are so run-down with paint falling off the walls, and nonfunctioning corridor lights which are left unrepaired for months on end. We feel for them. If the MP knew about this situation, and rightly he must, then also rightly he should take action to address this. Financial resources are always limited but if they are truly concerned about people, then they will find a way to make sure money is used where it is most needed.
It's from all these big and small issues that the people make the judgment of whether their leaders are loyal to them.
Other issues of integrity (moral leadership) and transparency also follows.
Well, right now, im not sure exactly how loyal our government is to our people.
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in this morally lacking time, people's concern is only for their own pockets and people will keep to popular and safe vote. MRT tracks and migration are fast becoming a solution to people of different backgrounds and eventually the popluation will be replaced by opportunistic non locals