War on Iran please!
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Why u so keen on saying iranians are hoarding oil? any reports to support ur claims?
thus they covertly use international finance institutions to purchase.
You see, when u use pharse like that, ppl will ask where u got ur info from?
Then u say we cant know because its covert
How do you know it happened when it is covert? are u an insider? -
Diplomacy had failed. War is the only solution. I too, am afraid to die, but in the end, i rather receive a bullet dying for a justified cause - saving billions other, than to slowly die of starvation and watching every other man, woman, and child fall onto the wayside in hunger.
xtreyier, I think you should go join SDP's Tak Boleh Tahan! protest campaign, rather than whine here about war on Iran.
They also care about rising prices.
They are staging campaigns against PAP regime.
That is productive activity.
If you care about high prices so much xtreyier, you should join them as well.
Won't die one.
At most arrested only.
That is better than dying to fight Iran right?
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Why do folks got hijack by some idiot who blame everyone else in the world? Think that War with Iran will be between US and Iranians?
The minutes Iran test nuke. You will see who is more agitated.
the list of countries will want missile defense shield and want Nuke to counter Shiite Iran expansion and that would be :
Israel, Jordan, Saudi, Kuwait, turkey, UAE, Egypt. Qatar. The entire Economics Shipping lane in the Persian Gulf will be changellene by Shiite , The Arab Royals family will be affected..
Iraq and Persian Gulf will be the proxy battle ground between the Sunni and the Shiite all over again. Most of these countries would have the oil money to procure Nuke. No Nuke research is needed they use Cash to buy the entire Nuke delivering system.
Mid East with Nuke and Oil think really really hard again. Are you seriously better off? RSN will end up deploying 50% more to bring oil tanker back to Asia.
If Mid East burn in Hell. The United States can easily secure Venezuela by force and substitute the 40% oil import from Mid east with more oil from Canada ,Alaska, California coast, Mexico and Venezuela.
And what would China and india do if tension among Arabs heat up?
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
xtreyier, I think you should go join SDP's Tak Boleh Tahan! protest campaign, rather than whine here about war on Iran.
They also care about rising prices.
They are staging campaigns against PAP regime.
That is productive activity.
If you care about high prices so much xtreyier, you should join them as well.
Won't die one.
At most arrested only.
That is better than dying to fight Iran right?
That's the most stupid thing i've heard from you. You think any political group in this country can solve the rise of prices? It is not anyone's fault in this country that price rosed. This is all due to the mad ambition of one country's leadership - Iran.If you want to solve a problem, go to the root of the cause. Cut off only the grass, it will grow another one again.
If anyone is whining, it is you and your selfish desire to serve your political ambitious masters without looking further beyond the length of your nose, on the suffering of billions affected by a common cause and common root - Iran!
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This is all due to the mad ambition of one country's leadership - Iran.
Can you provide evidence to support above statement xtreyier?
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This is really ridiculous,
Iran made oil expensive, so we must destroy Iran to make life easier. What bull shit is this?
So what if Iran made oil expensive? Its their oil... It like saying, Mcdonald is overpricing its products, attack mcdonalds!
If you find it so hard to cope with the higher cost of oil, then be your own brainiac and create a new source... It's really stupid and unrealistic thinking for those who are willing to fight Iran in war(individual)...
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In here, people r assuming other people r guilty before they even commit the crime. They have not make a nuclear plant they r already assuming they r killing everyone with it. They did not buy oil and they r assumed to hoard oil and earning profit from it. Everybody is innocent unless proven guilty. If u wanna state something, prove it.
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Originally posted by whiskers:
Why u so keen on saying iranians are hoarding oil? any reports to support ur claims?
You see, when u use pharse like that, ppl will ask where u got ur info from?
Then u say we cant know because its covert
How do you know it happened when it is covert? are u an insider?
If there was clear cut evidences on Iran manipulation on oil prices, do you think i would still be here? The war on Iran would had been long over and oil price back to $80 per barrel!I do not just make claim without reason and logic. Many times, for the ordinary laymen, we have to read between the lines, and figure out from numerous seemingly unrelated sources to search for clues and analyse each data. No one or country will just lay everything on the table for you find. You have to search.
Let me take you on a brief chronological journey into the deprivations of the Iranian leadership.
1.) Iran exports 2.5million barrels of oil a day. At $80/b for the last 5 years, each yr they would have a state revenue of $70 billion dollars -US$70,000,000,000 on oil alone. Setting aside $50billion in their treasury, it would mean a war chest of US$250billion to play in manipulation of international affairs.
Social spending is atrocious - WTO rank them 93rd on health care alone. Population of 70million, with an area of 1.6million sq km, there are still slums, beggars and poverty. Thus, much of it's money is not into social spending, but it seems for other nefarious purposes. ( 12million below poverty line)
2.) I will not touch on their nuclear ambition debacle for it is already widely known.
3.) The spike in oil prices began in 2005. Oil only average around $40/b but shot up to $50/b. This was also the same time the Bushrer Nuclear Power station in Iran was completed and the row over suspected nuclear weapon production began.
4. )June 2007, oil shot up to $80 and by July 08, it peaked $147/b. At June 07, Talks between Iran and the west over the nuclear weapons issue had broken down.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2006/jun/22/iran.ewenmacaskill
-an indication of things to come by Iran.
5.)Jan 08 saw the new year started with price rice in non-oil related staples - food. And soon everything else followed, for oil had a touch in everything. It is a daily use staple. Opec kindheartedly tried to increase output, but someone put a stop to it.
http://www.iranfocus.com/en/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=14036
6. ) By April, the world was suffering. Opec listened, but again, someone refused.
7.) This is an intelligence report gathered from a credible agency that does paid biz as advisors for MNCs and investors. I didn't want to reveal my sources initially, but i hope i did not put the author at risk.
http://www.world-check.com/articles/2008/05/09/iran-venezuela-use-oil-tankers-manipulate-gliobal-/
8) And now, the latest developement
http://www.usatoday.com/money/markets/2008-07-10-oil-stocks-thursday_N.htm
Iran is the cause of our woes, the root of our suffering. War is the only solution. There is no other choice.
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Still no evidence on Iran cause high oil price xtreyier.
How?
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Originally posted by xtreyier:
If there was clear cut evidences on Iran manipulation on oil prices, do you think i would still be here? The war on Iran would had been long over and oil price back to $80 per barrel!I do not just make claim without reason and logic. Many times, for the ordinary laymen, we have to read between the lines, and figure out from numerous seemingly unrelated sources to search for clues and analyse each data. No one or country will just lay everything on the table for you find. You have to search.
Let me take you on a brief chronological journey into the deprivations of the Iranian leadership.
1.) Iran exports 2.5million barrels of oil a day. At $80/b for the last 5 years, each yr they would have a state revenue of $70 billion dollars -US$70,000,000,000 on oil alone. Setting aside $50billion in their treasury, it would mean a war chest of US$250billion to play in manipulation of international affairs.
Social spending is atrocious - WTO rank them 93rd on health care alone. Population of 70million, with an area of 1.6million sq km, there are still slums, beggars and poverty. Thus, much of it's money is not into social spending, but it seems for other nefarious purposes. ( 12million below poverty line)
2.) I will not touch on their nuclear ambition debacle for it is already widely known.
3.) The spike in oil prices began in 2005. Oil only average around $40/b but shot up to $50/b. This was also the same time the Bushrer Nuclear Power station in Iran was completed and the row over suspected nuclear weapon production began.
4. )June 2007, oil shot up to $80 and by July 08, it peaked $147/b. At June 07, Talks between Iran and the west over the nuclear weapons issue had broken down.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2006/jun/22/iran.ewenmacaskill
-an indication of things to come by Iran.
5.)Jan 08 saw the new year started with price rice in non-oil related staples - food. And soon everything else followed, for oil had a touch in everything. It is a daily use staple. Opec kindheartedly tried to increase output, but someone put a stop to it.
http://www.iranfocus.com/en/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=14036
6. ) By April, the world was suffering. Opec listened, but again, someone refused.
7.) This is an intelligence report gathered from a credible agency that does paid biz as advisors for MNCs and investors. I didn't want to reveal my sources initially, but i hope i did not put the author at risk.
http://www.world-check.com/articles/2008/05/09/iran-venezuela-use-oil-tankers-manipulate-gliobal-/
8) And now, the latest developement
http://www.usatoday.com/money/markets/2008-07-10-oil-stocks-thursday_N.htm
Iran is the cause of our woes, the root of our suffering. War is the only solution. There is no other choice.
like I've said, its their oil... They can do whatever they want...So war is the only solution? are you sure? What makes you think that Iran will surely lose? If they stop all exports of their oil, guess the price of oil will go up tremendously...
Most of your sources are US based... Thats so un-biased(sarcastic)
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Anyways, what makes TS so sure that Iran is the cause for increase in higher price for oil... There could be other factors...
Seems that TS didnt think it through...
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xtreyier, can you provide a source that says that Iran is engineering the current high oil price?
For example if I make statement saying USA engineered the high oil price in 1973, I at least can quote a source:
...His voice quickens further when he reminisces about the era of great oil diplomacy in the Seventies and his contemporary, former US Secretary of State Henry Kissinger.
At this point he makes an extraordinary claim: 'I am 100 per cent sure that the Americans were behind the increase in the price of oil. The oil companies were in in real trouble at that time, they had borrowed a lot of money and they needed a high oil price to save them.'
He says he was convinced of this by the attitude of the Shah of Iran, who in one crucial day in 1974 moved from the Saudi view, that a hike would be dangerous to Opec because it would alienate the US, to advocating higher prices.
'King Faisal sent me to the Shah of Iran, who said: "Why are you against the increase in the price of oil? That is what they want? Ask Henry Kissinger - he is the one who wants a higher price".'
Yamani contends that proof of his long-held belief has recently emerged in the minutes of a secret meeting on a Swedish island, where UK and US officials determined to orchestrate a 400 per cent increase in the oil price...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2001/jan/14/globalrecession.oilandpetrol
Can you quote a source xtreyier?
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xtreyier, see below video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Site
Don't be naive xtreyier.
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
xtreyier, can you provide a source that says that Iran is engineering the current high oil price?
For example if I make statement saying USA engineered the high oil price in 1973, I at least can quote a source:
...His voice quickens further when he reminisces about the era of great oil diplomacy in the Seventies and his contemporary, former US Secretary of State Henry Kissinger.
At this point he makes an extraordinary claim: 'I am 100 per cent sure that the Americans were behind the increase in the price of oil. The oil companies were in in real trouble at that time, they had borrowed a lot of money and they needed a high oil price to save them.'
He says he was convinced of this by the attitude of the Shah of Iran, who in one crucial day in 1974 moved from the Saudi view, that a hike would be dangerous to Opec because it would alienate the US, to advocating higher prices.
'King Faisal sent me to the Shah of Iran, who said: "Why are you against the increase in the price of oil? That is what they want? Ask Henry Kissinger - he is the one who wants a higher price".'
Yamani contends that proof of his long-held belief has recently emerged in the minutes of a secret meeting on a Swedish island, where UK and US officials determined to orchestrate a 400 per cent increase in the oil price...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2001/jan/14/globalrecession.oilandpetrol
Can you quote a source xtreyier?
Not everything needs a source to support, and what makes you think that history that were recorded are 100% truth? So Poh Ah Pak are you saying that everything in history is 100% true?
Quoting sources just shows you know history, but how true is history?
Asking TS to produce an evidence is similiar to this analogy:
TS: "Tomorrow 4D number will be 1234"
Poh Ah Pak: "What makes you think so?"The next day...
Radio: "1st price 1234"
TS is using his intuition, you can say he is guessing. But what makes you think he is not right just because you can't see the evidence right now doesn't mean it won't have a chance of happening. Having an open mind will help you think better Poh Ah Pak. :)
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TS: "Tomorrow 4D number will be 1234"
Poh Ah Pak: "What makes you think so?"That is different lah.
That is 4D.
We are talking about allegations and evidence.
Random stuff like 4D how to have evidence?
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because like anything in this world, theres a probabilty of X for things to occur. 4D or Iran "manipulating" the oil prices these are probability. So what difference does it have, by using 4D as an analogy?
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because like anything in this world, theres a probabilty of X for things to occur.
Is there probablity of below on Iran?
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1. The yankees lowers their central bank lending rates... Iznt the US helping the iranians then? by lowering their currency
2. refineries around the world are making stellar profits, if by ur reason in point 7, then tankers are grounded, refineries should theoretically be swatting flies, idling.
3. On point 6, Iran can sell oil at higher prices why not? they can buy more missiles...
4. Iran has other spending such as weapons acquisitions, various research works, even if they do have that fat purse, they will be buying oil at a much higher premium than the amt they sold. isnt it more convenient that they should just stop production all together,this will certainlty spike prices and yet, Iran has not even slowed its production significantly.
5. if anyone is to be blamed, blame the US, it is the mess they created,
-overleverage causing subprime that cripples its own economy, then print more money
-invasion of IRAQ. disrupting oil productionInfact why the oil spiked is still a mystery, until we can say on hindsight, we can only speculate... IMO though, this oil bubble is like the commodity and technology we have in the past, its part of the economic cycle.
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Originally posted by Dezhou:
Not everything needs a source to support, and what makes you think that history that were recorded are 100% truth? So Poh Ah Pak are you saying that everything in history is 100% true?
Quoting sources just shows you know history, but how true is history?
Asking TS to produce an evidence is similiar to this analogy:
TS: "Tomorrow 4D number will be 1234"
Poh Ah Pak: "What makes you think so?"The next day...
Radio: "1st price 1234"
TS is using his intuition, you can say he is guessing. But what makes you think he is not right just because you can't see the evidence right now doesn't mean it won't have a chance of happening. Having an open mind will help you think better Poh Ah Pak. :)
How lucky then.... because it could have easily come out anyother number.... u can believe what ever god(or numbers), but u cant use it to justify war.
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If a bomb was dropped on Xtreyier's house with his family members still inside, Xtreyier may add 'No' before 'War on Iran please!'.
Forget about morality. Capitalist-wise, fact is the U.S. has run out of resources to wage another big war since there are already too many dollar bills flooding the world. Each bomb means that the U.S. would have to print more money to build and fly a bomber (oil involved again) to drop it on the innocent Iranians. Then each cent of the money spent will add more to the sea of falling dollars.
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Ya, xtreyier, since you wish war against Iran, what are your views on a bomber dropping a bomb on your house and your family members inside all killed?
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Originally posted by whiskers:
How lucky then.... because it could have easily come out anyother number.... u can believe what ever god(or numbers), but u cant use it to justify war.
Thats why i said "TS is using his intuition, you can say he is guessing." You probably just filter through huh? Im not using my analogy to justify a reason for war. Im asking poh ah pak to be open to probability and not just base on history as a solution to everything.
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Still need evidence wah.
What if like Iraq, say got weapons of mass destruction, turn out all a bunch of fat lies?
How?
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Originally posted by Poh Ah Pak:
Still need evidence wah.
What if like Iraq, say got weapons of mass destruction, turn out all a bunch of fat lies?
How?
Fat lie or not. At least we know the Iraqis now at least have the chance to recieve proper education, safer neighbourhood and freedom.
No one is perfect, same goes to US for making such accusations that turned out to be false. But because of this war, you are able to differentiate the real threat the world is now facing, that is terrorism. People die its inevitable, but the sacrifice made can save x times the lives of their future generation of Iraqis.
Just look at China, they are even preparing for a terrorise attack drill for the Olympics.
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At least we know the Iraqis now at least have the chance to recieve proper education, safer neighbourhood and freedom.
Is that a joke?