Looks like it is getting serious again....
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Originally posted by whiskers:
3 mths ago... below 2500 was unthinkable... now!!!! walau waht happen today... 700 bailout passed also drop... me dare nt bet liao la.. anything can happen... jus watch theshow...
ya...go in after chinese new year.i actually know someone who's contemplating selling house liao to bridge the gap. crazy fella play stock on borrowed money, now bank asking for top-ups. talk big when stocks was doing well, now, everynite cannot sleep.
sibeh jialat to say the least.
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Originally posted by redDUST:
ya...go in after chinese new year.i actually know someone who's contemplating selling house liao to bridge the gap. crazy fella play stock on borrowed money, now bank asking for top-ups. talk big when stocks was doing well, now, everynite cannot sleep.
sibeh jialat to say the least.
I think if there is one rule before going in to play stocks, it is "Thou shall not borrow"
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Originally posted by whiskers:
I think if there is one rule before going in to play stocks, it is "Thou shall not borrow"
I beg to differ, the appropriate rule in trading should be:
1) Never answer a margin call from your broker
-Why chase good money after bad? Realise your mistakes and never add on to your losses.
Margin is a good leverage if used correctly.
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Another note:
In a bull market, everyone thinks that they are a genious investor because every stock they 'tikam' also go up.
In a bear market, Mr market shows you how foolish you are.
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BARC.L 314.00 -54.00 -14.67% BARCLAYS
MER 23.50 -3.17 -11.89% ML CO CMN STK
The despots paid around 700 for Barclays with Singaporeans blood and sweat money and see what it is now? To cover up the losses, they raise electricity and telephone charges.
Despite their treachery they continue to take massive amounts of public money for themselves. TT Durai characters.
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Originally posted by redDUST:
ya...go in after chinese new year.i actually know someone who's contemplating selling house liao to bridge the gap. crazy fella play stock on borrowed money, now bank asking for top-ups. talk big when stocks was doing well, now, everynite cannot sleep.
sibeh jialat to say the least.
Yes, from stock market to property contagion, soon people will be forced to fire sell their houses to cover their stock positions and when property prices crash, people sell stocks to cover their property and there will be a merry go round until we hit the bottom.
It is not only New York that engages in derivatives trading. Singapore is one of the biggest culprits. In order for the despots to show "good" results, the despots, like the US regulators, loosen controls on derivatives trading, creating the big mess..
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Originally posted by Evangel:
I beg to differ, the appropriate rule in trading should be:
1) Never answer a margin call from your broker
-Why chase good money after bad? Realise your mistakes and never add on to your losses.
Margin is a good leverage if used correctly.
It is easy to talk when the market is one way street like now. Trading on margin and "Never answer a margin call from your broker" will lose you all your money when it swings wildly with no clear directions.
For example, you buy at 100 on margin and the market moves down to 95 before going to 120, you are already out (at 95 when you have a margin call). If you top up margin and it goes down to 90 and at 90 you do not top up, you are out even if it subsequently goes back up to 120.
If you top up at 95, 90, 85, 80.... you will probably have to sell your house as people that trade on margins, normally ends up over trading because of the leverage.
In a one way down market, your statement sounds very profound (based on hindsight) but the REALITY is that, it is good only sometimes and not at all times and situations. If you know what the situation will be (not was, not the past), you are a god. If you are a god, you will not be trading stocks.
It is still best, if you want to invest in stocks, to wait for, not just the market but the situation, the credit crunch, or in Singapore's case, the on-coming crash in property market to end, play out, before investing in stocks.
Let the whole thing play out before you go in, not with borrowed money and not on margin.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
It is easy to talk when the market is one way street like now. Trading on margin and "Never answer a margin call from your broker" will lose you all your money when it swings wildly with no clear directions.
For example, you buy at 100 on margin and the market moves down to 95 before going to 120, you are already out (at 95 when you have a margin call). If you top up margin and it goes down to 90 and at 90 you do not top up, you are out even if it subsequently goes back up to 120.
If you top up at 95, 90, 85, 80.... you will probably have to sell your house as people that trade on margins, normally ends up over trading because of the leverage.
In a one way down market, your statement sounds very profound (based on hindsight) but the REALITY is that, it is good only sometimes and not at all times and situations. If you know what the situation will be (not was, not the past), you are a god. If you are a god, you will not be trading stocks.
It is still best, if you want to invest in stocks, to wait for, not just the market but the situation, the credit crunch, or in Singapore's case, the on-coming crash in property market to end, play out, before investing in stocks.
Let the whole thing play out before you go in, not with borrowed money and not on margin.
What you said is true and different people have different strategies to trade.
The general rule is to cut loss if unsure. Then enter again if charts or fundamentals tell you so.
In this bear market, the trend is down, so don't try to beat the trend because you will always lose.
In redDUST's friend's case, his friend is wrong, he lost money, he answered the margin call again and again. This is a lesson to not put good money after bad decisions. A lesson on hindsight. I will still insist on not answering margin calls. Even though you may be right, the market tells you that you are wrong now. You may be right later, but you dont know when. So don't answer your margin call and listen to the market.
If he had cut losses at 8-10% everytime, I'm sure he would not lose much. It is important to save yourself and fight the battle another day.
For traders, Mr Market tells you whether you are right or wrong, win or lose money.
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Originally posted by Evangel:
What you said is true and different people have different strategies to trade.
The general rule is to cut loss if unsure. Then enter again if charts or fundamentals tell you so.
In this bear market, the trend is down, so don't try to beat the trend because you will always lose.
In redDUST's friend's case, his friend is wrong, he lost money, he answered the margin call again and again. This is a lesson to not put good money after bad decisions. A lesson on hindsight. I will still insist on not answering margin calls. Even though you may be right, the market tells you that you are wrong now. You may be right later, but you dont know when. So don't answer your margin call and listen to the market.
If he had cut losses at 8-10% everytime, I'm sure he would not lose much. It is important to save yourself and fight the battle another day.
For traders, Mr Market tells you whether you are right or wrong, win or lose money.
1. The rule "cut loss if unsure" can result in losses when you are in a swing market and before you know it, you have lost, if not everything, a big amount. Looking back at how the market performed recently, (hindsight) your strategy seems very wise and profound. That is, looking back on hindsight, looking back on hindsight it seems wise and profound. Yet if you look at swinging markets, your "cut loss if unsure" can lose you everything and yet the market did not even moved! You buy at 100, it goes down to 95 you cut and it goes back up to 100. You buy at 90 and it goes down to 85 and you cut. After you cut it goes back to 100. The market has not moved in terms of price... the first time you bought at 100 and it is still at 100 but you have cut twice!
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The damned despots deserve all the curses.... Barclays below 300 and they bought around 700....
QUOTES
Symbol Price Change % Change BARC.L 299.25 -68.75 -18.68% from Yahoo! Finance
..and to make themselves look good, they sell national assets like Tuas Power and raise electricity bills by 21%
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...and look at their BofA shares...
Bank of America falls after results
Dividend cut, weaker outlook undercuts sentiment
NEW YORK (MarketWatch) - Bank of America shares retreated 9% in pre-open trading Tuesday as investors pondered life with a smaller dividend and a worsening earnings outlook after the bank reported a surprising 68% drop in third quarter profit late Monday.After the close of trading on Monday, Bank of America said its third-quarter profit slid below analysts' estimates, and announced a dividend cut and stock offering aimed at positioning it for an eventual recovery.The company's shares fell 9.3% in pre-open trade, to $29.25.Remember to curse these asspots that take the people's money to bail out foreign banks and take public money and put into their own pockets... then raise electricity charges by 21%.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
1. The rule "cut loss if unsure" can result in losses when you are in a swing market and before you know it, you have lost, if not everything, a big amount. Looking back at how the market performed recently, (hindsight) your strategy seems very wise and profound. That is, looking back on hindsight, looking back on hindsight it seems wise and profound. Yet if you look at swinging markets, your "cut loss if unsure" can lose you everything and yet the market did not even moved! You buy at 100, it goes down to 95 you cut and it goes back up to 100. You buy at 90 and it goes down to 85 and you cut. After you cut it goes back to 100. The market has not moved in terms of price... the first time you bought at 100 and it is still at 100 but you have cut twice!
Personally, I dun use margin, so no risk of margin call. Me jus a small fry, bet small small, dun cut loss its ok, since stocks in cdp doesnt cost u money.. Jus wait for the next bull wave loh.
But i believe, if you are a trader, then a cut loss limit is very important, look at cosco.. U dun wait for it to drop 50% then decide to cut, by then its impossible to cut liao.the more it drop the harder it is to cut.
Cut loss if unsure is much safer, u lose also lose 5% only, if dun cut, u might lose alot more. -
Originally posted by whiskers:
Personally, I dun use margin, so no risk of margin call. Me jus a small fry, bet small small, dun cut loss its ok, since stocks in cdp doesnt cost u money.. Jus wait for the next bull wave loh.
But i believe, if you are a trader, then a cut loss limit is very important, look at cosco.. U dun wait for it to drop 50% then decide to cut, by then its impossible to cut liao.the more it drop the harder it is to cut.
Cut loss if unsure is much safer, u lose also lose 5% only, if dun cut, u might lose alot more.I am just saying that if you think "cutting loss" is the way to make money, think again. If your objective is to make money, you have to come up with a winning formula... like wait for the bottom of the economic cycles before you go in; buy good companies with great management and make sure that you have enough money to ride out the market excesses. If the company whose stock you are holding is no longer value for money than you should get out whether it is a profitable trade or a losing trade at that point.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
I am just saying that if you think "cutting loss" is the way to make money, think again. If your objective is to make money, you have to come up with a winning formula... like wait for the bottom of the economic cycles before you go in; buy good companies with great management and make sure that you have enough money to ride out the market excesses. If the company whose stock you are holding is no longer value for money than you should get out whether it is a profitable trade or a losing trade at that point.
The strategy I'm refering to is for traders because margin is involved. And if a trader doesnt know how to identify swing markets, he is a damn lousy 1. In a market situtation now, it is a clear bear. Europe have yet to fully disclose their losses.
If you are talking about value investing, it would be another different story which I practice.
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QUOTES
Bank of America drops 26.23% in one day and Barclays way below 300.
More 21% electricity bills increases and telephone charges to make somebody's daughter in law look good?
Curse the old despot for his cronyism, nepotism, and using high office for personal and party gains and your curses will not be near enough.
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If you believe in god/a god, ask him/her why only one more asspot got cancer and what about the rest, what about the assdogs?
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Damn the despots and curse them harder....
BARC.L 236.00 -78.00 -24.84% Barclays down 24.84% to 236.00 at the moment, the useless idiots take massive amounts of public money for their own pockets and show the people these type of results.
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Fed Leads Global Coordinated Rate Cut, Eases by Half-point- Reuters
The Federal Reserve led a coordinated round of global official rate cuts on Wednesday, easing by a half-point, as did the European Central Bank, Bank of England and Swiss, Canadian and Swedish banks. In an attempt to stem unprecedented global market turmoil, the Fed cut its key federal funds lending rate by half a percentage point to 1.5 percent and also lowered its discount rate by the same amount to 1.75 percent. The ECB also cut by a half-point to 3.75 percent as did the Bank of England, taking its rate to 4.5 percent. China also joined the effort, cutting its key rate 27 basis points.... » read more
Related StoriesBut the asspots, curses to them and their families and cronies, if they cut rates here is useless because it is already so low... and why is it so low? The damned despots kept it low for the benefit of their cronies and ass dogs.... as a high interest rate would have benefited the CPF accounts and would they think of benefiting the CPF accounts? asspots only care how much public money they can take for themselves and their families....
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hosay lah!
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This certainly deserves even harder curses for the people that take massive amounts of public money .....
You guess what the price of Shin Corp, you know Thaksin's company the idiots paid S$6 billion for, you know what is the price the shares are selling at the Stock Exchange of Thailand?
Curse harder and more of them will be stuck with cancer, they and their assdogs.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
Curse harder and more of them will be stuck with cancer, they and their assdogs.
considering that this slump is caused almost entirely by the good US of A.... I certainly hope that their HMO is able to deal with the amount of cancer cropping up.....btw.... how much did you lose....???
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Originally posted by Chin Eng:
considering that this slump is caused almost entirely by the good US of A.... I certainly hope that their HMO is able to deal with the amount of cancer cropping up.....btw.... how much did you lose....???
Sure, the asspots did not bailout Merry Lynch, in January this year and put in more money recently, $900million ( if I remember correctly ) MORE, on top of the tens of billions and they must not be blamed for the losses.... sure, to delusionals, the blame should go to the US of A and never to those that took people's sweat and blood money and give it on a silver platter to foreigners.
...and delusionals are too stupid to know what the meaning of taking profits and laughing all the way to the bank to bank it in is... and call them losses... hahaha, so delusional so early in the morning...
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
This certainly deserves even harder curses for the people that take massive amounts of public money .....
You guess what the price of Shin Corp, you know Thaksin's company the idiots paid S$6 billion for, you know what is the price the shares are selling at the Stock Exchange of Thailand?
Curse harder and more of them will be stuck with cancer, they and their assdogs.
Why is your mind filled with so much attract? According to the Law of Attractions, if you have negative mind state, negative situation will keep coming at you. If you keep cursing and swearing then all these cursing and swearing will keep coming back after you. -
Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
Sure, the asspots did not bailout Merry Lynch, in January this year and put in more money recently, $900million ( if I remember correctly ) MORE, on top of the tens of billions and they must not be blamed for the losses.... sure, to delusionals, the blame should go to the US of A and never to those that took people's sweat and blood money and give it on a silver platter to foreigners.
...and delusionals are too stupid to know what the meaning of taking profits and laughing all the way to the bank to bank it in is... and call them losses... hahaha, so delusional so early in the morning...
You end up paying the same hiked transport/utilities bills/GST/incoming tax/etc, so you're not of any exceptions to the rest of the delusional.
Probably you're worse, since you claim to have know it yet you still pay them!
lol
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Originally posted by yamizi:
Why is your mind filled with so much attract? According to the Law of Attractions, if you have negative mind state, negative situation will keep coming at you. If you keep cursing and swearing then all these cursing and swearing will keep coming back after you.It does not matter if it comes back to me or not, as long as the curses work... hahahah...
