Reduce the load of pertrol in your vehicle
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Originally posted by PRP:
Gewwngoblin,
Why can't i get the "reply with quote" wroking?
If u pump every 10 days,then your car carry excessive & unecesssary half a tank of fuel for about 5 days.If u filled half a tank of fuel each time,then it would probably last u 5 days.Not that inconvenince to pump fuel every 5 days and it would reduce your fuel consumption.
Pls chack your car mannul what octane of fuel your car should use.If it is 95 octane, the pumping higher octane fuel woundn't improve the performance of your car according to experts.
Erm... Some calculations will tell you that the difference between half a tank and a full tank (assume 40 litres tank) will, on average, only affect less than 1% of fuel consumption.
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i am never bothered with this half load/full load thingy. I think planning your routes and driving `smoothly' has better impact on your fuel consumption.
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Originally posted by fishbuff:
wha.. most of the forumers here own cars. so who says singaporeans are poor? long live PAP!
Chatted some of my friends..... HDB can pay with CPF.... salary use to finance loan for car.So HDB takes donkey years to pay out (with little additional repayments) and the car after 10 years poof! 50-60k assuming an average car.
So assuming an average Joe that does the above.... HDB and Car will be what he is working for his entire life.
Assuming he produces 1 kid with the same mindset.....voila! Another drone for the economy.... his lifetime pay? 1 HDB 1 Car
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
Chatted some of my friends..... HDB can pay with CPF.... salary use to finance loan for car.So HDB takes donkey years to pay out (with little additional repayments) and the car after 10 years poof! 50-60k assuming an average car.
So assuming an average Joe that does the above.... HDB and Car will be what he is working for his entire life.
Assuming he produces 1 kid with the same mindset.....voila! Another drone for the economy.... his lifetime pay? 1 HDB 1 Car
for housing, isn't it typical for an average joe to take 20-25 years to pay off, regardless of where you live? i am not sure when you mention `donkey years', how many years is that. unless one is rich, this is a typical life cycle one goes through. my parents slough for most of their lives to pay off their house too, in addition to raising their children.
as for cars, cost aside, most will also take 3-7 years to pay the car off for an average joe. typically, one will change their cars at least 3-5 times in their lifetime. technology upgrade, car safety and exterior look are main reasons for the change. i am on my 7th car already (call me stupid, but that is another discussion all together). whether your car(s) can be owned in perpetuity or 10 years is a moot point for reasons i listed prior. most will change their cars. even if you can own your car in perpetuity, they is no value in your car, unless it is a classic. let's use everyone's favourite comparison, australia. if you own a 15year old toyota camry, i am not sure what is the market price there, but you can check on the carsales.au site easily, it will probably sell for AU$6k.
overall, admittedly singapore is relatively more expensive on housing and cars than some, but this is applicable to any average joe around the globe on car and house ownership.
how is it that what you have written above is such a revelation? or what is your point?
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Originally posted by redDUST:
for housing, isn't it typical for an average joe to take 20-25 years to pay off, regardless of where you live? i am not sure when you mention `donkey years', how many years is that. unless one is rich, this is a typical life cycle one goes through. my parents slough for most of their lives to pay off their house too, in addition to raising their children.
as for cars, cost aside, most will also take 3-7 years to pay the car off for an average joe. typically, one will change their cars at least 3-5 times in their lifetime. technology upgrade, car safety and exterior look are main reasons for the change. i am on my 7th car already (call me stupid, but that is another discussion all together). whether your car(s) can be owned in perpetuity or 10 years is a moot point for reasons i listed prior. most will change their cars. even if you can own your car in perpetuity, they is no value in your car, unless it is a classic. let's use everyone's favourite comparison, australia. if you own a 15year old toyota camry, i am not sure what is the market price there, but you can check on the carsales.au site easily, it will probably sell for AU$6k.
overall, admittedly singapore is relatively more expensive on housing and cars than some, but this is applicable to any average joe around the globe on car and house ownership.
how is it that what you have written above is such a revelation? or what is your point?
Hi bro,
I apologize for not making my point clear. Because cars in Singapore is expensive 50-60k (my facts may be wrong) and it lasts 10 years after which you get scrap value back.... there's not much room for additional repayments to the Avg Joe's mortgage.
So alot of SGs are basically using their CPF to finance their loan (but the interest rate is low which is why many do it i believe) minimally and it takes ages to pay off (25 years is a long time in my opinion) their HDB.
And all these are leases. You own the lease. After which your kids take up their own leases and the cycle goes on.
Freehold/999 is very hard (expensive) for new couples to break into without help.
So the rich (with freehold) passes on their freehold to their kids and HDB owners pass on a lease which is going to be used up .... one of the reasons why i think the rich get richer and the poor gets poorer.
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I think also because the rich earns more by percentage interest or investments... i.e. 5% returns for 250k vs 5% returns for 20k
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Originally posted by eagle:
I think also because the rich earns more by percentage interest or investments... i.e. 5% returns for 250k vs 5% returns for 20k
True that. But that's fair cause its still 5% bro.
However the fact that average Joe's are likely to purchase HDB/99 year lease within their means they actually contribute less to the next generation which isn't the case for freehold/999.
This widens the gap between the rich and poor and is an issue which i feel should be tackled cause it isn't fair imo.
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
True that. But that's fair cause its still 5% bro.
However the fact that average Joe's are likely to purchase HDB/99 year lease within their means they actually contribute less to the next generation which isn't the case for freehold/999.
This widens the gap between the rich and poor and is an issue which i feel should be tackled cause it isn't fair imo.
5% is actually a more conservative estimate... When the economy is better, it could be more... Not to mention that the rich will most probably not need to touch those money, so they can be safely used for investing., whereas the average Joe would not dare to invest as much.
Your view about the HDB part is interesting. But well, if you are rich, the opportunites are far wider.
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Originally posted by eagle:
5% is actually a more conservative estimate... When the economy is better, it could be more... Not to mention that the rich will most probably not need to touch those money, so they can be safely used for investing., whereas the average Joe would not dare to invest as much.
Your view about the HDB part is interesting. But well, if you are rich, the opportunites are far wider.
I'll agree with that sad fact of life but not much can be done about that. We can't give the rich for eg. 4% interest rate and give the rest 5%. Won't b fair to the rich.Possibly tax the rich more and the poor less .... what do you think?
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
I'll agree with that sad fact of life but not much can be done about that. We can't give the rich for eg. 4% interest rate and give the rest 5%. Won't b fair to the rich.Possibly tax the rich more and the poor less .... what do you think?
Well, it takes a lot of risks for the rich to get richer too, only thing is that they can better afford the risks.
But if you tax them more, what motivation are there for them to take more risks, unless the returns are extremely great?
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
Hi bro,
I apologize for not making my point clear. Because cars in Singapore is expensive 50-60k (my facts may be wrong) and it lasts 10 years after which you get scrap value back.... there's not much room for additional repayments to the Avg Joe's mortgage.
So alot of SGs are basically using their CPF to finance their loan (but the interest rate is low which is why many do it i believe) minimally and it takes ages to pay off (25 years is a long time in my opinion) their HDB.
And all these are leases. You own the lease. After which your kids take up their own leases and the cycle goes on.
Freehold/999 is very hard (expensive) for new couples to break into without help.
So the rich (with freehold) passes on their freehold to their kids and HDB owners pass on a lease which is going to be used up .... one of the reasons why i think the rich get richer and the poor gets poorer.
thanks for clarifying.
there is the average joe who earns quite a fair bit (say up to S$6k/month) and the average joe who is really `average in his wages' (S$2-3k). the upper a-joe if he lives in a hdb flat, can let his CPF takes care of the repayment. technically, his disposable income is not affected as his CPF can take care of the payment, more so if mrs average joe chips in with the flat repayment. hence, he is left with his only other big ticket item, which is the car. in the singapore context, this average joe should be able to afford his car, i supposed an `average joe car like an altis'.
the rich getting richer is a conventional norm we accept as truth. maybe there is some truth in it. luckily, god is fair, things can go both ways. the rich, if they are not careful, can also be a pauper. just as the less-rich working their way up.
imo, the universal truth is 20% of the population probably control 80% of the wealth in a country, australia no exception. why single singapore out?
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Originally posted by eagle:
Well, it takes a lot of risks for the rich to get richer too, only thing is that they can better afford the risks.
But if you tax them more, what motivation are there for them to take more risks, unless the returns are extremely great?
Well I'm thinking if they feel the risk is no longer worth it .... stop. Why else do they need so much $ anyway if not for greed.Lets say for example monthly salary .... e.g.
$1-$2000 per month tax rate 5%
$2000-8000 per month tax rate 10%
$8000-$100000 per month tax rate 50%
So someone earning $5000/mth will get taxed 5% off $2000 and 10% off $3000.
Hope i made a good illustration I'm not really good in it.
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
Well I'm thinking if they feel the risk is no longer worth it .... stop. Why else do they need so much $ anyway if not for greed.Lets say for example monthly salary .... e.g.
$1-$2000 per month tax rate 5%
$2000-8000 per month tax rate 10%
$8000-$100000 per month tax rate 50%
So someone earning $5000/mth will get taxed 5% off $2000 and 10% off $3000.
Hope i made a good illustration I'm not really good in it.
Seldom will people think that there's too much money. It's something inherent in most of us. The thing is, if you tax them to the point where the risks are no longer worth taking, they can easily just pack up and move to another country where the tax might be lower and the risks more worthwhile. The influence could be rather significant, and is especially so for the heavily foreign talent based Singapore. The balance is indeed delicate.
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Originally posted by redDUST:
thanks for clarifying.
there is the average joe who earns quite a fair bit (say up to S$6k/month) and the average joe who is really `average in his wages' (S$2-3k). the upper a-joe if he lives in a hdb flat, can let his CPF takes care of the repayment. technically, his disposable income is not affected as his CPF can take care of the payment, more so if mrs average joe chips in with the flat repayment. hence, he is left with his only other big ticket item, which is the car. in the singapore context, this average joe should be able to afford his car, i supposed an `average joe car like an altis'.
the rich getting richer is a conventional norm we accept as truth. maybe there is some truth in it. luckily, god is fair, things can go both ways. the rich, if they are not careful, can also be a pauper. just as the less-rich working their way up.
imo, the universal truth is 20% of the population probably control 80% of the wealth in a country, australia no exception. why single singapore out?
I single Singapore out for only one reason the - 99 year lease.
Lets do some maths.
Lets say your parents own freehold worth $10.
My parents own HDB worth $10.
Our parents are enjoying themselves in heaven and in their will have left their properties to us.
Lets say they decided to enjoy themselves up there at age 70.
You have freehold of still $10 (lets not take into account of appreciation.)
But I have got (99-70)/99 x $10 = $2.93 .... I have lost $7 bcos my parents bought a godam lease.
Then buy freehold lor...... but can the avg Joe afford freehold?
So in other words .... 99 year lease holders.... you know what i mean lar.
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Originally posted by eagle:
Seldom will people think that there's too much money. It's something inherent in most of us. The thing is, if you tax them to the point where the risks are no longer worth taking, they can easily just pack up and move to another country where the tax might be lower and the risks more worthwhile. The influence could be rather significant, and is especially so for the heavily foreign talent based Singapore. The balance is indeed delicate.
Yea i suppose so I mean i dunno how big the implications really are if the rich all left Singapore.Yes balance is delicate .... meybe them million $ president scholars can come up with something.
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
I single Singapore out for only one reason the - 99 year lease.
Lets do some maths.
Lets say your parents own freehold worth $10.
My parents own HDB worth $10.
Our parents are enjoying themselves in heaven and in their will have left their properties to us.
Lets say they decided to enjoy themselves up there at age 70.
You have freehold of still $10 (lets not take into account of appreciation.)
But I have got (99-70)/99 x $10 = $2.93 .... I have lost $7 bcos my parents bought a godam lease.
Then buy freehold lor...... but can the avg Joe afford freehold?
So in other words .... 99 year lease holders.... you know what i mean lar.
fair point, but the reality we are in is, has the government let any of the hdb lease lapse? property price swing aside; typically, at the 25-30 years level, the government will exercise its redevelopment program in these estates. look at toa payoh, queenstown, AMK or one of the older estates. I have not seen or read that the `owners' of these flats gotten back a fraction of what they paid for or left homeless because of the lease expiring. The government always acquire these flats back for redevelopment, apparently at market price. if your flats are 25-30 years old, chances are you will still make a tidy sum of the flats because if you purchase the flat new 30 years ago, it will probably cost a fraction of what you paid for.
there is also a political motive to this. PAP's will not let this be a political issue. when it made its commitment of home ownership to the majority of singaporeans in its early days. they will need to keep to this promise, by hook or by crook. this is a huge factor that could capitulate the PAP if they overlook the home ownership matter.
your illustration is a theoratical exercise. it makes sense in isolation but the reality is there are socio-political factors that comes into play that will alter the entire premise of what you said.
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Originally posted by redDUST:
fair point, but the reality we are in is, has the government let any of the hdb lease lapse? property price swing aside; typically, at the 25-30 years level, the government will exercise its redevelopment program in these estates. look at toa payoh, queenstown, AMK or one of the older estates. I have not seen or read that the `owners' of these flats gotten back a fraction of what they paid for or left homeless because of the lease expiring. The government always acquire these flats back for redevelopment, apparently at market price. if your flats are 25-30 years old, chances are you will still make a tidy sum of the flats because if you purchase the flat new 30 years ago, it will probably cost a fraction of what you paid for.
there is also a political motive to this. PAP's will not let this be a political issue. when it made its commitment of home ownership to the majority of singaporeans in its early days. they will need to keep to this promise, by hook or by crook. this is a huge factor that could capitulate the PAP if they overlook the home ownership matter.
your illustration is a theoratical exercise. it makes sense in isolation but the reality is there are socio-political factors that comes into play that will alter the entire premise of what you said.
I'm not sure if any of the HDB leases have expired and the lease taken back.
But if none has occured whats the point in maing it a 99 year lease then? ....why not make it freehold or 999?
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
I'm not sure if any of the HDB leases have expired and the lease taken back.
But if none has occured whats the point in maing it a 99 year lease then? ....why not make it freehold or 999?
LOL, you are (very) fond of hypothetical questions, aren't you? As seen in your other posts.....
Why not free petrol?
Why not subsidize all rice, petrol here in Singapore?
Why not give your money away?
Why, why, why....
(Wait...), I will give you half the answer. See below.
For a government so obsessed with control........
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Originally posted by redDUST:
LOL, you are (very) fond of hypothetical questions, aren't you? As seen in your other posts.....
Why not free petrol?
Why not subsidize all rice, petrol here in Singapore?
Why not give your money away?
Why, why, why....
(Wait...), I will give you half the answer. See below.
For a government so obsessed with control........
I do apologize for my hypothetical questions lol
However ...."For a government so obsessed with control...." That is fundamentally wrong to do. I'm not saying its illegal to do it... but I'm saying that's control gone out of control. I for one do not wish to be "forced" to this and that.
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Originally posted by Genie99a:
I'm not sure if any of the HDB leases have expired and the lease taken back.
But if none has occured whats the point in maing it a 99 year lease then? ....why not make it freehold or 999?
Singapore how old only? HDB how long only? how can any 99 year lease expire?
Lease hold or freehold all Britist system, finally the land belong to the government. and at the expiry of the lease, the government has the right to take back. Usually places around same areas are same leasehold. Now mostly only 99 yrs cause government need redevelopment.
Farrer Court, Braddell Heights, and the other one along Alexandra Road, all were HUDC flats, 99 years only. Then sold en bloc, owners all laughing to the bank.
Your hypothetical calculation also wrong lah, "But I have got (99-70)/99 x $10 = $2.93 .... I have lost $7 bcos my parents bought a godam lease."
99 years lease is for 2 generations, if you can fully pay up in your lifetime, your son just need to pay the maintenance fee, what happen after that you think you can see from the grave huh?
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Originally posted by sgdiehard:
Your hypothetical calculation also wrong lah, "But I have got (99-70)/99 x $10 = $2.93 .... I have lost $7 bcos my parents bought a godam lease."
99 years lease is for 2 generations, if you can fully pay up in your lifetime, your son just need to pay the maintenance fee, what happen after that you think you can see from the grave huh?
Heya Buddy :)Yar I'll agree that 99 year lease should last 2 generations.
But that means there is a depreciation factor lor
Haiz -
Originally posted by mancha:
Economy driving tips
The Straits Times, Saturday, March 15, 2008. Life Pg. 10
> Be as light on the accelerator as possible.
> Choose the appropriate gear. Even in an automatic, it is better to manually shift down than to kick down to accelerate.
> When approaching a red light, lift your foot off and get in gear for a gentle take-off once it turns green. Try to avoid coming to a full stop.
> Do not tailgate. You will find that you have to brake and re-accelerate less. •
> Be alert to road and traffic conditions. No point stepping on the gas and then stomping on the brakes because there is a jam ahead. Avoid talking on the phone, which distracts you from observing traffic conditions.
> Inflate your tyres regularly (when they are cold). You can overinflate by 5 to 10 per cent.
> Maintain your car regularly, and use good quality oil and filters. Keep car body clean, as
dirt increases drag.
> Turn off the air-con at night or on cool days and wind down the windows. The so-called "parachute effect" is minimal below lOOkmh.
> Do not use your car as a storeroom. Every 25kg of weight raises consumption by 1 per cent. Hence it might be best to fill the tank to half full instead of full.
> Plan your trips. Avoid congested roads.
> Do not leave the engine idling for more than a minute.
> Reverse into a parking lot. When you start off again, the engine will be cold and fuel inefficient. If you can drive away smoothly without having to reverse when the engine is cold, you will save fuel. It is also safer.
> Choose the right octane fuel. Most cars will do fine with 95- or 92-octane petrol.Every 25kg of weitgjt raises consumption by 1%.Is there anyone know what the weight of half-tank of pertrol is?
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Every 25kg of weitgjt raises consumption by 1%.Is there anyone know what the weight of half-tank of pertrol is?
Depends on your petrol tank... Let's say for a 1800cc car with 40 litres petrol tank (Toyota Corolla Altis)
http://www.simetric.co.uk/si_liquids.htm
Density of petrol is 737.22 kg per cubic metre, which works out to 0.73722g/cm3
half tank is 20 litres, which works out to 20000cm3, which works out to 14.744kg
For other cars, the petrol tank might be even smaller...
Thus, as already said in the first post of this page,
Some calculations will tell you that the difference between half a tank and a full tank (assume 40 litres tank) will, on average, only affect less than 1% of fuel consumption
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Originally posted by mancha:
Economy driving tips
The Straits Times, Saturday, March 15, 2008. Life Pg. 10
> Be as light on the accelerator as possible.
> Choose the appropriate gear. Even in an automatic, it is better to manually shift down than to kick down to accelerate.
> When approaching a red light, lift your foot off and get in gear for a gentle take-off once it turns green. Try to avoid coming to a full stop.
> Do not tailgate. You will find that you have to brake and re-accelerate less. •
> Be alert to road and traffic conditions. No point stepping on the gas and then stomping on the brakes because there is a jam ahead. Avoid talking on the phone, which distracts you from observing traffic conditions.
> Inflate your tyres regularly (when they are cold). You can overinflate by 5 to 10 per cent.
> Maintain your car regularly, and use good quality oil and filters. Keep car body clean, as
dirt increases drag.
> Turn off the air-con at night or on cool days and wind down the windows. The so-called "parachute effect" is minimal below lOOkmh.
> Do not use your car as a storeroom. Every 25kg of weight raises consumption by 1 per cent. Hence it might be best to fill the tank to half full instead of full.
> Plan your trips. Avoid congested roads.
> Do not leave the engine idling for more than a minute.
> Reverse into a parking lot. When you start off again, the engine will be cold and fuel inefficient. If you can drive away smoothly without having to reverse when the engine is cold, you will save fuel. It is also safer.
> Choose the right octane fuel. Most cars will do fine with 95- or 92-octane petrol."When approaching red light,lift your foot off ....."
Is it OK to free the gear when approaching a red light?However, I often do that.
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i only pump in RESERVE TANK..
no point going over the cuzway w any pertrol at all....
get the max per trip.. best is i can just reach there zhun zhun no gas, and pump til brim.. SHIOK!