Originally posted by balance_else_complacent:
Fellow forummers,
Allow me to say something.
I like to say that I have great respect for all our opposition parties.
Although I may or may not be a opposition supporter,
as a member of Democratic Society,
I feel that to serve as a Opposition party member is more difficult than joining other kinds of parties in the Pore. Why ? Because they are doing what most dare not do.
Just ask around, how many given the chance dare to take up this role?
To me, these opposition people are greater than those who want to but dare not join the opposition. Look at how many earlier batch of opposition ended up? Look at dr Chee's situation.
Sadly, it is not just volunteering oneself as a candidate to represent the people's interest at the National Political Stage that make life difficult for oneself if one chooses to join any one of the few Alternative Parties in Singapore, but also even volunteering one's time to give active support to the Alternative Parties can also result in one's name being marked into the National Computer System as such.
Sensitive areas in selected Ministries will be made out-of-bound to you, which will leave your employer wondering what crime you have committed - when all that you have done is to exercise your Citizen's Right to participate in National Politics.
So, in the name of democracy, I am glad there are people who go into opposition .
This is good because:
1. How can a democracy be solid if there is ZERO opposition?
Democracy does not necessarily require an Opposition Party to exist.
It requires a liberalisation of Politics that is open and allow for a free exchange of political views, and where the policies are enacted through consultation and agreement between those who have been given the responsibility to Govern, with those who allow themselves to be governed.
The Opposition Parties exist only as groups or organisation formed to formally represent the different political ideologies or philosophies.
Obviosuly, Democracy will need some checks and balances - which do not necessarily require an Opposition, if the other Public Institutions can be kept separate and allowed autonomy to oversee each other.
Such Public Institutions will be the Government with the Civil Service combined, to be overseen by Parliament, and separately by the Judiciary to provide legal supervision to the drafting, implementation and interpretation of the laws of the land - with the Police Force assisting in the proper execution of those Laws.
2. Opposition's role is to keep the ruling people on their toes. But this is easier said than done. They represent the people by performing this role. They also can be used to speak up on behalf of the people.
The role of the Opposition Parties is more then just keeping the Ruliing Political Party on their toes, as they should be in position to form a Government, in the event that the present Political Party is no longer effective and the people has lost faith in their policies.
The Opposition Parties should play a big role in being the voice and conscience of the Citizens, when the governing political party prefer to ignore the Citizen's concerns and have its own agenda believing that they know better than the ordinary citizens.
In the past 50 years of ONE Party dominated rule in Singapore, the operating governing principle is "I know what is good for you" - and we have seen the disastrous consequences of such single minded implementation of a dogmatic thinking.
The following few examples reflect the consequences of the ''I know what is good for you" thinking from the present government -
Family Planning which require Singaporeans to 'Stop at 2" has resulted in a shrinking population;
the heavy handed use of the CPF policy has resulted in private wealth being sucked out of the economy with little Private Capital to fund any entrepreneurial drive;
URA Land Management Policies that require the continuous management of aritificially high property prices - and is the prime culprit in the high cost of businesses that result in the High Cost of Living in Singapore.
Different Alternative Parties that are allowed to exist will provide the opportunities for different groups of people with different preferences for different political thinking and practices.
Unfortunately, too many such Political Parties will end up working against the common interest of the Citizens, as they will end up diluting the available strength to face any stronger incumbent political party.
3. a Vibrant democracy needs a capable opposition.
Sadly, like the young nation, the opposition is too young at the moment. Too inexperienced to dominate or really be able to do the check and balance role.
As a member of this young democratic society, I also try to play my role by promoting democracy. encouraging check and balance. encouraging speaking up. encouraging challenging what can be challenged or need to be challenged. encouraging a mentality that questions what info is prescribed/ delivered to you.
This can also be interpreted as supporting the ruling people by encouraging them to perform their best for the people. At the same time, encouraging people to be more responsible as a democratic citizen. What happens in the society affects us. Thus we must be involved.
I hope the young democracy mature into a true 1st world democracy. Better do it fast. many have migrated. these are all capable ones. As I always said, to migrate is not for anyone. Even if u are rich and highly marketable.
If everyone say yes, it will be yes.
A capable opposition can only exist if there exist a vibrant political environment that will nurture the political openess, tolerance towards diverse political views, and less thin skin and less personal selfish pride that gets in the way of coming to consensus.
Switzerland is a model country in which any policy decision that affects the Nation will have the policy paper clearly and honestly presented to the Citizens, in which their opinion and approval is consulted through Referendum.
If the ''Million Dollar Ministerial Salary'' was to be proposed in Switzerland, it would have been the subject of a Referendum - as such a policy shift will have long term consequence to the Swiss Nation.
Unfortunately, the present Government has no desire to be Switzerland, even as much as it pays lip service to attempt to reach the Swiss Standards of Living for Singaporeans - which was declared by SM GCT when he was PM, and it seems that this is no longer attempted by the LHL Government.
We can live or have to live with the incompetence of the representives we send into the parliament until such time that they are voted out when the people awoke.
This incompetence is no longer a secret.
Dear Atobe,
As said, I would give you a reply. Initially I had wanted to break up every single sentence of your post apart and rebut every line, but it will only create boredom to all. So, rather than to do that, I apologise that i have to epitomise and summarize the issues you raised, in my usual point blank style as a reply to your posts.
Summing your posts up, I am sad that you still continue to harp on the issue of fairplay over the political processes in Singapore, without comming up with what the People needs - Solutions to their everyday woes and future generations.
You can talk all day and even decades on the fairness of the political process, but you or those you defend will never get elected, for the simple reason being that you are NOT RELEVANT to the People. They cannot relate to you.
A lousy workman blames his tools for his lousy workmanship, but a resourceful workman uses whatever he has to do a good job. This had always been the Singaporean way.
1. Does the opposition has such resourceful men who can help the PEOPLE's lives, not by rhetoric, but by viable solutions?
2. Where to find such men or CREATE such men?
3. How to protect and support such men?
4. Is the opposition prepared to bide its time to groom them up?
If the answer is no to the above, then for goodnews sake, support the one who is already in the PM's chair. He did a sterling job of guiding us out of the 97 financial crisis as a minister and is deserving of a chance to prove his worth till the next election. I ask you, search your heart, do you think anyone else can do better than him?
People are prepared to give the opposition a chance, but if the quality is so lacklustre, no one will put a clown in office just to say no in parliament with no effect. You had blamed constituencies will be blackmarked with little benefits if they vote in the opposition.
Please think out of the box instead of waiting for goodies to drop from the sky. For example, if my mother is staying in an opposition ward and deprive of goodies, wouldn't i get my friends and relatives to create a ruckus at the meet-the- people sessions with our MPs for a fair deal? Opposition or ruling party wards, we are all related closely to one another in small Singapore. Must i teach the opposition on how to think out of the box and be resourceful?
Do desist rebutting point by point. It makes painful reading for all. Just sum it up and explain as best you can if you feel you want to rebut. Thanks.
if one ask any `mainstream' north korean if their dear leader is a man of great leadership, vision and wisdom, it will be most likely an unequivocal "yes!" in fact, some will go as far as saying that north korea is perfect.
unfortunately, this seems to be the case here too for the some of them here who suffer from the same `tunnel vision'. the "if it ain't broke, don't rock the boat" line of thought seems to be the convenient excuse to expense progress in this small, fragile island.
singapore is still plagued by the `politics of fear' that the government instilled. we have heard enough of if we don't toll the line, `disaster' will slam singapore and we will never be able to rise up again.
well, we have seen political leadership change in many countries, including taiwan, australia, japan,...the list goes on. usa, currently the most competitive nation in the world, potentially go thru' this `political upheaval' every 4 years. so far, i have not seen these countries `sink into oblivion' or are `permanently disabled' it is precisely the political process in those countries that allow for the people to have a clear conscience to exercise their vote without fear that is providing the platform for political stability over time. in-fighting there may be over differences, but all rose above themselves for the country when the demand calls for it.
regretably, the government here stifle the opportunity for the citizens' mindware to grow in tandem with the progress made by singapore in other areas. by insisting that singaporeans here are dumb and not able to decide for what's best for the country, even in choosing its leaders; it invariably backfired because it imply that its own policy of governance is a failure. it could be true, looking at our soccer team where we have 6 FSTs in the 1st 11, our table tennis teams are littered with chinese players, locally groomed biggie companies here now need foreigners to help run the shops now.
the longer the MIW maintain a choke-hold on the political process of singapore to prevent a more transparent and open election, the harder the crash landing will be when the day comes.
remember, come what may, there is no way PAP can hold power in perpetuality.
everything will end. history has been repeated enough. poh is right that pap smeared (no puns intended) their used to be good name.time for lee dynasty to end. arguments of his credits are now nothing but opportunity costs. whatever you people says here has no effect on the governing side. they have eyes but not see for its not beneficial to their wallets.
i once read a post here saying that singaporeans now have reverted back to their peasants instinct. to survive and breed without really caring who the leaders are and what they are doing. the cabinet ministers are well in their cabinets. surving with their million dollars pay check and breeding too. is it that different?
Originally posted by redDUST:if one ask any `mainstream' north korean if their dear leader is a man of great leadership, vision and wisdom, it will be most likely an unequivocal "yes!" in fact, some will go as far as saying that north korea is perfect.
unfortunately, this seems to be the case here too for the some of them here who suffer from the same `tunnel vision'. the "if it ain't broke, don't rock the boat" line of thought seems to be the convenient excuse to expense progress in this small, fragile island.
singapore is still plagued by the `politics of fear' that the government instilled. we have heard enough of if we don't toll the line, `disaster' will slam singapore and we will never be able to rise up again.
well, we have seen political leadership change in many countries, including taiwan, australia, japan,...the list goes on. usa, currently the most competitive nation in the world, potentially go thru' this `political upheaval' every 4 years. so far, i have not seen these countries `sink into oblivion' or are `permanently disabled' it is precisely the political process in those countries that allow for the people to have a clear conscience to exercise their vote without fear that is providing the platform for political stability over time. in-fighting there may be over differences, but all rose above themselves for the country when the demand calls for it.
regretably, the government here stifle the opportunity for the citizens' mindware to grow in tandem with the progress made by singapore in other areas. by insisting that singaporeans here are dumb and not able to decide for what's best for the country, even in choosing its leaders; it invariably backfired because it imply that its own policy of governance is a failure. it could be true, looking at our soccer team where we have 6 FSTs in the 1st 11, our table tennis teams are littered with chinese players, locally groomed biggie companies here now need foreigners to help run the shops now.
the longer the MIW maintain a choke-hold on the political process of singapore to prevent a more transparent and open election, the harder the crash landing will be when the day comes.
remember, come what may, there is no way PAP can hold power in perpetuality.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Just one thing - what is this 'politics of fear' you talking about? Here in this open forum you are talking about the ruling party and allegations of its failings. I certainly doubt if such talk would even be allowed in N.korea.
Or do you intend to demand 'full freedom of speech' thru demagoguery-inflaming the masses thru emotions such as racism and religion - the fastest way to gain popularity and votes?
What 'transparency' and 'open election' are you talking about? Was our Independence won based on Queensberry rules? You think the ruling party had it easy back then - fiery race supremacists, bloodthirsty commie agitators, ruthless brits secret service agents, etc, etc?
While times had change, do remember certain threats still exists hidden amongst our society. The ruling party are full blooded singaporeans as well, with a stake in the same country. They had work hard to give our peace and (admit it ) a standard of living incomparable to our neighbours. They too, want good administration of the country.
What is deemed 'transparency' and 'open election' are nothing more than raising of standards to barrier of entry into governorship of a People. It applies to the ruling party as well. They are only humans. If they are capable to field candidates and rise to the bar, why not the opposition? Are the opposition candidates less than human, with no brains to outwit and outplay, and must cry and whine foul play to gain sympathy?
A country cannot be ruled by whiners and crybabies. Who will sympathise them and the People when adversity strikes?
I don't expect your agreement to what i had written. I only plead that you will consider my words seriously.
Originally posted by Point_blank:Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Just one thing - what is this 'politics of fear' you talking about? Here in this open forum you are talking about the ruling party and allegations of its failings. I certainly doubt if such talk would even be allowed in N.korea.
Or do you intend to demand 'full freedom of speech' thru demagoguery-inflaming the masses thru emotions such as racism and religion - the fastest way to gain popularity and votes?
What 'transparency' and 'open election' are you talking about? Was our Independence won based on Queensberry rules? You think the ruling party had it easy back then - fiery race supremacists, bloodthirsty commie agitators, ruthless brits secret service agents, etc, etc?
While times had change, do remember certain threats still exists hidden amongst our society. The ruling party are full blooded singaporeans as well, with a stake in the same country. They had work hard to give our peace and (admit it ) a standard of living incomparable to our neighbours. They too, want good administration of the country.
What is deemed 'transparency' and 'open election' are nothing more than raising of standards to barrier of entry into governorship of a People. It applies to the ruling party as well. They are only humans. If they are capable to field candidates and rise to the bar, why not the opposition? Are the opposition candidates less than human, with no brains to outwit and outplay, and must cry and whine foul play to gain sympathy?
A country cannot be ruled by whiners and crybabies. Who will sympathise them and the People when adversity strikes?
I don't expect your agreement to what i had written. I only plead that you will consider my words seriously.
PB, without going thru' your rebuttal in detail, i can already sense clearly your line of thought; you see things at 2 ends of the spectrum.
and no, i am not advocating a `free-for all' type of politics.
very clearly, PB's argument is fallacious because it commits the fallacy of slippery slope (causal).
If A happens, then by a gradual series of small steps through B, C,…, X, Y, eventually Z will happen, too.
Z should not happen.
Therefore, A should not happen, either.
but clearly, the scenario of whiners and crybabies is obviously not going to occur. because the casual links between each event is weak. i.e. allowing freedom of speech will not in fact lead to "demagoguery-inflaming the masses thru emotions such as racism and religion." that's just one example of the weakness in linkage.
Also, "People are prepared to give the opposition a chance, but if the quality is so lacklustre". But what if the lacklustre or weakness is due to them busy with something else and not being able to display their full abilities?
Originally posted by Point_blank:
Dear Atobe,
As said, I would give you a reply. Initially I had wanted to break up every single sentence of your post apart and rebut every line, but it will only create boredom to all. So, rather than to do that, I apologise that i have to epitomise and summarize the issues you raised, in my usual point blank style as a reply to your posts.
Summing your posts up, I am sad that you still continue to harp on the issue of fairplay over the political processes in Singapore, without comming up with what the People needs - Solutions to their everyday woes and future generations.
You can talk all day and even decades on the fairness of the political process, but you or those you defend will never get elected, for the simple reason being that you are NOT RELEVANT to the People. They cannot relate to you.
Dear Point_blank,
I had expected more after the time you have taken to craft a reply, and I am disappointed that you prefer more rhetoric in the usual dismissive manner of the MIW. Your current response did not make any reference to the specifics that I have made to your previous post.
With the time taken, you have returned by opening new issues to argue and justify the current status quo in the political landscape in Singapore; and ask not to reply point-by-point. Why ?
A lousy workman blames his tools for his lousy workmanship, but a resourceful workman uses whatever he has to do a good job. This had always been the Singaporean way.
The Singaporean way ? By whose standard of measure ? Who is blaming the tools for lousy workmanship, when there is no proper workshop that exist, and when stifling rules prevent the environment that will nurture the ''Art of Human Creativity'' ?
Was this not the situation during the Colonial Days, and when Singapore was in Malaysia ? Was it not MM LKY who was also as vocal as CSJ today - in protesting the curtailment of political activities - first by the Colonial Government, then by the Malaysian Federal Government to the extent that LKY will even cry out loud :
... If you believe in democracy, you must believe in it unconditionally. If you believe that men should be free, then, they should have the right of free association, of free speech, of free publication. Then, no law should permit those democratic processes to be set at nought, and no excuse, whether of security, should allow a government to be deterred from doing what it knows to right, and what it must know to be right... "- Lee Kuan Yew, Legislative Assembly Debates April 27, 1955
"Let us get down to fundamentals. Is this an open, or is this a closed society? Is it a society where men can preach ideas - novel, unorthodox, heresies, to established churches and established governments - where there is a constant contest for men's hearts and minds on the basis of what is right, of what is just, of what is in the national interests, or is it a closed society where the mass media - the newspapaers, the journals, publications, TV, radio - either bound by sound or by sight, or both sound and sight, men's minds are fed with a constant drone of sycophantic support for a particular orthodox political philosophy? - Lee Kuan Yew Dec 18, 1964 Malaysian Parliamentary Debates
1. Does the opposition has such resourceful men who can help the PEOPLE's lives, not by rhetoric, but by viable solutions?
Why will you ask the obvious when you do not even allow yourself the option of seeking out those who are resourceful ?
Have you read any of the books written by CSJ in the early 1990s, or were you too prejudiced to have written him off ?
It is not that there are no resourceful people in Singapore, but how many are you prepared to accomodate and debate your point of views and listen to their opinions that defer and differ from yours ?
What are viable solutions ? How would you know that the solutions are viable unless you are prepared to try a different way from doing the usual ? Can you even attempt to know the alternative solutions to be viable, when you are already closed in your thinking that the tried and proven ways remain safer ?
Has it not been a fact that only when a country is prepared to accomodate all the different thinking and put them into a melting pot that great nations are built from the ground up ?
Incidentally, some of the issues that CSJ wrote in the early 1990s - about the lamentable education policies, and the heavy reliance on MNC that do not provide security for Singaporean employment - turned ''prophetic'' as seen in the massive job cuts by MNCs in the early 2000s, as CSJ had written about their transient nature being attracted only to places offering lower manufacturing costs; with the dogmatic unthinking form of rote education being abandoned ten years later in 2001-2002.
There were other capable thinkers in Singapore - who were as competent as the MIW Team - but were mowed down by the Mafia-like politics that tolerate no challenge from any direction.
Dr Catherine Lim was one such Singaporean, who prefer to stay out of the political debate that has been sullied by the LKY style of gangster politics, which he accuse a young pup like CSJ of practising, when LKY himself is already a God Father figure.
Lawyer Ms Teo Soh Lung was a capabale and bright lawyer, personally committed to help the under-class. She was unfortunate enough to have supported JBJ and appeared in open court during the battle between the Law Society and the Government led by LKY. She was removed from the political scene, when she was rounded up by the ISD - accused to be a member of the Marxist Conspiracy in the Catholic Church.
This is the 'Politics of Fear' that LKY instilled with his style of gangster politics.
2. Where to find such men or CREATE such men?
In such a political environment, can good men and women stand out to speak out for Singaporeans ?
Are those who are not prepared to join the MIW team less capable, and to be seen only as fools ?
3. How to protect and support such men?
Does the MIW team need any further protection ?
Or is your question directed at the protection of aspiring men and women to join the political arena - from the Third World 'Gangster' Politcs employed by the MIW Team ?
Your question is already answered in the speeches that LKY made and quoted in the preceding paragraphs - colored in brown.
4. Is the opposition prepared to bide its time to groom them up?
You should be asking if the MIW Team is prepared to give the political space for Singaporeans to grow and mature in political thinking, and allow an open society for minds to develop critical and analytical thinking..... - or is it a closed society where the mass media - the newspapaers, the journals, publications, TV, radio - either bound by sound or by sight, or both sound and sight, men's minds are fed with a constant drone of sycophantic support for a particular orthodox political philosophy?
If the answer is no to the above, then for goodnews sake, support the one who is already in the PM's chair. He did a sterling job of guiding us out of the 97 financial crisis as a minister and is deserving of a chance to prove his worth till the next election. I ask you, search your heart, do you think anyone else can do better than him?
Are you calling for the support of the current status quo in the political landscape in Singapore - as was also prophetically described by LKY in his speech in 1964 - to continue supporting a particular orthodox political philosophy ? If so, why do you even bother to take 24 hours to come up with this post ? Did PM LHL did a sterling job in pulling us out of the 1997 financial crisis, or was it the sacrifices made by the larger Singaporean community that pulled us out of the situation ? Incidentally, the financial crisis was partly external as much as it is also due to internal factors caused by the artificially high property prices that had to burst. The writings were already on the wall since the earlier bust in 1987, yet the rapid development of external events overtook us, while smarter private individuals such as George Soros came out on top.
People are prepared to give the opposition a chance, but if the quality is so lacklustre, no one will put a clown in office just to say no in parliament with no effect. You had blamed constituencies will be blackmarked with little benefits if they vote in the opposition.
When SDA Chiam See Tong and WP Low Thia Kiang are both given proper offices at the void decks of HDB blocks in their respective constituencies - equal to the quality given to the PAP Members of Parliament - then it can be said that the People are given the opportunity to give the Opposition a chance.
As matters stand, the People are subjected to a ''syncophantic propaganda'' that originate from HMV in the MIW HQ.
With years at honing this skill, the MIW has become expert at pressing home a Lie - which when spoken often enough by reputable persons, will soon be taken as Truth.
Please think out of the box instead of waiting for goodies to drop from the sky. For example, if my mother is staying in an opposition ward and deprive of goodies, wouldn't i get my friends and relatives to create a ruckus at the meet-the- people sessions with our MPs for a fair deal? Opposition or ruling party wards, we are all related closely to one another in small Singapore. Must i teach the opposition on how to think out of the box and be resourceful?
Before offering to teach others, have you considered if you are already well taught, or learnt sufficiently to have the experience and wisdom to teach others ?
It is easier to call others to "Think out of the Box" - but do you know what is required from an individual to "Think out of the Box" ?
Tell your ''mother's story'' to the MIW MP - and see how far you get with your confused line of thinking.
Such Third World Petty Politics exist only in Singapore led by Elitist MIW Leaders who believe that they are World Class First World material.
We are more then neighbors living in different constituencies.
We are ONE Nation, ONE People, ONE Country - yet the MIW Team will subject the People's development in the opposition held constituencies to to a Third World Political Petty Thinking.
Do desist rebutting point by point. It makes painful reading for all. Just sum it up and explain as best you can if you feel you want to rebut. Thanks.p>
Your carefully crafted response had taken you 24 hours to make, and it will be a gross injustice not to appreciate your fine work by giving my careful and considered response to each of your carefully crafted paragraphs.
Now that I have responded each of the many points in your reply - surely you must feel that you have received fair attention to all the points your have brought up - all done in about 20 minutes, as I traversed through your posted thoughts ?
'good' people keeps joining the one party.
very few and rare people join the Opps party.
Is there any surprise for the current situation of the Opps?
Its self-explanatory.
IF, imagine, a few of these 'good' people choose to join the Opps instead.
They also would have the chance to prove how 'good' they are.
But I must say, this is the road never travelled or less travelled.
Given both is to serve the people, my question is why?
What could be the reason?
It is good to note that you have written those 'good' people in the manner that you did, as the real Good People have avoided associating themselves entirely from politics - as these Good People know not to get themselves stuck in the mud.
You did ask ' WHY' these 'good' people keeps joining the one party ?
The answer is written on the wall by the POWER of ONE.
Make themselves look good by making the other side look bad, and enhance your own image of success further by handing out huge payouts - not from your own pockets, but from everyone else's pockets including those from the other parties.
These 'good' people will prefer to take the safer and shorter route to success, knowing that both sides will require them to work the ground just as hard.
The sad part is that many of these 'good' people have to change their principles, and accpet those required of them from the God Father of the Team.
Everyone is expected to be part of the Team, except the Leader of the Team - who is given the privilege to decide if he should follow his own principles.
Not obvious to these 'good' people is the high risks of failure if you are not yet the annointed ones to enter the inner sanctum, which is only available to those serving longer then twenty years or more.
Easy roads may not necessarily be the most comfortable road leading to longevity.
i still maintained that to `look & `be' good, it needn't be done at the expense of the other.
what we have now a government that is not doing the right thing.
what we do need are more servant leaders undertaking leadership roles that control the main arteries of singapore livelihood, including politics.
Originally posted by Atobe:Dear Point_blank,
I had expected more after the time you have taken to craft a reply, and I am disappointed that you prefer more rhetoric in the usual dismissive manner of the MIW. Your current response did not make any reference to the specifics that I have made to your previous post.
With the time taken, you have returned by opening new issues to argue and justify the current status quo in the political landscape in Singapore; and ask not to reply point-by-point. Why ?
The Singaporean way ? By whose standard of measure ? Who is blaming the tools for lousy workmanship, when there is no proper workshop that exist, and when stifling rules prevent the environment that will nurture the ''Art of Human Creativity'' ?
Was this not the situation during the Colonial Days, and when Singapore was in Malaysia ? Was it not MM LKY who was also as vocal as CSJ today - in protesting the curtailment of political activities - first by the Colonial Government, then by the Malaysian Federal Government to the extent that LKY will even cry out loud :
... If you believe in democracy, you must believe in it unconditionally. If you believe that men should be free, then, they should have the right of free association, of free speech, of free publication. Then, no law should permit those democratic processes to be set at nought, and no excuse, whether of security, should allow a government to be deterred from doing what it knows to right, and what it must know to be right... "- Lee Kuan Yew, Legislative Assembly Debates April 27, 1955
"Let us get down to fundamentals. Is this an open, or is this a closed society? Is it a society where men can preach ideas - novel, unorthodox, heresies, to established churches and established governments - where there is a constant contest for men's hearts and minds on the basis of what is right, of what is just, of what is in the national interests, or is it a closed society where the mass media - the newspapaers, the journals, publications, TV, radio - either bound by sound or by sight, or both sound and sight, men's minds are fed with a constant drone of sycophantic support for a particular orthodox political philosophy? - Lee Kuan Yew Dec 18, 1964 Malaysian Parliamentary Debates
Why will you ask the obvious when you do not even allow yourself the option of seeking out those who are resourceful ?
Have you read any of the books written by CSJ in the early 1990s, or were you too prejudiced to have written him off ?
It is not that there are no resourceful people in Singapore, but how many are you prepared to accomodate and debate your point of views and listen to their opinions that defer and differ from yours ?
What are viable solutions ? How would you know that the solutions are viable unless you are prepared to try a different way from doing the usual ? Can you even attempt to know the alternative solutions to be viable, when you are already closed in your thinking that the tried and proven ways remain safer ?
Has it not been a fact that only when a country is prepared to accomodate all the different thinking and put them into a melting pot that great nations are built from the ground up ?
Incidentally, some of the issues that CSJ wrote in the early 1990s - about the lamentable education policies, and the heavy reliance on MNC that do not provide security for Singaporean employment - turned ''prophetic'' as seen in the massive job cuts by MNCs in the early 2000s, as CSJ had written about their transient nature being attracted only to places offering lower manufacturing costs; with the dogmatic unthinking form of rote education being abandoned ten years later in 2001-2002.
There were other capable thinkers in Singapore - who were as competent as the MIW Team - but were mowed down by the Mafia-like politics that tolerate no challenge from any direction.
Dr Catherine Lim was one such Singaporean, who prefer to stay out of the political debate that has been sullied by the LKY style of gangster politics, which he accuse a young pup like CSJ of practising, when LKY himself is already a God Father figure.
Lawyer Ms Teo Soh Lung was a capabale and bright lawyer, personally committed to help the under-class. She was unfortunate enough to have supported JBJ and appeared in open court during the battle between the Law Society and the Government led by LKY. She was removed from the political scene, when she was rounded up by the ISD - accused to be a member of the Marxist Conspiracy in the Catholic Church.
This is the 'Politics of Fear' that LKY instilled with his style of gangster politics.
In such a political environment, can good men and women stand out to speak out for Singaporeans ?
Are those who are not prepared to join the MIW team less capable, and to be seen only as fools ?
Does the MIW team need any further protection ?
Or is your question directed at the protection of aspiring men and women to join the political arena - from the Third World 'Gangster' Politcs employed by the MIW Team ?
Your question is already answered in the speeches that LKY made and quoted in the preceding paragraphs - colored in brown.
You should be asking if the MIW Team is prepared to give the political space for Singaporeans to grow and mature in political thinking, and allow an open society for minds to develop critical and analytical thinking..... - or is it a closed society where the mass media - the newspapaers, the journals, publications, TV, radio - either bound by sound or by sight, or both sound and sight, men's minds are fed with a constant drone of sycophantic support for a particular orthodox political philosophy?
Are you calling for the support of the current status quo in the political landscape in Singapore - as was also prophetically described by LKY in his speech in 1964 - to continue supporting a particular orthodox political philosophy ? If so, why do you even bother to take 24 hours to come up with this post ? Did PM LHL did a sterling job in pulling us out of the 1997 financial crisis, or was it the sacrifices made by the larger Singaporean community that pulled us out of the situation ? Incidentally, the financial crisis was partly external as much as it is also due to internal factors caused by the artificially high property prices that had to burst. The writings were already on the wall since the earlier bust in 1987, yet the rapid development of external events overtook us, while smarter private individuals such as George Soros came out on top.
When SDA Chiam See Tong and WP Low Thia Kiang are both given proper offices at the void decks of HDB blocks in their respective constituencies - equal to the quality given to the PAP Members of Parliament - then it can be said that the People are given the opportunity to give the Opposition a chance.
As matters stand, the People are subjected to a ''syncophantic propaganda'' that originate from HMV in the MIW HQ.
With years at honing this skill, the MIW has become expert at pressing home a Lie - which when spoken often enough by reputable persons, will soon be taken as Truth.
Before offering to teach others, have you considered if you are already well taught, or learnt sufficiently to have the experience and wisdom to teach others ?
It is easier to call others to "Think out of the Box" - but do you know what is required from an individual to "Think out of the Box" ?
Tell your ''mother's story'' to the MIW MP - and see how far you get with your confused line of thinking.
Such Third World Petty Politics exist only in Singapore led by Elitist MIW Leaders who believe that they are World Class First World material.
We are more then neighbors living in different constituencies.
We are ONE Nation, ONE People, ONE Country - yet the MIW Team will subject the People's development in the opposition held constituencies to to a Third World Political Petty Thinking.
Your carefully crafted response had taken you 24 hours to make, and it will be a gross injustice not to appreciate your fine work by giving my careful and considered response to each of your carefully crafted paragraphs.
Now that I have responded each of the many points in your reply - surely you must feel that you have received fair attention to all the points your have brought up - all done in about 20 minutes, as I traversed through your posted thoughts ?
Dear Atobe,
I sacrificed a part of my time to answer to your post, and yet all that i received from you is yet again a repetition of your points, with no new insights other than EXCUSES for the consistant failure of the opposition political parties.
Be that as you wish and disregard my posts as you want, for you are only one amongst many who may feel otherwise. Whine and cry all you want but WHEN will you and those you defend START working on solutions to solve the daily issues for the People?
Simple question and i hope for an un-convoluted answer.
Originally posted by Point_blank:
Dear Atobe,
I sacrificed a part of my time to answer to your post, and yet all that i received from you is yet again a repetition of your points, with no new insights other than EXCUSES for the consistant failure of the opposition political parties.
Be that as you wish and disregard my posts as you want, for you are only one amongst many who may feel otherwise. Whine and cry all you want but WHEN will you and those you defend START working on solutions to solve the daily issues for the People?
Simple question and i hope for an un-convoluted answer.
Atobe's target audience are sheep, not humans with common sense. So dont waste your time reading or replying his post.
Plus Atobe strategy to winning any arguement is always to mess up the discussion with extremely long-winded repetition essays, with the hope that no forumers will not bother to read and reply. :D
Originally posted by Chinkara:Atobe's target audience are sheep, not humans with common sense. So dont waste your time reading or replying his post.
Plus Atobe strategy to winning any arguement is always to mess up the discussion with extremely long-winded repetition essays, with the hope that no forumers will not bother to read and reply. :D
i thought sheeps refer to the staunch followers of the men in WHITE?
that word is taken, you need another.
Originally posted by Chinkara:Atobe's target audience are sheep, not humans with common sense. So dont waste your time reading or replying his post.
Plus Atobe strategy to winning any arguement is always to mess up the discussion with extremely long-winded repetition essays, with the hope that no forumers will not bother to read and reply. :D
Thanks Chinkara for reminding me on the ways of Atobe. I doubt if you are his target audience of sheeps. You 'da man!' :-P
What a nice afternoon chuckle..
A particular individual here should really step out and smell the roses, live in the real world to understand what he does not yet comprehend or have the privilege of understanding.
Diversity is a word often used, but not practised ad nauseum in relation to communication processes where there is a fair chance of instrumental blowback. :)
Originally posted by redDUST:i thought sheeps refer to the staunch followers of the men in WHITE?
that word is taken, you need another.
Sorry i use the word Sheep, not Sheeps. because Sheeps does't exist. :D
Trolls spotted, everyone! They are Point_blank and Chinkara. These 2 just registered recently to post here to go against people who are not in favour of PAP. They are spamming this forum.
Originally posted by LazerLordz:What a nice afternoon chuckle..
A particular individual here should really step out and smell the roses, live in the real world to understand what he does not yet comprehend or have the privilege of understanding.
Diversity is a word often used, but not practised ad nauseum in relation to communication processes where there is a fair chance of instrumental blowback. :)
They are here attempting to shut people's mouth to stop talking and exposing PAP. They will not succeed in doing so. It is getting so rampant these days that many forums are full of people exposing PAP.
Originally posted by qlqq9:They are here attempting to shut people's mouth to stop talking and exposing PAP. They will not succeed in doing so. It is getting so rampant these days that many forums are full of people exposing PAP.
Perhaps our presence is to expose despicable irresponsible persons that would lead others to blunders, such as you?
Originally posted by Chinkara:
Sorry i use the word Sheep, not Sheeps. because Sheeps does't exist. :D
nitpicking, ya? ok, sheep. happy?
hope you are not constantly sweating over the minute stuff, you typically miss the forest for the trees.
Originally posted by redDUST:hope you are not constantly sweating over the minute stuff, you typically miss the forest for the trees.
hope you dont simply and conveniently generalize anybody who doesnt agree with your view as MIW support. Like i said, the sheeps you are talking about doesnt really exist.
Originally posted by Point_blank:
Perhaps our presence is to expose despicable irresponsible persons that would lead others to blunders, such as you?
So people who do not agree with you and the ways of PAP are despicable irresponsible, ha ha ha. You are narrow minded and all the way out to spam forums to attack people who don't agree with you and PAP, Troll. I suggest you go to all websites and tell everyone who expose PAP and who do not agree with you the same.
Troll alert, people.
Troll Point_blank, you will never never ever succeed to stop anyone who don't agree with you and PAP. Never, never ever, ha ha ha.