USA push for new security mechanism irks Southeast Asia
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US push for new security mechanism irks Southeast Asia
Monday, April 14, 2008
WASHINGTON: US-led moves to turn a forum grappling with the North Korean nuclear crisis into a permanent security mechanism are frustrating Southeast Asia’s bid to become a key player in regional security, experts say.
The United States is pushing for the six-party nuclear talks, also involving China, Russia, Japan and the two Koreas, to be transformed into a permanent Northeast Asian mechanism for resolution of regional security issues.
A Russia-led working group on a “Northeast Asia Peace and Security Mechanism” was established following a landmark agreement by the six parties in February 2007, in which North Korea agreed to close its key nuclear plant.
But officials in the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (Asean) are worried such a mechanism could undermine its role in regional security management.
Asean hosts the biggest official security umbrella grouping in the Asia-Pacific - the 14-year-old Asean Regional Forum or ARF comprising the 10 Asean states together with 17 others, including the United States, Russia, China, the European Union, North Korea, Australia, India and Pakistan. “There is a concern in Southeast Asia that such a Northeast Asia forum would actually undermine the ARF,” Muthiah Alagappa, an Asian expert at the Hawaii-based East West Centre told a conference in Washington on Friday.
“The belief is that if the big powers all get together in another forum, then ARF would be sidelined,” he said.
But Alagappa felt the fears might be misplaced. “I don’t think Southeast Asia should delude itself that ARF is the overall (security) umbrella. The US is a global power, China is rising power, Japan is the second largest economy, they are going to deal with the issues.”
Aside from the ARF, the Asean group has two other key forums where security is often discussed - an annual summit with China, Japan and South Korea, known as the Asean plus Three process, and an East Asian Summit involving the 13 countries as well as India, Australia and New Zealand.
“ARF is only part of the regional security architecture, which also consists of the Asean plus Three as well as the East Asian Summit,” one Asean diplomat in Washington stressed.
Some in Asean perceive that the United States is promoting the Northeast Asian security forum because it is not a participant in the East Asian Summit.
The United States was not invited to the summit because it has refused to sign an Asean non-aggression pact, a prerequisite for membership in the 16-nation grouping.
US suggestions to expand the six-party forum, all of whose members are in the ARF, to include other ARF countries as well such as Australia are also viewed with suspicion by some in Asean.
“Any bid to undermine Asean would be dangerous, considering its role so far as a bulwark against aggression by big powers,” said one Asean official. -
since when did europe or usa gave a darn about some south east asian forum...
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Yep.. that's right.. let the big boys do the talking.
Association of Asean Countries, should just focus on economic development.
Members : Brunei, Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Malaysia, Myanmar, Philippines, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam.
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Unfornatetly i am not sure Asean has not shown any leadership on working together.
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Anyone have any idea as to why US refuse to sign the Asean non-aggession pact?
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Treaty of Amity and Cooperation in Southeast Asia
Indonesia, 24 February 1976http://www.aseansec.org/1217.htm
http://www.aseansec.org/92.htm
I think USA still wants the freedom to intervene in south east asia.
Sign non-aggression pact will tie up their hands.
They still have military bases in Singapore, Thailand, Philippines and others.
Zbigniew Brzezinski, Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs in 1977-81 gaves his views on what sort of strategy USA should take to continue its global hegemony in the 21th century:
A geostrategy for Eurasia
http://www.comw.org/pda/fulltext/9709brzezinski.html
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Originally posted by 4getmenot:
since when did europe or usa gave a darn about some south east asian forum...
South east asia is a region that US is very interested in, because a large portion of the oil is transported through malacca strait.
That time US even suggested to deploy its aircraft carrier to patrol in the straits to fight with pirates but was turned down by the countries here.
Where got country use aircraft carrier to fight with pirates one. Its intention very obviously is to tell China that they can block their oil supply when war breakout. -
Where got country use aircraft carrier to fight with pirates one. Its intention very obviously is to tell China that they can block their oil supply when war breakout.Submarines Versus Aircraft Carriers
U Sank My Carrier!
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Originally posted by TooFree:
Anyone have any idea as to why US refuse to sign the Asean non-aggession pact?
You dunno meh ?
That kim of North K, keep boasting about nuclear warfare and missiles/rocket that can have a range to hit California, USA.
His own people are starving and dying .. yet all he cares about is his power and his successful nuclear tests !
Why would USA sign the non-aggression pact when clearly.. there's enemy lurking and giving threats every now and then ?
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DPRK not part of Asean.
They are not part of non-aggression pact.
there's enemy lurking and giving threats every now and then ?
The threat comes from both sides, not only from DPRK.
USA also threatens DPRK.
I support DPRK.
I hope USA doesn't try to sabotage or weaken Asean's influence in the region.
I will oppose that.
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
DPRK not part of Asean.
They are not part of non-aggression pact.
The threat comes from both sides, not only from DPRK.
USA also threatens DPRK.
I support DPRK.
I hope USA doesn't try to sabotage or weaken Asean's influence in the region.
I will oppose that.
Well.. if you think nuclear blackmail is an ethical thing to do ... I don't see why you shouldn't support DPRK .
http://www.heritage.org/Research/NationalSecurity/em550.cfm
Here's another link from CNN.
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DPRK already gave face to USA in 2003.
During the months January-March 2003, DPRK could have tested nukes, fired long range missiles to disrupt USA propaganda campaign against Iraq and shift the attention to North Korea.
In early March 2003, DPRK made a move against the USA. They send a few fighter jets to confront the USA spy plane.
North Korean Fighters Confront US Spy Plane
This move was designed to send a warning to the USA to tell them to come to the bargaining table or they will fuck the USA in the backside and sabotage their war against Iraq.
PRC applied a bit of pressure to control DPRK, so DPRK did not make anymore moves in March 2003.
USA happy happy attack Iraq on 20 March 2003.
U.S. launches cruise missiles at Saddam
Kim Jong Il already gave face to USA already, let them attack Iraq smoothly.
If it was me, I would not be that kind to the USA.
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...In contrast, North Korea has not only the military power but also the political will to wage total war against the United States.
North Korea has made it clear that it will strike all US targets with all means, if the US mounted military attacks on North Korea.
That North Korea's threat is no bluff can be seen from the aggressive actions taken by North Korea since the Korean War armistice, most recent of which is North Korea's attempt to capture an American spy plane.
In the morning of March 1, 2003, an American RC-132S spy plane, Cobra Ball, took off from a US airbase in Okinawa, and cruised along the East coast of North Korea collecting electronic signals.
The US intelligence suspected that North Korea was about to test a long-range missile and the plane was there to monitor the suspected missile launch.
When the US plane reached a point about 193 km from the coast of North Korea, two MiG-29 and two MiG-21 fighter planes showed up unexpectedly.
The North Korean planes approached within 16 m and signaled the US plane to follow them.
The US pilot refused to follow the command and left the scene posthaste. The US plane was tailed by the hostiles for about 22 min but let the US spy plane go.
There are two key points to be observed here.
First, the hostile planes waited for the US plane at the Uhrang airbase, located about 200 km from the point of air encounter.
They knew that the US plane was coming.
The North Korean planes flew 200 km to intercept the US plane. Did the US plane see them coming?
If it did, why no evasive action? After intercepting the US plane, the hostile planes dogged it for 22 min. Why no American planes for the rescue? The US crew must have informed the base of the danger they were in, but no action was taken by the base.
If Kim Jong Il had given the command, the MiGs would have shot down the US plane and returned to their base before the US could have scrambled war planes.
Second, North Korea intercepted an American spy plane flying 200 km from its coast.
According to the international norm, a nation's territorial air space extends 19 km from its coast line. The US is the exception and claims air space of 370 km from its coast line; any foreign airplane violating this extended air space is challenged or shot down by the US military...
http://209.85.175.104/search?q=cache:
USA don't even dare to send fighters to confront the DPRK jets.
Scared like a mouse.
Invasion of Iraq two weeks away, where got time and effort to deal with DPRK?
Confront DPRK, start a crisis, Iraq invasion how?
Very shrewd of Kim Jong Il to time his moves at the ripe time.
He is too kind to USA, let them off easily, only send a warning.
He didn't sabotage USA's war against Iraq.
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
DPRK already gave face to USA in 2003.
During the months January-March 2003, DPRK could have tested nukes, fired long range missiles to disrupt USA propaganda campaign against Iraq and shift the attention to North Korea.
In early March 2003, DPRK made a move against the USA. They send a few fighter jets to confront the USA spy plane.
North Korean Fighters Confront US Spy Plane
This move was designed to send a warning to the USA to tell them to come to the bargaining table or they will fuck the USA in the backside and sabotage their war against Iraq.
PRC applied a bit of pressure to control DPRK, so DPRK did not make anymore moves in March 2003.
USA happy happy attack Iraq on 20 March 2003.
U.S. launches cruise missiles at Saddam
Kim Jong Il already gave face to USA already, let them attack Iraq smoothly.
If it was me, I would not be that kind to the USA.
I'd agree if North K wasn't so dependent on foreign aids to feed her people and keeping them alive but barely.
http://www.cato.org/pubs/fpbriefs/fpb73.pdf
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USA want to fuck with North Korea.
They don't even know what sort of opponent they are up against.
They are dealing with Kim Jong Il.
You think who?
He is the most cunning player in the region.
Want to fuck with him, better have some skills also, or he will laugh at you.
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
USA want to fuck with North Korea.
They don't even know what sort of opponent they are up against.
They are dealing with Kim Jong Il.
You think who?
He is the most cunning player in the region.
Want to fuck with him, better have some skills also, or he will laugh at you.
Yes.. it is true.. Kim JL is a cunning old fox.
He's screwed over his own people for a long long time.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp_asiapacific/view/341669/1/.html
here's another link.. it's all sad...
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200003/200003140290.html
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True, very true, Kim Jong Il's rule is very harsh.
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The USA's secret plan to nuke Vietnam, Laos
Korea: Forgotten Nuclear Threats
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Originally posted by 4getmenot:
since when did europe or usa gave a darn about some south east asian forum...
Right-o,i dont know why the United States want to give a damn about a Third World Association/Organisation.
ASEAN - Association of Third World Nations.
So Singapore should be leaving the group liao
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A starving nuclear power. Singapore should help DPRK. Home > Latest News > Asia April 16, 2008 UN agency warns of looming N. Korea food crisis SEOUL - TIME is running out to avert a humanitarian tragedy in North Korea due to acute food shortages, a United Nations (UN) agency warned on Wednesday. 'The food security situation...is clearly bad and getting worse,' said Tony Banbury, the World Food Programme's (WFP) Asia director. 'It is increasingly likely that external assistance will be urgently required to avert a serious tragedy,' he said in a statement. The WFP estimates that over 6.5 million people, out of a population of 23 million, do not have enough to eat. It said the figure would rise unless urgent action is taken. Mr Banbury called on international donors to increase aid, and urged North Korea to allow aid agencies to check that food is reaching the needy. South Korean officials said in February that some of Seoul's rice aid intended for hungry civilians had been diverted to frontline army units. The hardline communist state suffered famine in the mid- to late 1990s which killed hundreds of thousands. -- AFP http://www.straitstimes.com/Latest%2BNews/Asia/STIStory_227897.html
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Any aid sent to North Korea will probably only benefit it's military. While the common people go hungry. Until North Korea has less soldiers and more farmers. I do not advocate sending them one solitary grain of rice. A country that cannot feed itself or even produce it's own electricity. But squanders it's very limited resources developing nuclear weapons is beyond help. Helping North Korea is like buying food for a drug addict. So that he can spend his money on more drugs.
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But squanders it’s very limited resources developing nuclear weapons is beyond help.
No nuclear weapons how to fight with USA?
USA invade like Iraq how?
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
No nuclear weapons how to fight with USA?
USA invade like Iraq how?
Do you know how Saddam came into power ? And the old Bush's involvement in his rise to power ?
DPRK fight nuclear with USA ? You think China will allow that to happen ?
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DPRK must have nuclear weapons to deter USA from attacking.
They can attack Iraq, DPRK they also can attack.
DPRK cannot take this risk.
The USA's secret plan to nuke Vietnam, Laos
Korea: Forgotten Nuclear Threats
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I'd rather ANY country attack DPRK and get rid of that Kim JI.