ERP? Aren't COEs meant to check car population?
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After they made a mistake by flooding the market with COE, they blame Singaporeans for desiring to live beyond their means. Not to mention sending counter insurgency agents to the internet to blame Singaporeans for their policy failure.
http://www.straitstimes.com/ST%2BForum/Story/STIStory_255322.html
ERP? Aren't COEs meant to check car population?
ERP? Aren't COEs meant to check car population? I AM confused and annoyed by policies affecting car ownership in Singapore. As a motorist, I am of the view that there are more and more cars on the roads nowadays, so the Government has to set up more Electronic Road Pricing (ERP) gantries and raise ERP rates to control traffic.
My question is simple. What happened to the original purpose of the certificate of entitlement (COE)? Isn't it supposed to be the ultimate tool to limit the number of cars on the road? If the COE is doing its job well, why are the roads so choked that the authorities have 'no choice' but to set up ERP gantries everywhere to control traffic?
Let's see what went wrong. First, for the past few years, the number of COEs grew, and car prices tumbled to a low five-figure sum. Second, car loans stretched to 10 years, with banks and dealers offering cash-back deals and zero downpayments. Third, additional registration fee taxes were reduced. The road tax has also been lowered.
Simply put, the measures made cars cheaper and many people flocked to buy them - and many of those shouldn't own a car at all. I estimate at least half the car owners today earn less than $5,000 a month. Why are they buying a car? With ever-increasing oil prices and inflation, one will soon need to pay more than $1,500 a month for a small Japanese car, including loan instalments, petrol, maintenance and repair, parking, road tax, insurance and so on.
And now, the new scheme will allow cash rebates to scrap cars, in order to turn drivers back to public transport. This is not wrong, but we are not using the system correctly. In the first place, we should make it very difficult to own a car, but we are doing the exact opposite by making it easy for people to own a car and subsequently 'converting' them back to public transport. This is moving one step forward and two steps back. Asking a car owner who has been driving for a decade to convert back to taking buses is like asking someone who is used to getting water from the tap to fetch water from a well again.
A better solution is to limit car loans to five years, with a minimum 50 per cent downpayment. This will weed out thousands of people who can ill-afford a car. And yes, make the COE useful again by releasing fewer of them.
Tan Wee Liang
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To be really honest, I have also been plagued by this question long ago.
An excellent piece of article.
Well done Singapore.
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oh no. that means my dad shouldnt be owning a car & a motorcycle.
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First, ERP is to restict number of cars going into the CBD area.
Next, ERP is to help singaporeans own more cars.
Now, ERP is to help control the traffic.
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It only meant that if you cannot afford a car, you better dun buy any.
Or else you will be "san-man" by the time you leave your house and not forgetting you must be a law-abiding citizen to afford further "expense".
Sg land is land for the rich.
If you are not rich, you dun buy a car.
That is the answer.
The poodles care less whether there is congestion or not.
As long as they make more $$$ for their master, they get their bonus.
You die, your problem.
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What will one do if one wants to make $$$$$ ? Increase COE to earn more money from peasants. Increase car volume. Then increase ERP to earn more from more peasants. Blame peasants for their habits. --------------------------- Rather than keeping COE volume low. Then increase/stagnate ERP to earn from fewer peasants.
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dun like how the govt always tax you heavily?
very simple. dun vote for them. dun wait for others to do the job. if you want to vote for the ruling party, then dun complain when everything start going up.
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The extension of loan periods is for the banks to earn more $$. Longer Loan period = More $$ paid by those who take up the loan. It is possible to have a less congested road with more COE, without ERP. Make more roads. But it looks like some idiots failed to see this. Or maybe they saw it, just that they don't know how to implement it (Or should I said, "CAN'T implement it"?). Still, the fact that they are idiots doesn't change. OK. Now, let's wait for those idiots' reply.
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COE is meant to control CAR Ownership.....
ERP is meant to control CAR Movement.....
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increase in car owners = increase in no. of road tax payers = increase of $$ for gar-ben-men..
y would they care if you can afford to pay ERP or not..cannot pay = drive pass ERP areas aft the stipulated hours..(& yet..they can still earn $$ from roadtax)
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Originally posted by hloc:
COE is meant to control CAR Ownership.....
ERP is meant to control CAR Movement.....
they dun mind you owning car. theu just dont want you to drive your car around. that why they tell you ERP is to help you own more cars, and at the same time also help to control the traffic flow.
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COE and ERP both did not work. But they sure do collect alot of $$$
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Originally posted by mistyblue:
COE and ERP both did not work. But they sure do collect alot of $$$
It did work...... I seldom find the need to own a car, and wouldn't want to own one NOW. But other S'porean are too willing to go into debt JUST to own a Car for 10yrs nowadays.......
The funny thing is..... Knowing how expensive it is to own a car in S'pore, with ERP, COE, parking, fuel price.... etc (and it will only get more expensive). Why oh why would S'porean still die die wants to own a car
Is it a 'FACE' thing
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is a bubu trap lah.. keke
if adjust back like last time, jap car cost at least $80k last time
buy a car needs 20 % downpay, 7 yrs max loan, u will see those earning less than $5k (rough figure) will not buy a car..
and of course, car population will still increase because there are more and more millionaires in spore... right??
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COE means you are entitled to OWN a car, not DRIVE a car.. paying for COE simply allows you to park your car at the car park la..
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Easier loans is to help banks earn more money. If difficult to ask people get loans banks headache liao.
Remember people, we want to be a first class financial hub, first class transportation system. Everything first class. GDP must keep increasing every year, little cars on the road = less consumer spending = lower GDP. If lower GDP, people will say ministars not performing, they don't want a pay cut leh. 5% reduction on 3.7mil is $185,000 lesser income leh. You think they want meh? AND SO THE SYSTEM WILL CLASH!
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I am really impressed by your talents in the ways they manage the traffic.
Very innovative ways.
I wonder who are the people who actually created these plans and policies?
They should be honored for their contributions to their fellow men and women.
The people should know who they are so that some can tell them how grateful they are for their self-less contributions to enrich the lives of the common people. Enriching their driving experience on the highways and parking.
You people should know who they are. Afterall singapore is a tiny place on the map.
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Originally posted by kilua:
After they made a mistake by flooding the market with COE, they blame Singaporeans for desiring to live beyond their means. Not to mention sending counter insurgency agents to the internet to blame Singaporeans for their policy failure.
i will ask this question about this statement you made..
why the hell did you blame the gabrament for the actions of irresponsible asswipes who cannot make responsible decisions for themselves?
you can blame the gabrament for a lot of things.. their greed, their idiocy, their speed in blaming people.. but you cannot and must not blame the gabrament for the decisions made by individuals who refuse to take personal responsibility for their own actions..
for that, you show yourself to be unwilling to shoulder your own responsibilities... making you... what? the very thing that requires the very "autocratic gabrament" you rail against...
look into the mirror and think about your own responsibilities before you rant against the gabrament...
and if you want to rant against the gabrament, please rant against the correct things.. here, it's the flooding of COE, the duplicity of COEs/ERPs, the lies told, their arrogance in not even bothering with a believable lie... the lot...
don't undermine everything said by being so stupid that you blame the gabrament for decisions made by the people...
that's the same as blaming the gabrament for the way people voted.. and they did...
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both coe and erp are very successful policies in sucking dry commoners money.
coe implemented to make sure 1stly(legitimate) less people can afford to buy cars thus going green.2ndly(Rumors) make sure those that can afford to buy cars will pay heavily to the govt thus the ability to upkeep million dollars salaries for useless bums..
this generated an effect for car sellers in order to survive thats to decrease upfront payment and rebates to attract buyers and up sales.
Our incredibly effective(read unbelievably ridiculous) govt saw more cars on the road and results in traffic congestions. They saw ERP as a solution 1stly(legitimate) to cut unnecessary car flows into usually busy areas.(people need to wake in the morning to go work,thus driving to city area is somehow saw as unnecessary car flow). 2ndly(rumors) another great way to generate money to upkeep already too high salaries for useless bums.
it yet again generated another 2 effects..one is a vicious cycle of the above. the other is the govt saw that to catch big fishes(more money), one has to loose more fishing line(lower COE so more people can buy cars). so people who saw the short term benefits of lowered COE,rebates yada yada yada starts to think hey im rich enough to buy car.thats where the govt moves in to suck our money away..
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Originally posted by mistyblue:
COE and ERP both did not work. But they sure do collect alot of $$$
COE and ERP do work. Without the COE, there will be more cars in Singapore, without the ERP there will be more movement in certain areas.However the current situation of yet so many cars in Singapore and so many movement in certain areas means that the system is not working well enough. That means, we need higher rates for the COE and ERP. Some of the suggestions like 50% down payment etc do work also...
Then again, pple will blame some pple for the rising cost of things in Singapore. Things including cars.
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Gahment don't wanna look bad by restricting COE from the start so they make excuse by saying they reduce up front cost of cars so that car become more 'accessible' to the masses.... but later when buy liao, found out that fuel and ERP etc... are super chor, but they cannot blame gahment.. Cuz its your own choice to buy.
Must do you sums properly, plan ahead... blah blah blah... basically shifting the responsibility to us. That's true in some sense though; its our own responsibility to decide if we can afford it.
I rather have a choice to decide whether I want to buy car or not then to have so few COE that even if I want to buy, I might not be able to get.
I think I have the best solution; leave COE as it is and leave ERP as it is, but make getting driving/taxi license sibeh hard and only for good drivers, not like all those kayu crap out there. Confirm traffic immediately lessen by 60-70% :D
In this way, ppl cant complain about price and availability of ERP/COE etc... its because of their own poor skill! :D Good idea?
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Increasing GST is to help the poor.
So ERPs and COEs work on a somewhat similar concept.
Yes, I know.
Mee siam mai hum.
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The number of COEs released depends on the number of vehicles that are deregistered or scrapped, but they should have slowed down the growth of the vehicle population using that long ago.
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Originally posted by charlize:
Increasing GST is to help the poor.
So ERPs and COEs work on a somewhat similar concept.
Yes, I know.
Mee siam mai hum.
zzz.. that sentence is like..
Last time i damn rich pay million of taxes.. Suddenly i no money.. knn give me money like enough for can food nia.. =.= -
Originally posted by youyayu:
zzz.. that sentence is like..
Last time i damn rich pay million of taxes.. Suddenly i no money.. knn give me money like enough for can food nia.. =.=Oh stop it.
I lost you at zzz .
Really.